Could PennyBoy Be Benched????

[GimmeShelter]

DONT PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH. I NEVER SAID HE PLAYS AT THE SAME LEVEL OR IS EQUAL TO BRADY. I SAID BRADY IS A GREAT QB , AND IN MY OPINION SO IS CHAD. You always try and sway the arguement to a Chad vs. Tom thing. One has nothing to do with the other. Pennington has had three straight injury plagued years, three straight years of new OC's, three straight years with a new offense, and to top it all off, he has come back from the most devasting injury a thrower can have, TWICE!

The guy is a true Champion in my mind even if he never wins the SB. Onc again for the learning disabled (tex), Brady is great, but so is Chad.

Despite you giving the highest props to Brady don't expect OCD TX to let it go at that. He cant.

[steJMike]

NO, and it's not going to happen so stop wasteing your time on this thread.

[Jetsfan80]

If it is indeed true that Pennington could be pulled if he performs badly against NE, then you can bank on Ramsey starting against Chicago. Pennington hasn't even a decent game in New England since 2002.

[#27TheDominator]

If it is indeed true that Pennington could be pulled if he performs badly against NE, then you can bank on Ramsey starting against Chicago. Pennington hasn't even a decent game in New England since 2002.

September 17, 2006: 22 for 37; 306 yards; 2 tds and 1 int.

You and Tex can yell fluke all you want, but that's still a decent game.

[PatsFanTX]

September 17, 2006: 22 for 37; 306 yards; 2 tds and 1 int.

You and Tex can yell fluke all you want, but that's still a decent game.

24-0 midway through the 3rd quarter.

Two fluke plays accounting for 129 yards passing.

Unable to sustain one long scoring drive the entire game.

Yea, keep fooling yourself into thinking PennyBoy had a good game against the Pats.

[PFSIKH]

September 17, 2006: 22 for 37; 306 yards; 2 tds and 1 int.

You and Tex can yell fluke all you want, but that's still a decent game.

Yeah and Brady threw for 320 yards and one TD versus the Broncos. I am not going to be writing that one on his top 10 list.

[#27TheDominator]

24-0 midway through the 3rd quarter.

Two fluke plays accounting for 129 yards passing.

Unable to sustain one long scoring drive the entire game.

Yea, keep fooling yourself into thinking PennyBoy had a good game against the Pats.

It was a decent game, not a great game. Decent, that was the criteria. You look at those numbers and tell me it was a disaster with a straight face. They didn't lose because of Pennington. Find me a coach that would bench a qb for putting up those numbers and you'll have found a moron. BTW, thanks for updating your stats.

[Biggs]

It was a decent game, not a great game. Decent, that was the criteria. You look at those numbers and tell me it was a disaster with a straight face. They didn't lose because of Pennington. Find me a coach that would bench a qb for putting up those numbers and you'll have found a moron. BTW, thanks for updating your stats.

Sorry to disagree with you. The key to that game was getting off to a good start. Pennington buried the Jets with his awful play in the first half. He was misrable and the team followed his lead.

[afosomf]

the homerism makes me want to barf

Penne sucked vs Pats

Jericho made an outstanding play, the nice floater penne thru almost got Jericho blown up.

the play by coles was all coles as well.

All penne can do now is to be a career backup or play a bottom feeder team.

[#27TheDominator]

Sorry to disagree with you. The key to that game was getting off to a good start. Pennington buried the Jets with his awful play in the first half. He was misrable and the team followed his lead.

Awful? Miserable? I think you're talking about the running game. Blaylock 6 carries for 7 yards, Barlow 14 for 42, Leon and Askew each 1 carry, no gain. Teams weren't packing the box to stop our run game. There weren't any 3 and outs and if you'll remember the Pats were putting some serious pressure.

[serphnx]

Awful? Miserable? I think you're talking about the running game. Blaylock 6 carries for 7 yards, Barlow 14 for 42, Leon and Askew each 1 carry, no gain. Teams weren't packing the box to stop our run game. There weren't any 3 and outs and if you'll remember the Pats were putting some serious pressure.

That's no excuse. Good defenses ALWAYS stop the run without 8 in the box. That's where the QB is supposed to win the game with his arm, and that's why I'm not too big on having a great run game, it dissappears in big games anyway. Unless you have Terrell Davis or Barry Sanders, you need a top-notch QB to score points in this league against the good Ds.

