UDFA WR Hamze El-Zayat

[JohnnyLV]

8 hours ago, JiFtheOracle said:

 

It's a great moment but it's sort of cruel too. For probably an hour he is 95% certain he is getting cut and then JD just tortures him some more.

[JiFtheOracle]

18 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Yeah what on earth would compel a person to do such a thing?

 

lmfao - too be clear, it wasnt an insult @Warfish, he was trying to be cute, which he totally achieved but we all know him too well at this point and we know he's the biggest underdog fan in the world.  He should change his name to WarfishTheUnderdogFan.  It's catchy and what the cool posters are doing these days.

 

[#27TheDominator]

Just now, JiFtheOracle said:

JSN had 630 total yards from and 4 TD's last year.  The Seahawks had to spend a 1st rounder for that production.

Gipson had 1200 total yards and 2 TD's last year.  The Jets used zero draft picks for that production.

Well, I'm not really looking to chase the guy out of the thread.  If his argument is the Jets should have spent more resources on WR (it was his argument last season) fine.  If it is that he doesn't like these specific players?  Fine.  He may have a point that we tend to like WRs in camp reports because the "flash" every year since the tweet will always mention their every catch . 

It's the part where he acts like all UDFA are irrelevant where he is super far off base.   There probably isn't a team in the league that didn't give significant snaps to UDFA rookies and some develop into guys like Bryce Huff.  

[Warfish]

1 minute ago, JiFtheOracle said:

lmfao - too be clear, it wasnt an insult @Warfish

I'll be the judge of that, thanks. 

I get a distinct feeling I wholesale dismissed you as a trolling gaslighting liar who doesn;t believe any of his own post, you'd not likely take that well ol' friend.

1 minute ago, JiFtheOracle said:

.....we all know him too well at this point and we know he's the biggest underdog fan in the world.  He should change his name to WarfishTheUnderdogFan.  It's catchy and what the cool posters are doing these days.

Naaa, it's kinda like tats, at this point I never got one, so not gonna bother now in my 50's.  Same for name changes, I've been Warfish all along, no point changing it now.  Although maybe WarfishisaFatLiar might be something some guys might prefer, possibly?

[JiFtheOracle]

2 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Well, I'm not really looking to chase the guy out of the thread.  If his argument is the Jets should have spent more resources on WR (it was his argument last season) fine.  If it is that he doesn't like these specific players?  Fine.  He may have a point that we tend to like WRs in camp reports because the "flash" every year since the tweet will always mention their every catch . 

It's the part where he acts like all UDFA are irrelevant where he is super far off base.   There probably isn't a team in the league that didn't give significant snaps to UDFA rookies and some develop into guys like Bryce Huff.  

I dont know what you're trying to do here, have you ever seen the movie Rudy?  Do you know the name Buster Douglas?  We you not alive for Wayne Chrebet's career? Did you know Tom Brady was a 7th round pick?

[Warfish]

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Well, I'm not really looking to chase the guy out of the thread.

No stress, wasn't chased away, was just thinking of giving the trhead back to talk about this kid at this point, like yall wanted to is all.

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

If his argument is the Jets should have spent more resources on WR (it was his argument last season) fine.

It's been my argument for most of three decades now.

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

If it is that he doesn't like these specific players?  Fine.

I don't know this kid here, at all.  

I'm not a fan of Gipson or Brownlee, but happily, they both may get a chance to prove me wrong this season.

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

He may have a point that we tend to like WRs in camp reports because the "flash" every year since the tweet will always mention their every catch.

I get more bent out of shape by fan hype sometimes than I should.  I've said it many times, there are often moments and topics where I simply do not understand you all, my fellow fans, very well at all.  I don't seem to think like yall think in many cases.

3 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

It's the part where he acts like all UDFA are irrelevant where he is super far off base.   There probably isn't a team in the league that didn't give significant snaps to UDFA rookies and some develop into guys like Bryce Huff.  

A tiny minority become valuable, but in general and overall, they're camp bodies and first round cuts mostly.

[JiFtheOracle]

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'll be the judge of that, thanks. 

I get a distinct feeling I wholesale dismissed you as a trolling gaslighting liar who doesn;t believe any of his own post, you'd not likely take that well ol' friend.

