Let’s talk about Zach Wilson

[Barton]

2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

White also had a 4.1 % sack rate here whereas Wilson’s is 9.7 %.  And White never got to play with AVT.  

People took one play and made it seem like White is a guy who will take massive hits all the time based on purely on his lack of mobility.  Not so because he typically got the ball out quickly.

Meanwhile supposed “elite escapability”-blessed Zach Wilson got sacked at more than 2x a higher rate working with the same OL (+ AVT for a few games).  

Yup. Too small a sample size to say White is injury prone. 

[Jetsfan80]

31 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

He is having an outstanding camp and improving everyday.  Enjoy it buddy.

 

21 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

One of our young players is having an outstanding camp and improving w/ each practice.  And the majority of jet fans are miserable about that.

You could not explain the disease any better. 

For his standards sure.  

[jgb]

1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

For his standards sure.  

He hit a screen pass and didn’t alienate the team during the post game. Success through lowered expectations.

[jtomm]

On 8/2/2023 at 4:15 PM, peebag said:

No, we need to send him on assignments.

[T0mShane]

3 hours ago, JKlecko said:

That's an absurd take.  Based on your posts when you used to be on ganggreen.com, I expected better from you. He was horrific last season and part of his rookie season.  He didn't come into the NFL that way.  If you were running for your life your rookie season and had no talent around you, you probably would have developed the same bad habits that he did.  He has demonstrated that he can do things well.  You, like many other Jets fans, have written him off already, and you either don't want to see positives from him because that doesn't fit your agenda, or you're no longer capable of looking at things objectively.

Both Saleh and JD have said that they still believe in Zach.  One of the reasons that Rodgers said that he wants to come here was that he believes in Zach and wants to help him.  I believe that is part of the reason the Jets wanted Rodgers. If they had given up on Zach entirely, they would have signed Carr as a FA to at least a 4-year deal, and saved the draft picks and the delay in getting their new QB here.  That would have also allowed them to bring in a quality backup QB (since according to you, they think Zach is sh*t).  The fact that they didn't do that speaks volumes that in fact, the Jets have NOT given up on Zach and in fact, still believe in him.  I suggest you go back and watch the Titans game from Zach's rookie season.  He makes throws in that game that few other QBs in the NFL can make.

Due to colossal screw ups by JD and Saleh, Zach was set up to fail rather than succeed.  They told him that he wouldn't have to carry the team, yet that is in fact what they expected him to do his rookie season.  They expected him to do things that were totally unrealistic (change his basic footwork and his mindset about how he plays 180 degrees while starting and playing at a high level), with zero good coaching, while that idiot MLF was expecting him to exploit weaknesses in opposing secondaries in the first 3-4 games of his career.

 

I was on ganggreen for like five minutes before that guy Petro(?) banned me. As far as how the organization views Zach, they have Rodgers here for two years, at minimum, and then the fat numbers on his contract hit. They aren’t going to pay Rodgers while giving Zach any new money. Wilson’s contract is up after 2024, so we’re basically watching the end of his Jets career, likely this season. 

[Claymation]

6 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

White also had a 4.1 % sack rate here whereas Wilson’s is 9.7 %.  And White never got to play with AVT.  

People took one play and made it seem like White is a guy who will take massive hits all the time based on purely on his lack of mobility.  Not so because he typically got the ball out quickly.

Meanwhile supposed “elite escapability”-blessed Zach Wilson got sacked at more than 2x a higher rate working with the same OL (+ AVT for a few games).  

Yes he did, in 2021, he played with AVT against NE, Cin, IND and BUF.

 

[Dunnie]

For his standards sure.  

Really by any standard available...

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Jetsfan80]

15 minutes ago, Claymation said:

Yes he did, in 2021, he played with AVT against NE, Cin, IND and BUF.

 

My bad I was only thinking about 2022 in that regard.  

[Larz]

So Zach had a good practice. That’s good. 

[Joe W. Namath]

19 minutes ago, Larz said:

So Zach had a good practice. That’s good. 

