Keenan. Allen

[BroadwayJoe12]

Dude, they're f'ing terrible. Dont make it seem like Im trying to clean something up here. They couldnt draft offensively to save their jobs....literally. Jet fans here on this site has put together better mock drafts then what the Jets ultimately drafted offensively by way of these "terrible" ass scouts. 

 

If you're offended, cool. They're terrible. Now lets move on. 

 

In the last 10 years, we've used ~23 picks on offense, you want to know how many times we've drafting an offensive skill position player?? Twice. Keller and Hill. The philosophy of our general managers has not been to use our high picks on WRs, RBs or TEs in the draft, they used free agency to do that.  Thus, I find it lazy and shortsighted to say that our scouts can't draft offensively, just because our general manager has not done so. It's as if all our scouts only have the ability to scout defensive talent and have a mind-cramp when it comes to the other side of the ball. For what it's worth, they've seemingly done a decent job with the players they draft. 

 

These are the players our GM drafted and you tell me where they were supposed to pull out these magic skill-position players?

 

'04 --> Cotchery (4th). Great value

'05 ---> Cedric Houston (6th). 

'06---> Brick (1st) Nick (1st). Brad Smith (4th). Leon (4th). Pretty solid value with Smith and Leon. 

'07 --> Jacob Bender (6th). Chansi Stuckey (7th). Pretty much what you expect from 6th and 7th round players. 

'08---> Keller (1st), Marcus Henry (6th), Ainge (7th). Not what you want out of a 1st round TE, but he did pretty well seeing as how Mark was his QB. 

'09 --> Mark (1st). Green (3rd), Slauson (6th).  Screwed the pooch on Mark and I think they got decent value from a 3rd round back and a 6th round OG. 

'10 --> Ducase (2nd), McKnight (4h), Conner (5th)

'11 --> Powell (4th). Kerley (5th). McElroy (7th). McKnighty (7th)

'12---> Hill (2nd). Gannaway (6th). White (7th)

 

Only two offensive skill-players in ten years were drafted within the first two rounds. It's impossible to know how our scouts rate players until you know what their bigboard looks like. All we can see is that our GMs are fine plugging in mid round RBs and WRs and hoping our offensive line and QB can make it work. Obviously that has no been the case.  Maybe the scouts are terrible, I just don't think anyone has enough information to make that call.

[Integrity28]

Keenan Allen had a first round grade on a lot of boards and slipped due to an injury I believe. He would have been a steal.

 

Correct, and he was obviously a steal.

 

That being said, he's benefited from playing with a legit QB who loves to lock onto 1 receiver... but if you watch Allen play, he knows how to get open. He plays better than his experience level.

 

Just because another team drafts a guy, not in the first round, and he ends up being good... doesn't mean Jets fans need to bellyache that he's not ours. These guys need to get over it.

[jetsjetsjetss]

TY Hilton wasnt a train wreck. And you know my favorite: Mr. Alshon Jeffery wasnt a Train wreck either. 

 

P.S. Stop reaching 

 

 Alshon was the 7th WR taken in the draft.

 

TY even later. Its cool they are good now but the teams and people who actually do this as a profession didnt see much in them

 

we always look so smart after the fact dont we

[Matt39]

I remember folks rationalizing the Doug Jolley trade and then the Nugent pick. This team man.

[NCJETSFAN]

An example of what, exactly? Are you saying you had Allen on your board in the 3rd? It was a super high risk, home run pick for the Chargers. Good for them, but not drafting him wasn't a whiff for the Jets or any other team. Or any other person with a double digit IQ paying attention to the draft and events leading up to it. Talk about being dead from the neck up.

