Is Geno Smith a GOOD DEEP BALL THROWER?

[Long Island Leprechaun]

he gives the defense a better chance to catch it than the receivers

Yes, but he's accurate. Let's not quibble about details.

[#27TheDominator]

I am just wondering how that loss would have changed the Olympics from 1992 to 1994?

the reason we sent the Dream team was b/c we were getting beat.  of course the 1994 world championships wouldn't be as big as the Olympics.  we lost in the world championships w/ K too but no one remembers, it's about the Olympics.

 

I am not sure what you are whining about either.

Never could have figured this out.  So, you are saying that people remember Olympic gold medalists more than FIBA world champions?  That people remember Keith Smart for hitting the 3 but forget Coleman's 19 rebounds?  Thanks for the history lesson.

[Villain The Foe]

Geno: stronger arm, zero accuracy on deep balls.

Fitz: weaker arm, better accuracy.

They're both sub-par.

And the misinfo continues. Scroll down and take a look at "deep accuracy %age"

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/02/12/signature-stats-accuracy-percentage-breakdown/

 

At Pro Football Focus, our Signature Stats are built from the stats we collect while grading each game. In turn, we’re able to provide our Premium Stats subscribers with some advanced numbers that give a clearer picture of certain aspects of a player’s game than regular box score stats can provide.

In this scan through one of our most popular Signature Stats, we’re looking at quarterback accuracy, breaking it down into three categories: Overall Accuracy Percentage, Acc% on deep attempts, and Acc% when under pressure.

Our Accuracy Percentage stat goes beyond your standard quarterback completion percentage, taking into account dropped passes, throw aways, spiked balls, batted passes and passes where the quarterback was hit while attempting to throw.

So, with all that in mind, here is our look at quarterback accuracy around the league.

Accuracy Percentage

The Top 10

The best of the best in terms of Accuracy Percentage features some of the players you’d expect to find at the top of this list, and a few who come as a bit of a surprise. Leading the way among the 41 QBs who surpassed the 175 drop-back mark to qualify is Green Bay’s Aaron Rodgers, accurate on 79.3% of his passes after finishing second in 2012 with 80.2%. That’s impressively consistent from the Packers’ signal caller, and he’s joined inside the Top 10 by backup Matt Flynn who, despite his struggles, managed to be accurate on 74.7% of his passes, tied with Ben Roethlisberger and Sam Bradford for the seventh-best mark in 2013.

Name	Team	Accuracy %
Aaron Rodgers	GB	79.3%
Philip Rivers	SD	78.7%
Matt Ryan	ATL	78.4%
Josh McCown	CHI	77.8%
Peyton Manning	DEN	77.0%
Drew Brees	NO	77.0%
Sam Bradford	STL	74.7%
Ben Roethlisberger	PIT	74.7%
Matt Flynn	GB	74.7%
Nick Foles	PHI	74.2%

Ever prominent atop most quarterback rankings regardless of which stat you’re looking at, Drew Brees and Peyton Manning were tied for fifth with an Acc% of 77.0%, with Manning seeing 6.5% of his catchable passes dropped by receivers. In fourth we have Josh McCown, highlighting his impressive season and something that will surely catch the attention of teams looking for a quarterback this offseason while Matt Ryan, much maligned for a midseason slump, was still in the Top 3.

The Bottom 10

Like the Top 10, the Bottom 10 won’t come as much of a shock to anyone who watched these quarterbacks play in 2013. Oakland’s Matthew McGloin was at the bottom of the pile with an Acc% of just 66.5%, and he was joined in the lower group, sadly for Raiders fans, by teammate Terrelle Pryor.

Name	Team	Accuracy %
Kellen Clemens	STL	68.7%
E.J. Manuel	BUF	68.4%
Terrelle Pryor	OAK	68.3%
Brandon Weeden	CLV	68.2%
Joe Flacco	BLT	67.8%
Thaddeus Lewis	BUF	67.5%
Case Keenum	HST	67.5%
Geno Smith	NYJ	67.4%
Eli Manning	NYG	67.2%
Matthew McGloin	OAK	66.5%

High profile signal-callers in the Bottom 10 include former Super Bowl MVP’s Joe Flacco and Eli Manning, with neither justifying their lofty contracts in 2013. Neither come as too much of a surprise, however, with Flacco having the sixth-worst mark in 2012, and Manning 11th from the bottom.

