ZACH WILSON isn’t on the Jets anymore discussion (merged)

[WestCoastMole]

3 hours ago, Warfish said:

He by most accounts barely made the team late in the process.  He's the #3 QB in a league that generally doesn't 53-man roster a #3 QB.

Again uncited sources. This is more Johnny Down the Street stuff. If Johnny jumps off the roof do you do that to ?

I will address the second part in the next section

 

Quote

I'll repeat myself, the "bashers" or critics have been far more accurate about Zach as a pro than his supporters, and this accomplishment does not qualify those supporters to start taking victory laps,

What qualifies Zach Supporters to take "Victory Laps" is the satisfaction of catching Zach Bashers in the act of fabricating lies.

READ IT AGAIN : Zach's Bashers have been caught in making lies to support their claims.

To add to that Zach's Bashers are LAZY ! A cursory Google News search shows the level of commitment Sean Payton has to developing Zach as a talent. Even when Zach had a Bad Day in OTAs Payton expressed confidence in Zach's abilities. Payton stated a month and a half of work went getting the trade for Zach done. When he did ink Zach Payton told him "I'm going to make millions for you". Does that sound like a guy who was setting Zach up to be cut ? The fact is Zach's rapid progress through out the Preseason has startled both Sean Payton and Denver's Offensive Coordinator Joe Lombardi for its breath and speed..

If the Zach Bashers are so confident in their line why can't they support with citations of news stories ? Here is just one from ESPN.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/40995578/sean-payton-broncos-qb-zach-wilson-make-53-man-roster

All of the Doom-and-Gloom stories come from a few outlets ALL BASED IN NEW YORK - NEW JERSEY area. And most of them have gone underground now that Zach is on the Broncos Final 53 Man Roster.

Its not that hard to do rather than hurl Unexamined Assumptions, Cat Calls and Back Handed Insults you use to advance their arguments.

 

Now in the next credenza of The Moving Goal Posts Zach's Bashers migrate to is he is the Number 3 QB on the team. If you had been following the Denver Media you would know that Jarrett Stidham and Zach Wilson are in the final year of their contracts. Both QBs are in the final year of their contracts. Both QBs need to be evaluated so Denver knows what to do and set their priorities for 2025. All three Denver QBs will be getting starts this year. Payton has put Nix first in the rotation as a tip of the cap to George Paton. But don't be surprised if Sean Payton gives a Quick Hook to Nix. The Cardinal Rule for NFL Defenses is when you see a rookie starting YOU BLITZ HIM, YOU BLITZ HIM HARD, YOU BLITZ HIM FAST and YOU NEVER LET UP. You do everything you can do get him rattled. The Broncos face two of the Better Defenses in the first 4 weeks of the season. (The Steelers and the Jets) We will see how Nix stands up against the heat. By early October Stidham could be the starting QB. Zach will be Inactive early on and could not make the field till November but Payton would not be in much of a position to make contract recommendations the Front Office with some Game Film to support his case.

 

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/shrug, maybe worry less about other posters think, and more about just stating clearly what you think and why. 

It's more about what other posters say. Its easy to ignore Personal Attacks but false assertions left unchallenged legitimize a narrative that has no basis in fact. These Bashers are quick to tell us how much they know about what is going on with the Bronco's Training Camp. But they can't supply a shred of evidence to support their claims.

[bicketybam]

31 minutes ago, WestCoastMole said:

The Cardinal Rule for NFL Defenses is when you see a rookie starting YOU BLITZ HIM, YOU BLITZ HIM HARD, YOU BLITZ HIM FAST and YOU NEVER LET UP. You do everything you can do get him rattled

That's the same rule for 4th year pro, Zach Wilson.

[WestCoastMole]

43 minutes ago, bicketybam said:

That's the same rule for 4th year pro, Zach Wilson.

Maybe but Zach made it clear last Sunday he can throw the bomb with accuracy.

He had a couple of 40+ yarders. One of the TDs last week to Brandon Johnson went 45 yards in the air.

[bicketybam]

15 minutes ago, WestCoastMole said:

1 hour ago, bicketybam said:

Zach Wilson.

Maybe but Zach made it clear last Sunday he can throw the bomb with accuracy.

You can't be serious 😅

[greenwichjetfan]

58 minutes ago, WestCoastMole said:

Maybe but Zach made it clear last Sunday he can throw the bomb with accuracy.

He had a couple of 40+ yarders. One of the TDs last week to Brandon Johnson went 45 yards in the air.

