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Lichtenstein: Bumbling Bowles Clueless About His Own Team

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5 hours ago, Ex-Rex said:

Hackenberg is one of the worst QB's I have ever seen and in no way should he get a shot BEFORE Bryce Petty. But, I also agree with GenXJet that Bowles blows. He has NOT had an original first thought on offense OR defense and is so far over his head as HC that he can't even see the surface anymore. I pray to God that Woody is watching from Jolly Old England and decides to fire Bowles right after the season and allow Maccagnan to hire the next HC. At least then we will have a pair running the team that are on the same page.

This says it all. I don't even think Hackenberg is good enough to be a backup on a CFL team. I know money is the reason why Buster Skrine is still on the team, but I have no idea why he is starting over Burris, who, imo, is proving to be a very capable corner. We have some good players on defense but they still seemed way too disaorganized. They were often out of position on Sunday. Marcus Maye will be a decent safety in this league but I'm still puzzled as to why we went with a safety in round 2. If our plan is to get a franchize QB next season, shouldn't we have went offense in the second round last year? My expectation is that we can trade our #2 two this spring for a second and third rounder. Not even Macc can screw up two second round picks. 

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1 hour ago, prime21 said:

The best thing the Jets could have done was trade down and perhaps select one of those positions.  I don't know what deals were discussed or if any made sense but we didn't do a deal.  Adams was probably the best player available on the field and in the locker room.  

How is everyone so knowledgeable about ADAMS in the locker room?

Are there any JET towel boys or JET  water boys on this message board.  How many regular season games has Adams played?????
one

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How is everyone so knowledgeable about ADAMS in the locker room? Are there any JET towel boys or JET  water boys on this message board.  How many regular season games has Adams played?????

one

 

Based on what former coaches, players, and scouts were reporting.

 

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5 hours ago, JetsFanatic said:

If the Jets fire Bowles after this season he definitely could get another job. No HC can win with this team. It depends if they are competitive and show improvement. 

I can't agree with you on that. While I admit Bowles has not been put in a position to succeed this season, he really hasn't shown sings that he's a competent head coach. Everything from personnel decisions to being too conservative to sticking with vets who are way past their prime or weren't even that good to begin with. 

Bottom line is, Macc's test begins at the end of this 0-16 cluster **** of a season. The question is, does he even deserve to sit down, grab a pencil and take the test after drafting two safeties with the first two picks, a scrub receiver in the third round instead of a guy like Pat Elflien who is going to be a good O-lineman in  this league, and of course, picking Suckenberg with last year's #2 pick? 

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On 9/12/2017 at 9:09 PM, Sperm Edwards said:

So instead it's easier to say blah blah blah and suggest elite players would be ordinary here and/or have no impact because Jets. But beyond your strawman suggestion that mobs of people are suggesting that swapping a safety for a RB would make this failure a success, rather what they're pointing out is that this is but another example of poor design rather than a single, catastrophic culprit.

Good teams also don't stick with bad personnel just for the sake of sticking with them. As I so often hear said, as justification for keeping these failures for longer: when has that ever worked? Should we have stuck with Kotite? I mean he couldn't get us much worse than 1-15, right? Maybe we should have extended Herm before the Chiefs wooed him away. I didn't realize until now you were secretly a fan of sticking with Idzik for another 3 years to avoid replacing him within a mere 4 seasons.

This abortion of a roster is borne from poor planning upon poor planning, poor judgment upon poor judgment. Granted, the one who chose the chooser is the true mother of this failure, but Woody isn't selling the team anytime soon no matter how much we wish it. The best we can hope for is for him to realize his mistake sooner rather than later, and try something different. Neither Bowles nor Maccagnan are getting smarter. Or even if they improve, the amount by which they need to improve is too great, and if all their experience to date has led to what we see before us, a mere 2 more years isn't going to fix their issues.

If you aren't getting through a wall by banging your head against it, the solution is not to bang your head against it for even longer, suggesting that staying the course of failure is some type of virtue. Perhaps try something smarter, and find a way around the wall. 

That was a pretty long comment. I couln't finish it. But if you are saying both of these clowns should go, I'm with you all the way

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On 9/12/2017 at 9:17 PM, Freemanm said:

This says it all. I don't even think Hackenberg is good enough to be a backup on a CFL team. I know money is the reason why Buster Skrine is still on the team, but I have no idea why he is starting over Burris, who, imo, is proving to be a very capable corner. We have some good players on defense but they still seemed way too disaorganized. They were often out of position on Sunday. Marcus Maye will be a decent safety in this league but I'm still puzzled as to why we went with a safety in round 2. If our plan is to get a franchize QB next season, shouldn't we have went offense in the second round last year? My expectation is that we can trade our #2 two this spring for a second and third rounder. Not even Macc can screw up two second round picks. 

So frustrating to watch this team under Bowles' leadership.  I remember the first year Parcells took over the Jets who were 1-15 the previous year and how they almost made the playoffs under his leadership.  Amazing how many of the same players performed under Parcells.  We so desperately need a real coach with a strong track record otherwise our young talent will never reach their potential.

