Judging QB's in Todays NFL

[Smashmouth]

Only one real way to judge a QB and that's above his shoulders, unfortunately there is no real way to put a number or measurable to brain power or should I say the speed at which your brain can process information. Not only do you have to understand the game, a huge playbook and put the work in to do so but you also must process information within a 2 second window and be dealing with what 10 other players are doing as well while processing that information.

If you have 4 receivers running 4 different routes (wr wr te rb) you need to know each route and also how the protections are set, have a feel for the rush, and have the footwork mechanics and quickness to make the play. There is a hell of a lot going on in less than 3 seconds and that's not even including if the play breaks down so with all that being said there is 100% no way to say how a player will respond to the constant pressure of the NFL since even the bad pass rushing teams will get to you faster than they will in college where most of these QB's are on superior teams and the day in day out pressure is simply not there like it is in the NFL.

If I was picking a QB, not giving a damn what analysts have to say but by what I've seen, it would be Mac Jones due to his footwork and very fast release. Now that could go down in flames but so can Zack, Trevor and Justin. Mac Jones runs a 4.8 40 that's not super fast but its far from slow so when a play breaks down and you find a huge running lane you can easily pick up yardage and slide to end the play. Also 4.3 speed does not translate to moving well in the pocket which Mac Jones seems to do incredibly well just like an extremely slow Tom Brady and Peyton Manning (happy feet and all) were able to do. If Peyton Manning and Tom Brady were unknowns and were in this draft ask yourself where would they be drafted ? Would we be hearing all the crap about how slow they are and how a guy like Justin Fields is a better athlete at a position which we all, knowing what we know about said 2 QB's is absolute horse sh*t. No one, even on this board, would take an incredible athletic QB over Peyton or Brady and to even suggest it would be pure stupidity.

So why are we worrying so much about the athlete and not things that are most important about the QB position ? Joe Montana could move/run well probably also ran in the 4.8 range Brady ran a 5.2 40 which is starting to get in the realm of slow. To me the QB position is about throwing the football and good footwork in the pocket can nullify a pass rush just as good as running for your life. While some fans think the NFL is changing so drastically it really is not you still have to master the fundamentals of the game to be successful. Athletes are all comparable to their time period when it comes to the speed of the game and the size of players but in todays so called high flying NFL there are still QB's and offenses from the 80's 90's and early 2000's that hold records to this day and damn near every one of them were pocket passers and not really incredible athletes yet people are still looking for the athlete. Not to mention running QB's like a Fields or a Lawrence usually have shortened injury prone careers with a few really good years mixed in Cam Newton comes to mind think his running and bravado early in his career didn't have an effect ? Lets see where Lamar's running gets him as the years pass other than shorting his career if he keeps going 1 and out in the playoffs it will shorten quicker. 

Bottom line is we look at QB's measurables and go with the best guy in that regard and that's flawed logic IMO picking a QB is and always will be a crap shoot. Sure you hope the guy who checks all the boxes physically works out but ask yourself how often does the perfect guy work out ? Not very often.

 

[JetsFanShawn]

4 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

Only one real way to judge a QB and that's above his shoulders, unfortunately there is no real way to put a number or measurable to brain power or should I say the speed at which your brain can process information. Not only do you have to understand the game, a huge playbook and put the work in to do so but you also must process information within a 2 second window and be dealing with what 10 other players are doing as well while processing that information.

If you have 4 receivers running 4 different routes (wr wr te rb) you need to know each route and also how the protections are set, have a feel for the rush, and have the footwork mechanics and quickness to make the play. There is a hell of a lot going on in less than 3 seconds and that's not even including if the play breaks down so with all that being said there is 100% no way to say how a player will respond to the constant pressure of the NFL since even the bad pass rushing teams will get to you faster than they will in college where most of these QB's are on superior teams and the day in day out pressure is simply not there like it is in the NFL.