Chad wasn't really getting overly pressured in that game, sure he was getting some pressure but overall I thought they did a good job pass-blocking for him. I could have sworn there were several 3 and outs but I could be wrong. Regardless, they played mostly a coverage scheme against him, and he had some time and opportunities, but he simply doesn't have the arm to fit the ball in tight places. That's the problem, anytime anyone plays a defense like that and has decent cover guys, Chad can't do much.

[afosomf]

That's no excuse. Good defenses ALWAYS stop the run without 8 in the box. That's where the QB is supposed to win the game with his arm, and that's why I'm not too big on having a great run game, it dissappears in big games anyway. Unless you have Terrell Davis or Barry Sanders, you need a top-notch QB to score points in this league against the good Ds.

Chad wasn't really getting overly pressured in that game, sure he was getting some pressure but overall I thought they did a good job pass-blocking for him. I could have sworn there were several 3 and outs but I could be wrong. Regardless, they played mostly a coverage scheme against him, and he had some time and opportunities, but he simply doesn't have the arm to fit the ball in tight places. That's the problem, anytime anyone plays a defense like that and has decent cover guys, Chad can't do much.

BIngoooooooooooo

we have a winner

Chad can't do much.... that's the fact jack

[Barton]

That's no excuse. Good defenses ALWAYS stop the run without 8 in the box. That's where the QB is supposed to win the game with his arm, and that's why I'm not too big on having a great run game, it dissappears in big games anyway. Unless you have Terrell Davis or Barry Sanders, you need a top-notch QB to score points in this league against the good Ds.

Chad wasn't really getting overly pressured in that game, sure he was getting some pressure but overall I thought they did a good job pass-blocking for him. I could have sworn there were several 3 and outs but I could be wrong. Regardless, they played mostly a coverage scheme against him, and he had some time and opportunities, but he simply doesn't have the arm to fit the ball in tight places. That's the problem, anytime anyone plays a defense like that and has decent cover guys, Chad can't do much.

Exactly. Chad was nonexistant in that entire 1st half. 0 points.

So what if NE stuffed the run? A QB cant win a game if his team cant run the ball great? Just another Pennington excuse.

Coming soon - JN Pennynette Handbook.....

[#27TheDominator]

He threw for 300 yards. Period. End of story. That is a decent game. That game might not have won the super bowl, but to say it is not decent is ridiculous.

Do you actually expect him to play better against a top D? No run game is an advantage now?

[PatsFanTX]

That's no excuse. Good defenses ALWAYS stop the run without 8 in the box. That's where the QB is supposed to win the game with his arm, and that's why I'm not too big on having a great run game, it dissappears in big games anyway. Unless you have Terrell Davis or Barry Sanders, you need a top-notch QB to score points in this league against the good Ds.

Chad wasn't really getting overly pressured in that game, sure he was getting some pressure but overall I thought they did a good job pass-blocking for him. I could have sworn there were several 3 and outs but I could be wrong. Regardless, they played mostly a coverage scheme against him, and he had some time and opportunities, but he simply doesn't have the arm to fit the ball in tight places. That's the problem, anytime anyone plays a defense like that and has decent cover guys, Chad can't do much.

Dude, it's quite obvious you have a very good understanding of the game of football.

[PatsFanTX]

Yeah and Brady threw for 320 yards and one TD versus the Broncos. I am not going to be writing that one on his top 10 list.

Exactly PFSIKH.

Those 320 yards means abosultely nothing when you evaluate Brady's performance in that game.

He just didn't get the job done that night.

Why do Jet fans continue to think PennyBoy had a good game against the Pats just because he threw for over 300 yards?

[PatsFanTX]

He threw for 300 yards. Period. End of story. That is a decent game.

So stats are more important than victories in you mind?

[#27TheDominator]

So stats are more important than victories in you mind?

Decent. Not good. Not "important." Could he have played better? Sure. Do I count those 129 yards the same as 13 3rd down completions to get a 1st down? No. Was he horrible? Miseable? No. Decent? Yes.

He was sacked 4 times.

Look for yourself:

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/playbyplay/NFL_20060917_NE@NYJ

BTW according to them the two "fluke" plays were 71 + 46 = 117 yards

Oh, and his pick was meaningless, on the next to last play when anything other than a TD was worthless.

[GimmeShelter]

Decent. Not good. Not "important." Could he have played better? Sure. Do I count those 129 yards the same as 13 3rd down completions to get a 1st down? No. Was he horrible? Miseable? No. Decent? Yes.

He was sacked 4 times.

Look for yourself:

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/playbyplay/NFL_20060917_NE@NYJ

BTW according to them the two "fluke" plays were 71 + 46 = 117 yards

Oh, and his pick was meaningless, on the next to last play when anything other than a TD was worthless.