AFC East rookies Geno Smith and E.J. Manuel find themselves here too, an indication of their struggles in their first seasons in the league, but Smith improved as the year went on and Manuel saw his season interrupted by injury, so there will be an expectation that both can lift themselves higher in 2014.

Acc%: Deep Passing

The Top 10

Deep Accuracy gives a good indication of which quarterbacks were most accurate challenging defenses downfield and, with a big start in limited action in Houston, Case Keenum tops the list with a Deep Acc% of 53.1%. Rodgers is once again amongst the best here, as the only quarterback other than Keenum to finish above 50%. Super Bowl QBs Russell Wilson and Peyton Manning round out the Top 5 along with the surprise inclusion of Kellen Clemens.

Name	Team	Deep Acc. %
Case Keenum	HST	53.1%
Aaron Rodgers	GB	52.8%
Russell Wilson	SEA	48.3%
Peyton Manning	DEN	48.2%
Kellen Clemens	STL	48.0%
Matt Cassel	MIN	47.4%
Geno Smith	NYJ	46.7%
Alex D. Smith	KC	46.3%
Matthew McGloin	OAK	45.7%
Mike Glennon	TB	45.0%

Despite his poor overall accuracy, Geno Smith was seventh-best on deep throws, completing 46.7% of passes 20 yards or more downfield, though that did come with seven interceptions — the only player in the Top 10 to throw more interceptions than touchdowns. He’s joined by fellow rookieMike Glennon who finishes the Top 10 at 45.0%, but had the best touchdown-to-interception ratio among them with seven TDs and just one INT.

The Bottom 10

Highlighting the myth about Flacco’s arm, the Ravens’ signal caller had the second worst Deep Accuracy of any quarterback in 2013, and had just one touchdown and eight interceptions. This comes a year after his 11 touchdowns and zero interceptions lead to claims that he was the best deep thrower in the league, despite finishing 18th with a Deep Acc% of 40.2% in 2012. Still, his accuracy on deep passes dropped by 14.1% in 2013, with only Jake Locker (23.3%) finishing with a lower mark.

Name	Team	Deep Acc. %
E.J. Manuel	BUF	34.1%
Ryan Tannehill	MIA	32.8%
Cam Newton	CAR	31.3%
Carson Palmer	ARZ	31.1%
Chad Henne	JAX	30.8%
Robert Griffin III	WAS	30.4%
Terrelle Pryor	OAK	30.0%
Jason Campbell	CLV	29.4%
Joe Flacco	BLT	26.1%
Jake Locker	TEN	23.3%

Robert Griffin III finished with the fifth-worst mark in his second year after coming in as the fifth best a year ago — a drop of 19.6% as he heads into a key season in his development. Unlike fellow rookie Smith, Manuel wasn’t able to balance out poor overall accuracy with a good showing on deep throws, rounding out the Bottom 10 in his first season. Carson Palmer also features here, completing just 31.1% of his deep passes and was the tied with Flacco for the most interceptions.

Acc%: Under Pressure

Top 10

It’s the tale of two injury replacement in the NFC North at the top here, with free agents-to-be McCown and Flynn at the top of the table. They’re joined in the first five by Philip Rivers and Peyton Manning, which hardly comes as a surprise. The Top 5 ends with a Ryan Fitzpatrick sighting and all five were accurate on at least 68.5% of their throws while under pressure.

Name	Team	Under Pressure Acc. %
Josh McCown	CHI	77.0%
Matt Flynn	GB	72.7%
Philip Rivers	SD	69.9%
Peyton Manning	DEN	69.0%
Ryan Fitzpatrick	TEN	68.5%
Matt Ryan	ATL	68.2%
Nick Foles	PHI	68.1%
Christian Ponder	MIN	67.7%
Cam Newton	CAR	66.4%
Chad Henne	JAX	65.2%

Once again Ryan features in the Top 10, giving Falcons fans plenty of reason to believe that his drop in play was nothing more than a minor blip, while Eagles fans will be pleased to see Nick Folesmake an appearance after a successful first stint as a starter under Chip Kelly. Christian Ponder andChad Henne performed well here despite struggling in general, while Cam Newton threw the most touchdowns under pressure of players in this group with nine.