Has had many good practices this year.  Thats very good!

[Dunnie]

Has had many good practices this year.  Thats very good!

It's amazing ... the denial going on in these parts is unrivaled

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Jetsfan80]

9 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I still have no clue what people are talking about when they say Zach has elite skills that made him worthy of # 2 overall.

A strong arm?  Cool, JaMarcus Russell had one of those too.  Is there a 2nd skill I’m supposed to be impressed with?  There’s nothing else about his game skill-wise that is upper echelon compared to other NFL QBs in the league today.  

If you want to say a prospect has elite pro skills he’s gotta be a freak athlete like Hurts or Lamar Jackson, physically imposing (with a heavy dose of freakishness) like Cam Newton or Josh Allen, OR he has to have incomparable accuracy like the Brees, Rodgers, Burrow, etc.  Wilson isn’t in any of those categories.

He’s a midround project QB masquerading as something much more and has a legion of supporters who blindly agree.  It’s bizarre.  

 

@JohnnyLV @jetsons care to explain to me what I'm missing that's "special" about Zach Wilson or just going the downvote route and moving on with your day?  

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, Dunnie said:

It's amazing ... the denial going on in these parts is unrivaled

Best practice QB ever.  Come a real game and he turns into a spinning ballet dancer the moment a modicum of pressure (perceived or otherwise) comes.  How does he fix that?  Rodgers just gonna tell him "hey kid don't do that" because CLEARLY LaFleur didn't in his 2 years here and its his fault?

[jgb]

1 hour ago, Dunnie said:

It's amazing ... the denial going on in these parts is unrivaled

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

The only post of yours I have ever fully agreed with. The denial is indeed absurd.

[JKlecko]

21 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I would agree with this if Zach Wilson has ever demonstrated the ability to do anything well. He’s horrific from the pocket and has zero composure or accuracy while on the move. No coordinator is fixing that, particularly now that the org isn’t invested in his development. We’re just running out the clock with Wilson. 

The bold is just utter BS imo. You're projecting what you think about Wilson onto what the organization thinks about him, and your reasoning is an epic fail.  Every move they've made shows that they still believe in him and haven't given up on him.

[Dunnie]

1 hour ago, jgb said:

The only post of yours I have ever fully agreed with. The denial is indeed absurd.

Edited August 6, 2023 by Dunnie

[JKlecko]

9 hours ago, Matt39 said:

After another topsy turvy season, Wilson has fallen out of favor, but the business relationship between Jets' owner Woody Johnson and Wilson's Uncle, David Neeleman is the wildcard in this scenario. 

Neeleman is the founder of JetBlue airlines, the official airline of the Jets. 

This high-level connection has the strong potential to keep Wilson grounded in New York and off of the trading block

I swear, the dumb BS I see on these Jets boards coming from Jets fans is simply amazing.  One can't this sh*t up!

[jgb]

9 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

The bold is just utter BS imo. You're projecting what you think about Wilson onto what the organization thinks about him, and your reasoning is an epic fail.  Every move they've made shows that they still believe in him and haven't given up on him.

Well, every move except for giving up premium draft picks and $75M (or more) on a 39-year-old replacement. But other than that... they love the guy!

[JKlecko]

2 minutes ago, jgb said:

Well, every move except for giving up premium draft picks and $75M (or more) on a 39-year-old replacement. But other than that... they love the guy!

I see that either your reasoning is not better than Tom's or you're just trying to be a wise guy.  They knew that Zach needed to sit this year and do a re-set.  They also knew that if they didn't start winning this year, that Saleh was probably going to be on the hot seat if not get fired.  If they had given up on Zach, they would have signed Carr early on to a 4- or 5-year contact and wouldn't have had to wait around or give up draft picks.  That would have signalled that they had given up on Zach.  They could have then brought in a better backup.  One of the reasons the Jets liked and wanted Rodgers is that he is friends with Zach and Rodgers asked to make sure that Zach was still part of the Jets plans, becaue he wanted to come here and help Zach develop.

