Jetscode1 Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 He is #1 on the Depth Chart! Keller is not a TE! Where does everyone get him as 3rd on the depth chart? Did Mangini make an announcement that Baker was being demoted that I missed? Again, I'm not saying to pay him as he is under contract but he is not 3rd on the depth chart. He is the only TE on the team that knows this Offense unless you count Kowalewski and Pociasck. He should play for the money he is getting paid and the Jets should hold him to his contract but getting rid of him is silly. He is not acting at all like Kendall. Kendall is a little girl! Just because he's #1 on the depth chart doesn't mean he gets a new contract. The player can't have it both ways. When he underperfoms he wants the same pay. If he over performs he wants a raise. Is Kellen Clemens getting paid more than Chad? Or are we waiting for him to clearly beat him out again in training camp? Baker is not obligated to attend the voluntary workout. Don't show. He just shouldn't bring all the attitude when the boss brings in possible replacements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Oh, and if Baker signs a new contract, think he will give back the prorated share of signing bonus that he banked? Players conveniently forget mid-contract that they fought hard for that guaranteed signing bonus money upfront, in lieu of no-guaranteed salary money, then have the audacity several years later crying about how low their base salary is. Unbelievable. Or what if he loses his starting job during the season? Is he going to give back new money given to him, that was based on him starting every game? Fat chance. With the salary cap, football contracts are based on what can you do for me going forward, not what have you done for me in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serphnx Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Was Baker bitching when he ws an UFA and no body knocked on his door, and the jets gave him a contract that he freely signed. The way thsi system works is that the high darft picks get an ungodly amount of money, monety they haven't earned yet. It is an unfair system, I admit. But, players have the opportunity to earn money as Free Agents, on the open market. And this is the contract that Baker garnered on that open market. He DID NOT have to sign it. He wasn't crying then. Ever wonder why when players switch agents, they always want to do new contracts? The reason that is, is very simple. The ONLY way those new agents get any money is to renegotiate. Okay, how is this system different than the system in place for all the rest of us, except in that football players make more money and have more power in negotiations? Most people go to school, then get a job after graduating. The job you recieve and the compensation you get is based in large measure on your academic performance, which has absolutely no application to how you will do in the real world. There is more similarity between college football and the NFL than there is in a college lecture and an actual job. Once you are on this job, let's assume you weren't a Harvard grad with good grades, but instead were mediocre (Baker was a third round pick, which still puts him in the top 100 or so of his graduating class, but for our purposes we will consider him mediocre--in the NFL the first 10 picks are worth a lot more than the guys picked in the third round). Now you work at this job for a few years, and you want to move on. So you begin looking for other work. Nobody wants you because you're not great at what you do. Your job though gives you a raise out of good faith and welcomes you back, even though you made it known you wanted to work elsewhere for more money. You work a few more years, never distinguishing yourself in the field, but are instead somewhat competent and have flashes of something more, but you just can't break into the top echelon, or even the top half. You want some more money though, so you ask for a cash advance. Once again, your employer out of good faith gives you that advance, resulting in a lower salary later on that year. It is at this point that Baker is bitching that his salary is lower. Note if you tried this in real life, you'd probably get fired on the spot. The company would probably also threaten legal action for you going to the press and slandering them (although more a threat than something actionable, but still there). After your bitch fest, the company hires a guy that wasn't quite an IVY Leaguer, but is still considerably above you. I really don't see the unfairness of the Jets system. If you guys really hate the system, go move to Cuba or some other Communist place. You aren't entitled to more money because you've been somewhere longer, and everybody doesn't start out as the same either. TO started around where Baker did, but TO is getting paid for his performance. They both bitch and whine, but while one guy's a Pro Bowler, the other guy is barely a starter. Results and performance determine your compensation, not the time you've been around or how much you whine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Okay, how is this system different than the system in place for all the rest of us, except in that football players make more money and have more power in negotiations? Most people go to school, then get a job after graduating. The job you recieve and the compensation