varjet Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 Ryan Fitzpatrick is a husband and father who is reaching the end of his NFL career. Despite the fact that the Jets would be a good home for him during the next couple of years, he really has a duty and obligation to his family to maximize his income now. The Jets will also be looking to draft a QB in the future, putting Fitz in jeopardy. I am not seeing why he should take less money to play for the Jets, taking into account risk and contract structure. Unfortunately, if you need to sign a NFL starting QB that can get you into the playoffs to a contract, that costs around $15mm. If Geno could have succeeded that would have been very powerful, as he is under contract at a very low salary. Even drafting a QB in the first round gets you a cheap QB for 5 years if they can actually play. This is obviously why teams will continue to reach for QBs in the draft and roll the dice-the potential payoff is too great. Which takes me to Mo Wilkerson. I have to trust that Maccagnan knows what he is doing, but the Franchise Tag for him is somewhat perplexing. I am thinking we were better off letting him sign away and take the compensatory pick. In this situation I think the Franchise Tag is somewhat immoral-he is not really the Jets' property. The smart move is to extend your good players when the player has a good reason to do so-get guaranteed money earlier. To allow Mo to get to where he is really leaves the Jets with very little bargaining position. They are constrained from participating in free agency, and if they pay him $15mm this year to have him walk next year, that would be a waste unless they sign Fitz and can otherwise put a good team on the field this year. Other players look at Wilkerson is being treated and will take that into account in their dealings with the team. There are FAs DL who do not require draft picks, and a deep draft in DL. It would be great to sign Mo long term and possibly move on from Richardson, but it seems like we are in limbo. I hope I am missing something. I will not be offended if someone offers them even a 3rd Round pick for Wilkerson (better than the compensatory pick). I think in about a week we will know whether the Jets are trying to compete this year, or building a team for the future. They do seem to have alot of players off contract, and not alot of cap space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 6 minutes ago, varjet said: Ryan Fitzpatrick is a husband and father who is reaching the end of his NFL career. Despite the fact that the Jets would be a good home for him during the next couple of years, he really has a duty and obligation to his family to maximize his income now. The Jets will also be looking to draft a QB in the future, putting Fitz in jeopardy. I am not seeing why he should take less money to play for the Jets, taking into account risk and contract structure. Unfortunately, if you need to sign a NFL starting QB that can get you into the playoffs to a contract, that costs around $15mm. If Geno could have succeeded that would have been very powerful, as he is under contract at a very low salary. Even drafting a QB in the first round gets you a cheap QB for 5 years if they can actually play. This is obviously why teams will continue to reach for QBs in the draft and roll the dice-the potential payoff is too great. Which takes me to Mo Wilkerson. I have to trust that Maccagnan knows what he is doing, but the Franchise Tag for him is somewhat perplexing. I am thinking we were better off letting him sign away and take the compensatory pick. In this situation I think the Franchise Tag is somewhat immoral-he is not really the Jets' property. The smart move is to extend your good players when the player has a good reason to do so-get guaranteed money earlier. To allow Mo to get to where he is really leaves the Jets with very little bargaining position. They are constrained from participating in free agency, and if they pay him $15mm this year to have him walk next year, that would be a waste unless they sign Fitz and can otherwise put a good team on the field this year. Other players look at Wilkerson is being treated and will take that into account in their dealings with the team. There are FAs DL who do not require draft picks, and a deep draft in DL. It would be great to sign Mo long term and possibly move on from Richardson, but it seems like we are in limbo. I hope I am missing something. I will not be offended if someone offers them even a 3rd Round pick for Wilkerson (better than the compensatory pick). I think in about a week we will know whether the Jets are trying to compete this year, or building a team for the future. They do seem to have alot of players off contract, and not alot of cap space. I wish fans would get it through their thick heads that these things are not mutually exclusive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 The Jets have a projected $37+ million in free cap space already in 2017 even before cutting D'Brick and whatever else. I'm not so worried about being able to bring these guys