And the 71 yarder was a 20plus yd pass before the Pats secondary fell apart allowing Cotchery to account for the other 50 yds.

[PFSIKH]

And the 71 yarder was a 20plus yd pass before the Pats secondary fell apart allowing Cotchery to account for the other 50 yds.

GS - Whether you credit the Pats secondary, wrongly IMHO, or Cotchery, 999 of 1000times all that happens is Cotchery makes a tough catch between 2 Patriots defenders.

Cotchery made an excellent heads-up play. The remaining yards, I think it was closer to 60, are all on him.

You are a good poster. This fallacy that Chad had a good game is BS. I think most reasonable Jets fans know he benefitted from two otustanding plays by his receivers. He got them the ball and has the yards, but C & C made Chad look alot better then he played that day.

[PatsFanTX]

This fallacy that Chad had a good game is BS. I think most reasonable Jets fans know he benefitted from two otustanding plays by his receivers. He got them the ball and has the yards, but C & C made Chad look alot better then he played that day.

PFSIKH,

You know it's the damn green kool aid that Jet fans drink.

PennyBoy did crap (first 3.5 quarters) against the Pats when the game counted.

When the game was all said and done, he benefitted by two fluke plays and a prevent defense.

Yea, that 300-yard passing game was really impressive.

[GimmeShelter]

Pfsikh, just getting the ball out on the Coles pass was a great play by Chad.

No offense but how I feel a player performed in a individual game doesn't require your stamp of approval before it is justified. Don't slide into TX like posting......You're better than that.

[Biggs]

Awful? Miserable? I think you're talking about the running game. Blaylock 6 carries for 7 yards, Barlow 14 for 42, Leon and Askew each 1 carry, no gain. Teams weren't packing the box to stop our run game. There weren't any 3 and outs and if you'll remember the Pats were putting some serious pressure.

Against the Pats Pennington has time after time failed to open the outside of the field down the field. That has allowed them to play a very small field against the Jets. He has got to open the games by establishing the deep out and make good defenses play more field. He continually fails to do this early in games and against the Pats and Jax it crushed us.

[PatsFanTX]

Against the Pats Pennington has time after time failed to open the outside of the field down the field. That has allowed them to play a very small field against the Jets. He has got to open the games by establishing the deep out and make good defenses play more field.

Biggs, you are dead on with your analysis.

The problem is, PennyBoy is incapable of delivering the deep out on a consistent basis.

He just does not have the arm strength to make that throw.

[PFSIKH]

PFSIKH,

You know it's the damn green kool aid that Jet fans drink.

PennyBoy did crap (first 3.5 quarters) against the Pats when the game counted.

When the game was all said and done, he benefitted by two fluke plays and a prevent defense.

Yea, that 300-yard passing game was really impressive.

I know.

GS -

True. More power to you if you are happy with a QB that did nothing until the game was out of hand.

[#27TheDominator]

Dear Pats fans, go scratch. I posted the play-by-play site. Please note: Pennington had put up 14 points BEFORE THE 3rd quarter had ended. NOTE to Tex, your statements that Penny couldn't drive the team when he had to ring false. I often wonder if you watch the Jet game, now I wonder if you watch the Pats game. The last 4 times he touched the ball Penny went TD, TD, FG and starting on the 9 drove to the 45 before the pick with 15 seconds left. He threw for over 10 yards EVERY drive in the game with the exception of the 1st drive of the 3rd when he attempted 1 pass and interference was called and Mangini elected to run on 3rd and 4th and 1 for no gain. Over 100 yards in the 1st half.

Yes, I know the FG drive was with a short field after the strip sack by Rhodes. Of course, if Mangini didn't elect to run with those stiffs for a whopping 2 yards on 1st and 2nd he might not have had to take a sack on 3rd down. Yes I know the plays by Cotchery and Coles were exceptional. However, do you realize that there are more levels to evaluate a football game than excellent or miserable/horrible. I NEVER SAID HE HAD A GREAT OR EVEN GOOD GAME. I said he was decent. I understand his limitations, but that game was not a horrible performance. It doesn't take Kool Aid to see that. In fact to say otherwise is delusional. Maybe if the D would have stopped the Pats from absorbing 8 minutes on their last drive Penny could have done something. There was nothing embarrassing about his performance against a "top tier D."

[Biggs]

Biggs, you are dead on with your analysis.

The problem is, PennyBoy is incapable of delivering the deep out on a consistent basis.