If I was picking a QB, not giving a damn what analysts have to say but by what I've seen, it would be Mac Jones due to his footwork and very fast release. Now that could go down in flames but so can Zack, Trevor and Justin. Mac Jones runs a 4.8 40 that's not super fast but its far from slow so when a play breaks down and you find a huge running lane you can easily pick up yardage and slide to end the play. Also 4.3 speed does not translate to moving well in the pocket which Mac Jones seems to do incredibly well just like an extremely slow Tom Brady and Peyton Manning (happy feet and all) were able to do. If Peyton Manning and Tom Brady were unknowns and were in this draft ask yourself where would they be drafted ? Would we be hearing all the crap about how slow they are and how a guy like Justin Fields is a better athlete at a position which we all, knowing what we know about said 2 QB's is absolute horse sh*t. No one, even on this board, would take an incredible athletic QB over Peyton or Brady and to even suggest it would be pure stupidity.

So why are we worrying so much about the athlete and not things that are most important about the QB position ? Joe Montana could move/run well probably also ran in the 4.8 range Brady ran a 5.2 40 which is starting to get in the realm of slow. To me the QB position is about throwing the football and good footwork in the pocket can nullify a pass rush just as good as running for your life. While some fans think the NFL is changing so drastically it really is not you still have to master the fundamentals of the game to be successful. Athletes are all comparable to their time period when it comes to the speed of the game and the size of players but in todays so called high flying NFL there are still QB's and offenses from the 80's 90's and early 2000's that hold records to this day and damn near every one of them were pocket passers and not really incredible athletes yet people are still looking for the athlete. Not to mention running QB's like a Fields or a Lawrence usually have shortened injury prone careers with a few really good years mixed in Cam Newton comes to mind think his running and bravado early in his career didn't have an effect ? Lets see where Lamar's running gets him as the years pass other than shorting his career if he keeps going 1 and out in the playoffs it will shorten quicker. 

Bottom line is we look at QB's measurables and go with the best guy in that regard and that's flawed logic IMO picking a QB is and always will be a crap shoot. Sure you hope the guy who checks all the boxes physically works out but ask yourself how often does the perfect guy work out ? Not very often.

 

THE JETS BUTTEM LINE THEY NEED A QB   

[CTM]

4 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

Only one real way to judge a QB and that's above his shoulders, unfortunately there is no real way to put a number or measurable to brain power or should I say the speed at which your brain can process information. Not only do you have to understand the game, a huge playbook and put the work in to do so but you also must process information within a 2 second window and be dealing with what 10 other players are doing as well while processing that information.

If you have 4 receivers running 4 different routes (wr wr te rb) you need to know each route and also how the protections are set, have a feel for the rush, and have the footwork mechanics and quickness to make the play. There is a hell of a lot going on in less than 3 seconds and that's not even including if the play breaks down so with all that being said there is 100% no way to say how a player will respond to the constant pressure of the NFL since even the bad pass rushing teams will get to you faster than they will in college where most of these QB's are on superior teams and the day in day out pressure is simply not there like it is in the NFL.

If I was picking a QB, not giving a damn what analysts have to say but by what I've seen, it would be Mac Jones due to his footwork and very fast release. Now that could go down in flames but so can Zack, Trevor and Justin. Mac Jones runs a 4.8 40 that's not super fast but its far from slow so when a play breaks down and you find a huge running lane you can easily pick up yardage and slide to end the play. Also 4.3 speed does not translate to moving well in the pocket which Mac Jones seems to do incredibly well just like an extremely slow Tom Brady and Peyton Manning (happy feet and all) were able to do. If Peyton Manning and Tom Brady were unknowns and were in this draft ask yourself where would they be drafted ? Would we be hearing all the crap about how slow they are and how a guy like Justin Fields is a better athlete at a position which we all, knowing what we know about said 2 QB's is absolute horse sh*t. No one, even on this board, would take an incredible athletic QB over Peyton or Brady and to even suggest it would be pure stupidity.

