Star Wars Mafia

[CTM]

You didn't think that when you were echoing my push to NOT investigate DPR and to investigate Doggin instead.... which now looks like you were leveraging my known innocence to protect DPR... it was smart to stay in step with me and going after DPR on day 2, it helped you get your distancing position thus setting you up for a nice "gambit" or whatever you guys call it.

Well played, if true.

ohh man.. i was echoeing it?

So you we're pied pipering me?

ok..

[Sharrow]

It's a fluid situation.

Why are you behind this reveal?

Well, tbh, I'm not sure how much I'm behind it anymore considering the lack of both confidence and sense that I've seen here. But I was behind it because I was feeling confident in our ability to sift through the bull**** once it was all out there. We did a pretty good job of knocking the **** out of DPR's reveal afterall. Crusher's too, imo.

[Integrity28]

lol.. none taken dude..

You don't seem to realize the pattern we are going to fall into here and my suggestion was a means to expediate it and possibly trip up scum in the process.

You can force me to reveal, and then move on to the next target, force them to reveal and wash, rinse, repeat, till we've had our mass reveal, albeit in much less advantageous terms to the town. Go down that path, if you must, town leader..

I'm not advocating that we force you to reveal CTM. I am advocating that we lynch you.

I will either prove or disprove what I posted above about you and DPR, it'll vet SMC's position... it'll shed some light on Vic, Sharrow... even possible Crusher... and in the meantime... it doesn't add any NEW reveals to the mix.

At some point we are going to have to lynch some fake reveals... my suggestion is starting with yours.

[Pac]

lol.. none taken dude..

You don't seem to realize the pattern we are going to fall into here and my suggestion was a means to expediate it and possibly trip up scum in the process.

You can force me to reveal, and then move on to the next target, force them to reveal and wash, rinse, repeat, till we've had our mass reveal, albeit in much less advantageous terms to the town. Go down that path, if you must, town leader..

or we can lynch Kleck (who I genuinely feel good about lynching), then dispose of you tomorrow or the day after. I think it's highly unlikely you avoid Vaders lightsabre too many more nights given your mysterious, incredibly powerful role.

[CTM]

Well, tbh, I'm not sure how much I'm behind it anymore considering the lack of both confidence and sense that I've seen here. But I was behind it because I was feeling confident in our ability to sift through the bull**** once it was all out there. We did a pretty good job of knocking the **** out of DPR's reveal afterall. Crusher's too, imo.

100% true that mass claim is off the table if more then a few people are against it, needs to be voting majority unanimous..

[Integrity28]

ohh man.. i was echoeing it?

So you we're pied pipering me?

ok..

If memory serves correct, I began resisting blindly following JVORs plan and was alone in that resistance until you took up my side in the argument. Now it could be that we are both equally distrusting... OR you saw the known innocent taking a position that benefited DPR at the time, and you chose to exploit it... knowing fully how to distance yourself from DPR after the fact.

I can go back and dig it all up... if you want.

[CTM]

I'm not advocating that we force you to reveal CTM. I am advocating that we lynch you.

I will either prove or disprove what I posted above about you and DPR, it'll vet SMC's position... it'll shed some light on Vic, Sharrow... even possible Crusher... and in the meantime... it doesn't add any NEW reveals to the mix.

At some point we are going to have to lynch some fake reveals... my suggestion is starting with yours.

might be the booze talking, but honestly I'd love to do that now so that I don't have read any more of your self congratulatory back patting you've been giving yourself for a few days..

[CTM]

If memory serves correct, I began resisting blindly following JVORs plan and was alone in that resistance until you took up my side in the argument. Now it could be that we are both equally distrusting... OR you saw the known innocent taking a position that benefited DPR at the time, and you chose to exploit it... knowing fully how to distance yourself from DPR after the fact.

I can go back and dig it all up... if you want.

please do..

[Integrity28]

You don't want to hear what i've really got.

And, i like you, andrew, so i'll refrain..

Were you the one that said it was super scummy when Pac used my name in the fat & happy game???

[CTM]

Were you the one that said it was super scummy when Pac used my name in the fat & happy game???

yes!

it was a joke ,sherlock..

[CTM]

or we can lynch Kleck (who I genuinely feel good about lynching), then dispose of you tomorrow or the day after. I think it's highly unlikely you avoid Vaders lightsabre too many more nights given your mysterious, incredibly powerful role.