An example of the jets ignoring our biggest needs . We need offensive players very bad As good as our defense is you can win without offense

[Villain The Foe]

In the last 10 years, we've used ~23 picks on offense, you want to know how many times we've drafting an offensive skill position player?? Twice. Keller and Hill. The philosophy of our general managers has not been to use our high picks on WRs, RBs or TEs in the draft, they used free agency to do that.  Thus, I find it lazy and shortsighted to say that our scouts can't draft offensively, just because our general manager has not done so. It's as if all our scouts only have the ability to scout defensive talent and have a mind-cramp when it comes to the other side of the ball. For what it's worth, they've seemingly done a decent job with the players they draft. 

 

These are the players our GM drafted and you tell me where they were supposed to pull out these magic skill-position players?

 

'04 --> Cotchery (4th). Great value

'05 ---> Cedric Houston (6th). 

'06---> Brick (1st) Nick (1st). Brad Smith (4th). Leon (4th). Pretty solid value with Smith and Leon. 

'07 --> Jacob Bender (6th). Chansi Stuckey (7th). Pretty much what you expect from 6th and 7th round players. 

'08---> Keller (1st), Marcus Henry (6th), Ainge (7th). Not what you want out of a 1st round TE, but he did pretty well seeing as how Mark was his QB. 

'09 --> Mark (1st). Green (3rd), Slauson (6th).  Screwed the pooch on Mark and I think they got decent value from a 3rd round back and a 6th round OG. 

'10 --> Ducase (2nd), McKnight (4h), Conner (5th)

'11 --> Powell (4th). Kerley (5th). McElroy (7th). McKnighty (7th)

'12---> Hill (2nd). Gannaway (6th). White (7th)

 

Only two offensive skill-players in ten years were drafted within the first two rounds. It's impossible to know how our scouts rate players until you know what their bigboard looks like. All we can see is that our GMs are fine plugging in mid round RBs and WRs and hoping our offensive line and QB can make it work. Obviously that has no been the case.  Maybe the scouts are terrible, I just don't think anyone has enough information to make that call.

TL;DR. im over it. 

 

The scouts were terrible dude, and Idzik agrees. Lets move on brother. 

[BroadwayJoe12]

Greene was awful. Jets scouts had a first round grade on him(even more awful). You draft a tight end in the first round you expect a player that will be a big part of the offense for at least two contracts. Total disappointment. Used Baker as example because the scouts were the same and the Jets never really drafted offense. 

 

He was drafted in the third round, I'm going to assume the first round grade was more fluff than anything. Keller wasn't the best pick, that's pretty clear, but he was far and away from being a bust at the 30th pick. Again though, we've drafted two WRs/TEs/RBs within the first two rounds over the last ten years, how do you expect us to find talent if we never attempt at drafting it?

[Villain The Foe]

 Alshon was the 7th WR taken in the draft.

 

TY even later. Its cool they are good now but the teams and people who actually do this as a profession didnt see much in them

 

we always look so smart after the fact dont we

Question. Who were the 6 WR's drafted before him? Exactly. 

 

Then I need to get a job in the profession because I was RAVING about Jeffery leading up to the draft. People were telling me I was wrong and putting up fat pictures of Jeffery. Now that this guy is looking like a beast on the block then some (respectfully) have even stated that I was right on dude. 

 

Its not like I waited until he was good on the NFL level. 

[jetsjetsjetss]

Question. Who were the 6 WR's drafted before him? Exactly. 

 

Justin Blackmon

Jacksonville

 

Michael Floyd

Arizona

 

Kendall Wright

Tennessee

 

A.J. Jenkins

San Francisco

 

Brian Quick

St. Louis

 

Stephen Hill

N.Y. Jets

 

Alshon Jeffery

Chicago

[Matt39]

He was drafted in the third round, I'm going to assume the first round grade was more fluff than anything. Keller wasn't the best pick, that's pretty clear, but he was far and away from being a bust at the 30th pick. Again though, we've drafted two WRs/TEs/RBs within the first two rounds over the last ten years, how do you expect us to find talent if we never attempt at drafting it?

 

I think they should start. But the few they've drafted, have not been very good. The Jolley trade was embarrassing. Roddy White or Heath Miller would still be on the team. And then they double down on stupid with Mike Nugent.