So why are we worrying so much about the athlete and not things that are most important about the QB position ? Joe Montana could move/run well probably also ran in the 4.8 range Brady ran a 5.2 40 which is starting to get in the realm of slow. To me the QB position is about throwing the football and good footwork in the pocket can nullify a pass rush just as good as running for your life. While some fans think the NFL is changing so drastically it really is not you still have to master the fundamentals of the game to be successful. Athletes are all comparable to their time period when it comes to the speed of the game and the size of players but in todays so called high flying NFL there are still QB's and offenses from the 80's 90's and early 2000's that hold records to this day and damn near every one of them were pocket passers and not really incredible athletes yet people are still looking for the athlete. Not to mention running QB's like a Fields or a Lawrence usually have shortened injury prone careers with a few really good years mixed in Cam Newton comes to mind think his running and bravado early in his career didn't have an effect ? Lets see where Lamar's running gets him as the years pass other than shorting his career if he keeps going 1 and out in the playoffs it will shorten quicker. 

Bottom line is we look at QB's measurables and go with the best guy in that regard and that's flawed logic IMO picking a QB is and always will be a crap shoot. Sure you hope the guy who checks all the boxes physically works out but ask yourself how often does the perfect guy work out ? Not very often.

 

The position is evolving

Most/all? Of the best young QBs bring a physical element Mahommes, watson, allen, etc. That's not a coincidence 

[jeremy2020]

5 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

Only one real way to judge a QB and that's above his shoulders, unfortunately there is no real way to put a number or measurable to brain power or should I say the speed at which your brain can process information..

yea, well, Ryan Fitzpatrick went to Harvard if you hadn't heard.

[Sperm Edwards]

16 hours ago, CTM said:

The position is evolving

Most/all? Of the best young QBs bring a physical element Mahommes, watson, allen, etc. That's not a coincidence 

All other things being equal, no one prefers someone slower, but I don't think Mahomes belongs in the same major dual-threat category as Watson & Allen (let alone the sprinter-speed guys like Murray or Jackson).

IMO Mahomes is a lot more like Herbert or Prescott - or what Z.Wilson's billed as being - which is mobile like Rodgers: certainly not a statue, and more of a scrambling behind the LOS threat than a forward rushing threat; however if there's enough daylight he'll be able to gain 20 yards or more (while he's young) and not just be limited to 7 yards before sliding like a lead-footed veteran.

I'm not an expert on these two prospects, but it seems Mahomes is a lot more like Wilson than like Fields in terms of real dual-threat rushing, and that hasn't seemed to hurt the planet's best QB. So not to be a jerk here (it comes so naturally, I admit), but it seems you made an argument that proved too much.

If Wilson doesn't pan out it'll be because he sucks, not because he can't run a sub-4.5 40.

[rangerous]

6 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

Only one real way to judge a QB and that's above his shoulders, unfortunately there is no real way to put a number or measurable to brain power or should I say the speed at which your brain can process information. Not only do you have to understand the game, a huge playbook and put the work in to do so but you also must process information within a 2 second window and be dealing with what 10 other players are doing as well while processing that information.

If you have 4 receivers running 4 different routes (wr wr te rb) you need to know each route and also how the protections are set, have a feel for the rush, and have the footwork mechanics and quickness to make the play. There is a hell of a lot going on in less than 3 seconds and that's not even including if the play breaks down so with all that being said there is 100% no way to say how a player will respond to the constant pressure of the NFL since even the bad pass rushing teams will get to you faster than they will in college where most of these QB's are on superior teams and the day in day out pressure is simply not there like it is in the NFL.

