madmike1 Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 The only time I resort to name-calling is when I am talking to you, because it is impossible to have a real football discussion with you.Yeah because I'm WAY out on a limb saying that Chad is above avg QB and that the jets shouldn't bench him LMAO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Hey, Mr. Football Knowledge, check out this old thread: http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14950&highlight=Aaron+Brooks I particularly like this post of yours: Yards and TD/INT ratio arn't meaningless stats and brooks blows ramsey away in both. I know some people have problems with the QB rating formula but if you look at the leaders in that stat the best QB's are at the top of that list. The top 4 are Manning Palmer Hasslebeck and Roethlisberger. Those guys were the 4 best QB's in the NFL last year... As compared to this post in this very thread: Barton you couldn't be stupid enough to judge QB's on TD/INT ratio. Could you? Barton couldn't...but madmike could! BTW, Chad Pennington is 13th in passer rating...one below.....JP LOSMAN!!! YEAH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Hey, Mr. Football Knowledge, check out this old thread: http://www.jetnation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14950&highlight=Aaron+Brooks I particularly like this post of yours: As compared to this post in this very thread: Barton couldn't...but madmike could! BTW, Chad Pennington is 13th in passer rating...one below.....JP LOSMAN!!! YEAH! As I've said earlier in this thread, my problem was judging players SOLELY on Yards TD/INT ratio or QB rating which is what Barton was doing. I've never said they were meaningless i just said they were flawed and i've never said anything other then that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 As I've said earlier in this thread, my problem was judging players SOLELY on Yards TD/INT ratio or QB rating which is what Barton was doing. I've never said they were meaningless i just said they were flawed and i've never said anything other then that. There is no magic stat for judging a QB. All the stats must be examined. They are all flawed, but when you look at all of them, it starts to paint a clearer picture of how good a QB is. How many stat categories have Chad Pennington ranked in the top ten? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 There is no magic stat for judging a QB. All the stats must be examined. They are all flawed, but when you look at all of them, it starts to paint a clearer picture of how good a QB is. How many stat categories have Chad Pennington ranked in the top ten? Did I say their was a magic stat? There you go again putting words in my mouth. in fact I've been saying that exactly same you just did from the second i got on this board. Chad is 7th in Comp %, 12th in YPA and 13th in Rating. and he's been in between 7 and 13 on most stats all year and thats where he belongs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanTX Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 I actually know something about football. POTW Nomination For the most hilarious post of the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanTX Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 I argue with dumb statements, period. That's what I do. And that is why I seem to argue with you so much. Because you make Peter North look like R44. Another POTW nomination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanTX Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 As I've said earlier in this thread, my problem was judging players SOLELY on Yards TD/INT ratio or QB rating which is what Barton was doing. I've never said they were meaningless i just said they were flawed and i've never said anything other then that. So if you take PennyBoy's TD/INT ratio (which is a pathetic 13/13) and add in his QB rating (which is below JP Losman) and finally add in PennyBoy's absolutely pathetic 4-15 record against top defensive teams, what kind of QB do you get? Case closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 People really need to take the QB rating out of their discussion. It was villified when used in support of Chad (rightly so), and in counter, it should not be used against him. Some people come off as hypocrites in using this formula in debating a qbs worth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 How the hell this ridiculous thread got to 47 pages is beyond me but here's the facts and lets stop this crap: The Jets are 7-5, WINNING, with Chad Pennington as the starting quarterback and until the Jets start LOSING with Chad Pennington as the starting quarterback they are NOT going to make a change, deal with it. The organization has invested WAY too much money and Kellen Clemens is not going to see the field (unless an injury occurs) most likely before the 2008 season. Chad Pennington is still a winning QB over his career for the Jets and this season aside from a few bad games has produced well. If Chad has been at least decent, have the Jets won / competeted with everyone? Yep. If Chad has sucked, have the Jets sucked? Yep. With a rookie under center we would be no better. 2008 - The Kellen Clemens Era will begin unless we somehow find a way to win the Super Bowl this season or next. Not before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 People really need to take the QB rating out of their discussion. It was villified when used in support of Chad (rightly so), and in counter, it should not be used against him. Some people come off as hypocrites in using this formula in debating a qbs worth I agree with this. Unless someone's rating is off the charts like Manning's 120+ rating in '04 or Young & Montana's 112 ratings, it is a poor indicator of comparing QB's when you're in the middle-ground around 80-90. Favre's best year he never topped a 100 rating. So was Doug Flutie's '98 season better than Favre's best season? Please. Namath never sniffed at a rating of 90 (or even 80 probably). Ditto Bradshaw & many other great QBs. Marino's career rating was in the 80's. Elway's was even lower. So is Pennington a better QB than both Elway & Marino were? Was Neil O'Donnell? His rating trumped both as well. It's not a dumb statistic to have, but the calculation used to arrive at the number is very, very flawed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsfanbkny Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 So if you take PennyBoy's TD/INT ratio (which is a pathetic 13/13) and add in his QB rating (which is below JP Losman) and finally add in PennyBoy's absolutely pathetic 4-15 record against top defensive teams, what kind of QB do you get? Case closed. a 7-5 QB and a 5-6 QB like you said patheticfantx QB are judged by wins...case closed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsfanbkny Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 People really need to take the QB rating out of their discussion. It was villified when used in support of Chad (rightly so), and in counter, it should not be used against him. Some people come off as hypocrites in using this formula in debating a qbs worth qb rating,td/int, and yards don"t mean shyt if your not winning...so you can throw all of it out the window.