JohnnyHector Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 2007 Miami Dolphins Rushing Attempts Against - 32nd 2007 Miami Dolphins Rushing Yards Allowed - 32nd 2007 Miami Dolphins Rushing YPC Against - 30th 2007 Miami Dolphins Rushing TD's Allowed - 30th 2007 Miami Dolphins Fumbles Recovered - 27th 2008 Miami Dolphins Rushing Attempts Against - 7th 2008 Miami Dolphins Rushing Yards Allowed - 11th 2008 Miami Dolphins Rushing YPC Against - 12th 2008 Miami Dolphins Rushing TD's Allowed - 7th 2008 Miami Dolphins Fumbles Recovered - 9th Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norway'sWaddlingMarmaloof Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Wait, another LOCAL radio show...Max Kellerman to be exact had the same top of discussion on as Mike and Mike did... does Pennington deserve consideration for MVP??? I'm crazy for bringing it up though, it has zero merit, right? OK, You have Kellerman on board, well done. Now, to ensure your argument full credibility, you just need you some Screamin A. Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 2007 Miami Dolphins Rushing Attempts Against - 32nd 2007 Miami Dolphins Rushing Yards Allowed - 32nd 2007 Miami Dolphins Rushing YPC Against - 30th 2007 Miami Dolphins Rushing TD's Allowed - 30th 2007 Miami Dolphins Fumbles Recovered - 27th 2008 Miami Dolphins Rushing Attempts Against - 7th 2008 Miami Dolphins Rushing Yards Allowed - 11th 2008 Miami Dolphins Rushing YPC Against - 12th 2008 Miami Dolphins Rushing TD's Allowed - 7th 2008 Miami Dolphins Fumbles Recovered - 9th JH... where's the stat for "intangibles"? There has to be a clear indicator there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 OK, You have Kellerman on board, well done. Now, to ensure your argument full credibility, you just need you some Screamin A. Smith. nAB5lOIl-2U Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 JH... where's the stat for "intangibles"? There has to be a clear indicator there. Madden '08 Ratings for Intangibles Trent Green - 71 Cleo Lemon - 63 John Beck - 52 Madden '09 Ratings for Intangibles Chad Pennington - 98 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Madden '08 Ratings for Intangibles Trent Green - 71 Cleo Lemon - 63 John Beck - 52 Madden '09 Ratings for Intangibles Chad Pennington - 98 MVP!!!! Oh wait I found these Madden '09 Ratings for Haircuts Chad Pennington- 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashingjet Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 So you're saying that if we had Cleo Lemon under center, that we would still be 8-5 and tied for the division lead? I am willing to bet my left AND right testicle that we would be last in the division. I concede that the turnaround is attributed to the entire team being remarkably improved, but you cannot discount the job Chad has done for us. His 3,000 yards in 13 games and the fact that he throws .46 interceptions a game are a testament to the fine job that he is doing down here. Without him we are a much worse team. That alone makes him a valuable player for us, maybe even most valuable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 So you're saying that if we had Cleo Lemon under center, that we would still be 8-5 and tied for the division lead? I am willing to bet my left AND right testicle that we would be last in the division. I concede that the turnaround is attributed to the entire team being remarkably improved, but you cannot discount the job Chad has done for us. His 3,000 yards in 13 games and the fact that he throws .46 interceptions a game are a testament to the fine job that he is doing down here. Without him we are a much worse team. That alone makes him a valuable player for us, maybe even most valuable. Don't bet what you don't have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawn306 Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 2007 Dolphins Defense - 30th in points allowed 2008 Dolphins Defense - 9th in points allowed 2007 Dolphins Offense - 26th in points scored 2008 Dolphins Offense - 23rd in points scored 2007 Dolphins Offensive Red Zone Possessions - 7th least 2008 Dolphins Offensive Red Zone Possessions - 6th least (Tied) 2007 Dolphins Defensive Red Zone Possessions - 13th most, 32nd in opposing TD% (65.4%) 2008 Dolphins Defensive Red Zone Possessions - 24th most (Tied), 9th in opposing TD% (47.4%) I see the point about records. You're right that obviously there are difference makers on teams that have winning records and are competitive/heading to the playoffs. But I do think that those teams truly need to be broken down. IMO the Phins/Falcons have been more of a turnaround due to the TEAM. Both have similarities in the sense of horrid season, terrible losing culture/traumatic type years, new coach that turns it around. Like I said I think this is more due to the TEAM. Better D, better run game, good signings, etc. The MVP debate is very subjective but I will say that I agree that only teams that are competitive deserve to have their players in the discussion. I do not think Chad Pennington is amongst those meriting consideration. The point is is that right now he is probably not a candidate. If they win out though then maybe it is not as insane to think that. Like I said earlier the QB usually gets too much credit when a team is winning and too much of the blame when they lose. Is Pennington THE main reason the Fish are 8-5. No Is he A reason Yes. Maybe we will learn more that final week. Hopefully for all our sakes and sanity he tanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 So you're saying that if we had Cleo Lemon under center, that we would still be 8-5 and tied for the division lead? I am willing to bet my left AND right testicle that we would be last in the division. I concede that the turnaround is attributed to the entire team being remarkably