If I was picking a QB, not giving a damn what analysts have to say but by what I've seen, it would be Mac Jones due to his footwork and very fast release. Now that could go down in flames but so can Zack, Trevor and Justin. Mac Jones runs a 4.8 40 that's not super fast but its far from slow so when a play breaks down and you find a huge running lane you can easily pick up yardage and slide to end the play. Also 4.3 speed does not translate to moving well in the pocket which Mac Jones seems to do incredibly well just like an extremely slow Tom Brady and Peyton Manning (happy feet and all) were able to do. If Peyton Manning and Tom Brady were unknowns and were in this draft ask yourself where would they be drafted ? Would we be hearing all the crap about how slow they are and how a guy like Justin Fields is a better athlete at a position which we all, knowing what we know about said 2 QB's is absolute horse sh*t. No one, even on this board, would take an incredible athletic QB over Peyton or Brady and to even suggest it would be pure stupidity.

So why are we worrying so much about the athlete and not things that are most important about the QB position ? Joe Montana could move/run well probably also ran in the 4.8 range Brady ran a 5.2 40 which is starting to get in the realm of slow. To me the QB position is about throwing the football and good footwork in the pocket can nullify a pass rush just as good as running for your life. While some fans think the NFL is changing so drastically it really is not you still have to master the fundamentals of the game to be successful. Athletes are all comparable to their time period when it comes to the speed of the game and the size of players but in todays so called high flying NFL there are still QB's and offenses from the 80's 90's and early 2000's that hold records to this day and damn near every one of them were pocket passers and not really incredible athletes yet people are still looking for the athlete. Not to mention running QB's like a Fields or a Lawrence usually have shortened injury prone careers with a few really good years mixed in Cam Newton comes to mind think his running and bravado early in his career didn't have an effect ? Lets see where Lamar's running gets him as the years pass other than shorting his career if he keeps going 1 and out in the playoffs it will shorten quicker. 

Bottom line is we look at QB's measurables and go with the best guy in that regard and that's flawed logic IMO picking a QB is and always will be a crap shoot. Sure you hope the guy who checks all the boxes physically works out but ask yourself how often does the perfect guy work out ? Not very often.

 

good points here.  as it's said, football is a game of inches.  the qb doesn't have to move a lot, just enough so that 40 speed is near meaningless.  get the guy who know which player to throw to, is accurate, decisive, and can feel the rush (and not fumble).

[Smashmouth]

6 hours ago, jeremy2020 said:

yea, well, Ryan Fitzpatrick went to Harvard if you hadn't heard.

And that makes Fitz a smart guy it certainly does not mean he can process all the things a QB must do within 2 seconds

[Smashmouth]

6 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

All other things being equal, no one prefers someone slower, but I don't think Mahomes belongs in the same major dual-threat category as Watson & Allen (let alone the sprinter-speed guys like Murray or Jackson).

IMO Mahomes is a lot more like Herbert or Prescott - or what Z.Wilson's billed as being - which is mobile like Rodgers: certainly not a statue, and more of a scrambling behind the LOS threat than a forward rushing threat; however if there's enough daylight he'll be able to gain 20 yards or more (while he's young) and isn't not just be limited to 7 yards before sliding like a lead-footed veteran.

I'm not an expert on these two prospects, but it seems Mahomes is a lot more like Wilson than like Fields in terms of real dual-threat rushing, and that hasn't seemed to hurt the planet's best QB. So not to be a jerk here (it comes so naturally, I admit), but it seems you made an argument that proved too much.

If Wilson doesn't pan out it'll be because he sucks, not because he can't run a sub-4.5 40.

very well said and i feel the same way with Jones ..he wont be a bad QB because he cant run a sub 4.8 40

[Smashmouth]

7 hours ago, JetsFanShawn said:

THE JETS BUTTEM LINE THEY NEED A QB   

That's not in question here at all. We are 100% taking a QB in this draft.

[Smashmouth]

7 hours ago, CTM said:

The position is evolving

Most/all? Of the best young QBs bring a physical element Mahommes, watson, allen, etc. That's not a coincidence 

So the position is changing would you take a Lamar Jackson over a Peyton Manning in todays modern evolving NFL knowing what you currently know ?

