Boom or bust?

[Bronx]

34 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

JJ isn't going to be playing LB.  If anyone plays LB it would be Reddick.

I want to be wrong, thanks.

[Mr. Rogers]

I really can't imagine any of our DL play LB lol. That's not a common thing in the NFL - JJ doing it in college or Reddick playing 3-4 OLB doesn't mean they'll be adequate to play as nickel LBs in a Jets defense where a lot of coverage skills, both in man and zone, is required. Perhaps extremely rarely the Jets could use a 5-2 type defensive package, but it wouldn't be a significant % of snaps. 

If McDonald is really breaking out in a huge way, he will just trend more towards 60-65% snaps instead of 40%ish. Clemons is likely the one to lose out if so - JJ and Reddick will likely be playing around 60-65% themselves and there's definitely room for all 3 of them to do so at other DL's expense.

[Rich Thornburgh]

Bust 

 

We coulda had Jordan Addison and Garrett Wilson at WR.  This franchise never learns

[THE BARON]

i predict two players will emerge to become fan favorites.  mac and corley

[Doggin94it]

11 hours ago, JustInFudge said:

The Jets have had over 45 sacks in back to back seasons, as a below .500 ball club.  You're selling them way short.

A complete list of teams whose top 3 pass rushers combined for 30 sacks last year:

Baltimore 32.5 (Madibuike had 14, Clowney 9.5, Van Noy 9)

Jacksonville 31 (Allen 17.5, Walker 10, Robertson-Harris 3.5)

Miami 30 (Chubb 11, Sieler 10, Wilkins 9)

Pittsburgh 30 (Watt 19, Highsmith 7, Golden 4)

That's it. There were only 4. If we have 3 guys combining for 30 total sacks, we're doing absolutely fantastic; the rest of the sacks come from other guys on the team picking up between 1 and 5 sacks.

[Doggin94it]

Just for fun, I went back and looked at the 2022 leader board as well and holy hell that PHI D had passrushers out the ears.

Their top 3 was Reddick (16) and two of Graham, Hargrave, and Sweat, who each had 11 - total of 38 among 3 player and 49 from just 4. That's insane.

The others that year? 

NE 34.5 (Judon 15.5, Uche 11.5, Wise 7.5)

PIT 30.5 (Highsmith 14.5, Heyward 10.5, Watt 5.5)

And yeah, that's it, again. 3 teams had that combo in 2022. 7/64 across 2 years. I'd be surprised if anything was different most years. 

So yeah, if our top 3 guys get 30 between them, that would be outstanding. 

[JustInFudge]

8 hours ago, Doggin94it said:

A complete list of teams whose top 3 pass rushers combined for 30 sacks last year:

Baltimore 32.5 (Madibuike had 14, Clowney 9.5, Van Noy 9)

Jacksonville 31 (Allen 17.5, Walker 10, Robertson-Harris 3.5)

Miami 30 (Chubb 11, Sieler 10, Wilkins 9)

Pittsburgh 30 (Watt 19, Highsmith 7, Golden 4)

That's it. There were only 4. If we have 3 guys combining for 30 total sacks, we're doing absolutely fantastic; the rest of the sacks come from other guys on the team picking up between 1 and 5 sacks.

Got it, I dont think I realized when you said group that you only meant those 3.  I thought you were taking into consideration the entire unit.  

That said, I still think it can happen.  Reddick gets 10-12, Will 10-12, JJ 6-8.  Probably more like 26-30 out of those 3 but I think that could go higher if everything clicks right.

Ironically, I actually think the Jags are a good example.  Walker as a rookie had 3.5 sacks, jumped up to 10 in his second season.  I know Walker was the 1st overall pick but IMO Will is a much better pure pass rusher and then they have a stud in Allen like we do in Reddick.  So again, 10 from Will 10-12 from Reddick, 6-8 from JJ...they could do it...or get super close.  

[Bronx]

40 minutes ago, JustInFudge said:

Got it, I dont think I realized when you said group that you only meant those 3.  I thought you were taking into consideration the entire unit.  

That said, I still think it can happen.  Reddick gets 10-12, Will 10-12, JJ 6-8.  Probably more like 26-30 out of those 3 but I think that could go higher if everything clicks right.