He just does not have the arm strength to make that throw.

There's alot about Pennington I don't like but I still think you don't replace him simply because he's a JAG who isn't going to win us a SB. The other two guys could suck and with this schedule a smart JAG can still give us some entertaining football.

I have alot of faith that Mangini isn't going to wait with Clemens if he thinks he's the next guy. He may not think he is and doesn't want to retard the growth of the rest of the young players on O? Pennington does help establish the proper tempo for the other young players and may be brings them along faster than they would with a rookie running the show?

[PFSIKH]

Dear Pats fans, go scratch. I posted the play-by-play site. Please note: Pennington had put up 14 points BEFORE THE 3rd quarter had ended. NOTE to Tex, your statements that Penny couldn't drive the team when he had to ring false. I often wonder if you watch the Jet game, now I wonder if you watch the Pats game. The last 4 times he touched the ball Penny went TD, TD, FG and starting on the 9 drove to the 45 before the pick with 15 seconds left. He threw for over 10 yards EVERY drive in the game with the exception of the 1st drive of the 3rd when he attempted 1 pass and interference was called and Mangini elected to run on 3rd and 4th and 1 for no gain. Over 100 yards in the 1st half.

Yes, I know the FG drive was with a short field after the strip sack by Rhodes. Of course, if Mangini didn't elect to run with those stiffs for a whopping 2 yards on 1st and 2nd he might not have had to take a sack on 3rd down. Yes I know the plays by Cotchery and Coles were exceptional. However, do you realize that there are more levels to evaluate a football game than excellent or miserable/horrible. I NEVER SAID HE HAD A GREAT OR EVEN GOOD GAME. I said he was decent. I understand his limitations, but that game was not a horrible performance. It doesn't take Kool Aid to see that. In fact to say otherwise is delusional. Maybe if the D would have stopped the Pats from absorbing 8 minutes on their last drive Penny could have done something. There was nothing embarrassing about his performance against a "top tier D."

What about the four times in the first half when Chad had a 3rd and 2 (x2) or 4 (x2) and he came up empty on passes?

While Chad obviously did not suck as bad as he did for 58 minutes last week, he had ample opportunity early in the first game to make it relelvant and he did not.

I know where your heart is. I was a Drew Bledsoe fan for almost 6 years after all. I cannot count how many times they would appear to be out classed only to have Drew rally the team to make it comestically pleasing. Rarely did I ever look at the big picture and think maybe if Drew did or did not do something earlier maybe they would have won. It was always, damm if he only had more time.

[#27TheDominator]

What about the four times in the first half when Chad had a 3rd and 2 (x2) or 4 (x2) and he came up empty on passes?

While Chad obviously did not suck as bad as he did for 58 minutes last week, he had ample opportunity early in the first game to make it relelvant and he did not.

I know where your heart is. I was a Drew Bledsoe fan for almost 6 years after all. I cannot count how many times they would appear to be out classed only to have Drew rally the team to make it comestically pleasing. Rarely did I ever look at the big picture and think maybe if Drew did or did not do something earlier maybe they would have won. It was always, damm if he only had more time.

PF, do you understand my argument? For the ninth time, I am not saying that he had a great game or even a good one. Just decent. Please characterize his performance for me. Did he suck? Was he awful? Was he awesome? Did he have an average game against a good team? I guess I will have to defer to the unbiased Pat fans because I am a blind homer for thinking that 300 yards passing (no matter when they came) is not an awful game. Especially against the all-mighty Pats. I mean it's not like he sh!t the bed against the Titans.

I hate breaking down such a BS game, but give me a break on the 3rd down stats:

3&4 5 yard completion; 3&4 incomplete; 3&7 20 yard completion; 3&2 incomplete; 3&3 9yard completion; 3&2 4 yard completion; 3&4 incomplete; 3&7 23 yard completion; 3&16 sacked; 3&4 penalty becomes 3&9 pass with defensive interference 1st down; 3&1 run; 4&1 run; 3&13 71 yards; 3&6 10 yards; 3&9 46 yards; 3&6 8 yards; 3&1 12 yards; 3&8 sack; 3&1 15 yards.

What is the common denominator? The Jets are/were fully incapable of running for a 1st down even on 3rd and 2 or 1. They were so bad at it they hardly tried. I repeat, it was not a stellar game by Pennington, but it also was not a blood bath.

[RSJ]

What about the four times in the first half when Chad had a 3rd and 2 (x2) or 4 (x2) and he came up empty on passes?

