CASHMAN: JOHAN'S NOT THE KEY

[NIGHT STALKER]

By MIKE PUMA

January 26, 2008 -- Brian Cashman won the popular vote last night in what he joked beforehand was the equivalent of a Hillary Clinton-Barack Obama debate.

The Yankee GM actually was a guest lecturer, joined onstage by his Red Sox counterpart Theo Epstein, at William Patterson University in Wayne, N.J. And the mostly partisan Yankee crowd - about 1,000 fans who paid $37 apiece and packed an auditorium to hear the rivals talk baseball - was most invigorated by Cashman's take on the possibility of pursuing Twin ace Johan Santana in a trade.

"My strong recommendation is we stick with our young pitching staff and keep it in-house," Cashman said to rousing applause. "That's my recommendation, and we've fought hard to take one step back to take two giant steps forward."

Epstein nodded in agreement, but it's not quite clear if the Red Sox GM was sharing Cashman's view or just happy to hear his division rival wants to pass on acquiring Santana.

While Cashman and Epstein may be fierce management rivals, last night underscored their friendship away from the ballpark. Earlier this month Cashman appeared at a fundraiser for Epstein's "Foundation to be Named Later" in Boston, and Epstein returned the favor with his visit here last night.

At times, the two were remarkably candid, from Cashman admitting Johnny DamonJohnny Damon and Bobby AbreuBobby Abreu were not in shape last spring to Epstein saying he regretted the rash trade he made two years ago, when he sent promising reliever Cla Meredith to the Padres to reacquire backup catcher Doug Mirabelli, after Mirabelli's replacement Josh Bard had a rough game handling Tim Wakefield's knuckleball.

On Bernie Williams' final years in pinstripes, Cashman's assessment was the former center fielder, "Got into music, and I thought it took a lot away from his play."

Cashman said one of the reasons Williams wasn't back with the YankeesNew York Yankees last year was the GM feared having to release the popular player during the season, and that wouldn't have been a proper sendoff. Cashman indicated Williams got the proper farewell two years ago, after a having a "terrible" 2005 season.

There was good byplay between Cashman and Epstein, with the latter joking he was responsible for importing the bugs into Cleveland that distracted Joba Chamberlain during Game 2 of the AL Division Series.

During a question-and-answer session, a fan asked each GM whom he would take from the other's team if given the chance. Cashman picked Jason Varitek, noting he'd like to take the catcher and "put him [on] another planet," to cripple the Red Sox.

Who would Epstein pluck from the Yankees?

"I'd take the gentleman on my left," Epstein said, motioning to Cashman, "and make him [our] scouting director."

Cashman wasn't afraid to put the Yankees in that underdog category, saying the Red Sox are the team to beat in the AL East.

"There's no doubt about it, they are the [defending] World Series champs," Cashman said. "When they take the field in spring training with relatively the same team, they'll know what they can do, and we're still building toward that."

mpuma@nypost.com

[Blackout]

its true

[PeterNorth09]

Red Sox are getting Santana even though the Yankees made a better offer for him. When are teams going to stop giving away their best players to Boston for *****ing table scraps?

[Smizzy]

It will be a HUGE mistake if NY lets Johan go somewhere else.

[GimmeShelter]

Cash sure was a little rough on Bernie there.

[anskyruben]

Two ass kissers at their finest. Bunch of jibberish.

[Thai Jet]

Red Sox are getting Santana even though the Yankees made a better offer for him. When are teams going to stop giving away their best players to Boston for *****ing table scraps?

I wouldn't exactly call Bostons last offer to the Twins table scraps.

[mbn007]

It will be a HUGE mistake if NY lets Johan go somewhere else.

Why?

[Smizzy]

Why?

I don't know...he's the best pitcher in MLB and a southpaw.

Our pitching staff is ****. You guys want to bank on what these kids might become...when Santan has already become great?

All we do is sign OLD PIECES OF **** who don't help us win anything. You give Arod 300 Million dollars and balk on getting a top pitcher?

Maybe Hank doesn't comprehend the fact AROD doesn't pitch.

[DaBrick Wall]

I don't know...he's the best pitcher in MLB and a southpaw.

Our pitching staff is ****. You guys want to bank on what these kids might become...when Santan has already become great?

All we do is sign OLD PIECES OF **** who don't help us win anything. You give Arod 300 Million dollars and balk on getting a top pitcher?

Maybe Hank doesn't comprehend the fact AROD doesn't pitch.

Santana gave up the most home runs in MLB last year. Even he's not a sure thing. You don't trade two of your top pitchers PLUS pay him $150 million. That's too steep a price to pay and the Yankees were smart to stay away.

[Smizzy]

Santana gave up the most home runs in MLB last year. Even he's not a sure thing. You don't trade two of your top pitchers PLUS pay him $150 million. That's too steep a price to pay and the Yankees were smart to stay away.

