Jets content with DRob at tackle?

[PeterNorth09]

He was hurt in training camp last year. How can you judge him and say he sucks without any real NFL sample to go on?

You must have not seen the egg he laid his rookie year in 2005. Plus, I heard he came in training camp last year weighing about 305-310 lbs before he got hurt. He had lost a lot of weight which would be a good thing except he is trying to play Nose Tackle.

[Bravejamriot]

not every player is successful their rookie years though. It does take time to adjust to the NFL level. I'm not saying hes gonna be great, but I just disagree that you can write him off as a failure already

[johnny green balls]

He was hurt in training camp last year. How can you judge him and say he sucks without any real NFL sample to go on?

hey champ, people who think he can compete are basing that judgment on the same scant evidence.

[SickJetFan]

Did anyone bother to think that we didn't go after any FA NT's better than DRob because there aren't any? What FA would you have like to see suit up instead? Name one who was available between March 2nd and today.

And regarding DRob vs Wilfat:

There is no way that 8 lbs separates these two. To compound it, Wilfat is a little taller. DRob is likely around 310. 317 was his weight when he was drafted. No friggin' way he carried the same baby fat around after Mangini's camp that he did before.

Wilfat is not listed at his current actual weight. Anyone can see this. He's probably around 350, which is enormous for a guy 6'2. Hey, for YEARS Ted Washington was listed at 325 also. Was that his real weight? Of course not. Only recently did he start to get listed at the slightly more accurate 370-375.

Muscle ways more then fat

[johnny green balls]

Muscle ways more then fat

hay, how due ewe no this?

[Xcel2NuFX]

Vince Wilfork - 6'2" - 325lbs

Drob - 6'1" - 317lbs

Drob is shorter, which is better, and if he can put on a little muscle he will be all set.

You do realize that the players give those numbers not the scale. Brooks Bollinger is listed as 6'1" when hes problbaly 5'9". Curtis Martin was always listed as 5'11" and 210 pounds and if you ever went to a practice and stood next to him you would realize he was definetly not that big. I'm 5'11" and standing next to Martin I thought he looked real small.

[Bravejamriot]

hey champ, people who think he can compete are basing that judgment on the same scant evidence.

As I said before: I never said he was going to be good, but I question how you can say he sucks without seeing him play very much.

[Sperm Edwards]

Muscle ways more then fat

What's your point? That Wilfolk has 60-70 lbs of fat on him? God, he must suck.

I don't have a major problem with DRob other than his salary & what we gave up to acquire him. I think he's not suited for the position, and it's not even a matter of opinion that he's GROSSLY overpaid (highest-paid DT in the NFL from 2006-2008).

[bitonti]

it's not even a matter of opinion that he's GROSSLY overpaid (highest-paid DT in the NFL from 2006-2008).

disagree - that pick was slotted money. The Jets could have drafted a punter at 4 overall that's the salary for that pick. It's basically 2002's contract plus 5%.

[Boozer76]

I've usually been one of DRob's biggest detractors, just ask Bitonti. The fact is the draft does not have anyone who will likely fill in as a NT right off the bat, likely not ever. We will need to wait until next year if replacing DRob is the goal. That being said, DRob did very well in the 2nd half of last season, and I think he will improve further. The problem with the Jets stopping the run right now has far less to do with DRob as it does Kimo, Hamilton, and Vilma. Kimo and Hamilton just stink, and Vilma is getting eaten up by blockers. To start they need a solid DE replacement. They recently picked up the guy from DAL, maybe he'll be a decent upgrade. Who knows. But that position couple with Vilma's improvement/replcement is far more vital to us stopping the run than DRob right now.

[Sperm Edwards]

disagree - that pick was slotted money. The Jets could have drafted a punter at 4 overall that's the salary for that pick. It's basically 2002's contract plus 5%.

False. And you know it. Every position doesn't get the same $ because of their draft slot. I don't see anyone other than QB's getting the >$50M contracts that Cutler & Leinart got, even though they weren't even top-10 (let alone top-5) picks.

His contract was higher than it needed to be since we gave up all leverage by trading so much to acquire him. What were we doing to do, not sign him after giving up two firsts & a 4th to move up to draft him? This was the price of trading up to the non-#1 slot (picks for picks) before the draft even started. Never heard of anyone doing that before or after we did.

Under his rookie deal, even Andre Johnson (the number THREE pick) did not/would not have had TWO seasons under his rookie deal that made his cap number the ~$9M that DRob's contract called for. We drafted Ferguson in the exact same slot (#4), but THREE full years LATER, and the total contract is about the same.

It was a bad contract. He was overpaid for the #4 pick. It was Tannenbaum's doing, though Bradway left him with no leverage whatsoever.

[SickJetFan]

What's your point? That Wilfolk has 60-70 lbs of fat on him? God, he must suck.

I don't have a major problem with DRob other than his salary & what we gave up to acquire him. I think he's not suited for the position, and it's not even a matter of opinion that he's GROSSLY overpaid (highest-paid DT in the NFL from 2006-2008).

1st off oops guess I need RIF cant spell weighs

there was a lot of dicussion on how big someone looks and weighs my only point is sometimes butterballs or baby fats dont weigh as much as someone who looks smaller but is more lean with muscle.

