Woody And The Jets

[Scott Dierking]

The Kendall situation was out of control. As the man who signs the paychecks, Woody is culpable for that embarrassing episode.

That is a fair point.

Woody COULD have put his foot down on that situation and said. "let's pony up". But, that may have undercut Tangini in authority. Will we have every player who is in a contract dispute come running to Woody after the brain trust says no? Maybe?

The Jets drew a line in teh sand one other time like this, and that was the Keyshawn Johnson showdown. I understood to some degree why they stood their ground there.

But this was a curious situation. It seemed like a trivial amount to make a huge point. Well, it was a point that they won with the player, but lost the war.

I would love to know the inner workings of that decision and why it was handled the way it was. Maybe ole Pete was toomedia friendly for their liking.

Maybe these 2 just need to not hold grudges and pick their battles.

[Jet Moses]

That is a fair point.

Woody COULD have put his foot down on that situation and said. "let's pony up". But, that may have undercut Tangini in authority. Will we have every player who is in a contract dispute come running to Woody after the brain trust says no? Maybe?

The Jets drew a line in teh sand one other time like this, and that was the Keyshawn Johnson showdown. I understood to some degree why they stood their ground there.

But this was a curious situation. It seemed like a trivial amount to make a huge point. Well, it was a point that they won with the player, but lost the war.

I would love to know the inner workings of that decision and why it was handled the way it was. Maybe ole Pete was toomedia friendly for their liking.

Maybe these 2 just need to not hold grudges and pick their battles.

In hindsight, it is clear that the Pete Kendall situation was an outrage. And think about it, if treating a mediocre, journeyman guard like that could cause as muchdevestation to this team that it did...

What will prevent this folly again? That's my main concern. Nobody has even taken responsibility for it, or said "hey, if we could do it all over again, we would do it differently".

Either the triumverate of Johnson, Mangini, and Tannenbaum are that arrogant, or worse, they are just plain dense.

[Gainzo]

My end zone seats are $105. They go up in price regardless of the Jets record.

My point is -- do you think the Jets will roll out no price increases next season? I hope they stay the same. I am not waiting up for it.

Thats more expensive than the endzone seats in Foxboro and only $20 less than my seats; 10 yard line, Row 9.

Barring the Club Seats and Suites, $125 is the most expensive ticket in Foxboro. I believe Club Seats are $10,000 a year with a 10 year commitment. I have no idea what a suite goes for. I'd guess at least $100,000 - $200,000 a year.

Keep in mind that Kraft did not introduce PSL's.

The Jets ticket prices are quickly approaching the Pats and you guys play in a Stadium that was built in the early '70's.

BTW: Good read JetMo.

[BP]

Thats more expensive than the endzone seats in Foxboro and only $20 less than my seats; 10 yard line, Row 9.

Barring the Club Seats and Suites, $125 is the most expensive ticket in Foxboro. I believe Club Seats are $10,000 a year with a 10 year commitment. I have no idea what a suite goes for. I'd guess at least $100,000 - $200,000 a year.

Keep in mind that Kraft did not introduce PSL's.

The Jets ticket prices are quickly approaching the Pats and you guys play in a Stadium that was built in the early '70's.

BTW: Good read JetMo.

Lower level end zone goes for $75, Mezzanine end zone goes for $105 at Giants stadium. I think Max is in the Mezzanine.

[mdjet]

Fair enough, but he still did all the hustling to turn 175 million into 1.2 billion. By the way, how did Woody's marriage turn out?

The man is a failure at every turn of the page. His lone accomplishment is inheriting a fortune. He didn't know what to do with all his money so he bought a football team. And now his sits around and wonders what he should do with his football team.

No I hear ya, just wanted to point out that he had a nice head start in life such as guys like Trump.

I think Woody is just a moron that inherited a ton of money, good for him. His family is a mess, his daughter a kook, and now Ahmad Rashad is spending his money...

[Gainzo]

Lower level end zone goes for $75, Mezzanine end zone goes for $105 at Giants stadium. I think Max is in the Mezzanine.

I'm aware of that. The Pats don't have mezzanine seats in the end zones although we do have a couple of McDonald's!

The mezzanine seats on the sidelines (corner of the end zone to the 20 yard line) are under $100 if I'm not mistaken.