Naaa, it's kinda like tats, at this point I never got one, so not gonna bother now in my 50's.  Same for name changes, I've been Warfish all along, no point changing it now.  Although maybe WarfishisaFatLiar might be something some guys might prefer, possibly?

You know what, you're right.  That was rude.  I wasnt trying to be insulting but when you put it that way, you're right.  Maybe you didnt realize how big of an underdog fan you were and I just assumed you were trying to be cute.  I should have taken a more open minded approach and provide a more educational response. 

For that, I apologize, but I said nothing about your weight!   

 

 

 

 

[Jet_Engine1]

34 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Naaa, it's kinda like tats, at this point I never got one, so not gonna bother now in my 50's.  

Hey! Same here! I managed to make through the Service and the Fire Department (Where every kid under 35 looks like he did 30 years in the Pacific Fleet in the 1920's) and every time I've ever thought of getting a Tat (I'm not against them, my wife has one), I always found a better use for the money. At this point, why bother?? LOL

[#27TheDominator]

26 minutes ago, Warfish said:

No stress, wasn't chased away, was just thinking of giving the trhead back to talk about this kid at this point, like yall wanted to is all.

It's been my argument for most of three decades now.

I don't know this kid here, at all. 

A tiny minority become valuable, but in general and overall, they're camp bodies and first round cuts mostly.

I don't know much about this kid either.  I know he tested badly enough that I wondered if he had an injury or reason.  The fact he was a tryout player that made it makes him even more unlikely.  

Valuable.  Define it.  Worthy of huge Huff style contracts?  Sure.  Several will make the team.  It will matter a great deal if they suck-suck, are JAGs or turn out to be good.  The Jets WR room has Wilson, Williams, Lazard, and Corley.  I can pretty much guarantee you that at least two more make the 53 and probably four more if you count the practice squad.  Roster spots, even practice squad slots, are by definition valuable.  Just because guys don't make pro bowls they still have value to the team. 

Personally, I was hoping to hear more from Brownlee.  The silence on him has been deafening.  FWIW, the two guys they just signed Brandon Smith from Iowa (out since 2021 with the Cowboys and Cards) and Winstead, the UFL kid who was with the 49ers last year's camp are both bigger dudes who don't seem to get much separation.  Harrell is a rocket, but has almost no production through ages of college and we don't hear his name much in camp.  If he shows any promise he'd be a practice squad candidate, but presumably if coaches at Alabama, Miami and Louisville didn't train him up we are unlikely to see anything from him 

[Warfish]

5 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Valuable.  Define it.

For me, full time starter who produces at league averages (or close) for his position.

Underproducing starters because we don't have anybody better, 3rd string backups, depth guys, practice squad bodies, camp bodies, of course those have value too.  But they're not meaningful, their value isn't really meaningful (well, if they play specials are are very good at that, that has value too).  They don't play, if they do they don't produce, and they're effectively interchangeable with any other random street FA Vet, UDFA or other fringe talent.

Lets be honest though, most times if some UDFA rookie #6 WR on your roster has to play alot of snaps, they usually suck, and the team usually sucks.  They're not often contributing in a meaningful way to winning, or winning titles.  Gipson played last year, so yes, that has value.  He just didn't play very well, outside his glorious forever-to-be-remembered-return TD in week 1. 

Are there exceptions to this, sure, there are exceptions to everything, just look at Purdy in San Fran, no Mr. Irrelevant becomes a Franchise QB.

I want to see a Jets WR room where this kind of hand-wringing or interest (pro or con) just isn't necessary.  Because we're that damn good at WR.  There are many teams, good teams, likely title-contending teams, whose fanbases don't have to be all hope and dream about unknown UDFA WR's.  Because those guys won't make their teams, and if they do, they'll never see the field.

If that's a pipe dream, so be it.  

 

[Sperm Edwards]

48 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I don't know much about this kid either.  I know he tested badly enough that I wondered if he had an injury or reason.  The fact he was a tryout player that made it makes him even more unlikely.  

Valuable.  Define it.  Worthy of huge Huff style contracts?  Sure.  Several will make the team.  It will matter a great deal if they suck-suck, are JAGs or turn out to be good.  The Jets WR room has Wilson, Williams, Lazard, and Corley.  I can pretty much guarantee you that at least two more make the 53 and probably four more if you count the practice squad.  Roster spots, even practice squad slots, are by definition valuable.  Just because guys don't make pro bowls they still have value to the team. 

