Ducasse is the biggest reason this team is struggling

[Boozer76]

Matt Slauson could have easily slid over and started the game at center given the situation with Mangold if Ducasse was even serviceable on the line. That would have been the no brainer move if Ducasse were even decent. Think about it, we are opting to start an undrafted rookie center over what should be the common sense approach of moving Slauson over and plugging Ducasse in at Guard. Ducasse was drafted in the 2nd round last year. He comes in for what, 2 plays, engages Hloti Ngata and then just inexplicably let him go kill Sanchez. What in the world was he thinking? Even if he thought he had help behind him did he really think a RB was going to stop Ngata? And for what, so Ducasse could go block the guy that's gonna take another 3 seconds to get there? If Ducasse was even serviceable he might even be an option to replace Hunter since he's been awful as well. But the fact is we drafted Ducasse to at least be a solid backup option, and he's so bad that the coaching feels keeping a rookie undrafted center in over him is the better option. I have always defended Tanny, but he whiffed big on this one. I don't know who's on the hook for having evaluated Ducasse in the draft last year and feeling he was a 2nd round grade but man what a horrible pick and we are paying big time for that miss. Even with Mangold healthy, Hunter is so bad that we still have major issues on the line. Ducasse should have been the answer to that given his 2nd round cost, yet he can't even supplant the idea of putting Baxter in at center over Slauson.

If you give Sanchez time he can play well. He's making alot of poor decisions, but he's also getting killed back there. Defenses are salivating at the opportunity to blow up our OL. Right now they're attacking Baxter in the middle, but make no mistake they'll be back to blowing up Hunter when Mangold returns. And god forbid another lineman goes down, especially for the season, it will be the end our our year. You would think a backup lineman shouldn't be the deciding factor of how our season goes, but Ducasse has singlehandedly trashed our season with his craptastic play.

[villain_the_foe]

Schottyball is the biggest reason why were struggling

[shawn306]

Matt Slauson could have easily slid over and started the game at center given the situation with Mangold if Ducasse was even serviceable on the line. That would have been the no brainer move if Ducasse were even decent. Think about it, we are opting to start an undrafted rookie center over what should be the common sense approach of moving Slauson over and plugging Ducasse in at Guard. Ducasse was drafted in the 2nd round last year. He comes in for what, 2 plays, engages Hloti Ngata and then just inexplicably let him go kill Sanchez. What in the world was he thinking? Even if he thought he had help behind him did he really think a RB was going to stop Ngata? And for what, so Ducasse could go block the guy that's gonna take another 3 seconds to get there? If Ducasse was even serviceable he might even be an option to replace Hunter since he's been awful as well. But the fact is we drafted Ducasse to at least be a solid backup option, and he's so bad that the coaching feels keeping a rookie undrafted center in over him is the better option. I have always defended Tanny, but he whiffed big on this one. I don't know who's on the hook for having evaluated Ducasse in the draft last year and feeling he was a 2nd round grade but man what a horrible pick and we are paying big time for that miss. Even with Mangold healthy, Hunter is so bad that we still have major issues on the line. Ducasse should have been the answer to that given his 2nd round cost, yet he can't even supplant the idea of putting Baxter in at center over Slauson.

If you give Sanchez time he can play well. He's making alot of poor decisions, but he's also getting killed back there. Defenses are salivating at the opportunity to blow up our OL. Right now they're attacking Baxter in the middle, but make no mistake they'll be back to blowing up Hunter when Mangold returns. And god forbid another lineman goes down, especially for the season, it will be the end our our year. You would think a backup lineman shouldn't be the deciding factor of how our season goes, but Ducasse has singlehandedly trashed our season with his craptastic play.

It does not say much for Vlad if you bring a guy in from off the street and he gets more playing time than you.

I don't think "awful" is a strong enough" word to describe this guy.

Just get him outta here.

[JiFtheOracle]

To put this all on a guy who wasnt expected to contribute as anything more than 2nd back up in the OL rotation, maybe even 3rd...is silly.

Turner going down hurt us a lot more than expected.