I haven’t posted in this thread because we shouldn’t have cared about him when he was at BYU and we shouldn’t be caring about him now.

That said, that TD bomb was one of the worst placed balls I’ve ever seen. He did everything he could to throw an INT there and the WR bailed him out.

[funaz]

I haven’t posted in this thread because we shouldn’t have cared about him when he was at BYU and we shouldn’t be caring about him now.
That said, that TD bomb was one of the worst placed balls I’ve ever seen. He did everything he could to throw an INT there and the WR bailed him out.

Zach has proven he has one of the worst deep balls I’ve ever seen.

All the arm power but it’s all useless because his accuracy sucks


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[Rangers9]

2 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

I haven’t posted in this thread because we shouldn’t have cared about him when he was at BYU and we shouldn’t be caring about him now.

That said, that TD bomb was one of the worst placed balls I’ve ever seen. He did everything he could to throw an INT there and the WR bailed him out.

Wide receivers are supposed to bail out QBs. 

[jetsrule128]

Issac Wilson made his college debut for Utah tonight against southern Utah 

7-11 74 yards 1 TD 2 INT 

5 rushes for 21 yards 0 TD 

[JetsFlyer]

Read the title of this thread. Thats all that matters

[jetsrule128]

 

[JetsMetsDevilsPA]

2 minutes ago, jetsrule128 said:

 

[Jetsfan80]

9 hours ago, Rangers9 said:

Wide receivers are supposed to bail out QBs. 

Not all the f**king time, dude.

[WestCoastMole]

11 hours ago, funaz said:

Zach has proven he has one of the worst deep balls I’ve ever seen.

All the arm power but it’s all useless because his accuracy sucks


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

Nonetheless the ball was thrown 45 Yards down the field and he hit the receiver on the dead run for 6 points. They don't get much better than that.

[greenwichjetfan]

10 hours ago, Rangers9 said:

Wide receivers are supposed to bail out QBs. 

If that’s the premise then Zach shouldn’t be getting credit for the throw. The receiver should get all the credit. 

When have you ever heard a QB get credit for a throw when the receiver bails him out? It’s usually always something like “the WR made something out of nothing” or “WR just saved a turnover”.

If you wanted to give credit to the QB there, you don’t talk about the catch, you talk about the throw: “the QB put it to where only his receiver can get it”; “perfectly placed balL”; “great touch and accuracy on the throw“

[WestCoastMole]

10 hours ago, Rangers9 said:

Wide receivers are supposed to bail out QBs. 

The ball was thrown a fraction of a second to late. It still was a very good pass, not excellent but still very good. Leave it to a Disgruntled Jet Fan to b!tch about a Touchdown.

[WestCoastMole]

6 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

If that’s the premise then Zach shouldn’t be getting credit for the throw. The receiver should get all the credit. 

When have you ever heard a QB get credit for a throw when the receiver bails him out? It’s usually always something like “the WR made something out of nothing” or “WR just saved a turnover”.

If you wanted to give credit to the QB there, you don’t talk about the catch, you talk about the throw: “the QB put it to where only his receiver can get it”; “perfectly placed balL”; “great touch and accuracy on the throw“

Earlier in the game Zach threw the ball 25 yards to the same receiver (Brandon Johnson) . Johson ran the ball 15 yards down the field and was about to cross the goal line for a TD before a defender was c about to  tackle him. Instead of lowering his shoulder Johnson decide to give the defender a juke. The defender didnt bite and dumped Johnson on the 1 yard line.. Two plays later Zach ran the ball in on a Quarterback Sneak. Did Zach bailout the receiver (Johnson) ?

[Rangers9]

Why do you think AR wants Davante Adams. To make great plays and to bail him out. Over and under throwing is a major part of football. Give us a break. 

[The Crusher]

Suck it haters!

 

 

[WestCoastMole]

3 hours ago, The Crusher said:

Suck it haters!

 

 

Too Funny

And to use the Saleh Bromide "If they ain't hatin you ain't Poppin"

And judging from the hate being cast Zach's way I'd say he had a pretty good game last Sunday.

[Jetsfan80]

34 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

If that’s the premise then Zach shouldn’t be getting credit for the throw. The receiver should get all the credit. 

When have you ever heard a QB get credit for a throw when the receiver bails him out? It’s usually always something like “the WR made something out of nothing” or “WR just saved a turnover”.