Personally, I was hoping to hear more from Brownlee.  The silence on him has been deafening.  FWIW, the two guys they just signed Brandon Smith from Iowa (out since 2021 with the Cowboys and Cards) and Winstead, the UFL kid who was with the 49ers last year's camp are both bigger dudes who don't seem to get much separation.  Harrell is a rocket, but has almost no production through ages of college and we don't hear his name much in camp.  If he shows any promise he'd be a practice squad candidate, but presumably if coaches at Alabama, Miami and Louisville didn't train him up we are unlikely to see anything from him 

Yeah the catch clip for this one looked really good, of course, but it's nothing like the one from Brownlee last summer, plus he has the size we all like to see as well. Then Brownlee did next to nothing during the season despite a wide-open opportunity with Lazard's benching that itself followed Corey Davis's retirement. 

Keeping it in perspective, they're all out supposedly competing with each other for WR5+ duties, and maybe some KO/punt return action, but the latter job should also add rookie Davis into that competition mix. Coverage units then further add roster bubble dimeback DBs as well. Those are actual contributors, even if they don't rack up stats, and yeah everyone loves a happy-ending underdog story, too. Everyone except the grumpus who keeps humbugging this thread, lol.

[rtnelson]

We have one of if not the most stacked CB rooms in the league.  If a CB rookie UDFA's name started getting thrown around then had a PBU against Garrett Wilson in camp, we would take notice even if the likelihood of him making the roster would be low.

Should we cry in a corner that GW can't seem to shake a UDFA rookie CB?

Perk our ears up that Saleh maybe found another talented UDFA on defense?

Or make another thread about Tippmann's snaps because that's important?

[#27TheDominator]

42 minutes ago, Warfish said:

For me, full time starter who produces at league averages (or close) for his position.

Underproducing starters because we don't have anybody better, 3rd string backups, depth guys, practice squad bodies, camp bodies, of course those have value too.  But they're not meaningful, their value isn't really meaningful (well, if they play specials are are very good at that, that has value too).  They don't play, if they do they don't produce, and they're effectively interchangeable with any other random street FA Vet, UDFA or other fringe talent.

Lets be honest though, most times if some UDFA rookie #6 WR on your roster has to play alot of snaps, they usually suck, and the team usually sucks.  They're not often contributing in a meaningful way to winning, or winning titles.  Gipson played last year, so yes, that has value.  He just didn't play very well, outside his glorious forever-to-be-remembered-return TD in week 1. 

Are there exceptions to this, sure, there are exceptions to everything, just look at Purdy in San Fran, no Mr. Irrelevant becomes a Franchise QB.

I want to see a Jets WR room where this kind of hand-wringing or interest (pro or con) just isn't necessary.  Because we're that damn good at WR.  There are many teams, good teams, likely title-contending teams, whose fanbases don't have to be all hope and dream about unknown UDFA WR's.  Because those guys won't make their teams, and if they do, they'll never see the field.

If that's a pipe dream, so be it.  

 

Are you one of those dudes that expects you to have 22 starters that last the season and are above average?  I guess I should just give up.  Jake Bobo played 300 snaps.  Do you watch the game?  Do you think the only guys that matter are the ones putting up stats?  The Chiefs won the super bowl and Justyn Ross played over 100 snaps.   So did Ritchie James.  Those guys made the team.  Those guys saw the field.  Those guys got rings.  

[#27TheDominator]

2 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Yeah the catch clip for this one looked really good, of course, but it's nothing like the one from Brownlee last summer, plus he has the size we all like to see as well. Then Brownlee did next to nothing during the season despite a wide-open opportunity with Lazard's benching that itself followed Corey Davis's retirement. 

Keeping it in perspective, they're all out supposedly competing with each other for WR5+ duties, and maybe some KO/punt return action, but the latter job should also add rookie Davis into that competition mix. Coverage units then further add roster bubble dimeback DBs as well. Those are actual contributors, even if they don't rack up stats, and yeah everyone loves a happy-ending underdog story, too. Everyone except the grumpus who keeps humbugging this thread, lol.