The Bottom 10

The theme for the Bottom 10 here seems to be inexperience, with most of the players here still fairly young in their careers. Nobody struggled under pressure as much as Buffalo’s backupThaddeus Lewis, who completed just 40% of his throws when pressure got to him. He’s joined at the bottom by McGloin and Brandon Weeden with both showing why so many doubt their viability as a long-term starters in the league. St. Louis’ Sam Bradford had the fourth-worst mark as we head into yet another offseason where he’s coming off an injury.

Name	Team	Under Pressure Acc. %
Andy Dalton	CIN	56.7%
Jake Locker	TEN	56.6%
Andrew Luck	IND	56.0%
Geno Smith	NYJ	55.5%
Colin Kaepernick	SF	55.1%
Matt Schaub	HST	55.1%
Sam Bradford	STL	53.4%
Brandon Weeden	CLV	50.8%
Matthew McGloin	OAK	50.0%
Thaddeus Lewis	BUF	40.0%

Andrew Luck and Andy Dalton also feature in the Bottom 10, with their up-and-down play leading to six pressured picks apiece. Geno Smith can be spotted once again, with pressure causing him plenty of problems in his rookie year, while veteran Matt Schaub’s inclusion won’t come as a surprise to anyone who saw him during what was as rough a year as he’s had in the league.

As always it’s important to note that, while these stats go well beyond the box score, they still aren’t as good an indication to a quarterback’s play as our grades. Context is still needed when looking at these numbers, with a two-yard dump off on 3rd-and-13 counting for the same as a 14-yard laser in terms of accuracy under pressure. Likewise for finding a receiver open downfield through blown coverage as opposed to a throw that splits coverage to find a home. Fortunately, our Signature Stats come as part of our PFF Premium Package so you can treat yourself to both and get the advanced stats and grades together.

[Jet Nut]

It tells me the exact opposite.  He had not "won" anything.  If he had and the decision was an actual merit-based evaluation of their relative QB skills then I think they would not have been so quick to name Fitz as the starter.

No, it is far more reasonable and a better fit for the facts here to assume that no firm choice had been made (because they had seen ZERO at that point).  It is reasonable to feel that the FO simply did not want to go into training camp with an open QB competition where every story every day would be parsing which of them got the most snaps with which set of receivers and who was "winning" the QB competition.  Much smarter especially if the "backup" is still rehabbing from a serious injury.  The real test, i.e. an actual effing preseason game or two would tell the tale and still give them time to make the change if Geno was still the same putrid Geno. 

You're so anti Geno it really doesn't really make a difference.  You still think he didn't win the competition before the punch.  Who cares, Fitz is the QB today, hopefully he holds onto the job because that will mean he's playing well and I assume the team will then be doing well also.  We both know Geno will eventually get back in there so lets hope it works well and that not only was the end of 2014 indicative of what he can do but he improves on those performances.  After all that would be the best scenario given the tools he has, the advantage he has over Fitz from a physical and age standpoint.

[nyjunc]

Long Island leprachaun

 

accurate to the defenders, he's not accurate to our guys.

[Villain The Foe]

This was released this year. Also check out the info on Mike Glennon. Dude is a beast. Back to Geno, all of the ridiculous claims that Geno is a poor deep ball thrower is ridiculous. He's numbers are average in this league.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2491902-aaron-rodgers-big-ben-orjay-cutler-ranking-the-nfls-best-deep-passers

 

 

Wilfredo Lee/Associated Press

 

Geno Smith has thrown more deep interceptions than any quarterback in the NFL over the last two years, despite the fact that most established starters threw 20 to 40 more deep passes than he did. That said, Smith's completion rate on deep passes is average, and he has had enough success as a downfield thrower to offer some hope for development.

The same cannot really be said of Robert Griffin III, who has given up throwing downfield unless DeSean Jackson is open by 10 yards, or EJ Manuel, whose quarterback career has been held back by his inability to throw footballs very well. Griffin's deep numbers were good as a rookie in 2012 (18-of-42, 626 yards, seven touchdowns, two interceptions), and he left college with tremendous arm skills, so there still might be a fine deep passer beneath the ticks, quirks and mistakes.

Kirk Cousins looks like a good deep passer when he first takes over a starting job, then just starts throwing interceptions in bunches.

Mike Glennon's numbers are excellent for a guy coaches would move mountains to bench. Glennon's arm has never been the problem; it's his tendency to get rattled in the pocket that gets him into trouble. He is the kind of quarterback who would look very different in a better situation; as a backup-for-hire behind a top veteran, he could grow into a fine spot starter.