[Boozer76]

To put this all on a guy who wasnt expected to contribute as anything more than 2nd back up in the OL rotation, maybe even 3rd...is silly.

Turner going down hurt us a lot more than expected.

He was drafted in the 2nd round. You would think the guy would be serviceable enough to plug in at G while Slauson plays Center. When you draft a guy at that level he's supposed to be at least good enough to be the 1st backup on the line. I mean, should a guy drafted as high as he was even be in competition with Turner if he was healthy? Ducasse "should" be good enough to give Hunter some competition at the very least. I'm not blaming him directly because turds can't help the fact that they're turds. I'm blaming whoever though his turdiness could be polished.

[jason423]

The real problem is this:

Vernon Gholston, Dustin Keller

Mark Sanchez, Shonn Greene

Kyle WIlson, Vlad Ducasse

Muhammad Wilkerson, Kenrick Ellis

These are the top 2 picks from each of the last 4 draft classes. Gholston is gone. Greene is going to be gone. Ducasse is going to be gone. Sanchez has yet to prove he can be a player to just take over a game and maybe never will. Wilson is still only playing in maybe 30% of the snaps for the Jets and even though he is improving hes already seemingly relegated to bench status. Keller is ok, Wilkerson may or may not be good and Ellis has yet to suit up for a game.

It is very difficult to win when, in 4 years, you dont find a high quality starter at the top of your draft. The Jets lived off finding that in 2006 and 2007. That is a long long time ago. The NFL is built through draft and the team is supplemented via free agency. The Jets arent getting that draft talent these last few years. It makes it difficult when the FA's start to get older and/or more expensive.

[Matt39]

Keller was still having Ray Lewis nightmares last night.

[JiFtheOracle]

He was drafted in the 2nd round. You would think the guy would be serviceable enough to plug in at G while Slauson plays Center. When you draft a guy at that level he's supposed to be at least good enough to be the 1st backup on the line. I mean, should a guy drafted as high as he was even be in competition with Turner if he was healthy? Ducasse "should" be good enough to give Hunter some competition at the very least. I'm not blaming him directly because turds can't help the fact that they're turds. I'm blaming whoever though his turdiness could be polished.

Boozer, I understand your frustration...but to say that a player who in all honestly was probably not even expected to see the field is the biggest reason for the Jets struggles is silly. And thats a nice way to put it.

The guy was a late 2nd round project and a luxury pick because the Jets had great depth in Hunter and Turner. Go look at players selected right after his pick, tell me how many are in the league. NO team in the NFL is banking on a player they pick in the late 2nd round to be the difference maker on a team. Especially when your OL is elite and there was no way to predict Hunter getting visited by the Space Jam aliens along with Mangold and Turner getting hurt.

Vlad is far from the reason for the Jets struggles.

[rillo]

I can't blame him, he should not have been drafted that high in the first place. They reached and failed.

[Boozer76]

Boozer, I understand your frustration...but to say that a player who in all honestly was probably not even expected to see the field is the biggest reason for the Jets struggles is silly. And thats a nice way to put it.

The guy was a late 2nd round project and a luxury pick because the Jets had great depth in Hunter and Turner. Go look at players selected right after his pick, tell me how many are in the league. NO team in the NFL is banking on a player they pick in the late 2nd round to be the difference maker on a team. Especially when your OL is elite and there was no way to predict Hunter getting visited by the Space Jam aliens along with Mangold and Turner getting hurt.

Vlad is far from the reason for the Jets struggles.

JiF, let's not act like Turner is some stud lineman. He was a back up for a reason. Ducasse was not drafted as a luxury, he was drafted to compete with Slauson for the open G spot and start at RT after Woody was either cut or retired. Ducasse was drafted with the notion that he was better than Turner. At the level he was drafted he should be serviceable at the very least, and because he isn't our OL is in absolute shambles. Sanchez has proven he can succeed if he has time to throw. He was absolutely abused back there. He obviously played poorly, but he's gonna end up with David Carr syndrome at this rate. Seriously, Colin Baxter was brought in during the last week of preseason and he's playing over Ducasse. That's davastating.

