Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Wrong again. I wanted videos of FULL GAMES, I looked at his stats and read every scouting report I could find on him. I.E. I educated himself about him so i wouldn't make stupid statements comparing him to Irabu like you are. I guarantee if the yankees had signed him this thread wouldn't exist. You're just being a homer. Okay, fair enough, so you're gambling your scouting credibility on this guy, right? If he turns out to be a bust, or even mediocre, it's safe to say you don't know jack$hit about scouting talent Okay, I'll keep that in mind, this is Mike's mortal lock, a man he scouted with his own two eyes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haggis Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Holy crap this thread is hilarious. Ham, you've been gone too long. Welcome back! Btw, 120M??????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Okay, fair enough, so you're gambling your scouting credibility on this guy, right? If he turns out to be a bust, or even mediocre, it's safe to say you don't know jack$hit about scouting talent Okay, I'll keep that in mind, this is Mike's mortal lock, a man he scouted with his own two eyes I like how for you he's either going to be a hall of famer (which i never said) or a complete and utter bust. I don't claim to be a scout I just know that i know a hell of a lot more about this guy then you do and that your statements are idiotic and are only being made because he plays for boston. If i end up being wrong about him then i will have made informed guess and have been wrong. (in fact as a yankee fan i hope i'm wrong) But at least i'm not talking out of my ass like you are. As far as i'm concerned this argument is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Holy crap this thread is hilarious. Ham, you've been gone too long. Welcome back! Thanks Haggis BTW, I'm looking for revenge in our fantasy baseball league this year .. you got me last year, man, but this year my team will be loaded for bear .. know why? .. we're drafting the Japanese Sandy Koufax, Matsuzaka! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFJF Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Okay, fair enough, so you're gambling your scouting credibility on this guy, right? If he turns out to be a bust, or even mediocre, it's safe to say you don't know jack$hit about scouting talent Okay, I'll keep that in mind, this is Mike's mortal lock, a man he scouted with his own two eyes keep in mind ham that this is the same person who has spent hours on end trying to convince me that randy johnson was worth hanging on to at 17 mil per season because he wasn't bad last season...he was "unlucky" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 I like how for you he's either going to be a hall of famer (which i never said) or a complete and utter bust. I don't claim to be a scout I just know that i know a hell of a lot more about this guy then you do and that your statements are idiotic and are only being made because he plays for boston. If i end up being wrong about him then i will have made informed guess and have been wrong. (in fact as a yankee fan i hope i'm wrong) But at least i'm not talking out of my ass like you are. As far as i'm concerned this argument is over. I Just Quoted the NY Post .. TOPS OUT AT 92 .. and I contrasted that with the HIGH 90's hype YOU, OTOH, insist this cat is the real deal, based on EYE WITNESS accounts, so the only one talking out of his @$$ here is you .. and this guy better be dominant or you're gonna look like a fool .. and don't blame me, I didn't ask you to insist this guy is for real, that was your choice, you volunteered that observation and insisted he's for real Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 keep in mind ham that this is the same person who has spent hours on end trying to convince me that randy johnson was worth hanging on to at 17 mil per season because he wasn't bad last season...he was "unlucky" Wow nice way to bastardize my argument... And nice simplistic thinking. It's nowhere NEAR as simple as he was either bad or unlucky. So you admit the trade was a salary dump? Because it didn't make the team any better which was my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 I Just Quoted the NY Post .. TOPS OUT AT 92 .. and I contrasted that with the HIGH 90's hype YOU, OTOH, insist this cat is the real deal, based on EYE WITNESS accounts, so the only one talking out of his @$$ here is you .. and this guy better be dominant or you're gonna look like a fool .. and don't blame me, I didn't ask you to insist this guy is for real, that was your choice, you volunteered that observation and insisted he's for real I, Unlike you don't base everything on eye witness accounts. Thats why i did research about the guy as i've said. As far as him topping out at 92 thats just not true, but even if it is, it's a HORRIBLE reason to give as the sole reason a guy is going to be a bust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 keep in mind ham that this is the same person who has spent hours on end trying to convince me that randy johnson was worth hanging on to at 17 mil per season because he wasn't bad last season...he was "unlucky" WHAT?!?! Well, now I feel a lot better about Matsusaka Now I'm WAY MORE confident in the NY Post assessment as compared to Mike's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 I, Unlike you don't base everything on eye witness accounts. Thats why i did research about the guy as i've said. As far as him topping out at 92 thats just not true, but even if it is, it's a