 

The Journeymen

You thought we were scraping the bottom of the barrel with that last group, but this turns out to be a pretty deep barrel. Here's a sampling of the veteran backups, spot starters and "bridge" quarterbacks who have received significant playing time in the last two years:

[CrazyCarl40]

Fitz has no accuracy on deep balls, he just throws it up for grabs hoping his receiver can make a play.

Better to at least let the offensive player be able to make a play rather than sailing it yards over their head or yards out of bounds. Geno's about as accurate as a dollar store pregnancy kit.

[Villain The Foe]

Better to at least let the offensive player be able to make a play rather than sailing it yards over their head or yards out of bounds. Geno's about as accurate as a dollar store pregnancy kit.

So is this what Geno Smith should look like? 

 

Awesome pass bro. 

[Jet Nut]

Better to at least let the offensive player be able to make a play rather than sailing it yards over their head or yards out of bounds. Geno's about as accurate as a dollar store pregnancy kit.

Would be better.  Its just we've never seen Fitz do that, its fantasy land 

And I wish the pass to D Smith was sent sailing over his head or out of bounds instead of inside and short into the defenders hands.  Or the pass into the DL would have gone into a passing lane instead.  Or the high pass to Marshall would have found the hands of an open 6'4" WR.  Like that kind of accuracy 

[nyjunc]

Better to at least let the offensive player be able to make a play rather than sailing it yards over their head or yards out of bounds. Geno's about as accurate as a dollar store pregnancy kit.

not really, I'd rather see the ball 10 yards past the receiver or OOB than give the opponent a chance to pick it off. 

[nyjunc]

So is this what Geno Smith should look like? 

 

Awesome pass bro. 

That's a Td w/ a decent pass, doesn't have to do anything special.  wide open.

[CrazyCarl40]

not really, I'd rather see the ball 10 yards past the receiver or OOB than give the opponent a chance to pick it off. 

Good. Because Geno is keen on doing both!

[Jet Nut]

That's a Td w/ a decent pass, doesn't have to do anything special.  wide open.

One of those mythical accurate passes?

[CrazyCarl40]

So is this what Geno Smith should look like? 

 

Awesome pass bro. 

Maybe it's a better pass if Mangold doesn't get beaten off the ball and Colon has any clue of what he's doing out there.

[nyjunc]

Good. Because Geno is keen on doing both!

Geno has never had these weapons.

[nyjunc]

Maybe it's a better pass if Mangold doesn't get beaten off the ball and Colon has any clue of what he's doing out there.

he has plenty of time to make a strong, accurate throw for the easy TD

[nyjunc]

One of those mythical accurate passes?

the "accurate" ones are the balls thrown up for grabs into double/triple coverage

[Jet Nut]

Maybe it's a better pass if Mangold doesn't get beaten off the ball and Colon has any clue of what he's doing out there.

Maybe its better you evaluate him like you would any other QB who threw up this brick.  It was a god awful pass to a wide open WR who had a clear path towards the EZ.  But hey, blame the new whipping boy, Nick Mangold

[Jet Nut]

Good. Because Geno is keen on doing both!

Last 4 games we watched Geno, he didn't do this kind of nonsense.  

Maybe Mangold was better?

[CrazyCarl40]

Geno has never had these weapons.

By these do you mean Brandon Marshall? He is literally the only difference between this year and last.

[Villain The Foe]

That's a Td w/ a decent pass, doesn't have to do anything special.  wide open.

Exactly what I said in my week 3 GIF breakdown. FItzpatrick threw the ball behind Enunwa and out of bounds on a play where Enunwa had about 5 yards of separation and the single high safety ran up to assist on the short slant by Kerley. 

Enunwa was WIDE OPEN with 5 yards of separation. That play should have been a 65 yard TD pass. If Geno would have made this throw there would have been a dozen of comments/gifs about it. Ryan Fitzpatrick does it and....silence. 

[Villain The Foe]

Maybe it's a better pass if Mangold doesn't get beaten off the ball and Colon has any clue of what he's doing out there.

Cut it out with the excuses bro. FItzpatrick stepped up into that throw and released the ball before he was hit. The pass was freaking poor. 