[Integrity28]

To put this all on a guy who wasnt expected to contribute as anything more than 2nd back up in the OL rotation, maybe even 3rd...is silly.

Turner going down hurt us a lot more than expected.

Ducasse is the reason Turner went down, technically.

[JiFtheOracle]

JiF, let's not act like Turner is some stud lineman. He was a back up for a reason. Ducasse was not drafted as a luxury, he was drafted to compete with Slauson for the open G spot and start at RT after Woody was either cut or retired. Ducasse was drafted with the notion that he was better than Turner. At the level he was drafted he should be serviceable at the very least, and because he isn't our OL is in absolute shambles. Sanchez has proven he can succeed if he has time to throw. He was absolutely abused back there. He obviously played poorly, but he's gonna end up with David Carr syndrome at this rate. Seriously, Colin Baxter was brought in during the last week of preseason and he's playing over Ducasse. That's davastating.

Players are drafted and dont pan out every year. Especially late 2nd rounders. Turner is a very good back up and would probably start on some teams. We used to say the same about Hunter.

And how do you know they drafted with the notion he was better? He was project, everyone knew it...we could afford to take the risk because we had great depht on an elite OL.

He's a bad player, but he was probably #3 on the depth rotation. He's a part of the struggles...maybe like 5%.

[shawn306]

Boozer, I understand your frustration...but to say that a player who in all honestly was probably not even expected to see the field is the biggest reason for the Jets struggles is silly. And thats a nice way to put it.

The guy was a late 2nd round project and a luxury pick because the Jets had great depth in Hunter and Turner. Go look at players selected right after his pick, tell me how many are in the league. NO team in the NFL is banking on a player they pick in the late 2nd round to be the difference maker on a team. Especially when your OL is elite and there was no way to predict Hunter getting visited by the Space Jam aliens along with Mangold and Turner getting hurt.

Vlad is far from the reason for the Jets struggles.

There are no luxury picks. The Jets are not that deep that they can waste a second round pick on a "project" and if that is honestly want Tannenbaum was thinking then that was a big mistake.

I can see having an OL sit a year learn the offense but by the second year he should at least be able to take some snaps without getting the QB killed.

He isn't the biggest reason,for the Jets offensive woes (I'll leave that to the Mangold injury and Schotty) but he should at least able to step in at this point and for a couple of plays and perform like at least an average OL. I'm not asking him to be Moore or Ferguson but don't be Adrian Clarke or Everett McIver for crying out loud.

[T0mShane]

The real problem is this:

Vernon Gholston, Dustin Keller

Mark Sanchez, Shonn Greene

Kyle WIlson, Vlad Ducasse

Muhammad Wilkerson, Kenrick Ellis

These are the top 2 picks from each of the last 4 draft classes. Gholston is gone. Greene is going to be gone. Ducasse is going to be gone. Sanchez has yet to prove he can be a player to just take over a game and maybe never will. Wilson is still only playing in maybe 30% of the snaps for the Jets and even though he is improving hes already seemingly relegated to bench status. Keller is ok, Wilkerson may or may not be good and Ellis has yet to suit up for a game.

It is very difficult to win when, in 4 years, you dont find a high quality starter at the top of your draft. The Jets lived off finding that in 2006 and 2007. That is a long long time ago. The NFL is built through draft and the team is supplemented via free agency. The Jets arent getting that draft talent these last few years. It makes it difficult when the FA's start to get older and/or more expensive.

Pow, pow, pow, pow.

[JiFtheOracle]

There are no luxury picks. The Jets are not that deep that they can waste a second round pick on a "project" and if that is honestly want Tannenbaum was thinking then that was a big mistake.

I can see having an OL sit a year learn the offense but by the second year he should at least be able to take some snaps without getting the QB killed.

He isn't the biggest reason,for the Jets offensive woes (I'll leave that to the Mangold injury and Schotty) but he should at least able to step in at this point and for a couple of plays and perform like at least an average OL. I'm not asking him to be Moore or Ferguson but don't be Adrian Clarke or Everett McIver for crying out loud.

There are no luxury picks? Ok.