improved, but you cannot discount the job Chad has done for us. His 3,000 yards in 13 games and the fact that he throws .46 interceptions a game are a testament to the fine job that he is doing down here. Without him we are a much worse team. That alone makes him a valuable player for us, maybe even most valuable. You forgot to mention his completion percentage. That's another one on that list of stats that are apparently more important than actually scoring points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashingjet Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Don't bet what you don't have. Oh man, that's rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 His 3,000 yards in 13 games and the fact that he throws .46 interceptions a game are a testament to the fine job that he is doing down here. The offense is 10th in total yards and 23rd in scoring. To what would you attribute that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashingjet Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 You forgot to mention his completion percentage. That's another one on that list of stats that are apparently more important than actually scoring points. Whoa, and the QB rating, can't forget that he has a 93 QB rating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashingjet Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 The offense is 10th in total yards and 23rd in scoring. To what would you attribute that? El Nino. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Oh man, that's rich It was there... had to take it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 So you're saying that if we had Cleo Lemon under center, that we would still be 8-5 and tied for the division lead? I am willing to bet my left AND right testicle that we would be last in the division. I concede that the turnaround is attributed to the entire team being remarkably improved, but you cannot discount the job Chad has done for us. His 3,000 yards in 13 games and the fact that he throws .46 interceptions a game are a testament to the fine job that he is doing down here. Without him we are a much worse team. That alone makes him a valuable player for us, maybe even most valuable. No, we are simply stating that your coaching staff is the biggest reason for the turnaround. (Schedule #2) Pennington has been Chad and Chad has shown a consistent ability to beat bad teams (which is noteworthy) Henning has worked wonders in the past, so I wouldn't be at all surprised if you had 6-7 wins today with McNown or Henne.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 El Nino. Would that also be why there are only 6 teams who have had fewer red zone possessions than Miami? CPF sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashingjet Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Would that also be why there are only 6 teams who have had fewer red zone possessions than Miami? CPF sucks. Dan Henning is sandbagging the offense untill week 17 when he will unleash a torrent of scoring drives. Or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsBlow99 Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Dan Henning is sandbagging the offense untill week 17 when he will unleash a torrent of scoring drives. Or not. Bold statement there.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillerPaul Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 I see CJ is still doing his thing getting you guys fired up. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashingjet Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Bold statement there.. I'm not serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 I see CJ is still doing his thing getting you guys fired up. lol Why didn't your damn team draft him like they were supposed to? Would've saved us a lot of grief you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashingjet Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 I see CJ is still doing his thing getting you guys fired up. lol Sometimes it's too easy. How're you doin' Stiller? Still riding that monstrous wave of a high after Sundays win? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Why didn't your damn team draft him like they were supposed to? Would've saved us a lot of grief you know. ... because they thought Plaxico would be a better offensive weapon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua4ever04 Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Absolutely not. Because any argument you can make for Chad Pennington as MVP, you can make a stronger one for Matt Ryan. I would agree that Matt Ryan has been better than Chad this year, but Chad is the single reason we are in the race. Without him, we'd be around 4-9 or in that neighborhood. He's been absolutely fantastic this year. I don't think he'll win, but he should get a couple of votes if we win out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 I would agree that Matt Ryan has been better than Chad this year, but Chad is the single reason we are in the race. Without him, we'd be around 4-9 or in that neighborhood. He's been absolutely fantastic this year. I don't think he'll win, but he should get a couple of votes if we win out. Yup, being at the helm of a bottom-10 scoring offense is really something to hang your hat on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 I would agree that Matt Ryan has been better than Chad this year, but Chad is the single reason we are in the race. Without him, we'd be around 4-9 or in that neighborhood. He's been absolutely fantastic this year. I don't think he'll win, but he should get a couple of votes if we win out. So your D, Ricky or Ronnie, have little to nothing to do with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua4ever04 Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 No, we are simply stating that your coaching