Ironically, I actually think the Jags are a good example.  Walker as a rookie had 3.5 sacks, jumped up to 10 in his second season.  I know Walker was the 1st overall pick but IMO Will is a much better pure pass rusher and then they have a stud in Allen like we do in Reddick.  So again, 10 from Will 10-12 from Reddick, 6-8 from JJ...they could do it...or get super close.  

Q. Will, McDonald will get around 5 sacks.   

[JustInFudge]

10 minutes ago, Bronx said:

Q. Will, McDonald will get around 5 sacks.   

Combined?

[Bronx]

28 minutes ago, JustInFudge said:

Combined?

Q. Will- 10; McDonald-5

[JustInFudge]

26 minutes ago, Bronx said:

Q. Will- 10; McDonald-5

Got it.  So in your estimation, Will McDonald will play roughly 300-400 more snaps this season and produce, 2 sacks more then he did as a rookie?  Solid math, Bronx. 

[Bronx]

13 minutes ago, JustInFudge said:

Got it.  So in your estimation, Will McDonald will play roughly 300-400 more snaps this season and produce, 2 sacks more then he did as a rookie?  Solid math, Bronx. 

Let his game do the talk, BTW, I hope that I am wrong. 

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Bronx said:

Q. Will, McDonald will get around 5 sacks.   

Huff, everyone’s all time fav had 4 in his first 2 seasons, combined.   
3.5 in his 3rd.

 

[Bronx]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

McD had that on his own with limited playing time as a rookie.  

Huff, everyone’s all time fav had 4 in his first 2 seasons, combined. 

If we can stop the run, then I can see higher production.  The run-stop has being one of the NY Jets' weaknesses under Saleh.  

[JustInFudge]

15 minutes ago, Bronx said:

Let his game do the talk, BTW, I hope that I am wrong. 

You started a thread claiming he was a bust, w/out letting his game talk.  lmfao

He had 3 sacks on 180 snaps as a rookie....you think he'll get 5 on 400+.  It's not logical but fun thread! 

 

[Jet Nut]

7 minutes ago, Bronx said:

If we can stop the run, then I can see higher production.  The run-stop has being one of the NY Jets' weaknesses under Saleh.  

The team has been a top 5 defense in two of his 3 years, I’m not complaining about the D

[slats]

9 minutes ago, Bronx said:

If we can stop the run, then I can see higher production.  The run-stop has being one of the NY Jets' weaknesses under Saleh.  

Really? The Jets gave up 4.1 ypc last year, good for 10th in the league. The problem with the rushing defense has been the number of rushes the defense faced while the offense failed to score or even get a first down. Jets faced the third most rushing attempts last year. 

[Rich Thornburgh]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

The team has been a top 5 defense in two of his 3 years, I’m not complaining about the D

Wait till we finally have a qb who doesn’t totally siphon balls dry 

[Doggin94it]

4 hours ago, JustInFudge said:

Got it, I dont think I realized when you said group that you only meant those 3.  I thought you were taking into consideration the entire unit.  

That said, I still think it can happen.  Reddick gets 10-12, Will 10-12, JJ 6-8.  Probably more like 26-30 out of those 3 but I think that could go higher if everything clicks right.

Ironically, I actually think the Jags are a good example.  Walker as a rookie had 3.5 sacks, jumped up to 10 in his second season.  I know Walker was the 1st overall pick but IMO Will is a much better pure pass rusher and then they have a stud in Allen like we do in Reddick.  So again, 10 from Will 10-12 from Reddick, 6-8 from JJ...they could do it...or get super close.  

If it happens, I think it's likely the other way around between Will and JJ; yeah, Will's a better natural pass rusher but he's got farther to go to maximize that talent than JJ does. Moderate growth from both could put JJ at 10 sacks and Will at 7-8

[Bronx]

3 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

The team has been a top 5 defense in two of his 3 years, I’m not complaining about the D

https://jetsxfactor.com/2023/08/15/ny-jets-pros-cons-saleh-defense/ 

NY Jets: The pros and cons of Robert Saleh’s defense

[Jet Nut]

6 minutes ago, Bronx said:

https://jetsxfactor.com/2023/08/15/ny-jets-pros-cons-saleh-defense/ 

NY Jets: The pros and cons of Robert Saleh’s defense

LOL, the 2021 defense sucked because of the scene, not because the personnel were dumped from the prior season to start the rebuild.  
And worse, players on the DL while fresh because of the rotation are under appreciated.  