[The Crusher]

51 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

So the position is changing would you take a Lamar Jackson over a Peyton Manning in todays modern evolving NFL knowing what you currently know ?

Peyton Manning neck broke 

[CTM]

1 hour ago, Smashmouth said:

So the position is changing would you take a Lamar Jackson over a Peyton Manning in todays modern evolving NFL knowing what you currently know ?

I'd take Mahommes over manning 

[The Crusher]

16 minutes ago, CTM said:

I'd take Mahommes over manning 

Least his neck ain’t broke 

[Jet Nut]

7 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

All other things being equal, no one prefers someone slower, but I don't think Mahomes belongs in the same major dual-threat category as Watson & Allen (let alone the sprinter-speed guys like Murray or Jackson).

IMO Mahomes is a lot more like Herbert or Prescott - or what Z.Wilson's billed as being - which is mobile like Rodgers: certainly not a statue, and more of a scrambling behind the LOS threat than a forward rushing threat; however if there's enough daylight he'll be able to gain 20 yards or more (while he's young) and isn't not just be limited to 7 yards before sliding like a lead-footed veteran.

I'm not an expert on these two prospects, but it seems Mahomes is a lot more like Wilson than like Fields in terms of real dual-threat rushing, and that hasn't seemed to hurt the planet's best QB. So not to be a jerk here (it comes so naturally, I admit), but it seems you made an argument that proved too much.

If Wilson doesn't pan out it'll be because he sucks, not because he can't run a sub-4.5 40.

Add Rodgers to that list.  Rodgers & Mahomes are not Allen, Jackson types.  

More to the point theres more than one way to play the position.  

[jeremy2020]

3 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

And that makes Fitz a smart guy it certainly does not mean he can process all the things a QB must do within 2 seconds

He also scored a 38 on the wonderlic if you hadn't heard

[SayNoToDMC]

I as a person lack basic empathy. Not a skill I can learn no matter how hard I try. I live off principle and loyalty. Give me that guy and he'll run through a wall, arm is a plus. Rest is BS

[SayNoToDMC]

10 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

All other things being equal, no one prefers someone slower, but I don't think Mahomes belongs in the same major dual-threat category as Watson & Allen (let alone the sprinter-speed guys like Murray or Jackson).

IMO Mahomes is a lot more like Herbert or Prescott - or what Z.Wilson's billed as being - which is mobile like Rodgers: certainly not a statue, and more of a scrambling behind the LOS threat than a forward rushing threat; however if there's enough daylight he'll be able to gain 20 yards or more (while he's young) and isn't not just be limited to 7 yards before sliding like a lead-footed veteran.

I'm not an expert on these two prospects, but it seems Mahomes is a lot more like Wilson than like Fields in terms of real dual-threat rushing, and that hasn't seemed to hurt the planet's best QB. So not to be a jerk here (it comes so naturally, I admit), but it seems you made an argument that proved too much.

If Wilson doesn't pan out it'll be because he sucks, not because he can't run a sub-4.5 40.

Honestly him panning out comes down to the reconstructed shoulder. How many years are we getting? If he lasted as long as we hope. I honestly always liked you but thought ypunhated me. You're articulate. I'm blunt. TS just sucks, lol

 

Edit: I should put stuff in English first. FU Tom, you should have messaged me about the yearly JN draft. I thought we were friends. I'm on team Joewilly ?

[Irish Jet]

6 hours ago, CTM said:

I'd take Mahommes over manning 

If you put Manning's 2004 team in today's NFL they would get a touchdown on every drive.

The QB's haven't gotten better. The new league is just trash. Hence old man Brady and Brees still look incredible with one foot in the grave, 

[JustInFudge]

The torch has been passed, the statues are a dying breed and lets be real, they've all sucked for a while now except for Brady.  QB first, athlete last is done and over with and a thing of old.  The position is about athleticism, smarts, competitiveness and leadership.  The future of this league is filled with athletic freaks who happen to play QB; Mahomes, Allen, Watson, Murray, Herbert, Jackson, Prescott.   Even the older dudes who are still balling, Tannehill, Wilson, Rodgers - all athletes first.  Manning's, Brady, Brees, Rivers - statues who can throw the ball - those days are long long long gone.

