stoicsentry Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 You act like Cotchery is some irreplaceable cog in their offense. He is not. Someone else could easily have replaced that production put in the same spot for them. As far as I'm concerned, Kerley has already replaced him. And Kerley is better. Might not have a better career but he is way better now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoicsentry Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 If Sanders or Maclin is signed I think Nicks makes sense to be the priority. He can beat press coverage which would balance out the other two nicely. Plus it would piss the Giants off, which is great because **** those guys. Isn't there a chance that Nicks ends up being a Holmes-like contract for us? I don't know about that guy, he kinda worries me. Does he lack hustle or was he just hurt last year? Probably a bit of both, just like Holmes has been for us in recent years---always hurt or dogging it when he's not hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Isn't there a chance that Nicks ends up being a Holmes-like contract for us? I don't know about that guy, he kinda worries me. Does he lack hustle or was he just hurt last year? Probably a bit of both, just like Holmes has been for us in recent years---always hurt or dogging it when he's not hurt. Nicks isn't remotely like Holmes and he's certainly not going to garner a contract like Holmes received either. The one and only concern with him is injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Nicks isn't remotely like Holmes and he's certainly not going to garner a contract like Holmes received either. The one and only concern with him is injury. Other than that, how was the play, Mrs. Lincoln? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Also, Nicks has 3 TDs in his last 30 games and a reputation for dogging it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoicsentry Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Also, Nicks has 3 TDs in his last 30 games and a reputation for dogging it. That's the kind of stuff I'm talking about. Do we really want that again? That's why I was really hoping for Decker. Say what you want about him playing with Manning. But still the reason he's the best target is that he's young, productive, doesn't dog it and he's healthy. No one else really matches that description. Maybe Tate somewhat. I don't want another headache at the WR position. Give me a guy I can count on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Other than that, how was the play, Mrs. Lincoln? Well yeah, there's a reason Decker's going to get paid more. If he was worth max money then signing him doesn't really make a ton of sense. Also, Nicks has 3 TDs in his last 30 games and a reputation for dogging it. It's Coughlin dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Nicks isn't remotely like Holmes and he's certainly not going to garner a contract like Holmes received either. The one and only concern with him is injury. Also, Nicks has 3 TDs in his last 30 games and a reputation for dogging it. While he has garnered a reputation for dogging it in practice and a bit on the field, it's hard not to like what he brings when he's actually healthy. He's never finished lower than 56th in DYAR (6th, 12th, 56th and 50th the last four years, respectively) and I doubt he's lost a step so precipitously at only 26 years old. His last two years has lowered his value to what some are guessing to be in the $4ish million range**, which makes him a decent buy-low candidate. If you could get him at two years for $10 million total and pair him with Sanders heading into FA, that's not a bad start. **Completely conjecture and not the highest reputable source, but I've seen others beside the herald mention his value to be in that range: The Herald suggests Nicks may only require a two-year, $7-10 million deal. New England could also show interest in free agent Emmanuel Sanders after signing him to a restricted free agent offer sheet last year. Feb 14 - 8:31 PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 While he has garnered a reputation for dogging it in practice and a bit on the field, Everyone that plays for Tom Coughlin gets fined for being late to sh*t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 That's the kind of stuff I'm talking about. Do we really want that again? That's why I was really hoping for Decker. Say what you want about him playing with Manning. But still the reason he's the best target is that he's young, productive, doesn't dog it and he's healthy. No one else really matches that description. Maybe Tate somewhat. I don't want another headache at the WR position. Give me a guy I can count on. I can't find the article, but it basically showed that TDs are non-predictive entities and how so many variables are in place when considering them that you can't really factor them in when considering a player. Look at Calvin Johnson's seasonal TD numbers: 4, 12, 5, 12, 16, 5, 12. Two seasons ago when Calvin had 5 tds he set the WR record for receiving yards at 1964 and was stopped on the one yard line 5 or 6 times, it's just fluky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Everyone that plays for Tom Coughlin gets fined for being late to sh*t. That's true, I was more referring to reports that he missed practices, which caused him to be out of sync with Eli all season. But then again, those were the same reporters who said Eli lost faith in Nicks, which caused him to look towards Randle and other, yet Nicks still was second on the team in targets, so who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 That's true, I was more referring to reports that he missed practices, which caused him to be out of sync with Eli all season. But then again, those were the same reporters who said Eli lost faith in Nicks, which caused him to look towards Randle and other, yet Nicks still was second on the team in targets, so who knows. The Giants offense was second only to Jacksonville's in ineptitude last year. Not to mention that the dude was hurt. He was