While Chad obviously did not suck as bad as he did for 58 minutes last week, he had ample opportunity early in the first game to make it relelvant and he did not.

I know where your heart is. I was a Drew Bledsoe fan for almost 6 years after all. I cannot count how many times they would appear to be out classed only to have Drew rally the team to make it comestically pleasing. Rarely did I ever look at the big picture and think maybe if Drew did or did not do something earlier maybe they would have won. It was always, damm if he only had more time.

With an effective running game Chad is a very good QB. Without one he is just another Tom Brady (system qb).

[afosomf]

PF, do you understand my argument? For the ninth time, I am not saying that he had a great game or even a good one. Just decent. Please characterize his performance for me. Did he suck? Was he awful? Was he awesome? Did he have an average game against a good team? I guess I will have to defer to the unbiased Pat fans because I am a blind homer for thinking that 300 yards passing (no matter when they came) is not an awful game. Especially against the all-mighty Pats. I mean it's not like he sh!t the bed against the Titans.

I hate breaking down such a BS game, but give me a break on the 3rd down stats:

3&4 5 yard completion; 3&4 incomplete; 3&7 20 yard completion; 3&2 incomplete; 3&3 9yard completion; 3&2 4 yard completion; 3&4 incomplete; 3&7 23 yard completion; 3&16 sacked; 3&4 penalty becomes 3&9 pass with defensive interference 1st down; 3&1 run; 4&1 run; 3&13 71 yards; 3&6 10 yards; 3&9 46 yards; 3&6 8 yards; 3&1 12 yards; 3&8 sack; 3&1 15 yards.

What is the common denominator? The Jets are/were fully incapable of running for a 1st down even on 3rd and 2 or 1. They were so bad at it they hardly tried. I repeat, it was not a stellar game by Pennington, but it also was not a blood bath.

Your cleavage is showing

I bet your right arm would give penne a run for his money.

We all deserve a QB who can throw a 20 yd out on a frozen rope and not one

who throws one that can be fair caught!

[#27TheDominator]

Your cleavage is showing

I bet your right arm would give penne a run for his money.

We all deserve a QB who can throw a 20 yd out on a frozen rope and not one

who throws one that can be fair caught!

Doesn't change the fact that he had a decent game.

[PFSIKH]

PF, do you understand my argument? For the ninth time, I am not saying that he had a great game or even a good one. Just decent. Please characterize his performance for me. Did he suck? Was he awful? Was he awesome? Did he have an average game against a good team? I guess I will have to defer to the unbiased Pat fans because I am a blind homer for thinking that 300 yards passing (no matter when they came) is not an awful game. Especially against the all-mighty Pats. I mean it's not like he sh!t the bed against the Titans.

I hate breaking down such a BS game, but give me a break on the 3rd down stats:

3&4 5 yard completion; 3&4 incomplete; 3&7 20 yard completion; 3&2 incomplete; 3&3 9yard completion; 3&2 4 yard completion; 3&4 incomplete; 3&7 23 yard completion; 3&16 sacked; 3&4 penalty becomes 3&9 pass with defensive interference 1st down; 3&1 run; 4&1 run; 3&13 71 yards; 3&6 10 yards; 3&9 46 yards; 3&6 8 yards; 3&1 12 yards; 3&8 sack; 3&1 15 yards.

What is the common denominator? The Jets are/were fully incapable of running for a 1st down even on 3rd and 2 or 1. They were so bad at it they hardly tried. I repeat, it was not a stellar game by Pennington, but it also was not a blood bath.

The difficult thing with the game is the Patriots mindset when the score was 24-0.

No one knows but it easy to assume they were being liberal with subsitutions and backing off on the agressiveness. How much of Penny's success was due to the Patriots dialing down everything and not allowing the big plays ?

Was it a total abysmal performance? No. However, an asterik needs to be applied to it due to the game circumstances.

The bottomline is the team lost. Played a valiant game, even after falling behind by alot, but in the end rightly or wrongly, Chad looked like one of the main problems for the first part of the game when the team trailed 24-0. Did he make amends? Sort of. Maybe he ws not the root cause, but he was a cause of the loss due to his performance in the first part.

[PFSIKH]

With an effective running game Chad is a very good QB. Without one he is just another Tom Brady (system qb).

Stupid Post of the week nomination.

[RSJ]

Tom Brady has yet to beat an opponent this year that has rushed for more yards than his team but Chad has done is a few times. The only time an opponent broke 100 yards against the Pats defense that team won. In 2005 the Pats only won 2 games where the opponent rushed for more yards. Rushing game and rushing defense equals wins.