[FidelioJet]

On 4/22/2021 at 2:17 AM, SayNoToDMC said:

Honestly him panning out comes down to the reconstructed shoulder. How many years are we getting? If he lasted as long as we hope. I honestly always liked you but thought ypunhated me. You're articulate. I'm blunt. TS just sucks, lol

 

Edit: I should put stuff in English first. FU Tom, you should have messaged me about the yearly JN draft. I thought we were friends. I'm on team Joewilly ?

It's not a reconstructed shoulder.  It's not even close to that.   

It's was a repaired Labrum.  It's pretty standard which multiple QB's have had.  Drew Brees being one of them.  I wonder if ZW playing to 42 would be too young for many around here.

[Jet Nut]

33 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

The torch has been passed, the statues are a dying breed and lets be real, they've all sucked for a while now except for Brady.  QB first, athlete last is done and over with and a thing of old.  The position is about athleticism, smarts, competitiveness and leadership.  The future of this league is filled with athletic freaks who happen to play QB; Mahomes, Allen, Watson, Murray, Herbert, Jackson, Prescott.   Even the older dudes who are still balling, Tannehill, Wilson, Rodgers - all athletes first.  Manning's, Brady, Brees, Rivers - statues who can throw the ball - those days are long long long gone.

And yet the biggest statue of them all and at 42 for bonus points will get his 7th SB ring in a few months.

The death of the drop back QB has been predicted for years.  Doesnt help when people wrongly point to Rodgers, Mahomes, Herbert and a Prescott as proof.  Smarts, competitiveness and leadership have always been part of the equation.   Produce a Manning, Brady, Brees, Rivers they'll thrive just ike they did in their times, maybe more given the changing rules/calls

 

[Sperm Edwards]

6 hours ago, jeremy2020 said:

He also scored a 38 on the wonderlic if you hadn't heard

48

So did Greg McElroy.

Its almost as though having 720 seconds to answer 50 questions/problems doesn’t translate to the ~2.7 seconds taken to throw the average NFL pass. 

It’d maybe be more relevant if it was a series of fast-answer-only problems (<5 seconds, visual problems with pattern recognitions not multi-sentence reading), where each question/problem is timed individually and not cumulatively. A QB doesn’t get rewarded with 6 seconds to throw on his third attempt just because he threw 2 in a row in 1.5 seconds and had therefore built up a bank of extra time to throw later.

It may prove a little bit useful in predicting one to grasp play book concepts outright (more than no test at all), and if they were all equally trained to answer the fast ones first because they’re all worth the same. But more like “yeah good enough” pass-fail than “a 40 leads to a better and smarter QB than a 30, because that’s not shown. Beyond grasping concepts off the field (when there’s no time constraint) it has no value in quick decision making after the ball’s snapped. 

Vince Young (allegedly) needed the play book stripped down because it was too complicated for him to grasp it all. While that limited him (and his teams), he was still a far better QB than Greg McElroy, who could’ve written the playbook, then accurately calculated the statistical success probability of each play vs. each defense, then translated it into 3 languages with perfect grammar. Meanwhile up against a Chargers D that'd averaged under 2 sacks/game, McElroy took 11 sacks in his only NFL start, getting the snot beat out of him while deciding where to throw it. 

[playtowinthegame]

The competition you play is a big factor imho. When you're playing at BYU it's like you're playing in Double-A instead of Triple-A before making the jump to the "Big Leagues." I just hope if we draft Zach Wilson we make him redshirt his rookie year and let Captain Morgan take the beatings while we get the offensive line figured out. If we draft Justin Fields I would have no problem starting him because the dude is built for the NFL. 

[JustInFudge]

4 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

And yet the biggest statue of them all and at 42 for bonus points will get his 7th SB ring in a few months.