actually trying to get on the field for the Dallas game and the staff wouldn't let him. So far as I know with the missed practices that was due to injury and there was one for personal reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JiFtheOracle Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 This is signing that makes a lot of sense to me. Fits the scheme, he's hitting his prime coming off his best season, he wont break the bank and he'd immediately be the best WR on the team. You sign a guy like Sanders, find another big target type WR in FA and draft a stud in the first 2 rounds...the offense would be significantly better immediately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 This is signing that makes a lot of sense to me. Fits the scheme, he's hitting his prime coming off his best season, he wont break the bank and he'd immediately be the best WR on the team. You sign a guy like Sanders, find another big target type WR in FA and draft a stud in the first 2 rounds...the offense would be significantly better immediately. So Big FA guy .... Sanders ,,,,, Top Draft Pick ,,,,,, Hill, Nelson and Kerley Does Sanders then push Kerley out of the slot ? Since Kerley is not a good ST whts his role on the team ? Part timer ? May not be a bad deal since Kerly always has some type of nagging injury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 The Giants offense was second only to Jacksonville's in ineptitude last year. Not to mention that the dude was hurt. He was actually trying to get on the field for the Dallas game and the staff wouldn't let him. So far as I know with the missed practices that was due to injury and there was one for personal reasons. I don't follow the Giants enough to really know, so I'll take your word on that. I've always thought Nicks was the most talented receiver on the Giants and while I was hesitant to give him the $9+ million that was circulating prior to the season, I would jump all over him at a reduced price. Pairing him with one of Maclin or Sanders would be an ideal off-season heading into the draft and not one that I find to unrealistic. Admittedly I'm only going by the rumored numbers by different beat-writers, but if you could land Sanders and Nicks for the same price or a $1-2 million more than just Decker, I think it's a no-brainer. Nicks wouldn't really surprise me either, as he's expressed his desire to remain both as a Giant and in new york. Can't find the article, but he made a point of answering a question that he would really like to remain in the area. I could be reading too much into it, but it sounded as if he'd be happy with either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 So Big FA guy .... Sanders ,,,,, Top Draft Pick ,,,,,, Hill, Nelson and Kerley Does Sanders then push Kerley out of the slot ? Since Kerley is not a good ST whts his role on the team ? Part timer ? May not be a bad deal since Kerly always has some type of nagging injury RJF and I were tossing some ideas around earlier, but more than not you'll see kerley and Sanders switching out of the Z and Slot roles while you'd have Nicks/Bigger WR play opposite them. Pairing Nicks and Sanders/Maclin is actually a very solid tandem, especially when you have Kerley underneath. If we are able to go that route, then people might warm up to the idea of Ebron in the first if they like his athletic potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 While he has garnered a reputation for dogging it in practice and a bit on the field, it's hard not to like what he brings when he's actually healthy. He's never finished lower than 56th in DYAR (6th, 12th, 56th and 50th the last four years, respectively) and I doubt he's lost a step so precipitously at only 26 years old. His last two years has lowered his value to what some are guessing to be in the $4ish million range**, which makes him a decent buy-low candidate. If you could get him at two years for $10 million total and pair him with Sanders heading into FA, that's not a bad start. **Completely conjecture and not the highest reputable source, but I've seen others beside the herald mention his value to be in that range: The Herald suggests Nicks may only require a two-year, $7-10 million deal. New England could also show interest in free agent Emmanuel Sanders after signing him to a restricted free agent offer sheet last year. Feb 14 - 8:31 PM If he's available at that price, I'd do it in a heartbeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Unlikely we go the Nicks route considering he was a Giant and he's another guy who walks to the beat of his own drum. Doubtful we follow up Holmes with Nicks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 RJF and I were tossing some ideas around earlier, but more than not you'll see kerley and Sanders switching out of the Z and Slot roles while you'd have Nicks/Bigger WR play opposite them. Pairing Nicks and Sanders/Maclin is actually a very solid tandem, especially when you have Kerley underneath. If we are able to go that route, then people might warm up to the idea of Ebron in the first if they like his athletic potential. health issues of Maclin/Nicks are a concern I know the WR crop is thin this year but are oft injured players a good option. In a world where Nicks and Maclin are healthy and not having issues staying on the field for 3 years I like the scenario you talk about here. Edit : Also in this scenario Hill could be used exclusively as the burner ...like a Dedric Ward type. I don't think he is well rounded enough to be a starting WR right now but he could contribute in that respect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JiFtheOracle Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 So Big FA guy .... Sanders ,,,,, Top Draft Pick ,,,,,, Hill, Nelson and Kerley Does Sanders then push Kerley out of the slot ? Since Kerley is not a good ST whts his role on the team ? Part timer ? May not be a bad deal since Kerly always has some type of nagging injury Like RJF and BJ12 are saying, Sanders isnt exclusively a slot WR. You can line him up wide. In fact, I think the game