staff is the biggest reason for the turnaround. (Schedule #2) Pennington has been Chad and Chad has shown a consistent ability to beat bad teams (which is noteworthy) Henning has worked wonders in the past, so I wouldn't be at all surprised if you had 6-7 wins today with McNown or Henne.. You are finding every excuse possible. At some point you're going to have to give credit to these players that are, ya' know, the guys that are actually playing the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua4ever04 Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 So your D, Ricky or Ronnie, have little to nothing to do with it. Did I say that? We've have GREAT defenses, Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams all here in the past. The simple fact is that not John Beck, Chad Henne or Josh McCown would have us where we are. Quarterback play is vital and we have one of the ten best in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua4ever04 Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Yup, being at the helm of a bottom-10 scoring offense is really something to hang your hat on... Why do you think our defense is playing so well? Chad keeps the team on the field and although we aren't lights out in the red zone, I would more likely attribute that to poor offensive line play. We don't get great push and often allow penetration, especially when the defense is close to the line of scrimmage. Chad has done more than enough for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Did I say that? We've have GREAT defenses, Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams all here in the past. The simple fact is that not John Beck, Chad Henne or Josh McCown would have us where we are. Quarterback play is vital and we have one of the ten best in the league. The reason Chad is so polarizing very simple. He doesn't do enough to win by himself, and doesn't do enough to lose. Here's the difference, IMO, that Chad is providing you. He isn't turning the ball over and allowing your defense and run game dictate the pace of the game. It is EXACTLY what Kerry Collins is doing in Tennessee. Would you say Kerry is in the top 10? He's not hurting you guys, that much I'll agree on, but winning games for you? Not so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 We've have GREAT defenses, Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams all here in the past. Did you just start watching the team this year? The defense was abysmal last year (worst against the run in football), Ricky Williams wasn't with the team, and Ronnie Brown went down for the year after 7 games. Quarterback play is vital and we have one of the ten best in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flgreen Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 I watch a lot of Fish football, and there are several reasons the Fish have improved so dramatically. Of course their CS has improved with Parcells coming in. Last years staff was horrible. The OL has improved greatly. They were even worst then the Jets last year. With two moves they rebuilt their OL. Signing Smilie was a biggie, and on the cheap. The Jets were interested in him last year, but Parcells jumped an got him right away. he has played better then Faneca this year. Problem with him is, he is always injured, and is again, which will hurt them. Both of their RB's were hurt last year. They are healthy this year. Porter is having a monster year, and as much as I hate the guy, no downplaying his value to this defense. Pennington was the straw that stirred the drink. I never understood the hatred for Pennington among Jets fans. He is not a HOF'er by any means but he is a very solid QB, who gives you 100%. It is going to be very difficult for either of the young QB's to unseat him as the starter. If they do he will be a great player coach type of back up. I wanted a QB change on the Jets, but I thought it would be Clemens beating out Pennington, and Pennington being his advisor and mentor. Clemens couldn't do it, and the Jets panicked, and made a major mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Why do you think our defense is playing so well? Chad keeps the team on the field and although we aren't lights out in the red zone, I would more likely attribute that to poor offensive line play. We don't get great push and often allow penetration, especially when the defense is close to the line of scrimmage. Chad has done more than enough for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua4ever04 Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 The reason Chad is so polarizing very simple. He doesn't do enough to win by himself, and doesn't do enough to lose. Here's the difference, IMO, that Chad is providing you. He isn't turning the ball over and allowing your defense and run game dictate the pace of the game. It is EXACTLY what Kerry Collins is doing in Tennessee. Would you say Kerry is in the top 10? He's not hurting you guys, that much I'll agree on, but winning games for you? Not so much. We commit fewer mistakes than any team in the league, we are near the top in time of possession and all of that is attributed to Chad. You're right, he's not going to chuck up 400 yards and win the 38-31 shootouts. But he will put the opposing offense in long field position by taking care of the ball and moving it consistently, and he'll keep your offense on the field and put up enough points to win more games than he loses. Chad Pennington is twice the quarterback Kerry Collins is. But he has done some amazing things in the fourth quarter to capture or preserve victories. Four differnet times this year we have possessed the ball for 10 minutes in the fourth quarter and each included a lengthy touchdown drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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