[jgb]

1 minute ago, JKlecko said:

I see that either your reasoning is not better than Tom's or you're just trying to be a wise guy.  They knew that Zach needed to sit this year and do a re-set.  They also knew that if they didn't start winning this year, that Saleh was probably going to be on the hot seat if not get fired.  If they had given up on Zach, they would have signed Carr early on to a 4- or 5-year contact and wouldn't have had to wait around or give up draft picks.  That would have signalled that they had given up on Zach.  They could have then brought in a better backup.  One of the reasons the Jets liked and wanted Rodgers is that he is friends with Zach and Rodgers asked to make sure that Zach was still part of the Jets plans, becaue he wanted to come here and help Zach develop.

No, they would've have "signaled" that they gave up on him. It doesn't benefit them to do so in any scenario. He has a guaranteed contract. They may believe in him, they may not, they may hope to get trade value back in the future, they may be trying to build his confidence up... in no situation does it benefit the Jets for them to announce they are done with Zach. But boy, actions speak louder than words.

 

[T0mShane]

13 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

The bold is just utter BS imo. You're projecting what you think about Wilson onto what the organization thinks about him, and your reasoning is an epic fail.  Every move they've made shows that they still believe in him and haven't given up on him.

How are you saying something it “utter BS” and following it up with “imo.” It’s a statistical fact that Zach is 1. Bad from the pocket and 2. Inaccurate outside of the pocket. The only place where Zach performs at a statistically competent level are downs on which he 1. doesn’t face pressure and 2. gets the ball off under 2.5 seconds and 3. Is throwing against zone coverage. Regrettably, other teams know this, so they don’t provide him with many of those opportunities. As far as “believing in him,” what do you predict his next contract will look like? Presuming Rodgers plays this year and next, then retires, he initiates a $49 million dollar dead cap hit going into 2025. Do you think the Jets are going to extend Zach to a Jordan Love-type deal ($20mm/1 yr) on top of what they’re locked into with Rodgers? No way. If Zach were to somehow improve enough that the franchise considers him salvageable two years from now, it’s not going to be in his interests to re-sign here for a prove-it deal anyway. 

[T0mShane]

8 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

If they had given up on Zach, they would have signed Carr early on to a 4- or 5-year contact and wouldn't

They just gave Aaron Rodgers a five year contract with beefier cap hits that Carr’s deal ensures post-‘24. The Saints can dump Carr after 24 and incur a tiny $17 mil cap hit spread over two seasons. Rodgers’ hit would be upwards of $49 mil in that scenario. 

[Dunnie]

They just gave Aaron Rodgers a five year contract with beefier cap hits that Carr’s deal ensures post-‘24. The Saints can dump Carr after 24 and incur a tiny $17 mil cap hit spread over two seasons. Rodgers’ hit would be upwards of $49 mil in that scenario. 

Why can't the antizaxxers admit the kid is getting better ? Why is that a bad thing ?

I don't get it ..jgb, jetsfan80, TomShane ... Can you clue me in?

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[T0mShane]

1 minute ago, Dunnie said:

Why can't the antizaxxers admit the kid is getting better ? Why is that a bad thing ?

I don't get it ..jgb, jetsfan80, TomShane ... Can you clue me in?

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

I think the thing is that he’s not getting better and there’s an effort afoot to reward him (and Becton) for doing the bare minimum of what their jobs require, which would be fine if they were both picked on Day Three.

[jgb]

3 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

Why can't the antizaxxers admit the kid is getting better ? Why is that a bad thing ?

I don't get it ..jgb, jetsfan80, TomShane ... Can you clue me in?

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

It wouldn’t be a bad thing. But 5 passes isn’t enough to make such a pronouncement. 

[The Engineer]

17 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I think the thing is that he’s not getting better and there’s an effort afoot to reward him (and Becton) for doing the bare minimum of what their jobs require, which would be fine if they were both picked on Day Three.

Says your expert opinion? Haha what? You’re an expert at nothing football related. You and your clown posse of poster friends that make it absolutely miserable even browsing these forums anymore. 