Only time will tell.

[PFSIKH]

Santana gave up the most home runs in MLB last year. Even he's not a sure thing. You don't trade two of your top pitchers PLUS pay him $150 million. That's too steep a price to pay and the Yankees were smart to stay away.

And his ERA was almost a half run lower then your 2x19 game winner?

In arguably his worse season, he out did Wang in every important stat except won/loss. I doubt Wang wins 19 in Minny or even 10.

[SouthernJet]

And his ERA was almost a half run lower then your 2x19 game winner?

In arguably his worse season, he out did Wang in every important stat except won/loss. I doubt Wang wins 19 in Minny or even 10.

excellent point,,

[NIGHT STALKER]

And his ERA was almost a half run lower then your 2x19 game winner?

In arguably his worse season, he out did Wang in every important stat except won/loss. I doubt Wang wins 19 in Minny or even 10.

And you know this how? How many wins does Beckett get in Colorado?

[PFSIKH]

And you know this how? How many wins does Beckett get in Colorado?

Are you serious?

Wang won 19 games with worse stats in just about every category for a team that scored 968 runs and won 94 games.

Compared to:

Johan who won 15 games with a significantly lower ERA for a team taht averaged almost a run less and won only 79 games.

Wang is a good pitcher, but a great pitcher barely broke .500. Give him the Yankees offense and he is probably a 20 game winner.

Wang is good. Johan is great.

[shutout]

Wang is good.

Sorry,had to quote it. Nothing personal, and I apologize for the off topic post, but that just can't go unnoticed on this board

[PFSIKH]

Sorry,had to quote it. Nothing personal, and I apologize for the off topic post, but that just can't go unnoticed on this board

No need to apologize. Especially on this board.

[DaBrick Wall]

And his ERA was almost a half run lower then your 2x19 game winner?

In arguably his worse season, he out did Wang in every important stat except won/loss. I doubt Wang wins 19 in Minny or even 10.

Where did I compare Wang to Johan Santana? I'm just saying, Santana's HR rate and G/F ratio would be concerning to me. The Mets didn't give jack **** up for him though so they shouldn't care. He's still the best pitcher in the game, but I would have reservations about trading two of my young starting pitchers, plus a serviceable CF, for him.

[mbn007]

I still do not see where the Yankees desperately needed Santana. Don't get me wrong, any team would love to add him, especially for the next 3-4 seasons. After that though, I do think he slows/breaks down. His workload is very high, and even though he is going to a lighter hitting league, with bigger ballparks, he still will log the innings. after 4 more seasons, he will then have had 8 straight years at 220+ innings. Since he Ks a bunch, that means a lot of pitches. You start to worry at that time.

Meanwhile, the Yankees are going the route that they should have many years ago. Draft well, and develop your own kids. While Joba, Phil and Ian are still more prospects than "sure things" , but I would rather take my chance on them. I have followed the Minors for decades, and this is the first time that the Yankees really have solid pitching prospects, Even better than the early 1990s, when Mo, Andy and company were in the pipeline.

The Mets made a fantastic deal, unless Gomez is the real thing offensively. So far, I do not see it. He is a big kid, so maybe he fills out a bit, and develops like the Twins think he will.

But considering what the rumored Yankee and Red Sox offers were, I am glad my name is not Mr. Smith, Minny Twins GM.

[AFJF]

I still do not see where the Yankees desperately needed Santana. Don't get me wrong, any team would love to add him, especially for the next 3-4 seasons. After that though, I do think he slows/breaks down. His workload is very high, and even though he is going to a lighter hitting league, with bigger ballparks, he still will log the innings. after 4 more seasons, he will then have had 8 straight years at 220+ innings. Since he Ks a bunch, that means a lot of pitches. You start to worry at that time.

Meanwhile, the Yankees are going the route that they should have many years ago. Draft well, and develop your own kids. While Joba, Phil and Ian are still more prospects than "sure things" , but I would rather take my chance on them. I have followed the Minors for decades, and this is the first time that the Yankees really have solid pitching prospects, Even better than the early 1990s, when Mo, Andy and company were in the pipeline.

The Mets made a fantastic deal, unless Gomez is the real thing offensively. So far, I do not see it. He is a big kid, so maybe he fills out a bit, and develops like the Twins think he will.

But considering what the rumored Yankee and Red Sox offers were, I am glad my name is not Mr. Smith, Minny Twins GM.

I think it was Peter Gammons that said in the end, Minny ended up getting what would have been the fifth best offer they had gotten from all the teams involved.

[mbn007]

I think it was Peter Gammons that said in the end, Minny ended up getting what would have been the fifth best offer they had gotten from all the teams involved.

Even if you want to be charitable and say he took the 3rd best offer, it was still a present-day-value, lousy deal for the Twins. And if the lower level kids don't produce, it will be even worse.