I don't think i said powerful, I said the towns position would be comprimised.. and you'll agree, i reckon, when you see the death scene..

[Integrity28]

yes!

it was a joke ,sherlock..

That's why I asked... I kinda figured. Sorry next time I will use:

[Integrity28]

please do..

JVOR first suggests his plan...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564597&postcount=861

I begin diggin my heels in, and presenting my opposition to his plan...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564615&postcount=873

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564623&postcount=878

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564647&postcount=893

You kicked the tires with about 2 posts in between JVOR launching his plan, as I built up momentum, and right here is where you began to start echoing my concerns with the plan...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564675&postcount=920

JVOR finally gives us the results on Doggin...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1565173&postcount=1244

Then you decide to buck the plan and stay on Doggin, a move I thought was pure townie at the time...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1565182&postcount=1252

Then you advocate going after DPR on day 2... thus setting you up for the rest of the game with a revealed power role and plenty of distance between you and both Doggin and DPR. At this point I hadn't weighed in...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1565185&postcount=1255

[Integrity28]

Hmmm... DPR gone. CTM gone...

[CTM]

JVOR first suggests his plan...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564597&postcount=861

I begin diggin my heels in, and presenting my opposition to his plan...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564615&postcount=873

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564623&postcount=878

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564647&postcount=893

You kicked the tires with about 2 posts in between JVOR launching his plan, as I built up momentum, and right here is where you began to start echoing my concerns with the plan...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1564675&postcount=920

JVOR finally gives us the results on Doggin...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1565173&postcount=1244

Then you decide to buck the plan and stay on Doggin, a move I thought was pure townie at the time...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1565182&postcount=1252

Then you advocate going after DPR on day 2... thus setting you up for the rest of the game with a revealed power role and plenty of distance between you and both Doggin and DPR. At this point I hadn't weighed in...

http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1565185&postcount=1255

My first post after reading it was concern with the plan.. when i asked him, i thought we got to pick who you voted?

We we're arguing similiar positions, i wasn't following your lead.. seriously, reread it with a mindset that you aren't the only one who has good ideas and you'll see that several of independantly thought it was a bad idea.

[CTM]

Hmmm... DPR gone. CTM gone...

doh! wrong again..

lol..

i feel bad for you at this point.. but i'm also laughing at your over confidence, you need some humble pie me thinks..

[The Crusher]

Alright... just cracked open a beer... and in the process I decided that all this steering is for the birds.

CTM has pushed back on giving us ANY details about his supposed role... and simultaneously suggested and persisted in discussing a group role reveal.

At this point, I think we've seen enough "I agree with so-and-so's" to know that if we are going to risk lynching a town role to learn things... then that town role can be CTM, just as easily as anyone else... because in CTM's own words... everyone is going to reveal now.

So, by his own rationale, CTM is as good a person to start with as any. CTM's affiliation helps clarify quite a bit about the game... and where it is at this point.

**** the competing trains.

Unvote Brett

Vote CTM

This is what CTM does. He's directing the town towards ANYONE he can get them to lynch.

unvote

vote Chan The manipulator

[Klecko73isGod]

Just got caught up after being offline all weekend with the exception of a couple of draft updates. Man that was nice.

First of all, Pac continues to be an idiot with no clue who absolultely sucks at this game.

Second, I find it pretty funny that a couple of people who've been posting fairly sparingly when compared to others (Hess and AVM) are pissed that I am not posting enough for their liking, with Hess going so far as to call me the worst mafia player of all time. This, for me, is reminiscent of the assheads who watch way too much poker on TV and play online all the time only to get pissed when you take a big pot off of them in an actual game because you didn't play it by the book and they question your poking playing ability after you just took a wad of cash off of them.

Look, I know I suck at this game. But part of the reason I suck is because my past history of playing was so screwed up. Not to mention that some pricks here have no patience for people who are new and are trying to learn the game which automatically puts you on the defensive which makes you look guilty and an easy pickoff for a scum team that is already hurting early in the game.

Third, I really fail to see how a mass reveal of town power roles is in any way helpful to the town. Now I know you guys have all played more than I have and someone can surely explain the benefits of it to me. But with the mafia already down one player and the SK gone, all a mass reveal would do at this point is help the mafia IMO.

Thats just my two cents.

[Integrity28]

My first post after reading it was concern with the plan.. when i asked him, i thought we got to pick who you voted?