[77DRAFT]

Allen expected to go in the 1st or 2nd round, he fell because of rumors about his personality and mental make up.

[Villain The Foe]

 

1

5

Justin Blackmon

Jacksonville

15

64

865

13.5

5

1

13

Michael Floyd

Arizona

16

45

562

12.5

2

1

20

Kendall Wright

Tennessee

15

64

626

9.8

4

1

30

A.J. Jenkins San Francisco

3

0

0

0

0

2

33

Brian Quick St. Louis

14

11

156

14.2

2

2

43

Stephen Hill

N.Y. Jets

11

21

252

12

3

2

45

Alshon Jeffery

Chicago

10

24

367

15.3

3

 

and stats for first year

 

Im sorry, let me clarify. 

 

None of those 6 WR's are better than Alshon Jeffery. I didnt ask you the question as if you couldnt find the answer lmao. I asked you the question because none of those WR's, especially Hill compare to Jeffery's range and skillset outside of blackmon. And thats only an assumption because Blackmon has decided not to play football but to be a druggie unfortunately. And even with that said, Jeffery still had the best hands in the draft by far. 

 

Just because 6 other WR's went before him doesnt change that. 

[jetsjetsjetss]

Im sorry, let me clarify. 

 

None of those 6 WR's are better than Alshon Jeffery. I didnt ask you the question as if you couldnt find the answer lmao. I asked you the question because none of those WR's, especially Hill compare to Jeffery's range and skillset outside of blackmon. And thats only an assumption because Blackmon has decided not to play football but to be a druggie unfortunately. And even with that said, Jeffery still had the best hands in the draft by far. 

 

Just because 6 other WR's went before him doesnt change that. 

 

that proves my point then. go hindsight!

 

teams didnt think alshon was going to be the best. Its cool to look back at it now and say that but as of then the jets and other teams thought differently

 

our scouts were terrible? so were the other teams scouts. So if everyone is terrible i guess the jets have average scouts

[Matt39]

The Jets had Mike Nugent rated higher than Frank Gore and Vincent Jackson.

[Villain The Foe]

that proves my point then. go hindsight!

 

teams didnt think alshon was going to be the best. Its cool to look back at it now and say that but as of then the jets and other teams thought differently

It doesnt prove your point. Ask anyone who was on this board 2 years ago how I was talking about Alshon Jeffery. For 2 years straight I did, people kept putting up pics of him when he was "fat", but my answer to that was, his "fat ass" is better than every fit WR in the country. As for where he was drafted doesnt make a difference because when it comes to me this wasnt a hindsight situation. I was toting Alshon Jeffery pre draft, post draft and so on. If you dont believe that then ask Debatesman or EY on this forum. 

 

Now ask for the Jets, they decided to draft an athlete who's best attribute was blocking and weakest was catching and route running. Thats just stupidity. Just like I can say that Jeffery is better than the 6 WR's drafted before him, I could also say that Jeffery was the worst WR in the draft period. 

[jetsjetsjetss]

It doesnt prove your point. Ask anyone who was on this board 2 years ago how I was talking about Alshon Jeffery. For 2 years straight I did, people kept putting up pics of him when he was "fat", but my answer to that was, his "fat ass" is better than every fit WR in the country. As for where he was drafted doesnt make a difference because when it comes to me this wasnt a hindsight situation. I was toting Alshon Jeffery pre draft, post draft and so on. If you dont believe that then ask Debatesman or EY on this forum. 

 

Now ask for the Jets, they decided to draft an athlete who's best attribute was blocking and last was catching and route running. Thats just stupidity. Just like I can say that Jeffery is better than the 6 WR's drafted before him, I could also say that Jeffery was the worst WR in the draft period. 

 

go apply to be a GM

 

werent you also the guy who loved mcelroy?

[joewilly12]

Poor scouting has been going on for years here cant believe the Jets just don't get what the draft is for.

[Villain The Foe]

go apply to be a GM

 

werent you also the guy who loved mcelroy?

