SenorGato Posted October 17, 2010 Share Posted October 17, 2010 What say you? http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/j/johnsra05.shtml#1994-2004-sum:pitching_simple Average season from '94-'04 per 162 games: 19-8/244 IP/322 K's/73 BB/4.41 K/BB/19 HR/162 H/170 ERA+ Probably not, but he's top 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 Sandy Koufax. /endthread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted October 18, 2010 Author Share Posted October 18, 2010 Sandy Koufax. /endthread Johnson lasted like 8+ more years than Koufax. At least go Lefty Grove or something.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackout Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 yeah Sandy Bumarm didn't have nearly as long a leak, and Randy's best seasons were statistically more dominant. you just have a boner for folklore if you think Koufax was the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted October 18, 2010 Author Share Posted October 18, 2010 yeah Sandy Bumarm didn't have nearly as long a leak, and Randy's best seasons were statistically more dominant. you just have a boner for folklore if you think Koufax was the best. Repped for truf. Not that I'm not a huge Koufax fan...that curve was legit from the youtube stuff I've seen. It had the 12-6 of a Zito curve with the low 80's velocity of a Ben Sheets curve. It's just that he tends to get overrated historically for a few reasons. Pedro Martinez is going to be the new Sandy Koufax in a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ILK Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 If you needed to win 1 game, who would you take? Sandy Koufax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 I may be biased because my Dad grew up a Brooklyn/LA Dodger fan and saw Koufax pitch firsthand. But that Dodger offense was always just anemic for Koufax and he found ways to win a lot of 1-0 and 2-1 games. He's the main reason Drysdale made the Hall....without Koufax, there's no Koufax/Drysdale duo and no 1963 & 1965 World Title (he won World Series MVP both years). If you want to fault Koufax for getting hurt, fine, but for a 5-year stretch, you'd be hard-pressed to find a more dominant pitcher and a more important one to his team. The man had THREE pitching triple crowns. And as Brooklyn said, there's probably no other pitcher you'd prefer to hand the ball to to win you one game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 And yes, the best righty of all-time is in my signature. Dominance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted October 18, 2010 Author Share Posted October 18, 2010 If you needed to win 1 game, who would you take? Sandy Koufax. That's no given...Bob Gibson...Randy Johnson was damn good in his playoff career, especially the WS....Clemens never lost a WS game...there's plenty more... Personally, I'd probably go Gibson. If you want to fault Koufax for getting hurt, fine, but for a 5-year stretch, you'd be hard-pressed to find a more dominant pitcher and a more important one to his team Pedro Martinez...'97-'02. http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/martipe02.shtml#1997-2003-sum:pitching_simple Keep in mind that he did this in a hitter's park, in the hitter's league, in a hitter's division, during a hitter's era. Koufax's home/road splits are famously uneven...one of the knocks on him when ranking him historically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor99 Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 Pedro Martinez...'97-'02. http://www.baseball-...pitching_simple Keep in mind that he did this in a hitter's park, in the hitter's league, in a hitter's division, during a hitter's era. Accounting for the era, Pedro's '99 and '00 seasons were arguably the best of all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morrissey Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 Accounting for the era, Pedro's '99 and '00 seasons were arguably the best of all time. No argument from me. 1999 ALCS was intersting. I remember being scared to death of Pedro, kinda reminds me of this years ALCS with Cliff Lee, but too much lesser extent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 Pedro Martinez...'97-'02. http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/martipe02.shtml#1997-2003-sum:pitching_simple Was he a lefty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE ILK Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 That's no given...Bob Gibson...Randy Johnson was damn good in his playoff career, especially the WS....Clemens never lost a WS game...there's plenty more... Personally, I'd probably go Gibson. Pedro Martinez...'97-'02. http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/martipe02.shtml#1997-2003-sum:pitching_simple Keep in mind that he did this in a hitter's park, in the hitter's league, in a hitter's division, during a hitter's era. Koufax's home/road splits are famously uneven...one of the knocks on him when ranking him historically. They are all great pitchers, but IMO Koufax had the more un-hittable stuff, and Pedro was RHP, Blackout said LHP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIGHT STALKER Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 Let's put it this way from someone who grew up in that era. Sandy Koufax was as dominate a pitcher you could find. In his prime, I would put him up against anyone...anyone! And that includes by beloved Yankees and Whitey Ford. It's too bad that arthritic elbow kept him from even more success. I would take him against any lefty/righty...he was that good. I would get into debates when I was kid with my best friend who was a Dodger fan. I would always tell him Ford was better, but down deep, I knew it was Koufax...I just wouldn't give him the benefit of the doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted October 19, 2010 Share Posted October 19, 2010 Oddest Koufax story-he was retired well over 10 years. As a goof, Tommy Lasorda asked him pitch batting practice to the NL Champion 1977 Dodgers before the start of the World Series against the Yankees.Koufax complied after asking his doctor for clearance. The Dodgers' brass thought it would be a cute story. Instead Koufax, hitting the low 90s on the gun and still displaying his curve, struck out everybody. He hadn't toed a rubber in over a decade and kept himself in reasonable shape, but even with a decade plus of rust he was able to stifle a pennant winner. Said there was great concern afterward that the whole idea had backfired because the Dodgers' confidence was shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted October 19, 2010 Author Share Posted October 19, 2010 Jane Levy wrote a book about Koufax...A Lefty's Legacy...really good book. I think RJ's stuff is right up there with Koufax. Not many 6'10 lefties with a 95+ fastball and a low 90's slider. Those were the only two pitches he threw for so many years too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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