If you wanted to give credit to the QB there, you don’t talk about the catch, you talk about the throw: “the QB put it to where only his receiver can get it”; “perfectly placed balL”; “great touch and accuracy on the throw“

Clearly you don't understand how this works in Mole's mind.  When things go well, even if Zach Wilson had nothing to do with it, it's a credit to Zach.  When they don't go well, the blame falls on the coaches, O-Line, receivers, the GM, the fans, and/or the positioning of the stars in our galaxy.

[Rangers9]

Like a starting pitcher the QB gets credit for successful plays and series even if they were not the key contributor. They also get credit for Ws and discredit for Ls. How many series and scoring plays have we watched with great QBs like AR and Brady when they just led the team successfully and their playmakers did most of the work. That's why these prime Wrs are now making 30 million per. Of course if you don't want to give the credit and just the blame for someone you hate knock yourselves out. 

[TuscanyTile2]

Will ZW end up being a more talked-about Jet than Chad Pennington?  

[greenwichjetfan]

1 hour ago, WestCoastMole said:

Earlier in the game Zach threw the ball 25 yards to the same receiver (Brandon Johnson) . Johson ran the ball 15 yards down the field and was about to cross the goal line for a TD before a defender was c about to  tackle him. Instead of lowering his shoulder Johnson decide to give the defender a juke. The defender didnt bite and dumped Johnson on the 1 yard line.. Two plays later Zach ran the ball in on a Quarterback Sneak. Did Zach bailout the receiver (Johnson) ?

1) I was refuting your post saying that he threw the deep bomb with accuracy. I don’t care enough about Zach to try to read your description of a play he took part in.

2) Anything and everything that Zach has ever done well is because his teammates, coaches, and the universe conspired to bail him out. That’s why there’s such a ridiculously small sample size in college and the pros combined of him doing well. 

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, Rangers9 said:

Like a starting pitcher the QB gets credit for successful plays and series even if they were not the key contributor. They also get credit for Ws and discredit for Ls. How many series and scoring plays have we watched with great QBs like AR and Brady when they just led the team successfully and their playmakers did most of the work. That's why these prime Wrs are now making 30 million per. Of course if you don't want to give the credit and just the blame for someone you hate knock yourselves out. 

This would be a fair point….IF you were honestly willing to blame Zach Wilson fairly for the many, many times drives do NOT work out.  He was a 3-and-out machine with the Jets despite elite playmakers Garrett Wilson and Breece Hall.  

But I suppose a nice performance against a 3rd/4th string defense in preseason and “winning” a QB3 job in year 4 changes everything!

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

1 hour ago, Rangers9 said:

How many series and scoring plays have we watched with great QBs like AR and Brady when they just led the team successfully and their playmakers did most of the work. That's why these prime Wrs are now making 30 million per.

LOL

How many successful drives has Zach Wilson been a part of in his career?

Only the top 10 or so WRs pull 30M a year, whereas even a scrub QB in Derek Carr is getting 37.5 M AAV

Anyways, part of playing QB is understanding football, how to read defenses pre-snap, -- how to get the team out of bad playcalls and into good ones -- understanding protections, leverage, the strengths and weaknesses of defenders, opposing DC tendencies and coverage schemes, how to process quickly post-snap, etc.

Obviously, the WRs have to run the right routes, catch the ball, and the OL has to block.

There's a lot more to playing the QB position than the physical aspect, and Zach Wilson has not only failed with basic things like accuracy on routine throws, but shown himself to be the worst starting QB in the NFL in terms of the mental side of the game.

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

LOL

How many successful drives has Zach Wilson been a part of in his career?

Remember the 2nd Denver preseason game where the D caused a turnover putting the O within the opposing 30 and Zach tripped over his d**k to the tune of a 3-and-out FG?

Yeah, that happened a lot with the Jets (Jaguars game in particular where he was benched for Streveler comes to mind):  Zach repeatedly being put in positions to succeed only to derp it up.  Thats who he is and always will be.

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Clearly you don't understand how this works in Mole's mind.  When things go well, even if Zach Wilson had nothing to do with it, it's a credit to Zach.  When they don't go well, the blame falls on the coaches, O-Line, receivers, the GM, the fans, and/or the positioning of the stars in our galaxy.

In theory, to mitigate Zach Wilson's indecisiveness, lack of field vision, and inability to read a defense and some of the OL issues in previous years (e.g. 2022) the OC could have tried to run a Miami Dolphins style offense where you get ball out so quick with tons of presnap motion and misdirection so that the OL doesn't really need to do a whole lot in pass pro.

The problem is that unlike Tua, Zach Wilson is trash in the short to intermediate areas.

In reality, nothing would have worked.

