Judging QB's in Todays NFL

[Dunnie]

Dunnie, I will respond as much as I like to and I will not look at Matt Stafford stats because he is 35 years of age and not the future of the NFL. 
 

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[JustInFudge]

6 hours ago, Biggs said:

Last year Joe Borrow went 1 and looks like he's going to be great.  Mac Jones is going to go in the top 10.   Kyle Murray hasn't broken into the top half of the league in QBR.   Derrick Carr and Kirk Cousins both were in the top 10 in QBR last year. 

This is nonsense.  Drew Brees was old without mobiity and had a rag arm last year he still was able to be in the top 6 and go 9 and 3 in his starts.

Guys who can see it react to it get the ball out on time, basically the ability to process and react accurately will always be top NFL QB's.    Kurt Warner walked out of a grocery store and put up HOF numbers based on his ability to distribute the ball accurately almost nothing more to his game. 

It's not nonsense.  See my response to Sperm, I think I make my point better, maybe.  Joe is an underrated athlete.    Kurt Warner is totally irrelevant to this conversation. 

You're a GM, you're building a franchise today are you taking  Derek Carr or Kirk Cousins over; Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson, Deshaun Watson, Patrick Mahomes, Justin Herbert, Kyler Murrary?  lmfao

[JustInFudge]

7 hours ago, adb280z said:

Matt Ryan is still productive.

Stafford had to play in Detroit, the only franchise in the NFL that might be more inept than the Jets.

sorry, didnt see this...35 and 36 respectively.  

[Grandy]

On 4/22/2021 at 7:47 AM, JiFapono said:

The torch has been passed, the statues are a dying breed and lets be real, they've all sucked for a while now except for Brady.  QB first, athlete last is done and over with and a thing of old.  The position is about athleticism, smarts, competitiveness and leadership.  The future of this league is filled with athletic freaks who happen to play QB; Mahomes, Allen, Watson, Murray, Herbert, Jackson, Prescott.   Even the older dudes who are still balling, Tannehill, Wilson, Rodgers - all athletes first.  Manning's, Brady, Brees, Rivers - statues who can throw the ball - those days are long long long gone.

This is how it is. Athlete/QB hybrids are the new trend in picking QB's and it tends to work. Just look at recent QB successes. All had some specialty of mobility or arm talent. Scouting has also adjusted for this. Wilson, Lawrence Fields, and Lance all have rare mobility and Arm talent/strength. In this day and age, true pocket QB's finding success is rare without there being many years of experience behind the.

Statue QB's work when a QB has enough experience, and teams are opting to give athletics freaks a bigger shot than guys who come into the NFL smart but with unspectacular natural talent. It's risky, but as it can be seen it pays off. 

[Smashmouth]

17 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Brees was always a rollout QB at his best. What made him a "freak" was his pinpoint accuracy. What made the others "freaks" was their arm strength and/or accuracy. 

I get your rationale, but I think you're just seeing a combo of changes in what's ultimately a very small subset. There were always "athletic" QBs getting drafted (however you want to subjectively grade them as being such). Most failed. 

Would Kyler Murray have gone #1 overall 10 years ago? Perhaps, perhaps not, but if not it's more a function of negativity towards short-QB bias than running-QB bias. Vick was Kyler Murray years before, and he went #1. Brees was short without Vick's wheels, and was passed on in round 1 outright. Vick was the next-generation QB.

What's also changed is the college game: ultra-mobile QBs in college aren't just coached to be RBs who can throw a little better than the other RBs. Throw in some other-reason bias if you will, as some of that existed too, but of late imo that's what's what's leading them to get drafted higher.

I'm not even going to delve deeply into your who sucks / who doesn't list. I think it'd result in subjective rationalizations of what's holding some QBs back and what's elevating others. I'd expect ignoring successes as insignificant while magnifying failures, in a way that a preferred-list of QBs isn't subject to.

All I think this is really? A greater number of QBs coming out are more mobile than previously. However I think it's an argument too far that the game's passed by those that aren't. Those others being retired is totally irrelevant, seeing how if they weren't retired they wouldn't be unsuccessful. Playing a way that's passed by, they were still beating up on pretty much everyone.

If a QB is field-smart & can throw, the game's not passing him by. Good QBs are good and bad QBs are bad, and there's more to it than waist-down mobility (which I sense you know, despite this line of argument). In any era, Peyton Manning becomes a HOF QB and despite their 40 times Blaine Gabbert, Geno Smith, Brett Hundley, etc. aren't. What made Tannehill night & day better than Mariota wasn't his greater mobility; it was his passing. 

What people fail to realize about QB's is that brain power trumps speed/scrambling every single time.

A QB who can read a defense pre snap and get the ball out quick will be much better off than a guy scrambling to avoid the rush who usually has to take his attention somewhere else while scrambling, then re-focus down field while the guy dropping back to pass understands movement in the pocket and can get the ball out quick and can keep his eyes down field as the play develops. 

The athletic QB is also going to take more high impact hits especially the running athletic QB see how long that lasts in the NFL. There's a reason why guys like Brady, Brees, Rivers, Rapist and Rodgers lasted so long they are in incredible shape and work out in the offseason to stay in great shape, plus they don't take an over abundance of big hits. How long did Cam Newton and Micheal Vick last ? Also the fact that athletic role out type QB's can not sustain that type of play into their mid 30's should be considered. Also a role out scrambling QB can not be nearly as accurate as a pocket passer. In this athletic NFL some seem to be touting guys like Brady would have never stepped on an NFL field 

[Sperm Edwards]

7 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

What people fail to realize about QB's is that brain power trumps speed/scrambling every single time.

A QB who can read a defense pre snap and get the ball out quick will be much better off than a guy scrambling to avoid the rush who usually has to take his attention somewhere else while scrambling, then re-focus down field while the guy dropping back to pass understands movement in the pocket and can get the ball out quick and can keep his eyes down field as the play develops. 

The athletic QB is also going to take more high impact hits especially the running athletic QB see how long that lasts in the NFL. There's a reason why guys like Brady, Brees, Rivers, Rapist and Rodgers lasted so long they are in incredible shape and work out in the offseason to stay in great shape, plus they don't take an over abundance of big hits. How long did Cam Newton and Micheal Vick last ? Also the fact that athletic role out type QB's can not sustain that type of play into their mid 30's should be considered. Also a role out scrambling QB can not be nearly as accurate as a pocket passer. In this athletic NFL some seem to be touting guys like Brady would have never stepped on an NFL field 

You fool -- they're not athletes. These unathletic HOF QBs. Bet anything that none of them can walk & chew gum at the same time. They're totally unathletic, yo.