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanTX Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 qb rating,td/int, and yards don"t mean shyt if your not winning...so you can throw all of it out the window.. OK then, please explain how PennyBoy's pathetic 4-15 record against top defenses makes him a good QB? This should be real good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsfanbkny Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 OK then, please explain how PennyBoy's pathetic 4-15 record against top defenses makes him a good QB? This should be real good. 3. J. Kitna DET 31904. M. Bulger STL 3172 kitna 2-10 third in pass yardage bulger 5-7 tory holt and steven jackson and isiaac bruce.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanTX Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 3. J. Kitna DET 31904. M. Bulger STL 3172 kitna 2-10 third in pass yardage bulger 5-7 tory holt and steven jackson and isiaac bruce.. You avoided the question. Please respond to what I asked you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsfanbkny Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 You avoided the question. Please respond to what I asked you. not really i was trying to make a point about stats mean shyt like i said in my post throw them out the window...and as to your question here i"ll answer it...the pats D is ranked where this year and that was three weeks ago so that is one victory against a good D right..the bears was a hicupp thing and i am hoping just like every other fan in here is he doesnt have another one...but if your saying he can"t beat a good D then your saying your D suks am i right tx.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 OK then, please explain how PennyBoy's pathetic 4-15 record against top defenses makes him a good QB? This should be real good. He is 2-2 in the playoffs Has thrown for over 11,000 yards in 57 starts. He has over 65.1% accuracy. He has a 68-43 TD/INT ratio. He has a 89.6 QB rating. Why ISN'T he a good QB? BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanTX Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Why ISN'T he a good QB? 4-15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 4-15 Back that up. What is a "top defense" and over what time period? BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsfanbkny Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 He is 2-2 in the playoffs Has thrown for over 11,000 yards in 57 starts. He has over 65.1% accuracy. He has a 68-43 TD/INT ratio. He has a 89.6 QB rating. Why ISN'T he a good QB? BZ i dont think anybody understands why tx is so mad all the time he lives in tx cant even watch his favorite team live....shyt i would be pissed to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsfanbkny Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Back that up. What is a "top defense" and over what time period? BZ no no no bz he cant beat a good D so three weeks ago we beat a horrible D... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanTX Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Back that up. What is a "top defense" and over what time period? BZ Since PennyBoy was the starting QB back in 2002. Top defense is a defense ranked in the top 10 of the NFL. How many times do you need this stat explained? PFSIKH has explained his research numerous times on this board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Since PennyBoy was the starting QB back in 2002. Top defense is a defense ranked in the top 10 of the NFL. How many times do you need this stat explained? PFSIKH has explained his research numerous times on this board. Oh I see... "his research"... Well, "my research" says that "his research" is unfounded and poorly tabulated. BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanTX Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Oh I see... "his research"... Well, "my research" says that "his research" is unfounded and poorly tabulated. BZ You can take the validity up with PFSIKH. But trust me, his info is dead-on accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 I've seen absurd Chadinette threads claiming Brady or Peyton Manning aren't better than Chad and couldn't do better than him. That's absolutely ridiculous. Pennington is, at best, a mediocre QB. The "haters" are those that say as much. WTF!?! Nobody said that you are full of it. Pennington is our best quarterback. Obviously he is not as good as Brady or Manning but he is our best signal-caller. You want to upgrade over Chad? Draft Leinart or Jay Cutler or bomb the rest of this season to draft Brady Quinn. Helen Clemens is not the answer. Neither are Brian Brohm or Jamarcus Russell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatsFanTX Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Helen Clemens is not the answer. How do you know that for sure? How many poor regular season games has Clemens had to lead you to that conclusion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 You can take the validity up with PFSIKH. But trust me, his info is dead-on accurate. So you are basing your statements on research you don't have and don't have the actual facts to back it up with. Sounds like you stating an opinion without fact. Toodles. BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsfanbkny Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 You can take the validity up with PFSIKH. But trust me, his info is dead-on accurate. i noticed in about three or four of your posts when bz was schooling you kept telling him talk to pkfish why is that tx... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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