We we're arguing similiar positions, i wasn't following your lead.. seriously, reread it with a mindset that you aren't the only one who has good ideas and you'll see that several of independantly thought it was a bad idea.

I post with conviction, to get reactions out of those I suspect... it makes me laugh, when I post the "AHA!!!! I'VE GOT YOU NOW!!!!"

I had re-read it a couple times previously, and had defended you... but it can be painted both ways.

doh! wrong again..

lol..

i feel bad for you at this point.. but i'm also laughing at your over confidence, you need some humble pie me thinks..

You feel bad for me? Hold on let me change my vote.

I am 3/3 on successful lynches going back to last game... if I am wrong about you, I am due for it... but something tells me I might not be.

PS - When have you known me not to be trying to make people laugh?

[Integrity28]

This is what CTM does. He's directing the town towards ANYONE he can get them to lynch.

unvote

vote Chan The manipulator

Fat boy. You'd better be town...

[HessStation]

Just got caught up after being offline all weekend with the exception of a couple of draft updates. Man that was nice.

First of all, Pac continues to be an idiot with no clue who absolultely sucks at this game.

Second, I find it pretty funny that a couple of people who've been posting fairly sparingly when compared to others (Hess and AVM) are pissed that I am not posting enough for their liking, with Hess going so far as to call me the worst mafia player of all time. This, for me, is reminiscent of the assheads who watch way too much poker on TV and play online all the time only to get pissed when you take a big pot off of them in an actual game because you didn't play it by the book and they question your poking playing ability after you just took a wad of cash off of them.

Look, I know I suck at this game. But part of the reason I suck is because my past history of playing was so screwed up. Not to mention that some pricks here have no patience for people who are new and are trying to learn the game which automatically puts you on the defensive which makes you look guilty and an easy pickoff for a scum team that is already hurting early in the game.

Third, I really fail to see how a mass reveal of town power roles is in any way helpful to the town. Now I know you guys have all played more than I have and someone can surely explain the benefits of it to me. But with the mafia already down one player and the SK gone, all a mass reveal would do at this point is help the mafia IMO.

Thats just my two cents.

Er, if I called you worst mafia player of all time, that was mean and I'm sorry. But I think I was saying you're playing like the worst town player, if town, so far this game...yeah I'm pretty sure that's what I was saying. Highlighted is the first time you've given any personal thought into the game which is the first time makes me think you more town. Kudos for saying anything. I think that's been the point all along.

I would think you know that by now so I still don't completely get the you woe is me I don't know how to play thing you sometimes get into.

[SMC]

I would like to hear SMC, Dan, Crusher and Klecks view on this mass reveal. I guess that would be for tomorrow. I'm passing out on my couch here.

I think it's bogus. Thus far, there are 13 players out there still alive. Only I have come clean and what I can do. CTM has been "outed" but refuses to tell us what it is he can do. Also, despite CTM's "power" he hasn't done a damn thing beneficial to the town with it.

I would have to believe there is a cop out there. That person can still get us good intel. If he/she outs herself then the cop is an easy NK target. So what is that person to do? Lie to protect him/herself? Then lying will jeapordize that person later because he/she will be harder to believe.

I think the best course of action now that others have chimed in is to

Vote: CTM

And, no, I'm not double voting. The pied piper keeps on spewing nonsense and then attacks people who questions his tactics and veracity.

[Klecko73isGod]

Er, if I called you worst mafia player of all time, that was mean and I'm sorry. But I think I was saying you're playing like the worst town player, if town, so far this game...yeah I'm pretty sure that's what I was saying. Highlighted is the first time you've given any personal thought into the game which is the first time makes me think you more town. Kudos for saying anything. I think that's been the point all along.

I would think you know that by now so I still don't completely get the you woe is me I don't know how to play thing you sometimes get into.

Fair enough. Some people tend to take this game too seriously, especially considering that it is meant to be a fun time-killing type of thing, and it felt to me like that's what you were doing there.

Anyway I am too confused at this point to make a serious case against anybody. Some players seem scummy to me but there really isn't a strong case to be made against them.

If I am going to vote for anyone right now, I need to be more convinced.

[HessStation]

I think it's bogus. Thus far, there are 13 players out there still alive. Only I have come clean and what I can do. CTM has been "outed" but refuses to tell us what it is he can do. Also, despite CTM's "power" he hasn't done a damn thing beneficial to the town with it.

