lawngnome o-line Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 I know there have been a bunch of threads started up about TJ, but taking a look at the his stats I think he hasn't been as bad as of an investment as many people think. To his Jets resume: Among the league: (excluding Willie Parker) 6th in the league in attempts (207) 9th in the league in yards (763) **35th in average (3.7)** 16th in the league in ypg (69.4) 1 Fumble, None Lost **0 Tds** TJ has rushed for 3 100 yard games, in 2 of 3 the Jets won (25 attempts for 110 Miami, W; 24 attempts 130 v. Philly, L; 30 attempts 117 Pitt, W) For the people who complain about TJ being terrible, personally I don't think he's been too bad although only 3 100+ yard games is discouraging through 11. The starred sections are obvious areas needing improvements but it just proves that the Jets need to address the line o-line in FA (Alan Faneca, Stacey Andrews) or through the draft (Jake Long, Ryan Clady) ASAP. Teams that can control the ball through the ground attack would take the pressure of KC and help him develop as a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 6th in rushing attempts and 35th in average is not good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 6th in rushing attempts and 35th in average is not good. He's a solid back. We need some run blockers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kidhuman Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Agreed, it would help also if he could get into the end zone. The Jets need another RB to compliment him like Barber/Jones in Dallas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Chad haters make a huge deal about him being 31 yet these were the same people who went ga-ga about the Jets trading an early second round pick for a 29 year old running back. Go figure. It was a horrendous trade. You can dress the stats up however you want but on the field TJ does not help this team at all. He'll get 100 yards against the horrific Fish D and the Browns have a porous run defense but that's it. Plus he only has 1-2 years of good football left in him which sucks considering the big contract our FO gave him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LWC611 Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 TJ's production is more of an indictment of the Jets O-line then his talent. Which is why i hope that we get a guard that can run block either in FA or in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flgreen Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 TJ's production is more of an indictment of the Jets O-line then his talent. Which is why i hope that we get a guard that can run block either in FA or in the draft. That's it. Jim Brown could be back there and his #'s would stink behind this OL. We did not give up a 2nd for TJ, we swapped 2nd's big difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 6th in rushing attempts and 35th in average is not good. LOL, why is the Eagles logo still your avatar??? Get with the times Troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GM Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 6th in rushing attempts and 35th in average is not good. The stat is skewed... It lumps in backs with only 60 carries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Chad haters make a huge deal about him being 31 yet these were the same people who went ga-ga about the Jets trading an early second round pick for a 29 year old running back. Go figure. It was a horrendous trade. You can dress the stats up however you want but on the field TJ does not help this team at all. He'll get 100 yards against the horrific Fish D and the Browns have a porous run defense but that's it. Plus he only has 1-2 years of good football left in him which sucks considering the big contract our FO gave him. Chad haters dont make a huge deal about him being 31. The big deal with Chad is that he cant make the basic throws that are necessary for an NFL QB. Still, you may be right about Jones. There were some wonderful players there for the Jets at the top of the second round. This trade is a function of the Jets' failure to accurately assess their own talent base. Despite last year's success the team should have looked to upgrade the overall talent base, not sacrifice draft position to fill a single position of need. I dont see them making the same mistake again this offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 That's it. Jim Brown could be back there and his #'s would stink behind this OL. We did not give up a 2nd for TJ, we swapped 2nd's big difference. 1) I seriously doubt Jim Brown would be on Thomas Jones' level in any scenario 2) What the hell do we need Thomas Jones for if he needs so much around him to be successful? 3) We gave up an almost-first-round pick for an almost-third-round pick. It's not like we moved down from #44 to #49. We dropped almost a full round; like 25 slots. Would it have been any different of a trade if our original pick was #39 and we dropped to the early 3rd round instead of the 2nd-last pick in the 2nd round? It's semantics. We dropped (essentially) a full round in the draft. 