HORRIBLE reason to give as the sole reason a guy is going to be a bust. Mike, PAY ATTENTION, he came billed as a flame thrower, as being the proud owner of some HIGH 90's cheese .. but you should know that because you're the Japanese baseball scout, you should know he came billed as a flame thrower .. so if he tops out at 92 that's a huge red flag, it automatically debunks a big fat myth .. it turns out the HIGH HEAT was as real as the cartoon Gyroball, MYTH as opposed to REALITY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 WHAT?!?! Well, now I feel a lot better about Matsusaka Now I'm WAY MORE confident in the NY Post assessment as compared to Mike's Here's a quote from SI "Like Santana, Matsuzaka has a power pitcher's fastball, typically about 94 mph," Here's one from ESPN "Matsuzaka has a fastball that has been clocked as high as 100 mph," And here's what BA says about him "Who needs a gyroball? He has six pitches that grade out as plus or plus-plus at their best, and he'll be the best Japanese import ever. And no, we're not forgetting about Ichiro" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFJF Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 WHAT?!?! Well, now I feel a lot better about Matsusaka Now I'm WAY MORE confident in the NY Post assessment as compared to Mike's Yeah, it's hilarious...he's got all kinds of wonderful sabermetrics to show how Randy was nowhere near as bad as he actually was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Here's a quote from SI "Like Santana, Matsuzaka has a power pitcher's fastball, typically about 94 mph," Here's one from ESPN "Matsuzaka has a fastball that has been clocked as high as 100 mph," And here's what BA says about him "Who needs a gyroball? He has six pitches that grade out as plus or plus-plus at their best, and he'll be the best Japanese import ever. And no, we're not forgetting about Ichiro" DATES .. I NEED DATES Are those quotes recent, or back when the hype machine was in full force, when he was being portrayed as the new Japanese Nolan Ryan? That quote from the NY Post .. TOPS OUT AT AROUND 92 .. that was from THIS WEEK Which is exactly why I'm saying if this NY Post is right, this guy was a 120 Million Dollar hoax He'll go down as the most expensive sham in baseball history Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 DATES .. I NEED DATES Are those quotes recent, or back when the hype machine was in full force? That quote from the NY Post .. TOPS OUT AT AROUND 92 .. that was from THIS WEEK The ESPN quote was from last week. The SI article is from this week and the BA quote is from 2 weeks ago. And if you really think that meaningless ST innings change anything then you're deluding yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Here's another quote FROM THE NEW YORK POST THIS MONTH "Matsuzaka's fastball climbed as high as 94 mph and Uggla described it as "explosive."" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Yeah, it's hilarious...he's got all kinds of wonderful sabermetrics to show how Randy was nowhere near as bad as he actually was. Randy Johnson sucked .. pitched like a washed up hasbeen .. I would have given him away for nothing .. I would have been thankful just to unload that bloated contract .. so needless to say I was thrilled to recieve something {anything} in return Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 give me the link to the article you started this thread with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Here's another quote FROM THE NEW YORK POST THIS MONTH "Matsuzaka's fastball climbed as high as 94 mph Climbed as high, as in that was his fastest fastball? What happened to 99-100 MPH .. that was the hype, that was the myth, but where is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Climbed as high, as in that was his fastest fastball? What happened to 99-100 MPH .. that was the hype, that was the myth, but where is it? no one ever said he sat at 99-100. they had he sat at 92-94 and that he'd BEEN CLOCKED higher. 92-94 is more then hard enough when your secondary pitches are as good as this guys' are. Link to that post article please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 give me the link to the article you started this thread with. http://www.nypost.com/seven/03212007/sports/yankees/hes_the_kei_to_yanks_rotation_yankees_kevin_kernan.htm TURN TO PAGE 2 See I don't lie, I Just print the facts, nothing but the facts, even if the facts debunk the myth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 DATES .. I NEED DATES Are those quotes recent, or back when the hype machine was in full force, when he was being portrayed as the new Japanese Nolan Ryan? That quote from the NY Post .. TOPS OUT AT AROUND 92 .. that was from THIS WEEK Which is exactly why I'm saying if this NY Post is right, this guy was a 120 Million Dollar hoax He'll go down as the most expensive sham in baseball history Ham, how much less did the Yanks bid......would 25 mill less make the signing ok in your eyes? Everybody including the Yanks wanted the guy and threw stupid money at him. Painting the Sox as misinformed here before the guy plays a regular season game is why you are the Mayor of Mulligan's Island. BTW that NYPOST article is just a Yankee beat writer trying to slant a good Igawa performance as a possibility that he's better than Dice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 http://www.nypost.com/seven/03212007/sports/yankees/hes_the_kei_to_yanks_rotation_yankees_kevin_kernan.htm TURN TO PAGE 2 See I don't lie, I Just print the facts, nothing but the facts, even if the facts debunk the myth Thats