[TheSage]

Krafty hit a triple by marrying the bosses daughter, that's why you always see her up in the press box hamming it up, it was her money that enabled all of this...

You beat me to it-in fact - his father in law was a well known philanthropist long before the world heard of Robert Kraft..

But let's give credit to both Woody John and Robert Kraft who have both been exceedingly philanthropic.

We may not like Kraft's football tactics but he is a damn good person

[Gainzo]

You beat me to it-in fact - his father in law was a well known philanthropist long before the world heard of Robert Kraft..

But let's give credit to both Woody John and Robert Kraft who have both been exceedingly philanthropic.

We may not like Kraft's football tactics but he is a damn good person

There is a huge difference between Kraft & Woody:

Kraft was a fan long before he had the money to buy the team. He had season tickets forever. He has a passion for the team that a lot of owners don't have.

He screwed up in the mid 90's when he meddled with the football side of things (over ruling Tuna and demanding they draft Terry Glenn). He learned his lesson and now focus' his energy on the business side of things.

[RSJ]

BTW, great article Jetmo.

In defense of Woody and believe me I'm not letting him off the hook, he was willing to spend some money on Winfield and a few others that we just couldn't close the deal with.

[Boozer76]

Thanks for the feedback.

The Kendall situation was out of control. As the man who signs the paychecks, Woody is culpable for that embarrassing episode.

I do not believe that Tannenbaum, nor Bradway before him, had carte blanche on contract decisions. I think Woody always had the last word, and still does.

OK JetMo, so you really think that Tannenbaum, Mangini, and Johnson sat in a room talking about Kendall and it wen like this:

Mangini-Kendall is looking for about a 1.3 mil increase. He's a good guard and made sacrifices to the team.

Tannenbaum-I can certainly fit 1.3m into the cap

Johnson-No. He's getting old and I always felt he's a little undersized. Tell him to can it. In fact, put him in the rookie dorm!!!!

You give way to much credit to Woody and owners across the league.

[Green DNA]

I'm aware of that. The Pats don't have mezzanine seats in the end zones although we do have a couple of McDonald's!

The mezzanine seats on the sidelines (corner of the end zone to the 20 yard line) are under $100 if I'm not mistaken.

I'm on the side of the end zone and it's till $105, in fact I think seats on the 50 yard line are still $105. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the whole effin mezzanine is $105.

[Green DNA]

We may not like Kraft's football tactics but he is a damn good person

Personally, I'd like to punch him in his bloated face, but that's just me.

[Gainzo]

I'm on the side of the end zone and it's till $105, in fact I think seats on the 50 yard line are still $105. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the whole effin mezzanine is $105.

Damn. Thats pretty expensive. The Jets are doing the same thing the Pats did. They are raising ticket prices so that when the new place opens there won't be "sticker shock" when you get your season ticket invoice.

I just hope there are no PSL's for you guys.

[Scott Dierking]

You give way to much credit to Woody and owners across the league.

You know who has turned out to be a pretty good owner for his team and IS involved in football operations-Jerry Jones.

Heck, he even calls himself GM.

He did not listen to EVERYTHING that Parcells said, and molded the team as he wanted.

Rather than collapsing after a Parcells departure, he has brought on a mediocre coach, revamped his offensive line with some risky moves that paid off, and had a very good year.

Say what you want about Jerry Jones and his arrogance, but he has done some pretty good things for his fan base, all the while staying involved in the football operations.

Woody Johnson? Not so much. But that does not make him a bad owner. Yet.

[Boozer76]

You know who has turned out to be a pretty good owner for his team and IS involved in football operations-Jerry Jones.

Heck, he even calls himself GM.

He did not listen to EVERYTHING that Parcells said, and molded the team as he wanted.

Rather than collapsing after a Parcells departure, he has brought on a mediocre coach, revamped his offensive line with some risky moves that paid off, and had a very good year.

Say what you want about Jerry Jones and his arrogance, but he has done some pretty good things for his fan base, all the while staying involved in the football operations.

Woody Johnson? Not so much. But that does not make him a bad owner. Yet.

He''s 1 of 32 owners. He's the only owner who medles and is succesful, maybe give Al Davis during the 70's and that is it. Most of the ownersw who start meddling look alot more like Snyder.