I loved McElroy because he was a Jet and I felt like we needed a change and that change would obviously come from the depth chart. I wasnt touting for the Jets to "Draft" McElroy. Big difference. 

[joewilly12]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000158529/article/new-york-jets-best-and-worst-draft-picks

[jetsjetsjetss]

I loved McElroy because he was a Jet and I felt like we needed a change and that change would obviously come from the depth chart. I wasnt touting for the Jets to "Draft" McElroy. Big difference. 

 

touting a change over talent is kind of a weird way to run a team. you need better scouts

 

people are wrong but hey again if your 100% right or over 70% apply to be a GM

[Villain The Foe]

touting a change over talent is kind of a weird way to run a team. you need better scouts

 

people are wrong but hey again if your 100% right or over 70% apply to be a GM

It was weird for Pete Carroll to bench a QB that they just gave a $25 million+ free agent contract to for a 3rd round unproven rookie. Idzik was part of that weird decision. 

 

Who's playing in the NFC Championship next week for the 2nd year? lol. 

 

Its not about being 100% right, its about changing what doesnt work. 

[T0mShane]

The Jets had Mike Nugent rated higher than Frank Gore and Vincent Jackson.

Blame Doug Brien.

[Villain The Foe]

Blame Doug Brien.

lol and some people here were attempting to argue with me because I said that the scouts were terrible. 

[Matt39]

lol and some people here were attempting to argue with me because I said that the scouts were terrible. 

 

You know you could argue Gholston wasn't a bad pick because we got great value there. He was supposed to go top 5. #Jetsfanlogic

[jetsjetsjetss]

It was weird for Pete Carroll to bench a QB that they just gave a $25 million+ free agent contract to for a 3rd round unproven rookie. Idzik was part of that weird decision. 

 

Who's playing in the NFC Championship next week for the 2nd year? lol. 

 

Its not about being 100% right, its about changing what doesnt work. 

 

? what does that have to do with anything.

 

Carroll didnt just change to change he changed because wilson is better

 

btw: i was actually wondering how involved idzik was watching the game the announcers referenced all these undrafted players they found this year who are stepping up. Idzik left and they havnt missed a beat hopefully idzik can replicate it

[NCJETSFAN]

? what does that have to do with anything.

Carroll didnt just change to change he changed because wilson is better

btw: i was actually wondering how involved idzik was watching the game the announcers referenced all these undrafted players they found this year who are stepping up. Idzik left and they havnt missed a beat hopefully idzik can replicate it

Idzik was their cap contract guy ! That's it he wasn't really involved in player decisions. That's what he has done his whole career .

[joewilly12]

Why did Idzik leave Seattle in the first place?

[Larz]

Idzik was their cap contract guy ! That's it he wasn't really involved in player decisions. That's what he has done his whole career .

 

except for the 3 years as a scout and the coaching thing but whateves

[Villain The Foe]

? what does that have to do with anything.

 

Carroll didnt just change to change he changed because wilson is better

 

btw: i was actually wondering how involved idzik was watching the game the announcers referenced all these undrafted players they found this year who are stepping up. Idzik left and they havnt missed a beat hopefully idzik can replicate it

It has to do with making changes that may or may not be popular at the time what you see as best for the team. 

 

Russell seemed better than Quinn but it had to be proven on the field field first, and It worked. I can tell you that most of the teams in the league wouldnt have made the move and left all that money sitting on the bench because they would have been so concerned about what people such as yourself would think of the move, especially if it didnt work. 

 

 

This is actually why I really like Idzik. He comes from that type of crowd and I respect that. 

[BroadwayJoe12]

It doesnt prove your point. Ask anyone who was on this board 2 years ago how I was talking about Alshon Jeffery. For 2 years straight I did, people kept putting up pics of him when he was "fat", but my answer to that was, his "fat ass" is better than every fit WR in the country. As for where he was drafted doesnt make a difference because when it comes to me this wasnt a hindsight situation. I was toting Alshon Jeffery pre draft, post draft and so on. If you dont believe that then ask Debatesman or EY on this forum. 