I dont know who is heavier or what they weigh and could care less actually.

I like DRob or rather I like how he came on - remains to be seens if he can get better/consistant and if he doesnt......cut him but deservers at least 1 half more season before jury goes out on him.

[Xcel2NuFX]

I've usually been one of DRob's biggest detractors, just ask Bitonti. The fact is the draft does not have anyone who will likely fill in as a NT right off the bat, likely not ever. We will need to wait until next year if replacing DRob is the goal. That being said, DRob did very well in the 2nd half of last season, and I think he will improve further. The problem with the Jets stopping the run right now has far less to do with DRob as it does Kimo, Hamilton, and Vilma. Kimo and Hamilton just stink, and Vilma is getting eaten up by blockers. To start they need a solid DE replacement. They recently picked up the guy from DAL, maybe he'll be a decent upgrade. Who knows. But that position couple with Vilma's improvement/replcement is far more vital to us stopping the run than DRob right now.

both played like their ages Hamilton and Von Olden that is. we can defintly upgrade our LB's around vilma also though last time I checked as improved as he was Bryan Thomas and Victor Hobson were not highly regarded around the league.

I like Bryan Thomas's role that he plays but hobson could ride the bench IMO.

[bitonti]

False. And you know it. Every position doesn't get the same $ because of their draft slot. I don't see anyone other than QB's getting the >$50M contracts that Cutler & Leinart got, even though they weren't even top-10 (let alone top-5) picks.

QBs get more outside of the top picks but at the top end, those numbers are basically slotted. It's like a big pyramid and those numbers don't change all that much at the very top. It was a bad deal relatively speaking but blaming Drob for the contract Tanny negotiated is a little backward to me. Also I don't know if you guys checked the DL market but there's no such thing as paying too much for DT these days. It's a premium position like QB, LT and DE, and will get paid as such.

Drob's deal was very front loaded, so those years 06-08 were planned to be a heavy hit - now they have flexibility going forward. But note they could have negotiated a back loaded deal that wouldn't have hit the cap at all, would that have changed your opinion?

[Sperm Edwards]

QBs get more outside of the top picks but at the top end, those numbers are basically slotted. It's like a big pyramid and those numbers don't change all that much at the very top. It was a bad deal relatively speaking but blaming Drob for the contract Tanny negotiated is a little backward to me. Also I don't know if you guys checked the DL market but there's no such thing as paying too much for DT these days. It's a premium position like QB, LT and DE, and will get paid as such.

Drob's deal was very front loaded, so those years 06-08 were planned to be a heavy hit - now they have flexibility going forward. But note they could have negotiated a back loaded deal that wouldn't have hit the cap at all, would that have changed your opinion?

He got (roughly):

2003: $3M signing bonus

2004: $10M signing bonus

2006: $2M roster bonus

Three full years later, we gave D'Brick (also the #4 pick) like $2M more than that guaranteed ($17M)

You are judging his compensation on "What would it cost to get him now?" instead of "What should it have cost to get him then?" He cost all that cap hit & 3 other players (two of them first-rounders). But I never faulted DRob for getting the best deal possible for himself. Nor Chad. That doesn't mean I like having them hit the cap so much either.

But if you think he was worth a $9M cap hit last year and another $9M cap hit next year, you must be on his payroll. He's good, but he's not great and certainly isn't the single best DT in the league (as he's being paid to be). He has had a bunch of very good games with a far greater amount of mediocre (if not sub-par) games. One week he'll look like a stud & get DPOTW or other such honors and a week later we wonder what we ever saw in him.

He'll be fine this year. Having Smizzy's asscrack lining up next to him instead of Kimo would have helped more, so Coleman should be an improvement (and we should see an improvement with DRob as a result).

But we should draft a NT prospect this year (Mebane, Thomas, Leonard, Soliai, Doughty, etc). If they are near DRob's level of play & there's a good FA crop out there, we would be better served with the extra cap room to shore up two positions instead of one by cutting him after June 1st & which clears $6.8M off the '08 cap and $4.5M off the '09 cap.

Of course if he shows a dramatic improvement over the way he played even later last year, we may extend him. I know perfectly well that good 3-4 NT's don't grow on trees. There are more franchise QB's in existence there than good 3-4 NT's.

[JetCane]

If the Jets had decent DE's then Robertson would be fine but they don't.

True. And there is at least a 30 pound difference between Wilfork and DRob.

There isnt a lot of beef at Vilma's position and at NT, and taken together, that will be a potential liability again. I bet Vilma would have adjusted better to the 3-4 if he had Wilfork playing in front of him.

He was hurt in training camp last year. How can you judge him and say he sucks without any real NFL sample to go on?

Pouha really wasnt looking very good in tc before he got hurt. None of the DL were, except a little of Dave ball, but Pouha looked--not very good. imo

[Gainzo]

True. And there is at least a 30 pound difference between Wilfork and DRob.

There isnt a lot of beef at Vilma's position and at NT, and taken together, that will be a potential liability again. I bet Vilma would have adjusted better to the 3-4 if he had Wilfork playing in front of him.

I agree with that. Wilfork is a much better 3-4 NT than DRob and would have helped Vilma immensely.