you get is based in large measure on your academic performance, which has absolutely no application to how you will do in the real world. There is more similarity between college football and the NFL than there is in a college lecture and an actual job. Once you are on this job, let's assume you weren't a Harvard grad with good grades, but instead were mediocre (Baker was a third round pick, which still puts him in the top 100 or so of his graduating class, but for our purposes we will consider him mediocre--in the NFL the first 10 picks are worth a lot more than the guys picked in the third round). Now you work at this job for a few years, and you want to move on. So you begin looking for other work. Nobody wants you because you're not great at what you do. Your job though gives you a raise out of good faith and welcomes you back, even though you made it known you wanted to work elsewhere for more money. You work a few more years, never distinguishing yourself in the field, but are instead somewhat competent and have flashes of something more, but you just can't break into the top echelon, or even the top half. You want some more money though, so you ask for a cash advance. Once again, your employer out of good faith gives you that advance, resulting in a lower salary later on that year. It is at this point that Baker is bitching that his salary is lower. Note if you tried this in real life, you'd probably get fired on the spot. The company would probably also threaten legal action for you going to the press and slandering them (although more a threat than something actionable, but still there). After your bitch fest, the company hires a guy that wasn't quite an IVY Leaguer, but is still considerably above you. I really don't see the unfairness of the Jets system. If you guys really hate the system, go move to Cuba or some other Communist place. You aren't entitled to more money because you've been somewhere longer, and everybody doesn't start out as the same either. TO started around where Baker did, but TO is getting paid for his performance. They both bitch and whine, but while one guy's a Pro Bowler, the other guy is barely a starter. Results and performance determine your compensation, not the time you've been around or how much you whine. I think you misconstrued my point, I am in complete agreement that Baker needs to comply within the system that he is. What is unfair, is that an untested college player, if he is high enough can earn 5-10 times over what an already established veteran can earn. That is a bit skewed, and is not representative of any system that you or I are part of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 All of you people slamming Baker need to get up off your ass and play the game. Baker is right. how the hell is the starter going to get paid less than the rookie. Baker is an amazing player. Were you all bitching about Baker when he was making one-handed catches in the corner of the endzone? My point is i hate it how a lot of you are quick to turn on a player the moment he voices a concern. You think every player should just sit quietly and take it up the ass. How else he is supposed to go about letting people know of his situation? If he didnt speak up he would be getting shafted. PAY THE MAN. Excellent Post. Chris Baker has a legit beef. He was making less money than his back-up and now he'll either be making less money than Keller too or he's on his way out. Baker is not a primadonna like Keyshawn Johnson or greedy bastard like Coles. He was set to make around $800K next year, alot of money to you and me but nothing compared to what Coles was making before the Jets restructured his contract. Not to mention Baker is an all-around good TE. He can block and make plays. For all you Kellen fans out there getting rid of Baker will hurt Kellen from the standpoint that Kellen used Baker more than Pennington did. Baker is on his way out. This is a personal beef between Tangini and Baker's agent. It's a shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vudu Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 He shouldve acted professionaly, maybe they couldve worked something out, but by going off like that, he did himself a disservice. Ugh i hate Draft time, now I cant wait for the season to start. t minus 4 months and counting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shutout Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 That's not what perplexes me. What does is that Baker received half of his 2008 salary in advance, in late 2007 (which he was more than happy to accept). That never gets mentioned. All they say is he's making only $700K this year. Well it was $1.5M until the Jets gave him more than half of it before the prior season ended. But they're athletes represented by agents. It's always going to be "What have you done for me lately?" Qouted because its STILL being ignored by most of the posters in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Excellent Post. Chris Baker has a legit beef. He was making less money than his back-up and now he'll either be making less money than Keller too or he's on his way out. Baker is not a primadonna like Keyshawn Johnson or greedy bastard like Coles. He was set to make around $800K next year, alot of money to you and me but nothing compared to what Coles was making before the Jets restructured his contract. Not to mention Baker is an