Matt39 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Forgot about Boggs. That was a sham. Winfield chose correctly. Its debatable- but Winfield was also trying to tick off Steinbrenner in the process. Winfield also played for like 10 teams before he was done. By the time Arod is finished- 3/4 of his career will have been with the Yanks. 2 MVP's, 1 WS as of now, potential 3000 hits and the home run record. He'll be entered as a Yankee. No different than Manny going in as a Boston Red Sox. I'd even say there's more of a debate of him going in as an Indian than Arod as a Mariner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmikeisback Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 You said his 2 BEST years were with the Yankees-Not necessarily so. He had some great years with Texas (and Marin ers). And yes, Mariners is what his hat should say if he gets honored. Dave Winfield spent more time with the Yankees than the Padres, but went in as a Padre. It should say M's because you hate the yankees. You don't really have a better reason than that. BTW 05 and 07 were the best years of his career. And any way you stack up his counting numbers or season AVG's he's been better as a yankee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Its debatable- but Winfield was also trying to tick off Steinbrenner in the process. Winfield also played for like 10 teams before he was done. By the time Arod is finished- 3/4 of his career will have been with the Yanks. 2 MVP's, 1 WS as of now, potential 3000 hits and the home run record. He'll be entered as a Yankee. No different than Manny going in as a Boston Red Sox. I'd even say there's more of a debate of him going in as an Indian than Arod as a Mariner. No guarantee he gets inducted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 No guarantee he gets inducted. Ok- you brought Arod into this. I never said it's a guarantee- I was going off the assumption that you made that he'd get in. I just think its fairly clear that Arod will get inducted as a NYY. And if Alex goes in Manny has to as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted July 5, 2011 Author Share Posted July 5, 2011 His combined numbers in Texas are better than what he did with the Yankees (average). Who knows if the Hall will even consider his steroid enabled stats, regardless. May all be moot. My stance is that all the confirmed steroid guys should not be in the hall. But that won't happen, the early guys will pay the price but eventually I believe guys like ARod will get in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted July 5, 2011 Author Share Posted July 5, 2011 Forgot about Boggs. That was a sham. Winfield chose correctly. Yes, he the team that he should have gone in as paid him the most money! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 You're really gonna try to defend his performance last year and this year? He's been nothing short of awful. He hits grounds balls 65% of the time for the last 2 years. Line drives 11%. Do you realize how awful that is? It's the worst in baseball by like 10%. Should I get out the list of horrible players who are putting up better numbers than he is? What he did in 2007 means nothing now and they are hurting the team trotting him out there to break a meaningless record and placate his ego. I think the vast majority of teams in the majors would love to have a SS who hits .270 and fields his position solidly and is a great leader in the clubhouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmikeisback Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 I think the vast majority of teams in the majors would love to have a SS who hits .270 and fields his position solidly and is a great leader in the clubhouse. BA means nothing. He's a 640 OPS player who plays mediocre defense and hits the ball hard pretty much less than every player in the majors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 I think the vast majority of teams in the majors would love to have a SS who hits .270 and fields his position solidly and is a great leader in the clubhouse. Jeter isnt hitting at all though and his defense is average at best. Most major league SS's dont make the errors Nunez has been making anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 You said his 2 BEST years were with the Yankees-Not necessarily so. He had some great years with Texas (and Marin ers). And yes, Mariners is what his hat should say if he gets honored. Dave Winfield spent more time with the Yankees than the Padres, but went in as a Padre. Dave Winfield was one of the last players who had a choice and he chose the Padres for purely financial reasons - it was better for Dave Winfield to enter the Hall of Famer as the first Padre enshrined rather than just another Yankee in the Hall of Fame. For some reason the Hall took that decision away from the player which I think is stupid. I don't think that a player should automatically go into the Hall with the team he breaks into the majors with. A-Rod will be better remembered as a Yankee when all is said and done - he's played the most years, hit the bulk of his home runs and won his championships (yes he will win more) as a Yankee. Mike Piazza will always be better remembered as a Dodger. Dave Winfield is really more remembered as a Yankee but he broke in with the Padres and won his WS with the Blue Jays - his was a strange case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Jeter isnt hitting at all though and his defense is average at best. Most major league SS's dont make the errors Nunez has been making anyway. You said it right there. Nunez is terrible defensively. When you consider the Yankees options, they got the right guy starting. While as a Yankee fan I'd love nothing more than Derek to voluntarily move down in the batting order, as a Yankee fan I can't begrudge him finishing his career as a Yankee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmikeisback Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 You said it right there. Nunez is terrible defensively. When you consider the Yankees options, they got the right guy starting. While as a Yankee fan I'd love nothing more than Derek to voluntarily move down in the batting order, as a Yankee fan I can't begrudge him finishing his career as a Yankee. So now the standard for him, a guy making 16 million, is. "Better than Nunez"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 So now the standard for him, a guy making 16 million, is. "Better than Nunez"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Dave Winfield was one of the last players who had a choice and he chose the Padres for purely financial reasons - it was better for Dave Winfield to enter the Hall of Famer as the first Padre enshrined rather than just another Yankee in the Hall of Fame. For some reason the Hall took that decision away from the player which I think is stupid. I don't think that a player should automatically go into the Hall with the team he breaks into the majors with. A-Rod will be better remembered as a Yankee when all is said and done - he's played the most years, hit the bulk of his home runs and won his championships (yes he will win more) as a Yankee. Mike Piazza will always be better remembered as a Dodger. Dave Winfield is really more remembered as a Yankee but he broke in with the Padres and won his WS with the Blue Jays - his was a strange case. One person's opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 One person's opinion. So you think Babe Ruth's plaque in the Hall should have a Red Sox hat on it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Scott you can always just admit you were wrong initially on Arod...no one will hold it against you. It was pretty transparent that your dislike of the Yankees was behind your Arod should go in as a Mariner argument(which you really didn't have one either). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 So you think Babe Ruth's plaque in the Hall should have a Red Sox hat on it? When did I say that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Scott you can always just admit you were wrong initially on Arod...no one will hold it against you. It was pretty transparent that your dislike of the Yankees was behind your Arod should go in as a Mariner argument(which you really didn't have one either). Matt, you can kindly allow me to have my own opinion. I promise, it won't hurt you in any way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Matt, you can kindly allow me to have my own opinion. I promise, it won't hurt you in any way. What possible case could you have for A-Rod going into the Hall as a Mariner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Matt, you can kindly allow me to have my own opinion. I promise, it won't hurt you in any way. If you have zero way of backing up your opinion why dont you just keep it to yourself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 If you have zero way of backing up your opinion why dont you just keep it to yourself? And exactly what way do you have of backing up that he will "go in as a Yankee"? Or, even go in at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmikeisback Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Matt, you can kindly allow me to have my own opinion. I promise, it won't hurt you in any way. Since when have you ever allowed anyone to have their opinion. You're the biggest a$$ on this board and you expect people to respect your opinion? Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 What possible case could you have for A-Rod going into the Hall as a Mariner? All I can speak to is where he is at today. He has played 8 years as a Yank. 7 as a Mariner. If he has a debilitating injury (who can predict the future?), he deserves as much chance today as going in as a Mariner as a Yankee-It is where his career started, it is where he actually had popularity as a player, rather than the oddity that he is today. maybe he was even steroid free in those years? The image of Rodriguez is certainly more pure as a Mariner than a Yankee, in most fans' eyes. Purely a judgment call of mine there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Since when have you ever allowed anyone to have their opinion. You're the biggest a$$ on this board and you expect people to respect your opinion? Really? Shouldn't you be disappearing form the Phil Hughes thread, after it was proven that his "peripherals" are NOT better than league average Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmikeisback Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Shouldn't you be disappearing form the Phil Hughes thread, after it was proven that his "peripherals" are NOT better than league average Go back to whining. No one will respect your opinion because you're a dick to everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Go back to whining. No one will respect your opinion because you're a dick to everyone. Go back to crying to the Mods in PMs, when someone proves you wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmikeisback Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Go back to crying to the Mods in PMs, when someone proves you wrong. No one is whining here except you. Anyone can see that. You made a dumb yankee hater point then when you were proved wrong you whine beucase people aren't respecting your opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 No one is whining here except you. Anyone can see that. You made a dumb yankee hater point then when you were proved wrong you whine beucase people aren't respecting your opinion. I have never sent a Mod a PM because I got schooled in a debate like you. Back on point, there is no "proving" on this topic. NO ONE knows TODAY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmikeisback Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 I have never sent a Mod a PM because I got schooled in a debate like you. Back on point, there is no "proving" on this topic. NO ONE knows TODAY. If no one knows why are making dumb hateraide posts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 And exactly what way do you have of backing up that he will "go in as a Yankee"? Or, even go in at all. His best years have been as a Yankee. He's been a Yankee longer than any other team. He won his one WS with the Yankees. Two MVP's as a Yankee. The Mariners wont even get consideration from the MLB assuming the steroids players enter the hall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 His best years have been as a Yankee. He's been a Yankee longer than any other team. He won his one WS with the Yankees. Two MVP's as a Yankee. The Mariners wont even get consideration from the MLB assuming the steroids players enter the hall. His OPS were actually best as a Ranger. -Of course he is not going in with them. Probably the real debate is whether he breaks the HR record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 His OPS were actually best as a Ranger. -Of course he is not going in with them. Probably the real debate is whether he breaks the HR record. His two MVP years as a Yankee he had a higher OPS than any of the 3 years in Texas. Manny on the other hand had his highest OPS years in Cleveland. But I dont think you'll hear any arguments that he shouldnt go in as a Red Sox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 His two MVP years as a Yankee he had a higher OPS than any of the 3 years in Texas. Manny on the other hand had his highest OPS years in Cleveland. But I dont think you'll hear any arguments that he shouldnt go in as a Red Sox. Manny probably won't be elected-That is a slam dunk in my opinion. A-Rod is a borderline case. By averages, ARod's best years were in Texas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 All I can speak to is where he is at today. He has played 8 years as a Yank. 7 as a Mariner. If he has a debilitating injury (who can predict the future?), he deserves as much chance today as going in as a Mariner as a Yankee-It is where his career started, it is where he actually had popularity as a player, rather than the oddity that he is today. maybe he was even steroid free in those years? The image of Rodriguez is certainly more pure as a Mariner than a Yankee, in most fans' eyes. Purely a judgment call of mine there. http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/rodrial01.shtml He's played 315 more games as a Yankee than as a Mariner, has almost 100 more homers in a Yankee uniform, two MVP awards as a Yankee, 0 as a Mariner, 7 all star appearances with the Yankees, 4 with the Mariners. Oh, and a World Series MVP award as a Yankee. Its not close. He's a Yankee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/rodrial01.shtml He's played 315 more games as a Yankee than as a Mariner, has almost 100 more homers in a Yankee uniform, two MVP awards as a Yankee, 0 as a Mariner, 7 all star appearances with the Yankees, 4 with the Mariners. Oh, and a World Series MVP award as a Yankee. Its not close. He's a Yankee. Matsui won the World Series MVP, other than that...its pretty damn obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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