4) It so happens that there was a player we coveted BADLY who was still around in that spot: David Harris. But because we traded down for Jones, it made us forfeit that 2nd AND a 3rd AND a 5th (or whatever it was) so we could move up to claim a player that would have been just sitting there for us. 5) We traded 3rd-round value & got Thomas Jones. The Patriots traded 4th-round value & got Randy Moss. Good Lord. 6) In addition to the picks Jones cost us, we also gave him a $20M contract with $12M up front. Now if we were a true contender & needed a RB, then this might be a good idea. But we had too many holes to really be in that class of team. 7) RB's should be found in the draft unless you're acquiring a superstar with at least 3-4 years left in his prime like Marshall Faulk. They're only as good as their OL allows them to become, so it's ridiculous to spend money AND draft picks on one who's merely a "good" player. 8) Giving Jones $5M/year instead of giving a solid OG like Steinbach or Dockery $7M/yr (or the same money to try Leonard Davis at guard) was a poor decision. That decision was DOUBLY worse since Mangini/Tannenbaum KNEW that Kendall wanted a raise that they were not planning on giving him & would be creating a malcontent with a history of not keeping quiet when he's unhappy. WTF did they think? That we could lose Kendall, replace him with a 6th-round converted tackle who neither played the position nor faced even Div I talent (let alone NFL talent), or a cast-off career nobody who wasn't even on a team last year? And that the greatness that is Thomas Jones would make up for this deficiency? Hey if that's what they think, then they're LIGHT YEARS behind where they should be as a HC and a GM. A friggin' junior high school kid playing fantasy football knows that a top talent at RB won't do squat behind a crappy line. 9) Never trade day one draft picks for a decent-but-not-great 29 year-old RB when your OL not only sucks, but is far from being good. 10) Never sign a 29 year-old RB to a new lucrative contract EVER unless he's TRULY the last piece to the puzzle like Dillon was for NE. There are no other exceptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasonJet Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Jones was a great pickup. It's hard to do much when your O-line can't block a thing. It's clear that when he gets a little bit of space Jones can really do a lot with it. One of his criticisms was that he supposedly runs into people too much and doesn't avoid tacklers. What a load of crap that was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted November 27, 2007 Share Posted November 27, 2007 Chad haters make a huge deal about him being 31 yet these were the same people who went ga-ga about the Jets trading an early second round pick for a 29 year old running back. Go figure. It was a horrendous trade. You can dress the stats up however you want but on the field TJ does not help this team at all. He'll get 100 yards against the horrific Fish D and the Browns have a porous run defense but that's it. Plus he only has 1-2 years of good football left in him which sucks considering the big contract our FO gave him. Yet another brilliant analysis from the all knowing Peter North. Too bad he conveniently forgot that Jones was the first back to but PIT for over 100 yards in 35 games, but that's just mere emantics. If Jones has blocking, he's a top tier back. Our line sucks, not Jones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94SupraTT Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Yet another brilliant analysis from the all knowing Peter North. Too bad he conveniently forgot that Jones was the first back to but PIT for over 100 yards in 35 games, but that's just mere emantics. If Jones has blocking, he's a top tier back. Our line sucks, not Jones. A top tier back? In his best season (2005) he was 8th in rushing. That was the best he has done his entire career. He has never been a top 10 back in the league other than 2005. Hardly what I would call "top tier". 2004 - 24th in rushing 2005 - 8th in rushing 2006 - 16th in rushing 2007 - 16th in rushing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjam76 Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Yet another brilliant analysis from the all knowing Peter North. Too bad he conveniently forgot that Jones was the first back to but PIT for over 100 yards in 35 games, but that's just mere emantics. If Jones has blocking, he's a top tier back. Our line sucks, not Jones. The offense still couldn't score and they won because the defense played well and Leon Washington returned a kick to set up FG position. I don't think you get the point. Jones is a decent RB on a team like the Packers or Cowboys or Patriots or Colts or the Bears last year. A 29 year old RB on a team who seems destined to only draft players and not sign top tier FA talent, means by the time this OL does become good, Jones will be 32-33 years old and who knows if he'll even be in the NFL anymore. And what kind of excuse is that? IF he had blocking he'd be good. Gee, you could say that about any avg RB in the NFL.... He's never even made the pro bowl. He's an avg RB who has to play for a super bowl contender, otherwise, he's useless. And for a 2-9 team looking more like they could be 4 years away from being any good, trading for a 29 year old RB is about the stupidest thing this team could have done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashingjet Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 If a running back in the NFL has no touchdowns by week 12, and he started all 11 games, he cannot be considered a top tier back. Period, end of story, that's all she wrote and adios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 If a running back in the NFL has no touchdowns by week 12, and he started all 11 games, he cannot be considered a top tier back. Period, end of story, that's all she wrote and adios. Like Curtis Martin in 2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbyjet69 Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Like Curtis Martin in 2003 You HAD to stick that one in there, huh Sperm! LOL!