The big thing to me is Rodgers.  These later round/UDFA guys all have talent and skills no matter what people think.  The big thing is fit and if they can do what the team wants/needs.  Rodgers seems to like bigger guys and not need as much separation.  Brownlee was killing it through camp with Rodgers, but disappeared when the season started.  Quarterback play basically fell off a cliff.  Brownlee didn't get much run early at least in part because he wasn't much on specials.  He eventually ended up playing a solid number of snaps without much production.  Maybe he will pick it up with Rodgers, but I'm not holding my breath.

[ARodJetsFan]

On 8/3/2024 at 2:20 PM, AFJF said:

Not a name we've heard much of but I shot out a couple of tweets on him when Xavier Gipson went down as a guy who should see more reps.

Yes, he's insanely undersized at 5' 8'' but in what little I could find of him after being signed he showed excellent burst/explosion and I wondered if he'd get some run over the next couple weeks.

Sounds like he had a couple of big grabs today running with AR and the 1's.

Started his career at Fordham before finishing up at Eastern Michigan.

Can also return kicks.

 

 

 

 

Jets Release Hamze El Zayat (Waived Injured so most likely will go on IR )

We have signed RB Deon Jackson.

[AFJF]

Just now, ARodJetsFan said:

Jets Release Hamze El Zayat (Waived Injured so most likely will go on IR )

I had this story on the front page of JN within minutes of the news breaking.  But thanks for the update.

Looks like he's heading to IR and reverts back to the Jets.

Too bad.  Kid was making some noise before the injury.

[ARodJetsFan]

3 minutes ago, AFJF said:

I had this story on the front page of JN within minutes of the news breaking.  But thanks for the update.

Looks like he's heading to IR and reverts back to the Jets.

Too bad.  Kid was making some noise before the injury.

I know you did - it should have been posted in THIS THREAD, which is why I re-posted it here.

[AFJF]

13 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

Are you one of those dudes that expects you to have 22 starters that last the season and are above average?  I guess I should just give up.  Jake Bobo played 300 snaps.  Do you watch the game?  Do you think the only guys that matter are the ones putting up stats?  The Chiefs won the super bowl and Justyn Ross played over 100 snaps.   So did Ritchie James.  Those guys made the team.  Those guys saw the field.  Those guys got rings.  

Yes.

I'm sure every fan base has some who only care about the superstar players, some who pay attention to most of (perhaps even all) the starters and those who try to get to know the whole roster.

Anyone who paid close enough attention last year knew that AR praised both Gipson and Brownlee as standouts long before they made the roster.  Then they made the roster.  Then they contributed.  Now they'll likely make the roster or PS again this year.  But because they were UDFA's, they suck and we shouldn't talk about them.

 

[AFJF]

1 minute ago, ARodJetsFan said:

I know you did - it should have been posted in THIS THREAD, which is why I re-posted it here.

When a story goes on the front page it automatically creates a new thread in the forums.  This conversation carried over to there immediately.

Sucks to see the kid making some headway, making plays with the 1's and then landing on IR.

[ARodJetsFan]

Just now, AFJF said:

When a story goes on the front page it automatically creates a new thread in the forums.  This conversation carried over to there immediately.

Sucks to see the kid making some headway, making plays with the 1's and then landing on IR.

Agreed.

[Warfish]

3 hours ago, AFJF said:

But because they were UDFA's, they suck and we shouldn't talk about them.

Gipson doesn't/didn't suck because he was an UDFA.

He was an UDFA because he wasn't/isn't considered very a terribly good prospect at the time he could have been drafted.

His regular season play last year, aside from his KR TD, supports that evaluation.  He wasn't very good last year when he played.  Had trouble getting open, only caught a bit more than half the balls thrown to him, fumbled alot, etc.  21 catches for 229 yards and 0 TD's as a WR, given he played about half the team's snaps in 2023, simply isn't very productive.  

We'll see how much of that was Zach Wilson here in 2024.  He'll very likely have every opportunity to do better.

And yes, since he is very likely to make the team and get playing time, we should absolutely talk about him.

Clearly, that may not be the case with El-Zayat, who does not appear to be likely to be on the 53 man roster this year, at this time.  Seems that one tweet may have been his highlight this year, but we'll see.  And yes, you can 100% talk about him too if it pleases you, but having others note that he's not likely going to make the team or be a meaningful part of the team is also allowed, like it or not.

