Jetsfan80 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 And as for Thomas Jones, he was great at running through giant holes created by Damien Woody and a not-yet-past-his prime Brandon Moore. He was nothing special. Jones did nothing before he was part of that great 2009 Jets O-line and did nothing after he left the Jets. Elite running backs do almost nothing for you in the NFL today other than cost you a high draft pick and perhaps a giant contract extension. Foster, Rice, Jones-Drew, Peterson, McFadden, Johnson, Lynch, Jackson, Gore......no Super Bowls for any of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 49ers skewed that average. He still better than Greene. The Packers cant run the football because they simply gave up running it last year and you just cant turn on a switch and start running the ball. It will probably take them a few more weeks to get a running game going if at all. Also when it comes to playing San Francisco NO ONE runs the ball on that team so its a bad example to use Bensons stats in that game. San Frans numbers vs the run last year were ridiculous and I think when we play them we'll be lucky to break 150 total yards as a team unless the east coast game takes a toll on them. He has averaged over 4 ypc once since he became a starter. I ran through the numbers the first time the ape ran this thread. Off the top of my head, Greene has better numbers and runs slightly better than the team's average. Benson has inferior numbers and is worse than his team's average. Benson does not get hurt, but he is not a very good running back. The Niners skewed his numbers? Did he play them 16 times last season? The year before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 I got roasted for suggesting we sign him and trade Greene. Benson isn't great, but he's durable and capable of yards after initial contact. Greene is not. Tebow is our best RB. Sad. Ahead of the curve, as usual. You're like a miniature Buddha, covered in hair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Are you kidding me with this? Woodhead has been a scatback who has never been higher than 3rd on the depth chart. Ward did OK in spots but was never a feature back. Leon disappeared in Seattle. The Jets have never made a concerted effort to get an elite feature back because that would require drafting one in the 1st round. I never said any of them were all-star talents, I'm just pointing out the humor in the fact that those clowns have had more success than the Jets have gotten out of guys they targeted as "answers" at the RB position and made the Jets roster over them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 I never said any of them were all-star talents, I'm just pointing out the humor in the fact that those clowns have had more success than the Jets have gotten out of guys they targeted as "answers" at the RB position and made the Jets roster over them. They all had temporary success. I don't think we'd be any better off right now if a player the caliber of Woodhead, Ward or Washington was our feature back. If it were up to me, Bilal Powell would be the starting back against Miami. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Can one of the advanced metrics geeks please provide some statistic I've never heard of to support this claim. Watch me run! Greene, DVOA 2009: 4.0% (19th) 2010: 7.3% (11th) 2011: 2.2% (25th) Benson, DVOA 2009: 2.3% (21st) 2010: -12.5% (38th) 2011: -10.4% (45th) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 I think we can pretty much throw DVOA in the bushes when the geeks start trying to portray Greene as a decent player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 He has averaged over 4 ypc once since he became a starter. I ran through the numbers the first time the ape ran this thread. Off the top of my head, Greene has better numbers and runs slightly better than the team's average. Benson has inferior numbers and is worse than his team's average. Benson does not get hurt, but he is not a very good running back. The Niners skewed his numbers? Did he play them 16 times last season? The year before? Dom I was not comparing just stating the fact that no one runs the ball on the Niners. I think Benson might have helped no by being the feature back but maybe to split some carries and be an insurance policy if Greene breaks down which hes already showing signs of after week 2. Personally I wanted the Jets to make a play for Maurice Jone Drew, yeah I know it was a pipe dream but you never know what a team would do if given the right offer. The Jets need an explosive RB who can play in all phases and currently we have no one. Is it possible Powell could be a good solid all around back ? who knows since we really have not seen a lot from him. But if Greene does go down and our options are Powell and Joe McPussy we are in big big trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 I got roasted for suggesting we sign him and trade Greene. Benson isn't great, but he's durable and capable of yards after initial contact. Greene is not. Tebow is our best RB. Sad. Ahead of the curve, as usual. Greene and Benson were both terrible after contact last year. Benson was worse. https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/03/27/2011-elusive-rating/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 I think we can pretty much throw DVOA in the bushes when the geeks start trying to portray Greene as a decent player. You're my favorite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 You're my favorite. Do you have the ability to explain what you like about Shonn Greene's ability as a back without linking DVOA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Do you have the ability to explain what you like about Shonn Greene's ability as a back without linking DVOA? To you? No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 I think we can pretty much throw DVOA in the bushes when the geeks start trying to portray Greene as a decent player. Define "decent"? I think they portray a pretty accurate picture. 