The death of the drop back QB has been predicted for years.  Doesnt help when people wrongly point to Rodgers, Mahomes, Herbert and a Prescott as proof.  Smarts, competitiveness and leadership have always been part of the equation.   Produce a Manning, Brady, Brees, Rivers they'll thrive just ike they did in their times, maybe more given the changing rules/calls

 

Do you actually read posts?  Or just assume what they say and respond?  I literally pointed out Brady as the anomaly in my very first sentence.  Literally in the very first sentence of that post, I pointed out they've all sucked for a while now, except Brady as the anomaly.  He's an outlier.  The league has officially changed.  It's not a prediction anymore, it's an actual, happening.  Brady is not the future of the NFL.  The future of the NFL are the names I provided and they're all freak athletes.  

[Biggs]

Nobody is picking a QB based on physical measurables alone.   The entire process for every team looking for a franchise QB is aimed at getting into their heads.  

 

[Biggs]

10 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

So the position is changing would you take a Lamar Jackson over a Peyton Manning in todays modern evolving NFL knowing what you currently know ?

Not ever.  

[Jet Nut]

52 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Do you actually read posts?  Or just assume what they say and respond?  I literally pointed out Brady as the anomaly in my very first sentence.  Literally in the very first sentence of that post, I pointed out they've all sucked for a while now, except Brady as the anomaly.  He's an outlier.  The league has officially changed.  It's not a prediction anymore, it's an actual, happening.  Brady is not the future of the NFL.  The future of the NFL are the names I provided and they're all freak athletes.  

Do you even read what you write?  You said word for word, copied and pasted:

Manning's, Brady, Brees, Rivers - statues who can throw the ball - those days are long long long gone.

This is what I responded to, dont fog over it.  Your words, to the letter.

Even here you cover for your initial post and then go and repeat the same point one more time: 

It's not a prediction anymore, it's an actual, happening.  Brady is not the future of the NFL. 

What makes Mahomes a physical freak?  His arm?  People said these same things about Cunningham, Elway, Moon, S Young, McNair, Vick, McNabb etc

[Biggs]

9 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Add Rodgers to that list.  Rodgers & Mahomes are not Allen, Jackson types.  

More to the point theres more than one way to play the position.  

Yes!

Let's also not lose sight of the fact that Rodgers and Mahomes have an athletic creativity to their game that can only happen because of the physical tools they possess.   That's also the reason Zach Wilson is now the consensus No. 2 prospect in this draft.  

[Dunnie]

The position is evolving
Most/all? Of the best young QBs bring a physical element Mahommes, watson, allen, etc. That's not a coincidence 

No ... its just what colleges are producing... the term evolving is utter nonsense.... how else can you explain the continued success of slow brady?

One could say the kids coming out simply cant do the same things anymore so THEY and THEIR teams adapt ..but there is no evolution ....

Please explain the evolution when Mike Vick was doing the same things 20 years ago.

I'll take Warren Moon over Mike Vick a thousand times over for his arm talent and accuracy....

For this reason I agree ... Zach is the no 1 QB this year and I even understand the Mac Jones argument ... he just doesn't have the same arm.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

[Jet Nut]

17 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Yes!

Let's also not lose sight of the fact that Rodgers and Mahomes have an athletic creativity to their game that can only happen because of the physical tools they possess.   That's also the reason Zach Wilson is now the consensus No. 2 prospect in this draft.  

Agree totally.  Theyre top athletes and add that athleticism to their game and it helps make them top QBs.  But theyre not changing the game forever and making a Manning obsolete and claiming their times have past.   

[Jet Nut]

13 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

No ... its just what colleges are producing... the term evolving is utter nonsense.... how else can you explain the continued success of slow brady?

One could say the kids coming out simply cant do the same things anymore so THEY and THEIR teams adapt ..but there is no evolution ....

Please explain the evolution when Mike Vick was doing the same things 20 years ago.