So basically you're agreeing with me that Woody isn't involved, or do you still agree with JetMo that Woody decided to tell Mangini and Tannenbaum to trade Kendall?

[Scott Dierking]

or do you still agree with JetMo that Woody decided to tell Mangini and Tannenbaum to trade Kendall?

I never said that.

I said that MAYBE Woody could have put a foot down and ponied up, but there are repercussions based on that action. Pretty much the same reason Al Groh left-Because he knew all the players would go to Tuna if they didn't like his decision.

[Boozer76]

I never said that.

I said that MAYBE Woody could have put a foot down and ponied up, but there are repercussions based on that action. Pretty much the same reason Al Groh left-Because he knew all the players would go to Tuna if they didn't like his decision.

But that's exactly my point. Why in the world would you want a guy who has absolutely zero football background, as almost every owner has, put his foot down to override the GM and head coaches decision? Do you really believe that Kendall's 1.3 mil had anything to do with whether or not they could afford it? Tangini didn't like something about him, whether it was locker room presence, age, or ability the decision was solely by Mangini and Tannenbaum. Most likely Mangini alone.

Woody does very little in the way of team decisions. You can argue back and forth whether or not he's a good owner for being more or less involved with the team, but calling him cheap is ridiculous. We are in the largest sports market in the world where pretty much every other sport charges far above the league average and is always at the top. It costs more to run a team here, and it costs more to buy a team here. Woody showed his spending willingness by pushing o have the most expensive stadium of all time that would have beared the most expensive yearly costs of all time, EVEN AFTER THE TAXES HELPED! Furthermore, he paid Chad Pennington the 2nd higher to the tune of being the 2nd highest paid QB behind only Peyton manning at the time. He allowed hi GM to run the team at the brink of the cap every single year he has owned the team. This year is the first where we actually have cap room, which is a testament to good management from Tannenbaum. Woody employed Jay Cross as president to handle things like pricing, West Side Stadium, public relations, etc. Now, if you really want to complain about the decisions the team has made since Woody was the owner, look no further than Jay Cross and blame Woody for hiring him. But the nonsense about Woody being cheap is beyond out of control.

[Maxman]

I find it amazing that people have this opinion of Hess when he never went out of his way to turn the Jets into a winner. There is a reason the Jets were so pitifull for so many years and it's because Hess refused to spend money on the team, and would rather hire his less expensive friends.

This is not true. I remember back then, the mid 80's -- the Jets were always top 5 in payroll. Blame Gutman, blame Hess for them being bad. But it wasn't for Leon holding back. He would have done whatever he could have to win.

They just paid the wrong players.

[Scott Dierking]

But that's exactly my point. Why in the world would you want a guy who has absolutely zero football background, as almost every owner has, put his foot down to override the GM and head coaches decision? Do you really believe that Kendall's 1.3 mil had anything to do with whether or not they could afford it? Tangini didn't like something about him, whether it was locker room presence, age, or ability the decision was solely by Mangini and Tannenbaum. Most likely Mangini alone.

Woody does very little in the way of team decisions. You can argue back and forth whether or not he's a good owner for being more or less involved with the team, but calling him cheap is ridiculous. We are in the largest sports market in the world where pretty much every other sport charges far above the league average and is always at the top. It costs more to run a team here, and it costs more to buy a team here. Woody showed his spending willingness by pushing o have the most expensive stadium of all time that would have beared the most expensive yearly costs of all time, EVEN AFTER THE TAXES HELPED! Furthermore, he paid Chad Pennington the 2nd higher to the tune of being the 2nd highest paid QB behind only Peyton manning at the time. He allowed hi GM to run the team at the brink of the cap every single year he has owned the team. This year is the first where we actually have cap room, which is a testament to good management from Tannenbaum. Woody employed Jay Cross as president to handle things like pricing, West Side Stadium, public relations, etc. Now, if you really want to complain about the decisions the team has made since Woody was the owner, look no further than Jay Cross and blame Woody for hiring him. But the nonsense about Woody being cheap is beyond out of control.

You really need to go back and read my first post in this thread.

I think you have me confused with another side of this debate.

[Boozer76]

You really need to go back and read my first post in this thread.

I think you have me confused with another side of this debate.

Huh, sorry about that. High five??