The Jets had the best Oline in the leauge with 2 guys that could start on the majority of teams in the NFL. Vlad was most certainly, a luxury pick. He was a project, everyone knew it, everyone said it, and the Jets had the luxury of taking the gamble late in the 2nd round where most players dont make it because they had 7 interchangable parts with not a huge drop off. He was not drafted to start, he was not drafted to be the immediate back up. He was draft because he had huge upside and wasnt necessary at all to play or even suite up for the Jets.

Vlad, was the definition of a luxury pick.

[Boozer76]

There are no luxury picks. The Jets are not that deep that they can waste a second round pick on a "project" and if that is honestly want Tannenbaum was thinking then that was a big mistake.

I can see having an OL sit a year learn the offense but by the second year he should at least be able to take some snaps without getting the QB killed.

He isn't the biggest reason,for the Jets offensive woes (I'll leave that to the Mangold injury and Schotty) but he should at least able to step in at this point and for a couple of plays and perform like at least an average OL. I'm not asking him to be Moore or Ferguson but don't be Adrian Clarke or Everett McIver for crying out loud.

Exactly. When he was drafted he was plugged in as the starting LG. He lost that job promptly to Slauson. You don't draft guys in the 2nd round to be the backup to the backup's backup. If they wanted a project then you draft a big guy with poor technique in the late rounds and hope you can teach him. Again, it's not Vlad's fault that he is a craptastic load if sh*t. Somebody looked at that load of sh*t and thought "hey, that looks like some good sh*t!" and pinned our hopes on that turd being the answer.

[Boozer76]

There are no luxury picks? Ok.

The Jets had the best Oline in the leauge with 2 guys that could start on the majority of teams in the NFL. Vlad was most certainly, a luxury pick. He was a project, everyone knew it, everyone said it, and the Jets had the luxury of taking the gamble late in the 2nd round where most players dont make it because they had 7 interchangable parts with not a huge drop off. He was not drafted to start, he was not drafted to be the immediate back up. He was draft because he had huge upside and wasnt necessary at all to play or even suite up for the Jets.

Vlad, was the definition of a luxury pick.

Who is "everybody"? I got blasted all last season when I said that Slauson was going to win the starting RG spot. He wasn't a luxury pick, he was supposed to give Slauson competition and develop into the starting RT after Woody left. Hunter was a "pleasant surprise" last year. I don't know what in the world you're remembering or forgetting, but nobody, and I mean NOBODY had the notion that Hunter or Turner were going to be better options than Ducasse last year.

[JiFtheOracle]

Exactly. When he was drafted he was plugged in as the starting LG. He lost that job promptly to Slauson. You don't draft guys in the 2nd round to be the backup to the backup's backup. If they wanted a project then you draft a big guy with poor technique in the late rounds and hope you can teach him. Again, it's not Vlad's fault that he is a craptastic load if sh*t. Somebody looked at that load of sh*t and thought "hey, that looks like some good sh*t!" and pinned our hopes on that turd being the answer.

Go look at the picks in, around or after Vlad. Tell me how many are contributing in the league and if they are, are they any good. I'd love to hear the percentages on how many late 2nd round picks make it in the NFL.

Who is "everybody"? I got blasted all last season when I said that Slauson was going to win the starting RG spot. He wasn't a luxury pick, he was supposed to give Slauson competition and develop into the starting RT after Woody left. Hunter was a "pleasant surprise" last year. I don't know what in the world you're remembering or forgetting, but nobody, and I mean NOBODY had the notion that Hunter or Turner were going to be better options than Ducasse last year.

Whatever dude, the Jets didnt draft a late 2nd round project to be their day 1 starter. Callahan was very familiar with Slauson, something tells me he was confident he could do the job and if he couldnt...they had Turner or Hunter to slam in there...not a project pick they scooped up basically in the 3rd out of UMass for christ sake.

This is pointless. Vlad is maybe 5% of the reason why the Jets suck.

[shawn306]

Go look at the picks in, around or after Vlad. Tell me how many are contributing in the league and if they are, are they any good. I'd love to hear the percentages on how many late 2nd round picks make it in the NFL.