[Bronx]

7 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

LOL, the 2021 defense sucked because of the scene, not because the personnel were dumped from the prior season to start the rebuild.  
And worse, players on the DL while fresh because of the rotation are under appreciated.  

Con: The best defensive linemen don’t get a chance to show it.
Despite earning first-team All-Pro honors, Quinnen Williams is still underrated in some segments of the media. A key reason is that many of his numbers (beyond sacks) were not as lofty as some other defensive tackles.

However, that was because he played significantly fewer snaps. Williams’ 690 defensive snaps ranked 29th among interior defensive linemen. Some of the other top defensive tackles had between 250-315 more snaps than him. Williams played 60.6% of the Jets’ defensive snaps, per Pro Football Reference. The other top linemen were all at least 72%; Daron Payne played 87%, and Christian Wilkins was at 84%.

Some Jets fans questioned whether it’s worth paying $24 million annually for a player who plays 60% of the snaps. That undersells how critical Williams is to the Jets’ defense.

 

 

[JetsfaninNorthHollywood]

On 5/23/2024 at 5:30 AM, The Crusher said:

It’s like opening a box of Cracker Jacks and  finding a toy. You don’t like, 

Or an onion ring in your fries...or vice versa.

[bicketybam]

2 hours ago, JetsfaninNorthHollywood said:

Or an onion ring in your fries...or vice versa.

Those are both fantastic things.

[#27TheDominator]

On 5/23/2024 at 7:04 AM, GKnight83 said:

Unworthy of the #99.

Unless he puts up 10 sacks this season I consider him a wasted pick.

It would be interesting if they try him at LB though.

Yes.  How dare they give McDonald the number that they have let the immortal Eric Ogbogu, Steven McClendon and T.J. Barnes wear.  They let that piece of sh*t Jason Taylor wear it.  It's going to take more than 15 years to wear that stink off of it. 

[Jetsfan80]

So mad we didn’t take the unathletic slot guy instead.  So, so mad.

[Jet Nut]

8 hours ago, Bronx said:

Con: The best defensive linemen don’t get a chance to show it.
Despite earning first-team All-Pro honors, Quinnen Williams is still underrated in some segments of the media. A key reason is that many of his numbers (beyond sacks) were not as lofty as some other defensive tackles.

However, that was because he played significantly fewer snaps. Williams’ 690 defensive snaps ranked 29th among interior defensive linemen. Some of the other top defensive tackles had between 250-315 more snaps than him. Williams played 60.6% of the Jets’ defensive snaps, per Pro Football Reference. The other top linemen were all at least 72%; Daron Payne played 87%, and Christian Wilkins was at 84%.

Some Jets fans questioned whether it’s worth paying $24 million annually for a player who plays 60% of the snaps. That undersells how critical Williams is to the Jets’ defense.

 

 

Go back to telling everyone McD is a mid round reach and a bust.  
 

[Bronx]

10 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Go back to telling everyone McD is a mid round reach and a bust.  
 

I will be delighted if McD proves me dead wrong, I will stay optimistic in the meantime. 

[Ulrich]

On 5/23/2024 at 7:27 AM, T0mShane said:

Gonna be interesting to track Will McDonald vs Broderick Jones vs JSN. The scuttlebutt is that Douglas was going to take Jones before the Pats rat****ed him, but they were never going to take JSN regardless, even though he was the fan and draftnik favorite. Reports out of Seattle said that they tried early on to make him a slot/gadget player, but he wasn’t really up to it because he wasn’t athletic enough for the role. Later in the season, they used him more as a traditional outside receiver and he had a few flashes, but there were drops and some disappearing acts down the stretch. 
 

Broderick Jones was pretty solid in the run game for the Steelers, but was spotty in pass pro, which is to be expected for a rookie. The team turned around and drafted Troy Fautanu in the first this year, and they’re making Jones the opening day left tackle. IMO, this one hurt because Jones has everything you want in a tackle, and he would have made the Jets significantly less desperate there last year, which maybe lets them keep Duane Brown in reserve while his shoulder heals, which maybe keeps Rodgers alive for a few more snaps. And, worst case, you’re not going into this draft desperate for tackle help which maybe lets you get more aggressive trading up or down for help at the skill positions. 
 