[Jetsfan80]

5 minutes ago, The Engineer said:

Says your expert opinion? Haha what? You’re an expert at nothing football related. You and your clown posse of poster friends that make it absolutely miserable even browsing these forums anymore. 

This "clown posse" you speak of is just super happy to have a real QB for once.  Sorry you feel the need to try to bring down our joy for the express purpose of propping up the QB2 who should be a QB4 and won't be on the roster in roughly 20 months.

[jgb]

8 minutes ago, The Engineer said:

Says your expert opinion? Haha what? You’re an expert at nothing football related. You and your clown posse of poster friends that make it absolutely miserable even browsing these forums anymore. 

Right, the fans who are excited about Aaron Rodgers replacing the statistical-worst QB for two consecutive years are the ones “ruining” the board.
 

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

This "clown posse" you speak of is just super happy to have a real QB for once.  Sorry you feel the need to try to bring down our joy for the express purpose of propping up the QB2 who should be a QB4 and won't be on the roster in roughly 20 months.

Ironic since the Zachians spent 2 years telling us we weren’t allowed to enjoy it when the Jets became good. My, talk about a backfire.

[T0mShane]

9 minutes ago, The Engineer said:

Says your expert opinion? Haha what? You’re an expert at nothing football related. You and your clown posse of poster friends that make it absolutely miserable even browsing these forums anymore. 

It’s just weird that you guys have concluded that the trade for and signing of Hall of Famer Aaron Rodgers is part of some five year master plan to resuscitate the career of Zach Wilson—one of the statistically worst QB busts in the history of the sport. It’s like watching your wife leave you for Jason Momoa and thinking “this will ultimately be good for our relationship.”

[jgb]

1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

It’s just weird that you guys have concluded that the trade for and signing of Hall of Famer Aaron Rodgers is part of some five year master plan to resuscitate the career of Zach Wilson—one of the statistically worst QB busts in the history of the sport. It’s like watching your wife leave you for Jason Momoa and thinking “this will ultimately be good for our relationship.”

She just needs to find herself and I need time to reset and work on myself. She’ll be back and we will be stronger than ever.

[Joe W. Namath]

1 hour ago, Dunnie said:

Why can't the antizaxxers admit the kid is getting better ? Why is that a bad thing ?

I don't get it ..jgb, jetsfan80, TomShane ... Can you clue me in?

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

It starts with “dis” and ends with “ease”.

[Hal]

1 hour ago, jgb said:

Right, the fans who are excited about Aaron Rodgers replacing the statistical-worst QB for two consecutive years are the ones “ruining” the board.
 

Ironic since the Zachians spent 2 years telling us we weren’t allowed to enjoy it when the Jets became good. My, talk about a backfire.

Don’t hate the players.   Just hate the game. 
 

@Jetsfan80 @T0mShane 

[LIJetsFan]

1 hour ago, Joe W. Namath said:

It starts with “dis” and ends with “ease”.

Sorry but I don't see why it's not legit to "know in your bones" that Zack is not NFL starter QB material.   Why is that opinion now some sort of high crime?  And before you ask, nothing would make me happier than Zack actually showing improvement and consistency.  As of now there is no evidence of it.      

[Hal]

Just now, LIJetsFan said:

Sorry but I don't see why it's not legit to "know in your bones" that Zack is not NFL started QB material.   Why is that opinion now some sort of high crime?  And before you ask, nothing would make me happier than Zack actually showing improvement and consistency.  As of now there is no evidence of it.      

Fair enough  

 

On the other side… His feet seem less happy.  He’s working on sliding around in the pocket.   He’s actually being coached now.  
 

Having a bad coach doesn’t mean he’s good.   It means there is a chance he turns it around.  I can’t imagine a better scenario to see what he can become.  
 

 

[Rich Thornburgh]

On 8/5/2023 at 2:09 AM, jgb said:

Wait until LaFleur calls “the good plays” in LA

One of these years Zach will get a good offensive coordinator