Whatever dude, the Jets didnt draft a late 2nd round project to be their day 1 starter. Callahan was very familiar with Slauson, something tells me he was confident he could do the job and if he couldnt...they had Turner or Hunter to slam in there...not a project pick they scooped up basically in the 3rd out of UMass for christ sake.

This is pointless. Vlad is maybe 5% of the reason why the Jets suck.

Just looking at the OL you have Jon Asamoah in KC starting and Jared Veldheer that were draft late 2nd early third round last year that are both starting.

[SMC]

The real problem is this:

Vernon Gholston, Dustin Keller

Mark Sanchez, Shonn Greene

Kyle WIlson, Vlad Ducasse

Muhammad Wilkerson, Kenrick Ellis

These are the top 2 picks from each of the last 4 draft classes. Gholston is gone. Greene is going to be gone. Ducasse is going to be gone. Sanchez has yet to prove he can be a player to just take over a game and maybe never will. Wilson is still only playing in maybe 30% of the snaps for the Jets and even though he is improving hes already seemingly relegated to bench status. Keller is ok, Wilkerson may or may not be good and Ellis has yet to suit up for a game.

It is very difficult to win when, in 4 years, you dont find a high quality starter at the top of your draft. The Jets lived off finding that in 2006 and 2007. That is a long long time ago. The NFL is built through draft and the team is supplemented via free agency. The Jets arent getting that draft talent these last few years. It makes it difficult when the FA's start to get older and/or more expensive.

Exactly. Although I think Wilkerson might end up being in that David Harris category (very good but not Revis/Mangold/Brick upper echelon)

[JonEJet]

Boys and girls....watch the game again. I'm afraid to say that the surgery on Moore took the football out of him. It's scary seeing him get blown back last night. He could be done, and that's why we can't run

[JiFtheOracle]

Just looking at the OL you have Jon Asamoah in KC starting and Jared Veldheer that were draft late 2nd early third round last year that are both starting.

Good for them...clearly they didnt have the luxury of not having to start them.

[Il Mostro]

Boys and girls....watch the game again. I'm afraid to say that the surgery on Moore took the football out of him. It's scary seeing him get blown back last night. He could be done, and that's why we can't run

True. Hip surgery is a nasty thing. Moore has fallen and he can't get up. Maybe the Jets will get him a Clapper as retirement gift. Barring some miraculous recovery, he is very, very done.

[SoFlaJets]

Boys and girls....watch the game again. I'm afraid to say that the surgery on Moore took the football out of him. It's scary seeing him get blown back last night. He could be done, and that's why we can't run

I've been saying this for a while now. That hip injury is not fully healed and Brandon Moore is a big reason why Wayne Hunter is struggling. We need to replace the right side of our line. Maybe after we go 8-8 there will be an OLman around pick # 21-23 coming out that can be plugged in as a starter. It takes a few years to overcome a high DP who is SUPPOSED to start blunder. We saw it with Gholston and Clemens and we're seeing it with Ducasse. If Ducasse was on the Pats he would already be gone. Belichick is not afraid to unload guys like him, no matter WHERE they were drafted.

[Sperm Edwards]

He was drafted in the 2nd round. You would think the guy would be serviceable enough to plug in at G while Slauson plays Center. When you draft a guy at that level he's supposed to be at least good enough to be the 1st backup on the line. I mean, should a guy drafted as high as he was even be in competition with Turner if he was healthy? Ducasse "should" be good enough to give Hunter some competition at the very least. I'm not blaming him directly because turds can't help the fact that they're turds. I'm blaming whoever though his turdiness could be polished.

Agreed. He can have all the potential in the world, but if he is truly THAT raw you take him in rounds 4-7 (if he's available) or not at all, and then stash him on the practice squad while he learns how to walk & chew gum at the same time. They watched all his film, they did research on him, and if they're thinking about taking him in round 1 (as reported) they had - or should have had - him in for a workout & watch him break down some film.

A 2nd round pick only gets a 4-year contract and then he's a UFA. You can't hold onto him and keep him off the field - even in cases of emergencies like now - until at least year 3.