As for McDonald himself, he was PFF’s highest-graded of the three, had a very good PRWR, especially for a rookie, and seemed to flash in both the pass and run game last year. We don’t have to give Saleh credit for much, but he has shown a good eye for pass rush talent. 

Except it wasn’t Brown’s ineptitude that caused Rodgers injury. It was a designed cut block Brown properly executed, meaning Rodgers was supposed to get rid of the ball will quickly which he didn’t. He held on to it, scrambled, Floyd hip-drop tackled him which is now illegal, and the rest is history. 

Also as you indicated Jones’ pass pro was subpar last season. And IINM overall his rookie year didn’t pan out as hoped. 

So perhaps this worked out better long term for the Jets. A more promising pure LT than Jones in Fashanu who learns from Smith, a future HOFer. To be sure Jones possesses amazing physical talent so he’ll probably turn out to be a good one. 

As for WMD no doubt the Jets have high hopes for him. Saleh mentioned Floyd as his NFL comp. And he has been effective developing Jets defensive lineman and pass rushers. Fingers crossed. 

[Raideraholic]

On 5/23/2024 at 9:57 AM, JustInFudge said:

Why does he say hi?  

 None of those Jet de  guys are MAXX Crosby .   Can play the run and pass equally well.   Malcolm Koonce gives the Raiders one of the top two des duos.  (Koonce  will have monster year in his contract year)  That’s not even counting Tyree Wilson who Raiders always knew was going to take him a year to get fully healthy. Wasn’t suppose to play that much last year,  but was forced to when c jones went nuts.       Been working out all off-season with  MAXX Crosby and Malcolm Koonce.    With C Wilkins the Raiders have that dominant Dt to take their defense to elite level.   ( they were second  best defense in all of football from the time when Antonio pierce took over . They have so much defense line talent good mix of old veterans, and a lot of young hungry defense lineman.   They probably add a veteran Cb to go with young bevy of cbs on their roster. 

[JustInFudge]

3 hours ago, Raideraholic said:

 None of those Jet de  guys are MAXX Crosby .   Can play the run and pass equally well.   Malcolm Koonce gives the Raiders one of the top two des duos.  (Koonce  will have monster year in his contract year)  That’s not even counting Tyree Wilson who Raiders always knew was going to take him a year to get fully healthy. Wasn’t suppose to play that much last year,  but was forced to when c jones went nuts.       Been working out all off-season with  MAXX Crosby and Malcolm Koonce.    With C Wilkins the Raiders have that dominant Dt to take their defense to elite level.   ( they were second  best defense in all of football from the time when Antonio pierce took over . They have so much defense line talent good mix of old veterans, and a lot of young hungry defense lineman.   They probably add a veteran Cb to go with young bevy of cbs on their roster. 

Neat. So why does Kavvon Thibodeaux say hi? 

[Barry McCockinner]

1 hour ago, JustInFudge said:

Neat. So why does Kavvon Thibodeaux say hi? 

[Rich Thornburgh]

On 5/24/2024 at 12:38 PM, Bronx said:

Con: The best defensive linemen don’t get a chance to show it.
Despite earning first-team All-Pro honors, Quinnen Williams is still underrated in some segments of the media. A key reason is that many of his numbers (beyond sacks) were not as lofty as some other defensive tackles.

However, that was because he played significantly fewer snaps. Williams’ 690 defensive snaps ranked 29th among interior defensive linemen. Some of the other top defensive tackles had between 250-315 more snaps than him. Williams played 60.6% of the Jets’ defensive snaps, per Pro Football Reference. The other top linemen were all at least 72%; Daron Payne played 87%, and Christian Wilkins was at 84%.

Some Jets fans questioned whether it’s worth paying $24 million annually for a player who plays 60% of the snaps. That undersells how critical Williams is to the Jets’ defense.

 

 

Remember when QW was considered a bust by the people who know everything?

[Rich Thornburgh]

On 5/24/2024 at 9:33 PM, Jet Nut said:

Go back to telling everyone McD is a mid round reach and a bust.  
 

He isn’t?