back, but am curious to see how the Jets go about it. It is going to be a months long thing extravaganza. Should be fun to read some guy whine for the thousandth time about being in the same discussion 1000 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shevys Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 16 minutes ago, varjet said: Ryan Fitzpatrick is a husband and father who is reaching the end of his NFL career. Despite the fact that the Jets would be a good home for him during the next couple of years, he really has a duty and obligation to his family to maximize his income now. The Jets will also be looking to draft a QB in the future, putting Fitz in jeopardy. I am not seeing why he should take less money to play for the Jets, taking into account risk and contract structure. Unfortunately, if you need to sign a NFL starting QB that can get you into the playoffs to a contract, that costs around $15mm. If Geno could have succeeded that would have been very powerful, as he is under contract at a very low salary. Even drafting a QB in the first round gets you a cheap QB for 5 years if they can actually play. This is obviously why teams will continue to reach for QBs in the draft and roll the dice-the potential payoff is too great. That means that we should be able to sign Fitz for about $10M, all things considered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cant wait Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 24 minutes ago, shevys said: That means that we should be able to sign Fitz for about $10M, all things considered. Even that is almost double what he's really worth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIJetsFan Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 Good post OP: I've been beating this dead horse here on the boards for a while now and have been told, "hey, we gotta keep our good players" BUT...we just can't afford Mo's 15.7 this year and tagging him was dumb especially in light of the DL market. We had leverage and should have let Mo test FA. Sadly too late now. Now we must hope that Mac has a trade already lined up otherwise the cap pinch is going to limit us pretty good. Agree 100% on Fitz too.....he owes this team nothing and should make hay while the sun shines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowlesMovement Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 30 minutes ago, cant wait said: Even that is almost double what he's really worth Not sure what you are basing that on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 An issue the Jets kind of put on themselves was drafting Williams when they had two good enough(or even very good) interior players on the roster already. Williams was fairly meh for most of the season...the overstocking of the same position wasnt smart and now were stuck overanalyzing a position we were already set at. Its hindsight obviously, but the edge rusher was there to take last year and we passed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varjet Posted March 8, 2016 Author Share Posted March 8, 2016 http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/ Here is a list of what QBs in the NFL get paid. Foles appears to be at the head of the next group of QBs. The guys making $16mm and above appear to have the physical skills to take a game over. Fitzpatrick's agent is trying to group him with Bradford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 1 hour ago, varjet said: Ryan Fitzpatrick is a husband and father who is reaching the end of his NFL career. Despite the fact that the Jets would be a good home for him during the next couple of years, he really has a duty and obligation to his family to maximize his income now. The Jets will also be looking to draft a QB in the future, putting Fitz in jeopardy. I am not seeing why he should take less money to play for the Jets, taking into account risk and contract structure. Unfortunately, if you need to sign a NFL starting QB that can get you into the playoffs to a contract, that costs around $15mm. If Geno could have succeeded that would have been very powerful, as he is under contract at a very low salary. Even drafting a QB in the first round gets you a cheap QB for 5 years if they can actually play. This is obviously why teams will continue to reach for QBs in the draft and roll the dice-the potential payoff is too great. Which takes me to Mo Wilkerson. I have to trust that Maccagnan knows what he is doing, but the Franchise Tag for him is somewhat perplexing. I am thinking we were better off letting him sign away and take the compensatory pick. In this situation I think the Franchise Tag is somewhat immoral-he is not really the Jets' property. The smart move is to extend your good players when the player has a good reason to do so-get guaranteed money earlier. To allow Mo to get to where he is really leaves the Jets with very little bargaining position. They are constrained from participating in free agency, and if they pay him $15mm this year to have him walk next year, that would be a waste unless they sign Fitz and can otherwise put a