I would have to believe there is a cop out there. That person can still get us good intel. If he/she outs herself then the cop is an easy NK target. So what is that person to do? Lie to protect him/herself? Then lying will jeapordize that person later because he/she will be harder to believe.

I think the best course of action now that others have chimed in is to

Vote: CTM

And, no, I'm not double voting. The pied piper keeps on spewing nonsense and then attacks people who questions his tactics and veracity.

I think if you were to double vote and CTM got lynched b/c of it, and flipped town, you're a goner so I'm comfortable with this.

[Dan.]

Wow, what an active weekend! I'm reading now and will post from my phone as much as I can throughout the day.

[SMC]

I think if you were to double vote and CTM got lynched b/c of it, and flipped town, you're a goner so I'm comfortable with this.

Exactly.

[Bleedin Green]

Vote Count

Klecko (2) - AVM, CTM

Sharrow (1) - JiF

brettw4rd (1) - Vicious

Crusher (1) - brettw4rd

CTM (5) - Integrity, Hess, Pac, Crusher, SMC

With 13 players remaining, it takes 7 to feed the Sarlacc.

[Dan.]

I think it's bogus. Thus far, there are 13 players out there still alive. Only I have come clean and what I can do. CTM has been "outed" but refuses to tell us what it is he can do. Also, despite CTM's "power" he hasn't done a damn thing beneficial to the town with it.

I would have to believe there is a cop out there. That person can still get us good intel. If he/she outs herself then the cop is an easy NK target. So what is that person to do? Lie to protect him/herself? Then lying will jeapordize that person later because he/she will be harder to believe.

I think the best course of action now that others have chimed in is to

Vote: CTM

And, no, I'm not double voting. The pied piper keeps on spewing nonsense and then attacks people who questions his tactics and veracity.

Yeah, I don't see how a mass reveal is helpful to anyone but scum. Especially with the numbers in our favor like they are now, and this early in the game. I'll look back at things more carefully, but I'm pretty surprised anyone was even considering the idea.

Near the end of the last game, Bleedin' suggested a mass reveal. Even then, I didn't go for it. And CTM was not advocating it either ... so it definitely gives me pause that this was his idea.

[Dan.]

exactly... like does the real doc protect himself or the doc that night. Gives scum a 50/50 chance they take out one of the 2 major roles and if they shoot correctly both in 2 consecutive nights.

Sure they lose one but I'd take that trade if I were them... just like they did in the fat and happy game when me (doc) was lynched and SMC (cop) was killed 2 night phases later.. it only took that 2nd night phase because you incorrectly thought Hess was the cop.. that wouldn't happen under your current plan as again... they'd know who everyone is and target accordingly.

Your plan is dog crap.

This is the obvious issue. I'm really shocked some people think this is a good idea at this point in the game. In this game of souped up roles, why tell them all that we've got. One of our many advantages right now is that the scum don't know what's out there.

[CTM]

Again, you guys crack me up who refuse to consider something that is used commmely in other places, and has enough validity here to atleast consider due to all the other roles that are likely in this game. Monkeybrain in particular, with his vast experiance of 2 games, is particularly amusing..

So, it's frustrating, plain and simple..

Further, the fact that people like pac and smc aren't even commenting on crusher is a head scratcher that i hope you remember later. The role crusher described as well as his attitude are entirely anti-town but because hes claiming a personal crisis, it's excusable for him to have a role that sounds an awful lot like emperor to me..

I wish i had some kind of personal issue to point to, but just plain old frustration really. There's 13 players alive in this game, once I reveal, we'll unwittingly be 1/3 of the way to a massclaim which is really the worst case scenario, as scum will have an increasingly narrow window to shoot into for the cop (and doctor will have no idea who to protect)

Anyway, sharrow and I are a rebel team. Night 1 I was looking for him (this is what DPR observed) and guessed wrong, he found me night 2 due to some bread crumbs i left in thread. (and ftr, the crusher case was his intially and 100% his research)

I alluded to this being powerful for the town later, cause it is, 2 confirmed innocents for the price at one is huge at end game. (If the cop reveals an innocent on either on of us, we're both confirmed) Plus the ability to work together off thread and trust someone 100% is huge, just like it is for scum. Additionally as i said, this position was taken before SMC and crusher alsio revealed to have roles. With there almost definitely being a cop and a doc in this game, it's fairly clear that everyone is roled at this point

I wouldn't be surprised if you still think this is some scum gambit, but w/e, it's too hard trying to convince you anymore cause some of you are working against the town and others not nearly as clever at this game as they imagine themselves to be. If you stop to think about it though, there's no chance scum would make a play like this...