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Like Curtis Martin in 2003 When TJ gets 100 career TD's I think he can, along with Curtis, become an exception. TJ is a pretty good player but was an absolutely awful pickup!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 You HAD to stick that one in there, huh Sperm! LOL!! I cannot help myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 I cannot help myself. TJ and Curtis aren't even comparable really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 TJ and Curtis aren't even comparable really. Curtis was a better receiver, a better blocker, & was good for far longer. Neither one is/was a dynamic runner & both routinely put up #'s at or below the league average in terms of yards per carry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Yet another brilliant analysis from the all knowing Peter North. Too bad he conveniently forgot that Jones was the first back to but PIT for over 100 yards in 35 games, but that's just mere emantics. If Jones has blocking, he's a top tier back. Our line sucks, not Jones. You are drunk. Thomas Jones is a top tier back? Jesus Christ. Talk about a Jets homer overrating his own players to the nth degree. I agree with you that the o-line is hideous and it has to share plenty of the blame but to put Thomas Jones on the level of Ladainian Tomlinson, Larry Johnson, Joseph Addai and Adrian Peterson is just stupid. The guy was a bust his first 4-5 years in the NFL, had a couple good years in Chiacago and is having a mediocre year now with the Jets. That's a top tier back if I ever saw one. And enough with the Steelers game. Dewayne Robertson, who has been absolulute garbage most of his career especially at NT, had 2.5 sacks that game. I guess if you want to base everything on that one Sunday I guess D-Rob is up there with Marcus Stroud, Vince WIlfork and Shaun Rogers. You'll have your day in the sun though. TJ is facing a horrendous run defense this week with Miami and the Browns couldn't stop Blair Thomas. Have fun crackhead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbyjet69 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Curtis was a better receiver, a better blocker, & was good for far longer. Neither one is/was a dynamic runner & both routinely put up #'s at or below the league average in terms of yards per carry. Didn't Curtis tie a recoed for most seasons in a row with above 4.0 yds per carry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Didn't Curtis tie a recoed for most seasons in a row with above 4.0 yds per carry? Being as his longest such streak was four years, I would lean towards no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Didn't Curtis tie a recoed for most seasons in a row with above 4.0 yds per carry? That's pretty unlikely since his personal record is three. He did have three consecutive years with under 4.00 in his first 3 seasons as a Jet though (and 5 of his 11 NFL seasons). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbyjet69 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 That's pretty unlikely since his personal record is three. He did have three consecutive years with under 4.00 in his first 3 seasons as a Jet though (and 5 of his 11 NFL seasons). Not according to NFL.com. He had 4 years in a row above 4.0 his last being 2004 with a 4.6. and in 2001 he had 4.5 In his first season as a Jet he ran for 3.5, then 4.0, and 3.8 in the 3rd. In his 11 year career he had 7 years where he had an average of 4.0 or better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Not according to NFL.com. He had 4 years in a row above 4.0 his last being 2004 with a 4.6. and in 2001 he had 4.5 In his first season as a Jet he ran for 3.5, then 4.0, and 3.8 in the 3rd. In his 11 year career he had 7 years where he had an average of 4.0 or better. My bad - you're right; one year in there he had 4.0 in there (which is hardly anything to brag about anyway). His 2nd season as a Jet it was just under 4.0 (it got rounded up). 4.0 blows. The league average every single season is between 4.0 and 4.1. It's particularly less impressive when running behind a strong OL, which he had for pretty much his entire career. He was a good RB & he was good for a long time. But if it meant eating up the insane cap room he cost us (at times like 1/7 of our entire cap), I don't wish for him back nor anyone else like him. For that kind of cap space, he should consistently be a top-3 back. The best anyone could rationalize him being top-3 is 2004 and that's a borderline call anyway. 2001 it seems that way but I don't consider a guy kept out of the endzone in 10 of his last 11 games (and we were held to 16 pts or less in 7 of them) to be a top-3 RB. The Jets suck awfully right now. We'd have the same 2-9 record with or without Martin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.