[Maxman]

Lower level end zone goes for $75, Mezzanine end zone goes for $105 at Giants stadium. I think Max is in the Mezzanine.

Yes I am in the mezz.

[Maxman]

So we all agree that Woody is the Devil, just for different reasons. Is that correct? lol.

[Alk]

Great article JM!! Sooth seems to think so too as a JI VIP posted it over there and he deleted the thread within 5 minutes.

[Boozer76]

So we all agree that Woody is the Devil, just for different reasons. Is that correct? lol.

No. I think he's as good an owner as 90% of the league.

[Bugg]

News flash! Do you really think they care about a fan base? As soon as they release PSL pricing, you're going to see a mass exit of true fans which will be supplanted by cooporate dick licks and ticket scalping brokers.

Correct me if I'm wrong-Kraft, for all our hatred for him as Jets fans-raised prices for the new stadium(and for better or worse that's to be expected in these parts in 2009), but did not charge a PSL.

The PSL will be a joint or mutual decision between the Jets and the Giants. I know for a fact from some family that works with the Mara's firm that, having been in NYC for almost a century, they aren't too keen on the PR hit PSLs would be. Their outlook is they will make enough money by practically ending tailgating and herding us all into the huge TGIF/ESPN ZOne/Applebee's pregame ripoff fest, so why gouge the regular guy fan any more than you have to to bleed his pockets?

What Johnson thinks or wants to do is unknown.It's a lot of money to leave on the table, but given the revenue projections once this stadium opens, it's chump change and bad publicity. If the 2 bulls can eff everyone coming off Route 3 for the next half century and beyond, why piss off a bunch of previously-compliant cows to continue to be effed?

It's fair to raise ticket prices, and may be a bunch, for a new stadium. But PSLs would be greed, pure and simple. And at the levels we're hearing talked about($5k per ticket), there's some decisions to be made, both by Johnson and fans who've supported this team even though we've gooten precious little to show for it.

[Gainzo]

Correct me if I'm wrong-Kraft, for all our hatred for him as Jets fans-raised prices for the new stadium(and for better or worse that's to be expected in these parts in 2009), but did not charge a PSL.

No PSL's for Gillette Stadium. Kraft, as much as I don't like the guy, did not subject me and the rest of the season ticket holders to PSL's.

Gillette was a privately funded stadium. The only thing the Commonwealth of Massachusetts kicked in was some minor money for infrastructure improvements around the Stadium.

[Maxman]

Great article JM!! Sooth seems to think so too as a JI VIP posted it over there and he deleted the thread within 5 minutes.

Are you serious? Not sure if you are but if so, that is weak. Let's delete Jets talk because sooth refuses to allow a return link. Unreal.

Or did they delete it because it was bashing the Jets? I wonder.

[BP]

Are you serious? Not sure if you are but if so, that is weak. Let's delete Jets talk because sooth refuses to allow a return link. Unreal.

Or did they delete it because it was bashing the Jets? I wonder.

Don't the Jets and JI each have one of these?

[Gainzo]

Are you serious? Not sure if you are but if so, that is weak. Let's delete Jets talk because sooth refuses to allow a return link. Unreal.

Or did they delete it because it was bashing the Jets? I wonder.

C'mon Max. You know better than that. Sooth doesn't want to lose his precious press pass.

What is the golden rule at JI? Don't bash the ownership or certain media members.

[Maxman]

LOL!!!

This thread is perfect now. Woody bashing wasn't enough. Now we have yet another example of Sooth's hatred and the thread is complete!

[Jet Moses]

No I hear ya, just wanted to point out that he had a nice head start in life such as guys like Trump.

I think Woody is just a moron that inherited a ton of money, good for him. His family is a mess, his daughter a kook, and now Ahmad Rashad is spending his money...

You won't get any argument from me.

OK JetMo, so you really think that Tannenbaum, Mangini, and Johnson sat in a room talking about Kendall and it wen like this:

Mangini-Kendall is looking for about a 1.3 mil increase. He's a good guard and made sacrifices to the team.

Tannenbaum-I can certainly fit 1.3m into the cap

Johnson-No. He's getting old and I always felt he's a little undersized. Tell him to can it. In fact, put him in the rookie dorm!!!!

You give way to much credit to Woody and owners across the league.

No, that's not it at all. But at what point during that public caning of Kendall does Woody intervene and say "What are you doing to my employee?"