 

Now ask for the Jets, they decided to draft an athlete who's best attribute was blocking and weakest was catching and route running. Thats just stupidity. Just like I can say that Jeffery is better than the 6 WR's drafted before him, I could also say that Jeffery was the worst WR in the draft period. 

 

Christ dude, I was saying that Warford was going to be the best OG in the draft, that doesn't make me a scout. There's way more that goes into drafting a player than just knowing he's going to be good. Every single person in here has a player that they wanted to drafted, who our team didn't and turned out being great, it doesn't make them scouts. You called that the 45th overall pick was going to be good, nice.  Alshon is amazing and beasted the SEC, but the fact that 6 WRs went before him shows you how he wasn't such a slam dunk; these GMs and scouts know all the off-the-field incidents and behind the scenes antics that you don't. What happens if SC's coach told teams that he was toxic and to stay away? Is that the scouts fault?  So much more goes into the draft than just, oh, this guy has talent, lets grab him.

[Villain The Foe]

Christ dude, I was saying that Warford was going to be the best OG in the draft, that doesn't make me a scout. There's way more that goes into drafting a player than just knowing he's going to be good. Every single person in here has a player that they wanted to drafted, who our team didn't and turned out being great, it doesn't make them scouts. You called that the 45th overall pick was going to be good, nice.  Alshon is amazing and beasted the SEC, but the fact that 6 WRs went before him shows you how he wasn't such a slam dunk; these GMs and scouts know all the off-the-field incidents and behind the scenes antics that you don't. What happens if SC's coach told teams that he was toxic and to stay away? Is that the scouts fault?  So much more goes into the draft than just, oh, this guy has talent, lets grab him.

okay. 

[jetsjetsjetss]

It has to do with making changes that may or may not be popular at the time what you see as best for the team. 

 

Russell seemed better than Quinn but it had to be proven on the field field first, and It worked. I can tell you that most of the teams in the league wouldnt have made the move and left all that money sitting on the bench because they would have been so concerned about what people such as yourself would think of the move, especially if it didnt work. 

 

 

This is actually why I really like Idzik. He comes from that type of crowd and I respect that. 

 

wilson>mcelroy

 

whatd you think of tebow?

[Villain The Foe]

wilson>mcelroy

 

whatd you think of tebow?

Tebow was a joke and a terrible move by the jets in regards to bringing in talent and being taken seriously as an organization trying to win. Woody/Tanny showed that they werent interested in bringing in top talent but more interested in jersey revenue. 

[redman81]

Those moves you speak of was on defense my friend. So you named Sheldon and Milliner. Do me a favor, name me the last two offensive players that have worked out just as well. .

Kerley? He was nowhere near rookie of the year like a Sheldon Richardson. Kerley isnt even in the conversation of the top 20 WR's in the league. Who are you going to say, Bilal Powell? What would have been more accurate to say is that the same scouting deptartment that does well when drafting defensive players dont do so well when drafting offensive players, IF they decide to even do so.

Mind you, this is the same scouting department that allowed the offense to go to sh_t so please, dont play me as an arm-chair GM. I've seen fans mock drafts on this very website that's been better than what that front office has done.

Actually Kerley is developing into a solid slot receiver for this team.

[Villain The Foe]

Actually Kerley is developing into a solid slot receiver for this team.

I totally agree, however, he's not a legit #1 or #2. Richardson is a legit starting DE. Milliner has shown signs but its still too early to call it. 

 

I wasnt bashing Kerley. It was more about BroadwayJoe disagreeing with my point of view. 

 

Kerley is a very valuable player, the best offensive player we we've drafted this decade so far (I still think Geno will be legit). This very statement however shows why the Jets are so bad as a team offensively though. Its stated that you build through the draft....and our best offensive player drafted is Jeremy Kerley...a solid #3 wide receiver.