[CrazyCarl40]

Maybe its better you evaluate him like you would any other QB who threw up this brick.  It was a god awful pass to a wide open WR who had a clear path towards the EZ.  But hey, blame the new whipping boy, Nick Mangold

I didn't say it wasn't a terrible throw. It wasn't. It was a pressured, rushed throw because of a lack of time to throw. Geno throws that ball five yards out of bounds or takes a sack.

[Jet Nut]

I didn't say it wasn't a terrible throw. It wasn't. It was a pressured, rushed throw because of a lack of time to throw. Geno throws that ball five yards out of bounds or takes a sack.

It was as bad a throw you can make to a wide open receiver.  A QB has to make that throw, being rushed and harassed is part of the job description.  He got the pass off, wasn't hit until after the ball is on its way.  

If Geno threw that pass, against the Eagles.  If he threw the pass into the DL, over Marshalls head, etc, etc, Jet fans would be screaming from the tops of buildings how Geno sucks and cant hit the side of a barn.  Fitz?  Blame Mangold

[CrazyCarl40]

Cut it out with the excuses bro. FItzpatrick stepped up into that throw and released the ball before he was hit. The pass was freaking poor. 

Neither guard blocked anyone. Just sayin'.

[CrazyCarl40]

It was as bad a throw you can make to a wide open receiver.  A QB has to make that throw, being rushed and harassed is part of the job description.  He got the pass off, wasn't hit until after the ball is on its way.  

How do you know Enunwa didn't turn the wrong way? Maybe it was supposed to go to the sideline? And a rush can impact a throw before a QB gets hit.

[nyjunc]

By these do you mean Brandon Marshall? He is literally the only difference between this year and last.

No he's not, a healthy decker the first 2 weeks this year.  Kerley was his top target the last 2 years and barely plays.

 

by the way, Marshall makes a HUGE difference so to say "only" about him isn't being fair.

[Villain The Foe]

Neither guard blocked anyone. Just sayin'.

Those excuses dont work when its Geno Smith right? 

So, with that said let me ask you a simple question and please be honest. Was Ryan Fitzpatrick able to step up into the pocket (that you assume the Oline didnt create) get his legs under him and throw the ball before being hit? 

If the answer is yes then I ask...Why the excuses? Is it because this isnt Geno Smith? 

[56mehl56]

By these do you mean Brandon Marshall? He is literally the only difference between this year and last.

Coaching staff that acknowledges they have an offense , not just a RB and wildcat QB.

[CrazyCarl40]

No he's not, a healthy decker the first 2 weeks this year.  Kerley was his top target the last 2 years and barely plays.

 

by the way, Marshall makes a HUGE difference so to say "only" about him isn't being fair.

Decker didn't play 15 games last year and have nearly 1,000 yards receiving? Spare me. The only difference between the weapons this year and last is Marshall, who by the way, helped cost the team the victory this weekend. Just sayin'.

[CrazyCarl40]

Those excuses dont work when its Geno Smith right? 

So, with that said let me ask you a simple question and please be honest. Was Ryan Fitzpatrick able to step up into the pocket (that you assume the Oline didnt create) get his legs under him and throw the ball before being hit? 

If the answer is yes then I ask...Why the excuses? Its is because this isnt Geno Smith? 

Let's not re-hash how much time Geno Smith had last season and wasted in the pocket. Fitz was able to partially step up, but it was muted by the rush and he threw it awkwardly. You can see him turn at the last second to brace for impact from rushers that either were never touched or beat the offensive lineman.

[56mehl56]

How do you know Enunwa didn't turn the wrong way? Maybe it was supposed to go to the sideline? And a rush can impact a throw before a QB gets hit.

If it was a timing route that might make sense, but Enumwa clearly made his break upfield before Fitz throws. If Fitz can't read that he's not as smart as some think.

[Jet Nut]

How do you know Enunwa didn't turn the wrong way? Maybe it was supposed to go to the sideline? And a rush can impact a throw before a QB gets hit.

You're flailing 

 

[56mehl56]

You're flailing 

 

and failing

[nyjunc]

Decker didn't play 15 games last year and have nearly 1,000 yards receiving? Spare me. The only difference between the weapons this year and last is Marshall, who by the way, helped cost the team the victory this weekend. Just sayin'.

Decker missed time and was playing hurt the majority of the season but week 17 he was healthy and Geno was hitting him in stride on the deep ball.