Zach Wilson needs a league where he can face 3rd string defenses every week and has 7+ seconds to throw on every dropback, when he can wait to see his WRs come clean into open swaths of grass downfield before pulling the trigger.  In those situations, he will throw a pretty ball and resemble an actual NFL QB.

If Sean Payton actually believed in Zach Wilson, he wouldn't have drafted Bo Nix in the top 15.

[bicketybam]

7 minutes ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

How many successful drives has Zach Wilson been a part of in his career?

Never forget! 😅

[Rangers9]

We all know that Zach sucked with the Jets. And was unable to consistently move the ball and score points. But if you're saying he has zero chance to improve and become a better player that's idiotic. Are the odds against it based on 3 years. Yes but he's played well at times including regular season. 

[WestCoastMole]

2 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Will ZW end up being a more talked-about Jet than Chad Pennington?  

Who knows ?

Anything is possible.

[Rangers9]

Look the reason this thread on Zach has survived so long is because idiots like me keep replying to dumb comments instead of ignoring them like smarter posters have been doing. 

[TuscanyTile2]

3 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

Look the reason this thread on Zach has survived so long is because idiots like me keep replying to dumb comments instead of ignoring them like smarter posters have been doing. 

I've never understood the whole "this thread is too long" thing.  It's a message board.  Discuss topics as much or as little as you'd like.

[WestCoastMole]

28 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

We all know that Zach sucked with the Jets. And was unable to consistently move the ball and score points. But if you're saying he has zero chance to improve and become a better player that's idiotic. Are the odds against it based on 3 years. Yes but he's played well at times including regular season. 

But its so much the last 3 years as it was the Coaching Staff that was charged with the responsibility of bringing him along.

Thinking back I can only think of only one Prospective young QB that the Jets brought up and trained properly ... Chad Pennington. And he sat on the bench for Two Years before he ever took a snap in a game. Joe Namath was one of those Dehydrated Super QBs that you just ad water to. And Weeb Eubank had a tough time dealing with Joe Willy's Warts. He was literally tearing the hair out of his head.

Saleh is a Good Defensive Coordinator that managed to convince the Johnsons he could run the whole ball of wax. So after the Zach Wilson Disaster he cleverly lands Aaron Rodgers to farm out the Offensive Responsibilities.

Lets hope for everyone's sake Aaron doesn't get injured again.

[WestCoastMole]

42 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

Look the reason this thread on Zach has survived so long is because idiots like me keep replying to dumb comments instead of ignoring them like smarter posters have been doing. 

Had the thought ever crossed your mind that their are people that have a genuine interest of what becomes of Zach ? Granted its a small minority of those participating in this thread but those people are there.

There are people who recognize the Jets have a Poor Record bringing up young QBs from the inception of the franchise.  Always content to hire Defensive Coordinators as Head Coaches The Jets Offense was left to suffer and rot. The have hired 3 Head Coaches that came from an Offensive Background, Joe Walton, Bruce Coslet and Adam Gase. The way things turned out they should have quit after Joey Walton. As to Adam Gase he was known through out the league as a Laughing Stock in Miami before the Jets hired him.

When will this franchise ever get an Owner that knows what he is doing ?

[WestCoastMole]

2 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

1) I was refuting your post saying that he threw the deep bomb with accuracy. I don’t care enough about Zach to try to read your description of a play he took part in.

2) Anything and everything that Zach has ever done well is because his teammates, coaches, and the universe conspired to bail him out. That’s why there’s such a ridiculously small sample size in college and the pros combined of him doing well. 

Zach threw the ball far enough (45+ yards) and and accurate enough for the WR to catch it and tumble into the End Zone. As Bill Walsh once said 'if I see a guy do something once and can coach him to do it all the time'. And Sean Payton seems determined to build off of what Zach does right.

Did you see that TD Pass from Zach to Nate Adkins on the 4th and Goal from the 1 Yard Line ? When he came to the line Zach saw he had a mismatch on the Right Hand Side of the Line and flipped the ball to Adkins. There wasn't a Defender within 10 Yards of Adkins. It was a thing of beauty. Overall Zach showed by his play last Sunday that underneath the warts lies a Complete Quarterback. Zach scrambled for 15 yards and a 1st down on 3rd and long. He ran a quarterback sneak for a touchdown and ultimately was involved in plays that scored 31 of Denver's 38 points on the day.

And this is what Sean Payton sees. All he has to do is clean-up Zach's warts and he has a complete QB.

Now why can't the Jets do that ?