good team on the field this year. Other players look at Wilkerson is being treated and will take that into account in their dealings with the team. There are FAs DL who do not require draft picks, and a deep draft in DL. It would be great to sign Mo long term and possibly move on from Richardson, but it seems like we are in limbo. I hope I am missing something. I will not be offended if someone offers them even a 3rd Round pick for Wilkerson (better than the compensatory pick). I think in about a week we will know whether the Jets are trying to compete this year, or building a team for the future. They do seem to have alot of players off contract, and not alot of cap space. I haven't seen anyone faulting either of them for trying to maximize their earnings in a career that ultra-rarely reaches age 40. They should see what they can get. So would you and so would I. Going rate or not, the Jets also have to weigh the going rate for the team around these players as well. Signing Fitzpatrick for $15M/season (and it's unlikely he'll sign with only 1 season of guarantees) is great for Fitzpatrick but I don't think it's so great for the Jets. At $3.5M he was a great bargain that afforded the Jets a starting QB so cheap they could spend a lot elsewhere. Fitzpatrick at $15M means there's $12M less than they have to spend elsewhere. Wilkerson and a bump in the cap limit aside, the team already has to deal with bumps in used up cap space (from 2015 to 2016) for Revis $1M, Ferguson $2.5M, Marshall $0.5M, Mangold $-1.8M, Decker $1.5M, Skrine $5M, Gilchrist $2.5M, L.Williams $0.8M, Carpenter $3.2M, Milliner $0.5M, Richardson $0.8M, Winters $1M, Pryor $0.4M, D.Smith $0.3M, Amaro $0.2M = $14M just to bring back these same players (i.e. no improvement from last year). Now add $11.5M more for Fitzpatrick = eats up over $35M in additional cap space to bring back these same players 1 year later, and try to improve the rest of the roster that clearly needed some tweaking or we'd have made the playoffs with that cake schedule. And it further ties us to an expensive Fitz if Petty or someone else materializes as starter (negating the savings we should realize by starting a cheap youngster). You just don't overpay unless it's a unique difference-maker. If someone else wants to overpay for what he's worth, let them and they'll be watching the playoffs from home as well. I understand tagging Mo. One hopes they have enough feelers out there from other teams who would be willing to give up a pick for him (the higher the better). But even if it's only a mid-round pick it's a mid-round pick more than not tagging him (don't bet on a compensatory pick, which disappears if we pick up UFAs from other teams. Thing is if we let him go it clears up space to add...someone else's high priced UFA, which then may cancel out any compensatory pick. I'm reserving judgment on Mac tagging Mo until we see what we get for him. But they did try to lock him up in the past and were unsuccessful. Maybe after his new contract is done it'll get leaked out how much he was seeking the past 2 offseasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munchmemory Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 24 minutes ago, varjet said: http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/ Here is a list of what QBs in the NFL get paid. Foles appears to be at the head of the next group of QBs. The guys making $16mm and above appear to have the physical skills to take a game over. Fitzpatrick's agent is trying to group him with Bradford. Looking at this, its pretty incredible how the Pats get away with not paying anyone. Gronk and Edelman are both way underpaid and Revis makes more than Brady apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 winning is expensive. you can't have a crappy roster and $50 million in cap room every off season now we find out if maccagnan can juggle spending like a drunken sailor he can do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 5 minutes ago, Larz said: winning is expensive. you can't have a crappy roster and $50 million in cap room every off season now we find out if maccagnan can juggle spending like a drunken sailor he can do Or you figure out how the Pats do it...they aint paying anyone big money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 Just now, Matt39 said: Or you figure out how the Pats do it...they aint paying anyone big money ernie adams has 30 car dealerships and an offshore bank account, which of course is just more cheating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cant wait Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 1 hour ago, BowlesMovement said: Not sure what you are basing that on Based on what the other journeyman scrubs get Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 7 minutes ago, Larz said: ernie adams has 30 car dealerships and an offshore bank account, which of course is just more cheating We are paying Revis 17 mill in 2016 while Gronks is due to make less than 2.5 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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