24 other backs were better than him last year, making him a low-end starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Greene and Benson were both terrible after contact last year. Benson was worse. https://www.profootb...elusive-rating/ Problem with Greene is he does not try to avoid the contact he tries to run over the tackler. Sometimes he lays a good beatdown on a LB or Defensive back but he also hurts himself in the process. Its probably because he just does not have the agility to avoid tackles. If the guy could stay healthy with this running style it would be a positive in the 4th quarter when defenses are worn out but thats another issue the guy is always nicked up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Define "decent"? I think they portray a pretty accurate picture. 24 other backs were better than him last year, making him a low-end starter. Greene is awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 If it were up to me, Bilal Powell would be the starting back against Miami. Me too. Just because Cedric Benson isn't an upgrade over Greene, it doesn't mean someone else can't be. I like Greene in that second half, grind it out role. That's where he's useful. Powell should be in there as a threat to run or catch a pass to open games. I'd like to see more McKnight, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Do you have the ability to explain what you like about Shonn Greene's ability as a back without linking DVOA? Does anybody have to like Greene to think he is better than Cedric Benson? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Me too. Just because Cedric Benson isn't an upgrade over Greene, it doesn't mean someone else can't be. I like Greene in that second half, grind it out role. That's where he's useful. Powell should be in there as a threat to run or catch a pass to open games. I'd like to see more McKnight, too. having powell as the starter would also make us less predictable on offense IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Watch me run! Greene, DVOA 2009: 4.0% (19th) 2010: 7.3% (11th) 2011: 2.2% (25th) Benson, DVOA 2009: 2.3% (21st) 2010: -12.5% (38th) 2011: -10.4% (45th) run forest run !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Does anybody have to like Greene to think he is better than Cedric Benson? No of course not. But the simple eye test is really the only thing needed to show which back you'd prefer. Benson's a better runner imo. Neither are very good though. I'm pretty sure the FO stuff isnt too kind to Ray Rice, which couldnt be further from the truth obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Watch me run! Greene, DVOA 2009: 4.0% (19th) 2010: 7.3% (11th) 2011: 2.2% (25th) Benson, DVOA 2009: 2.3% (21st) 2010: -12.5% (38th) 2011: -10.4% (45th) The funny thing is that I thought a stat geek would find some obscure stat to "prove" Benson was the better back. Isn't the ape a stat geek? Maybe I just lump everybody else into that category. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 No of course not. But the simple eye test is really the only thing needed to show which back you'd prefer. Benson's a better runner imo. Neither are very good though. I'm pretty sure the FO stuff isnt too kind to Ray Rice, which couldnt be further from the truth obviously. Your eyes and my eyes are not the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Your eyes and my eyes are not the same. of course. But Greene tripping over his own feet and running up his linemans ass is something Benson wont do. Greene's basically Blair Thomas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 of course. But Greene tripping over his own feet and running up his linemans ass is something Benson wont do. Greene's basically Blair Thomas. hey hey now that was uncalled for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 hey hey now that was uncalled for Blair Thomas was 19th in DVOA in 1991!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 of course. But Greene tripping over his own feet and running up his linemans ass is something Benson wont do. Greene's basically Blair Thomas. If Greene is Blair Thomas then what is Cedric Benson? Chauncey Washington? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 If Greene is Blair Thomas then what is Cedric Benson? Chauncey Washington? Pat Chaffey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Benson is better. Here is the stat that says I am right. 100% GFY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ILK Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Me too. Just because Cedric Benson isn't an upgrade over Greene, it doesn't mean someone else can't be. I like Greene in that second half, grind it out role. That's where he's useful. Powell should be in there as a threat to run or catch a pass to open games. I'd like to see more McKnight, too. Earth, Wind, and Fire light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 Pat Chaffey If I knew you were that old I would have gone with Dennis Bligen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 If I knew you were that old I would have gone with Dennis Bligen! I'm not I was just a Jets nerd in the 90's. The real nerds lapped me long ago clearly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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