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On 9/12/2017 at 9:17 PM, Freemanm said:

This says it all. I don't even think Hackenberg is good enough to be a backup on a CFL team. I know money is the reason why Buster Skrine is still on the team, but I have no idea why he is starting over Burris, who, imo, is proving to be a very capable corner. We have some good players on defense but they still seemed way too disaorganized. They were often out of position on Sunday. Marcus Maye will be a decent safety in this league but I'm still puzzled as to why we went with a safety in round 2. If our plan is to get a franchize QB next season, shouldn't we have went offense in the second round last year? My expectation is that we can trade our #2 two this spring for a second and third rounder. Not even Macc can screw up two second round picks. 

Disorganized is the right word and that points directly to the D.C. And Bowles.  Even with our young players there is no spark on this team.  And Skrines is our second highest paid player, so it ain't the money.  This whole team is built on cronyism.  Bowles has buddies in high places who recommended him and the D.C. Is his buddy and skrine is the teachers pet. 

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A few items

Who wants to work for the tool Woody?

Why would any respectable candidate want to be a part of the s**t show

Why would any talented player who is a free agent come here with the Jets track record? (maybe for severe overpay)

Jets

Effectively

Tank

Season

 

 

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On ‎9‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 9:17 PM, Freemanm said:

Not even Macc can screw up two second round picks. 

One would hope, but then Mac's first two 2nd round picks were Devin Smith and Christian Hackenberg.  

 

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I don't post much but read here often. I've seen enough of this regime to know that until we get a GM and coach, this team goes nowhere. I was a supporter of Macc, but the past draft left me wondering why I've supported him. Not because he drafted 2 safeties, but because he doesn't seem to get the picture that football is won in the trenches first. To ignore the OL his first 3 drafts is indefensible. This team needs OL. Everyone clamors for the QB, and yes so do I, but I'm not ready to get one killed before we have the basics of what makes football tick. You can have all the skill players you want but if the OL can't run or pass block, then who the hell is making plays. Tom Brady couldn't be a good QB on this team. The next subject is the coach. I have not seen any growth from him in 3 seasons to make me believe he is going to be a good even if we had good players. Yes we might win games because we have good players, but that would only be despite him. He needs to go and go SOON. His decision making is horrible. This starts from the top and it's time for this owner to hire a FOOTBALL guy to be in charge of the team, like Jacksonville did with TC. Then let him pick the GM and coach with the reporting structure that has the coach answering to the GM, and the GM to the President of Football Operations. Again, just my opinion, but something needs to change.

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6 hours ago, 68JET11 said:

I don't post much but read here often. I've seen enough of this regime to know that until we get a GM and coach, this team goes nowhere. I was a supporter of Macc, but the past draft left me wondering why I've supported him. Not because he drafted 2 safeties, but because he doesn't seem to get the picture that football is won in the trenches first. To ignore the OL his first 3 drafts is indefensible. This team needs OL. Everyone clamors for the QB, and yes so do I, but I'm not ready to get one killed before we have the basics of what makes football tick. You can have all the skill players you want but if the OL can't run or pass block, then who the hell is making plays. Tom Brady couldn't be a good QB on this team. The next subject is the coach. I have not seen any growth from him in 3 seasons to make me believe he is going to be a good even if we had good players. Yes we might win games because we have good players, but that would only be despite him. He needs to go and go SOON. His decision making is horrible. This starts from the top and it's time for this owner to hire a FOOTBALL guy to be in charge of the team, like Jacksonville did with TC. Then let him pick the GM and coach with the reporting structure that has the coach answering to the GM, and the GM to the President of Football Operations. Again, just my opinion, but something needs to change.

Agree on all counts.  We need an OL,  Bowles needs to go and we need to have our coach be accountable to the GM.

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On 9/12/2017 at 8:43 PM, Jet_Engine1 said:

Forget players, its positions. What are the marque positions in the NFL in descending order?

QB

LT

3-4 OLB/4-3 DE/Edge Rush

Corner.

 

Notice, no Safeties, no Defensive Tackles, no 3-4 DEs. Because those arent premium positions. 

 

Drafting for BPA is sound in theory. When youre already good. When that player is a premium position and fills a need. IDGAF how good Jamal Adams or Leonard Williams are, you dont draft a DT or a fracking Safety in the top 6 when you have ZERO QB, ZERO Playmakers, or are already 3 deep at the position on an otherwise barren roster 

 

As for Bowles, I thought Rex was bad, and I thought Herm was a moron. But Bowles is worse than both of them. Hes the worst Gameday HC since Kotite. Al Groh would be a massive upgrade, and the only reaaon hes still employed and might actually be back is because of the current social undercurrent in the NFL.