Anyway, if crusher and smc are innocent, which most of you people believe, and there' 3 scum left, + 1 kill and who knows how many roles reveals left today and tomorrow, that leaves at most people for whom they can mine for the cop now, and their odds will only be better tomorrow night. We're basically aquiring all the risks of mass claiming with none of benefits. but yeah, it's a horrible idea..

[CTM]

Yeah, I don't see how a mass reveal is helpful to anyone but scum. Especially with the numbers in our favor like they are now, and this early in the game. I'll look back at things more carefully, but I'm pretty surprised anyone was even considering the idea.

Near the end of the last game, Bleedin' suggested a mass reveal. Even then, I didn't go for it. And CTM was not advocating it either ... so it definitely gives me pause that this was his idea.

As mass reveal in a game of conversions makes no sense. A mass reveal in a game in which we're serially forcing everyone to reveal anyway makes more sense.

What is going to happen is that fter several of these, the town will get impatient and lynch the latest one, ratehr then the one that makes the least sense..

This is the obvious issue. I'm really shocked some people think this is a good idea at this point in the game. In this game of souped up roles, why tell them all that we've got. One of our many advantages right now is that the scum don't know what's out there.

First and foremost cause we are getting there anyway, we'll be all the way to a mass claim soon enough, but get none of the benefits..

[HessStation]

Again, you guys crack me up who refuse to consider something that is used commmely in other places, and has enough validity here to atleast consider due to all the other roles that are likely in this game. Monkeybrain in particular, with his vast experiance of 2 games, is particularly amusing..

So, it's frustrating, plain and simple..

Further, the fact that people like pac and smc aren't even commenting on crusher is a head scratcher that i hope you remember later. The role crusher described as well as his attitude are entirely anti-town but because hes claiming a personal crisis, it's excusable for him to have a role that sounds an awful lot like emperor to me..

I wish i had some kind of personal issue to point to, but just plain old frustration really. There's 13 players alive in this game, once I reveal, we'll unwittingly be 1/3 of the way to a massclaim which is really the worst case scenario, as scum will have an increasingly narrow window to shoot into for the cop (and doctor will have no idea who to protect)

Anyway, sharrow and I are a rebel team. Night 1 I was looking for him (this is what DPR observed) and guessed wrong, he found me night 2 due to some bread crumbs i left in thread. (and ftr, the crusher case was his intially and 100% his research)

I alluded to this being powerful for the town later, cause it is, 2 confirmed innocents for the price at one is huge at end game. (If the cop reveals an innocent on either on of us, we're both confirmed) Plus the ability to work together off thread and trust someone 100% is huge, just like it is for scum. Additionally as i said, this position was taken before SMC and crusher alsio revealed to have roles. With there almost definitely being a cop and a doc in this game, it's fairly clear that everyone is roled at this point

I wouldn't be surprised if you still think this is some scum gambit, but w/e, it's too hard trying to convince you anymore cause some of you are working against the town and others not nearly as clever at this game as they imagine themselves to be. If you stop to think about it though, there's no chance scum would make a play like this...

Anyway, if crusher and smc are innocent, which most of you people believe, and there' 3 scum left, + 1 kill and who knows how many roles reveals left today and tomorrow, that leaves at most people for whom they can mine for the cop now, and their odds will only be better tomorrow night. We're basically aquiring all the risks of mass claiming with none of benefits. but yeah, it's a horrible idea..

So your reveal is that you and Sharrow are rebel town who can work together through PMs? just want to clarify here.

[Sharrow]

So your reveal is that you and Sharrow are rebel town who can work together through PMs? just want to clarify here.

Is your head still up your own ass? Just want to clarify here.

[SMC]

No, CTM, a mass reveal in this game makes no sense. Pac earlier referred to the Fat game (non conversion), which Dan quoted. The fact that the cop wasn't killed earlier (me) is because you as scum thought Hess was the cop.

No need for other reveals. What we need, at least for now, is for Sharrow to confirm your claim.

If he does so, then I say we pursue someone else. We can go Crusher, perhaps.

[SMC]

Is your head still up your own ass? Just want to clarify here.

Do you confirm?