all-around good TE. He can block and make plays. For all you Kellen fans out there getting rid of Baker will hurt Kellen from the standpoint that Kellen used Baker more than Pennington did. Baker is on his way out. This is a personal beef between Tangini and Baker's agent. It's a shame. It's not quite that simple. He got (albeit a small) signing bonus when we took him back in 2006. $200K per year for 4 years gets amortized. So $200K of that was his 2008 salary in advance. Then you have his salary this year of $700K. That's $900K total so far. Then he took another $800K of his '08 salary in '07 before the season ended. That's $1.7M for 2008. He's not making less than Franks. His 2008 base salary ($700K) is more than Keller's is going to be. He's slotted to make $2.4M (when you count the SB money he's already been paid) in 2009. Baker & his agent are making it sound like he's received nothing and is making nothing. What if he's not in the Jets' long-term plans? Are we supposed to give him (another) raise anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Then he took another $800K of his '08 salary in '07 before the season ended. That's $1.7M for 2008. He's making more only b/c he's taking from his future salary. If the Jets hadn't drafted Keller I'd agree with you and say he has no legit gripe but now he's pretty much a marked man on this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 He's making more only b/c he's taking from his future salary. If the Jets hadn't drafted Keller I'd agree with you and say he has no legit gripe but now he's pretty much a marked man on this team. How is he taking from his future salary? He's been paid $1M of his 2008 salary already (which he happily took in advance). He's scheduled to make another $700K over the course of the season. Plus I forgot about another $100K workout bonus. That's $1.8M. Next year he's scheduled to make still more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 How is he taking from his future salary? He's been paid $1M of his 2008 salary already (which he happily took in advance). He's scheduled to make another $700K over the course of the season. Plus I forgot about another $100K workout bonus. That's $1.8M. Next year he's scheduled to make still more. "[baker] is in the third year of a $6.6 million contract, and will earn $683,000 this season, according to the Post. But the Jets signed Franks to a one-year deal worth $1.65 million, and Keller, drafted 30th overall, likely will receive a deal that goes beyond that." http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3371635 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 "[baker] is in the third year of a $6.6 million contract, and will earn $683,000 this season, according to the Post. But the Jets signed Franks to a one-year deal worth $1.65 million, and Keller, drafted 30th overall, likely will receive a deal that goes beyond that." http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3371635 Cannizzaro is spinning things because he hates this FO. He's still bitter that we dumped Herm on the Chiefs. His salary is $683,000. Well la-dee-freakin-da. David Harris' base salary is $370,000. He has received, and is due to receive, more than his base salary. A beat writer should know that. Or he does know it & is still bitter at the FO for dumping his buddy Herm, so he likes to stick it to them & fuel the fire whenever possible. He's a real scumbag. Look - here are Baker's official numbers: ---------------------------------- Contract signed 3/24/2006: 4 years, $6.6M: SB: $1,000,000 2006: cap # $1.25M Workout bonus: $200K Base salary: $800K SB prorat: $250K 2007: cap # $1.25M Workout bonus: $150K Base salary: $850K SB prorat: $250K 2008: cap # $1.75M Roster bonus: $400K Workout bonus: $100K Base salary: $1.00M SB prorat: $250K 2009: cap # $2.35M Roster bonus: $1.00M Workout bonus: $100K Base salary: $1.00M SB prorat: $250K SB prorat: $250K --------------------------- Contract renegotiated 11/7/2007: 2007: cap # $1,966,500.24 Workout bonus: $150K Base salary: $2,372,563 (includes 9 wks at $850K rate; cap value $1,566,500.24) SB prorat: $250K 2008: cap # $1.033M (Roster bonus: $0) Workout bonus: $100K Base salary: $683,500 SB prorat: $250K 2009: cap # $2.35M Roster bonus: $1.00M Workout bonus: $100K Base salary: $1.00M SB prorat: $250K ------------------------------ So while his base salary is now around $700K, his compensation for 2008 is greater than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 I say dont let the door hit ya on the way out of town Chris. This is not a player who usually opens his mouth. Chris Baker always works his ass off, he deserves a better contract than the one he has. No way in hell Bubba Franks should have a better one, he excepted so many roles during his career with the Jets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 "[baker] is in the third year of a $6.6 million contract, and will earn $683,000 this season, according to the Post. But the Jets signed Franks to a one-year deal worth $1.65 million, and Keller, drafted 30th overall, likely will receive a deal that goes beyond that." http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3371635 Prorate that Bonus, and Baker is earning more. And, he has the luxury, if he is smart, of earning interest on that upfront money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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