[Smashmouth]

On 8/7/2024 at 8:32 AM, Warfish said:

Well, this is alot to respond to, so lets see if I can (and do it without the quote-by-quote so many here hate):

I disagree that "Gipson making the team" is "what sports is about" for me as a fan.  For Gipson, 100%.  For me, it's about seeing the best athletes in the world playing their best, and seeing MY team win, and win a title.  That moment is the moment I seek, not the moment where Gipson makes the team in Hard Knocks.  Yes, those moments may be nice, but personally I liked the moment we drafted G. Wilson ALOT more than the moment Gipson made the team.  

People rooting for the longshot, I get it, 100%.  Liking hard workers, I get it, 100% (for ex. my view on the bum Lazard is well known). Forgive me, I'm just a little sick of the Jets seemingly ALWAYS being deeply reliant on these "longshots", which are/were longshots because they're not nearly as good, or talented, as the "not longshot" guys, especially at WR, a position IMO this team has mismanaged and undervalued for ages.  It always seems this unit is a cobbled together mess of aged out veterans, broken overpaid FA castoffs and low-talent UDFA's.  I want more G. Wilsons, and less Gipsons.

My view on Revis is well known at this point, no need to rehash that one, lol.

Overcoming the odds is great.  I'd prefer the odds favor us for a change.  I think the "embrace being the scrappy underdog" is a very Jets thing, because we're seemingly always the underdog, never the favorite, never the team stacked at WR with stud starters making the #6 UDFA type meaningless.

I enjoyed Gipsons PR TD.  I enjoyed less the other 16 games where he was a very obvious subpar WR who contributed little to the team winning games.  Maybe this year will change my mind about him.  And yes, I always want wins (generally).  I'm one of the rare ones here at JN who even wants to win "meaningless" late seasons games vs. losing on purpose for draft slots, so yeah.

Everybody in camp gets a few plays with the starters here and there, especially offensive skill players.  It's relevant, but maybe not as much as folks want to think.  And yes, folks always go overboard for UDFA WR's, it's an annual process here.  Just wait, if this kid catches a TD in preseason game #1, we're gonna have ten threads on him, proclaiming him the new #3 WR, lol.

And yes, we're all allowed to dream, agree 100%.

I guess my question is why Jets Fans very specifically always seem to dream about UDFA WR's making the team, rather that dreaming about a WR corps. so good, and so deep, that UDFA's have no chance to make the team.  That's my dream, to have more G. Wilsons, so that the #6 WR is still a drafted guy, like a Corely, and not some massive longshot who, when he gets to play, can't compete and can't produce, like Gipson in 2023, who was (seemingly now forgotten here) unproductive and pretty much out of his league vs. most defenses.  

I want to be the Dolphins or 49'ers.  Not the "team full of Chrebets" despite Chrebet being my third favorite Jet of all time.  Is that so wrong, to want studs so we don;t have to care or even give shots to UDFA's at WR?

 

 

 

I 100% see your point War and I agree its the Clowney Factor and the Ratliff factor ...let em dream ...Just keep in mind sometimes it does happen like Chrebet and Huff

My dream is watch for Zaire Barnes at LB 

 

[ARodJetsFan]

8 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

I 100% see your point War and I agree its the Clowney Factor and the Ratliff factor ...let em dream ...Just keep in mind sometimes it does happen like Chrebet and Huff

My dream is watch for Zaire Barnes at LB 

 

I've been hearing a lot of good things about Barnes lately.

Eric Watts is my UDFA defensive sleeper.

That said, I think WR Xavier Gipson, takes a big leap forward this year. 

The downside is, he'll probably be fighting with Corley for snaps.

[mrcoops]

Cleared waivers, goes onto IR ending his season:

[Smashmouth]

6 hours ago, ARodJetsFan said:

I've been hearing a lot of good things about Barnes lately.

Eric Watts is my UDFA defensive sleeper.

That said, I think WR Xavier Gipson, takes a big leap forward this year. 

The downside is, he'll probably be fighting with Corley for snaps.

The main thing is we know nothing about these young receivers and how they would respond with a real QB throwing them the ball. All questions get answered this year.