Great article JM!! Sooth seems to think so too as a JI VIP posted it over there and he deleted the thread within 5 minutes.

I'm dissapointed. I thought for sure it was worthy of the JI Garbage dump.

If the 2 bulls can eff everyone coming off Route 3 for the next half century and beyond, why piss off a bunch of previously-compliant cows to continue to be effed?

Bugg, demographics are changing; millions of baby boomers are retiring, getting their SSI, pensions, 401K annuities, and inheriting windfalls from expiring parents. These are the people Woody wants to attract. Xanadu is going to be AARP meets Disney World.

LOL!!!

This thread is perfect now. Woody bashing wasn't enough. Now we have yet another example of Sooth's hatred and the thread is complete!

Smooch is upset I didn't kiss his ring at 16H.

Seriously, it was sad--- there was Limo Lady with here table of Pat Tillman foundation stuff, and next to it was another table. Sooth was standing there, all alone, eating. I wish I had brought a camera.

[Bugg]

You won't get any argument from me.

No, that's not it at all. But at what point during that public caning of Kendall does Woody intervene and say "What are you doing to my employee?"

I'm dissapointed. I thought for sure it was worthy of the JI Garbage dump.

Bugg, demographics are changing; millions of baby boomers are retiring, getting their SSI, pensions, 401K annuities, and inheriting windfalls from expiring parents. These are the people Woody wants to attract. Xanadu is going to be AARP meets Disney World.

Smooch is upset I didn't kiss his ring at 16H.

Seriously, it was sad--- there was Limo Lady with here table of Pat Tillman foundation stuff, and next to it was another table. Sooth was standing there, all alone, eating. I wish I had brought a camera.

What I really dont get about "Xanadu"-do they know Orson Welles call John Foster Kane's mansion that in "Citizen Kane", and that it was mocking and sarcastic?Where ***** Galore, Glenn Garry Glenn Ross and Phillie Tartaglia's Whorehouse taken? There's no one clamoring for a giant indoor ski slope in New Jersey; good luck insuring that. And New Jersey needs another mall like it needs more refineries.

Just how much money is too much for Johnson? No demand graph goes up forever. He knows, for example, that until recently the Knicks were bulletproof,and now you cannot give their tickets away. I think it would be a wise and smart business decsiotn to say the jets and Giants need a understandable increase in ticket prices($125 per?), but as a gesture of goodwill to their loyal fans, will not charge a PSL. And if Kraft,who's franchise has appreciated without one, why go there? Gain, if they take a PSL, it's pure greed.

[Jet Moses]

What I really dont get about "Xanadu"-do they know Orson Welles call John Foster Kane's mansion that in "Citizen Kane", and that it was mocking and sarcastic?Where ***** Galore, Glenn Garry Glenn Ross and Phillie Tartaglia's Whorehouse taken? There's no one clamoring for a giant indoor ski slope in New Jersey; good luck insuring that. And New Jersey needs another mall like it needs more refineries.

Just how much money is too much for Johnson? No demand graph goes up forever. He knows, for example, that until recently the Knicks were bulletproof,and now you cannot give their tickets away. I think it would be a wise and smart business decsiotn to say the jets and Giants need a understandable increase in ticket prices($125 per?), but as a gesture of goodwill to their loyal fans, will not charge a PSL. And if Kraft,who's franchise has appreciated without one, why go there? Gain, if they take a PSL, it's pure greed.

The thing that all of Woody's graph paper brain accountants are failing to take into consideration is the fact that all the baby boomers and retirees are going to leave NJ to avoid the obscene taxes. The working stiffs, who have supported this team for half a century won't be able to afford the seats.

[RSJ]

This is not true. I remember back then, the mid 80's -- the Jets were always top 5 in payroll. Blame Gutman, blame Hess for them being bad. But it wasn't for Leon holding back. He would have done whatever he could have to win.

They just paid the wrong players.

I did not mention the payroll of the team. I was talking about his less than stellar and less expensive coaching staff and FO.

[Maxman]

I did not mention the payroll of the team. I was talking about his less than stellar and less expensive coaching staff and FO.

I don't think they lost because he wasn't willing to spend money on the team. I can come up with 100 other reasons why they lost though, but that is probably the topic for another thread, lol.