I'll take Warren Moon over Mike Vick a thousand times over for his arm talent and accuracy....

For this reason I agree ... Zach is the no 1 QB this year and I even understand the Mac Jones argument ... he just doesn't have the same arm.

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Well said.  Vick, McNabb, Moon, their have been lots of QBs who used their athleticism along with the fundamentals you have to possess as a QB to help make them better QBs.  

When you get down to it, you still have to be able to throw, read defenses, process what youre seeing and deliver a good pass on time.  

When people complain about Mac Jones, its not that he cant run, its that he isnt even mobile within the pocket to the degree that others are.  Mahomes is mobil with the pocket and can buy the time to make those wild angled throws but that he can run when he has to doesnt make him Murray, Jackson or Allen

[Sperm Edwards]

36 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

The torch has been passed, the statues are a dying breed and lets be real, they've all sucked for a while now except for Brady.  QB first, athlete last is done and over with and a thing of old.  The position is about athleticism, smarts, competitiveness and leadership.  The future of this league is filled with athletic freaks who happen to play QB; Mahomes, Allen, Watson, Murray, Herbert, Jackson, Prescott.   Even the older dudes who are still balling, Tannehill, Wilson, Rodgers - all athletes first.  Manning's, Brady, Brees, Rivers - statues who can throw the ball - those days are long long long gone.

Lol

Brady just won a SB. In his bifocal years.

Brees rewrote record books in large part by rolling out to throw, often throwing in the run, not by standing still like a statue whose feet need to be set just-so. He nearly got to the SB as well this year, despite what's very advanced age for the NFL.

Rivers made the playoffs as such a "statue" QB; years past his prime; and did so throwing to just meh has-beens, never weres, and a raw rookie. 

There's so much more that's wrong with this post it's probably not worth the effort to dissect further; like listing dramatically dissimilar QBs as the same type, the absurd idea that great pocket QBs are non-athletes, or as though what wins in the game today is suddenly different than just 10 years ago.

A field-smart QB with an accurate, strong-enough arm and a quick release is and will always be an asset. If he's also super mobile, hey even better, but that's neither a substitute for lesser passing skills nor even a requirement to QB one's team to a Super Bowl. 

[Biggs]

1 hour ago, JiFapono said:

Do you actually read posts?  Or just assume what they say and respond?  I literally pointed out Brady as the anomaly in my very first sentence.  Literally in the very first sentence of that post, I pointed out they've all sucked for a while now, except Brady as the anomaly.  He's an outlier.  The league has officially changed.  It's not a prediction anymore, it's an actual, happening.  Brady is not the future of the NFL.  The future of the NFL are the names I provided and they're all freak athletes.  

Brady is a freak athlete.  The ability to see the play and react the way Brady does is the definition of freak athlete.  

Larry Bird was a big slow white guy who was an absolute freak athlete.

[JustInFudge]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Do you even read what you write?  You said word for word, copied and pasted:

Manning's, Brady, Brees, Rivers - statues who can throw the ball - those days are long long long gone.

This is what I responded to, dont fog over it.  Your words, to the letter.

Even here you cover for your initial post and then go and repeat the same point one more time: 

It's not a prediction anymore, it's an actual, happening.  Brady is not the future of the NFL. 

What makes Mahomes a physical freak?  His arm?  People said these same things about Cunningham, Elway, Moon, S Young, McNair, Vick, McNabb etc

And now the goal posts change.  I don’t even know why I try with you.  And yet still, what I said was 100% accurate.  1 statue remains.  Brady.  The rest are gone and done.  The future are physical freaks.  If you don’t understand how Mahomes is a physical freak, well, that’s not my problem.  

[JustInFudge]

13 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Brady is a freak athlete.  The ability to see the play and react the way Brady does is the definition of freak athlete.  

Larry Bird was a big slow white guy who was an absolute freak athlete.

Ok cool.  Even better.  Only physical freaks are playing the position well.