This  X 1000000000

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On 9/13/2017 at 4:17 AM, Sperm Edwards said:

But they both need to get replaced. That doesn't happen by firing only one of them, and leaving the other to hire yet another incompetent and furnish him with more bad draft picks plus lazy or past-prime veterans.

The worst thing that could happen is giving either one of these two - even the perceived lesser of these two evils - another 3 years.

There is a way to make sure the HC and GM are always aligned... give both jobs to the same hombre. That should appeal to Woody--only one salary instead of two.

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On 9/13/2017 at 6:40 AM, bostonmajet said:

 

But, my guess is that you will be happy and both Mac and Bowles will be gone. Of course good teams don't trade FOs every 3-4 years. Bad teams do. But I hear your frustration. 

You're confusing correlation with causation. They don't flip FOs frequently because they are good. Not the other way around.

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On 9/13/2017 at 11:20 PM, jack48 said:

That was a pretty long comment. I couln't finish it. But if you are saying both of these clowns should go, I'm with you all the way

They both should go, assuming that a new competent GM can come in.  I would say Gettleman or Dorsey, but people seem to be poopooing them.  My guess is that Dorsey has learned from his mistakes and wants another chance.

I think some, but not all, of Macc's bad decisions were a product of working with Bowles.

15 hours ago, 68JET11 said:

I don't post much but read here often. I've seen enough of this regime to know that until we get a GM and coach, this team goes nowhere. I was a supporter of Macc, but the past draft left me wondering why I've supported him. Not because he drafted 2 safeties, but because he doesn't seem to get the picture that football is won in the trenches first. To ignore the OL his first 3 drafts is indefensible. This team needs OL. Everyone clamors for the QB, and yes so do I, but I'm not ready to get one killed before we have the basics of what makes football tick. You can have all the skill players you want but if the OL can't run or pass block, then who the hell is making plays. Tom Brady couldn't be a good QB on this team. The next subject is the coach. I have not seen any growth from him in 3 seasons to make me believe he is going to be a good even if we had good players. Yes we might win games because we have good players, but that would only be despite him. He needs to go and go SOON. His decision making is horrible. This starts from the top and it's time for this owner to hire a FOOTBALL guy to be in charge of the team, like Jacksonville did with TC. Then let him pick the GM and coach with the reporting structure that has the coach answering to the GM, and the GM to the President of Football Operations. Again, just my opinion, but something needs to change.

The director of football does not need to be a bigger job than the GM's.  I just needs to be someone with a brain who can call baloney on drafting 2 safeties in the first 2 rounds.

32 minutes ago, Fantasy Island said:

This  X 1000000000

This was the 2 safety point.   I think you really need to go onto Wikipedia and look at the drafts, and who the Jets ended up passing over to draft who they did.  Maye is a decent player, but my guess is that when you look at who was passed over in the second round at the end of the year, there will be better players that the Jets passed over-ignoring the running backs that the Jets were not going to draft, and I accept that.

The good news is that the 2015 and 2016 were lousy drafts overall.    The bad news is that the Jets were outgunned.  As I watch other teams play, it is interesting to see the players you read about or heard Kiper talking about make meaningful contributions to their teams.  Part of that is Macc, but part of that is Bowles and his development of those players.

Here is a chunk of the second round from Devin Smith down.  From what I recall, the Jets were going to reclaim Geno Smith, and knowing that he had an arm wanted Desean Jackson to heave the ball to.  The Jets were not able to sign him.   That appeared to have led Macc to want to draft Devin Smith.  For all of his BPA reputation, he really only does that in the first round.  We can discuss who the right players to draft there were, other than Devin Smith-it seems WRs like that are available in FA.  Its the Julio Jones that are not.

2 37 New York Jets Devin Smith  WR Ohio State Big Ten  
  2 38 Washington Redskins Preston Smith  DE Mississippi State SEC  
  2 39 Chicago Bears Eddie Goldman  DT Florida State ACC  
  2 40 Tennessee Titans Dorial Green-Beckham  WR Missouri SEC from New York Giants  [R2 - 2]
  2 41 Carolina Panthers Devin Funchess  WR Michigan Big Ten from St. Louis [R2 - 3]
  2 42 Atlanta Falcons Jalen Collins  CB LSU SEC  
  2 43 Houston Texans Benardrick McKinney  ILB Mississippi State SEC from Cleveland [R2 - 4]
  2 44 New Orleans Saints Hau'oli Kikaha  OLB Washington Pac-12  
  2 45 Minnesota Vikings Eric Kendricks  ILB UCLA Pac-12 2014 Butkus Award and Lott Trophy winner
  2 46 San Francisco 49ers Jaquiski Tartt  S Samford SoCon  
  2 47 Philadelphia Eagles Eric Rowe  CB Utah Pac-12 from Miami [R2 - 5]
  2 48 San Diego Chargers Denzel Perryman  ILB Miami (FL) ACC  
  2 49 Kansas City Chiefs Mitch Morse  G Missouri SEC  
  2 50 Buffalo Bills Ronald Darby  CB Florida State ACC

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