breaker he caught vs. the Jets was lined up outside vs. Cro. Could be wrong. I actually forgot about Nelson. I'd be completely fine with Sanders, Rookie, Kerley, Nelson and hope that the light clicks with Hill. That said, if a big target is availabe for the right price, you got to look at that too...you then have some flexibility with Kerley at the end of the season too. Either way, Sanders is 5'11...its not like he's clone of Kerley. He'd be a very nice addition IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Like RJF and BJ12 are saying, Sanders isnt exclusively a slot WR. You can line him up wide. In fact, I think the game breaker he caught vs. the Jets was lined up outside vs. Cro. Could be wrong. I actually forgot about Nelson. I'd be completely fine with Sanders, Rookie, Kerley, Nelson and hope that the light clicks with Hill. That said, if a big target is availabe for the right price, you got to look at that too...you then have some flexibility with Kerley at the end of the season too. Either way, Sanders is 5'11...its not like he's clone of Kerley. He'd be a very nice addition IMO. only reason I questioned is because there's not a Special teamer in the bunch and your carrying 6 WR's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 I don't follow the Giants enough to really know, so I'll take your word on that. I've always thought Nicks was the most talented receiver on the Giants and while I was hesitant to give him the $9+ million that was circulating prior to the season, I would jump all over him at a reduced price. Pairing him with one of Maclin or Sanders would be an ideal off-season heading into the draft and not one that I find to unrealistic. Admittedly I'm only going by the rumored numbers by different beat-writers, but if you could land Sanders and Nicks for the same price or a $1-2 million more than just Decker, I think it's a no-brainer. Nicks wouldn't really surprise me either, as he's expressed his desire to remain both as a Giant and in new york. Can't find the article, but he made a point of answering a question that he would really like to remain in the area. I could be reading too much into it, but it sounded as if he'd be happy with either. Nicks is a beast. That he can be had for a low risk/mid-salary deal absolutely makes it a no-brainer and everything I've seen so far indicates that's the case (barring Schiano or someone does something ridiculous). Not to mention the fact that he's the prototypical receiver that Marty's system depends on to keep the defense honest once they start adjusting to the short and mid-level passing game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 If he's available at that price, I'd do it in a heartbeat. THEN WHY ARE YOU ARGUING WITH ME AEIRGQLIRGBQLIW3BG4I34UBQIL3VLOI4TQO43IGNFJWA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 THEN WHY ARE YOU ARGUING WITH ME AEIRGQLIRGBQLIW3BG4I34UBQIL3VLOI4TQO43IGNFJWA I don't have a problem with Nicks qua Nicks. I have a problem with Nicks at anything close to $9mm per. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 That said, I remain convinced that you have a photo of Nicks in a heart-shaped frame next to your bed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 That said, I remain convinced that you have a photo of Nicks in a heart-shaped frame next to your bed. I'm going to be honest with you, I'm confused by your tactics, but I'm going to continue to act tough until I figure them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 I'm going to be honest with you, I'm confused by your tactics, but I'm going to continue to act tough until I figure them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 RutgersJetFan, on 17 Feb 2014 - 4:21 PM, said: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard King Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Cotch was a #4 in that offense behind Brown, Sanders and Miller. TDs are almost impossible to predict on a year to year basis, so I'm not chalking his surge in TDs to some revitalization. It's a lot of opportunity and luck and less sheer skill. The year CJ set the WR record he was tackled at the 1 yard line about 6 times and finished with single digit scores. Cotch was a great number two and right now is a great role player, but you ask him to take on 100 targets at this stage in his career and I think you'll be pretty disappointed. His targets this year were a direct result of Wallace going to Miami. But he showed up when they called on him and that's all I am saying. Roethlisberger is a generational QB no doubt and I'm saying that its no accident that Cotch had his best numbers with him. But what I am also trying to say is that Kevin Colbert is sneakily probably the best GM in football. They cut better offensive talent than we usually draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard King Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Not sure what their GM has done recently to be consider great unless your referring to his entire body of work which I'm not up to date with. But their GM handling of the cap has been on bar with Tanny. Every year they restructure and issue long term pain for short term gain and couldn't sign studs back even if it came at a reasonable price. This year being $12 mil over the cap (which is better then the $30+ mil they were position at last season) should lead to most of there FAs leaving once more. Yes they cut guys because they always have a core nucleus of guys that they build around and just draft solid talent. Hence the body of work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 If he's available at that price, I'd do it in a heartbeat. +1 I don't really like Nicks and did not want him in the draft when we rumored to be interested. I preferred Maclin, but we traded up for Sanchez. If you can get him at that price I'd have to go for it. There was a time not too long ago when I thought he was making Victor Cruz and the Giants were going to have to pay him. Guess I was wrong about that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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