Hall Of Fame

[Nick Ferraro]

The Pro Football HOF is headed toward the abyss that the Pro Baseball HOF fell into a long time ago. It's time to re-evaluate who votes.

Michael Irvin:

750 Catches

11,904 yards

65 TDs

Art Monk:

940 Catches

12,721 yards

68 TDs

This is not to say that Irvin is derserving - he certainly is. Leaving Monk out again is ridiculous. They also missed another chance to elect OT Gary Zimmerman who somehow made two all-decade teams (80s + 90s), but apparently that isn't enough.

[fatman]

These are some of the reasons that Monk wasn't picked.

SI.COM: Why didn't Art Monk get elected?

DR. Z: My feeling is that Monk was great player. But when you played the Redskins, he was not the guy you had to stop. He was a very functional player. A great team guy. But I liked two wideouts better this year. Irvin and Andre Reed.

Will the improvement of receivers' statistics in recent years hurt Monk's chances of making it in the future?

Oh yeah. I think his best chance might have been when he first came on the ballot, because he was still near the top of the all-time lists then, but he' falling.

SI.COM: How heated was the debate on Michael Irvin?

DR. Z: Very heated. I think some people just didn't like him. But for me, it was just too logical that he belonged in. He was the do-it-all receiver for a three-time champion. He could catch anything. He was a leader who helped get the team to work hard. He blocked. He was tough. And he never had any help at the other receiver position. Maybe his numbers weren't as big as some others, but the Cowboys had Emmitt Smith, so of course they weren't going to throw that much.

[vanDoug]

The Pro Football HOF is headed toward the abyss that the Pro Baseball HOF fell into a long time ago. It's time to re-evaluate who votes.

Michael Irvin:

750 Catches

11,904 yards

65 TDs

Art Monk:

940 Catches

12,721 yards

68 TDs

This is not to say that Irvin is derserving - he certainly is. Leaving Monk out again is ridiculous.

Seeing those stats compared like that, makes it hard to believe Irvin gets in 1st.

[Biggs]

The Pro Football HOF is headed toward the abyss that the Pro Baseball HOF fell into a long time ago. It's time to re-evaluate who votes.

Michael Irvin:

750 Catches

11,904 yards

65 TDs

Art Monk:

940 Catches

12,721 yards

68 TDs

This is not to say that Irvin is derserving - he certainly is. Leaving Monk out again is ridiculous. They also missed another chance to elect OT Gary Zimmerman who somehow made two all-decade teams (80s + 90s), but apparently that isn't enough.

Art Monk 7 years when he played a 16 game schedule under 1,000 yards, Michael Irvin zero years. Monk hung on, he played for 16 years he had 4 years with less than 500 yards, he has less pro bowls than he's team mate on the Redskins Gary Clark. He was good, Irvin was prolific in his prime years and simply better. He didn't hang on nearly as long.

[Kentucky Jet]

The Pro Football HOF is headed toward the abyss that the Pro Baseball HOF fell into a long time ago. It's time to re-evaluate who votes.

Michael Irvin:

750 Catches

11,904 yards

65 TDs

Art Monk:

940 Catches

12,721 yards

68 TDs

This is not to say that Irvin is derserving - he certainly is. Leaving Monk out again is ridiculous. They also missed another chance to elect OT Gary Zimmerman who somehow made two all-decade teams (80s + 90s), but apparently that isn't enough.

JOE KLECKO and WINSTON HILL! Need I say more?

[#27TheDominator]

Art Monk 7 years when he played a 16 game schedule under 1,000 yards, Michael Irvin zero years. Monk hung on, he played for 16 years he had 4 years with less than 500 yards, he has less pro bowls than he's team mate on the Redskins Gary Clark. He was good, Irvin was prolific in his prime years and simply better. He didn't hang on nearly as long.

Exactly. Those stats come from Monk playing 224 games to Irvin's 159. Monk had less pro-bowls than Irvin despite playing all those extra years. He was a compliler. I'm not saying Monk isn't deserving, but people who just look at numbers will be in love with guys like this-and Curtis Martin. He was a quality player, but how many years can Art Monk be considered among the best wide-outs?

[faba]

The Hall Of Fame has become watered down in baseball and football- the test should be were you a doimnant elite player over the course of your career.

Monk was not a real threat that made defenses coaches single him out.

[toon88]

Exactly. Those stats come from Monk playing 224 games to Irvin's 159. Monk had less pro-bowls than Irvin despite playing all those extra years. He was a compliler. I'm not saying Monk isn't deserving, but people who just look at numbers will be in love with guys like this-and Curtis Martin. He was a quality player, but how many years can Art Monk be considered among the best wide-outs?

great post...was going to say the same exact thing. 224 games to 159 games. That's 4 full seasons more for Monk. I believe that Monk should be in, but this outcry, that it is a joke that Irvin got in before him isn't fair. Both deserve to be in IMO, but it is looking more and more like Monk may never get in.

[Biggs]

Exactly. Those stats come from Monk playing 224 games to Irvin's 159. Monk had less pro-bowls than Irvin despite playing all those extra years. He was a compliler. I'm not saying Monk isn't deserving, but people who just look at numbers will be in love with guys like this-and Curtis Martin. He was a quality player, but how many years can Art Monk be considered among the best wide-outs?

I'm not a huge Curtis first ballot guy but Curtis has a better argument than Monk. 5 pro bowls in 11 years and he was the center piece that teams keyed on stopping. Monk was a 3 time in 16 years and rarely was even the No. 1 WR on his own team.

[jetophile]

In many ways the HOF is completely subjective. Why the hell isn't Winston Hill in there? I believe that's your cue, Biggs.

[#27TheDominator]

I don't have a problem with any of these guys being in. Certainly not Winston Hill. Curtis will probably get in and I think he deserves it. OTOH, the only guys that I believe can complain about not getting in are the all time greats. Butkus, LT, Jim Brown. That fiasco with Harry Carson made me sick. The guy was all class on the field and off, but I can't lok at him with a straight face any more. He whined like a little girl that couldn't get a date to the junior prom. Then he broke his word and jumped for joy by embracing the Hall when he was selected.

There is a problem with all this statistical analysis. Can anybody that's seen them both play honestly believe that Curtis Martin is as good as Earl Campbell? If you only look at the stats Curtis is way better. Stats lie. One of the baseball guys, Bill James I think, rated guys by their top 3 seasons. I think that gives you a pretty good look at where some of these guys should be ranked.

[Bugg]

I

There is a problem with all this statistical analysis. Can anybody that's seen them both play honestly believe that Curtis Martin is as good as Earl Campbell? .

That's the whole problem in a sentence. Martin compiled great stats over a long career. But Campbell was dominant and great in ways Martin never approached. Kinda think Monk is a lot like Martin.

But it becomes a relativity thing. Monk's career compares statistically favoraby to not only Irvin but Biletnikoff, Swann and Stallworth as well. And once it becomes about numbers for offensive players (and it now certainly is) I don't see how you keep Monk out. Heck, Biletnikoff is an arugment for Wayne Chrebet.

My problem is Ray Guy should be in, period. And nothwithstanding MSG's analysis, so should Klecko.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/wrindex.htm