not a news story. Thats an opinion column by Kevin Kernen who is a complete moron and you'd know that if you read any other of his articles. I guarantee you Kernan wouldn't know Matsuzaka if he tripped over him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Thats not a news story. Thats an opinion column by Kevin Kernen who is a complete moron and you'd know that if you read any other of his articles. I guarantee you Kernan wouldn't know Matsuzaka if he tripped over him. Well he's down in Florida watching him, are you? Look at where Kernan is reporting from .. the man is in Florida, following the Grapefruit league, and he's just reporting what he's seen and heard .. this dudes HIGH 90's CHEESE was a myth, just like his make-believe Gyroball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Well he's down in Florida watching him, are you? Look at where Kernan is reporting from .. the man is in Florida, following the Grapefruit league, and he's just reporting what he's seen and heard .. this dudes HIGH CHEESE was a myth, just like his make-believe Gyroball You know who Phil Hughes is? He's the guy in my avatar. he's considered the best pitching prospect in baseball. He's a power pitcher who has been compared to Roger Clemens. Do you know what his fastball sits at? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 You know who Phil Hughes is? He's the guy in my avatar. he's considered the best pitching prospect in baseball. He's a power pitcher who has been compared to Roger Clemens. Do you know what his fastball sits at? YES, but nobody ever said Phil Hughes hits the HIGH 90's and even triple digits on the gun, AS HAS BEEN SAID ABOUT THE NEW JAPANESE NOLAN RYAN .. Hughes fastball was always reported accurately, tops out at 94 or 95 .. but the new Japanese myth came billed as the proud owner of HIGH 90's Cheese, and that's all it turned out to be, a myth READ MY LIPS .. MYTHsusaka did not come AS ADVERTISED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 YES, but nobody ever said Phil Hughes hits the HIGH 90's and even triple digits on the gun, AS HAS BEEN SAID ABOUT THE NEW JAPANESE NOLAN RYAN .. Hughes fastball was always reported accurately, tops out at 94 or 95 .. but the new Japanese myth can billed as the proud owner of HIGH 90's Cheese, and that's all it turned out to be, a myth Hughes SITS at 91-93. And if he throws harder then that they YELL at him for overthrowing. The point is that Matsuzaka sits at 90-92 and thats PERFECTLY FINE. If you've read any scouting reports about him and knew anything about him as a pitcher, the reason people love him is NOT because he was a hard thrower in japan. The reason people think he's going to be good is because he has SIX pitches that he's able to throw for strikes. Kyle Farnsworth sits at 97 does that make him a great pitcher? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Here's one from ESPN "Matsuzaka has a fastball that has been clocked as high as 100 mph" no one ever said he {MYTHsusaka} sat at 99-100 I REST MY CASE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 I REST MY CASE That quote says he was CLOCKED AT 100. Thats VERY different from where a pitchers' fastball sits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Climbed as high, as in that was his fastest fastball? What happened to 99-100 MPH .. that was the hype, that was the myth, but where is it? Any link to where it was written that he was supposed to hit 99-100? Any at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Any link to where it was written that he was supposed to hit 99-100? Any at all? I beat you too it, and I have to thank Mike for finding that quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 I beat you too it, and I have to thank Mike for finding that quote you're completely misreading that quote. the fact that he once threw a ball 100 MPH dosn't mean thats where he sits or that he needs to throw that hard to succeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 That quote says he was CLOCKED AT 100. Thats VERY different from where a pitchers' fastball sits. Oh I see, so he can throw a 100 MPH fastball, but he chooses not too, opts instead for the low 90's Is that the same as the Gyroball .. he can throw it, but chooses not too? Common man, get real Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 I beat you too it, and I have to thank Mike for finding that quote That just says he hit 100.....that in no way means the advance report on him was high 90's as you've been implying. He was predicted to be like Santana, a good fastball in the 90's with lights out off speed stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Oh I see, so he can throw a 100 MPH fastball, but he chooses not too, opts instead for the low 90's Is that the same as the Gyroball .. he can throw it, but chooses not too? Common man, get real The reason he's good is NOT his fastball. And thats a fact you keep ignoring as you continue to concentrate on the stupid velocity argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Jets & Ham Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 you're completely misreading that quote. the fact that he once threw a ball 100 MPH dosn't mean thats where he sits or that he needs to throw that hard to succeed. Yeah I see what you mean, Mike .. he can throw 100 MPH, but he chooses not too .. wouldn't be fair to the hitters .. heck, I heard he can hit 120 MPH on the Gun if he wants to, but he'd rather not, rather not display his awesome power to the rest of us mere mortals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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