Jacked4JetsFB Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 The O-line would be much better if we had any type of passing game whatsoever. Teams stack the box because they know we cannot throw the ball, get us in long yardage situations, and then send more than we can block, and we cannot beat it. Our O-line is not our problem, the passing game is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 The O-line would be much better if we had any type of passing game whatsoever. Teams stack the box because they know we cannot throw the ball, get us in long yardage situations, and then send more than we can block, and we cannot beat it. Our O-line is not our problem, the passing game is. I agree. I thought our O-line was fine, and though it could use a little tweeking was the second best unit, on this team, behind the D-Line. They used to ask Marino's old O-lineman what it was like playing O-line for that guy, and all to a man would say, "the way that dude gets rid of it, we just needed to hold our block for about 1 second or even just chip and marino had it flying out of there. NOTHING is worse for an O-line than a QB who holds it too long, and this poor line has had two consecutive QB's who have done this, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 data is one thing, I'm sure the coaches know who is worth keeping wouldn't surprise me if they bring in guards and tackles, but I think howard is safe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 data is one thing, I'm sure the coaches know who is worth keeping Coaches can tend to be subjective. Just look at Rex. Numbers be damned, Sanchez and Holmes were his guys! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 Cutting mangold is probably the worst suggestions that anyone i actualy respect on this board has made in a long time. Thanks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 There was a reason that team underperfomed, Revis' contract wasn't one of them. If that is the case, then their new GM and coach have no choice but to jettison him since his money is not guaranteed. They're not mutually exclusive. Paying $16M to a corner is indicative of a front office/coaching staff that doesn't know what it's doing. It took until midseason for Schiano to finally use Revis like he was meant to be used, and by then it was too late for him to make a positive impact. Now they're hiring Lovie Smith, a Cover 2 guy, to once again misuse Revis. The Glazers man. Just terrific owners, I tell ya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 The numbers seem to indicate our YPC was not an accurate measure of our o-line's success. A lot of our great rushing days came against really bad run defenses. Adjusted Line Yards takes into account context (down and distance of each run, opponent, second level yards, etc). What horrible run defenses? I thought that the Browns and Miami were supposed to have decent run Ds. Three of our top five rushing games came against teams that are still playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 What horrible run defenses? I thought that the Browns and Miami were supposed to have decent run Ds. Three of our top five rushing games came against teams that are still playing. Nope. Cleveland averaged 111.3 yards per game allowed on the ground (18th) and the Dolphins averaged 124.9 (24th) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 They're not mutually exclusive. Paying $16M to a corner is indicative of a front office/coaching staff that doesn't know what it's doing. It took until midseason for Schiano to finally use Revis like he was meant to be used, and by then it was too late for him to make a positive impact. Now they're hiring Lovie Smith, a Cover 2 guy, to once again misuse Revis. The Glazers man. Just terrific owners, I tell ya. I'm just glad we're not paying him that money. It's going to show up more this year as they're only 9mil or so under the cap and would love to reunite Jared Allen with Frazier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Coaches can tend to be subjective. Just look at Rex. Numbers be damned, Sanchez and Holmes were his guys! they know who was playing hurt, what the play call in the huddle was, what calls were made at the line of scrimmage, who missed what block, when the RB bounces outside when the hole was inside, that kinda stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 they know who was playing hurt, what the play call in the huddle was, what calls were made at the line of scrimmage, who missed what block, when the RB bounces outside when the hole was inside, that kinda stuff Yeah but those individual variables get washed out with large samples, which we have with the data presented. If a guy misses a block here or there but has a strong season overall, that won't matter much. What we don't know is if, say, Willie Colon had a rough year and Howard's numbers suffered as a result (or vice versa). That would only come from watching the tape. That's what makes advanced stats much more difficult to understand and analyze in football than, say, baseball, where it's hitter vs. pitcher and there's less complexity to deal with. But they aren't useless data either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed4 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I won't claim to know much about him all I have to go on is what I read and see and all the reports seem to be very positive. From Bleacher Report: "What Ebron brings to the table is not only a great playmaking ability but also an ability to haul in just about any pass thrown his way. If Smith does retain the quarterback position, he needs someone who can catch just about anything." The catches at :25, 1:20 and 1:49 would indicate a pretty good set of hands. And yes, I know it's highlights but still. You probably believe we've sent a man to the moon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 The line wasn't terrible. It was fair. But looking at what we have at the offensive skill positions, particularly QB, an Oline that's merely fair isn't going to lead to much success. When we had a dominant line in '09, the offense couldn't help but run over teams despite having a rookie QB. There were big holes and lots of time to throw. That's the best formula when dealing with an inexperienced QB and middle-of-the-road talent at WR. A strong running game gets stronger, and receivers have plenty of time to separate. Ivory ran through tacklers all season. He'd benefit most of all I think. The numbers don't suggest this at all. The only area on the field we don't need improvement is on the D-Line. Everywhere else can use upgrades. Perhaps better QB play would improve the play of the o-line as well, but until we get said QB in here (or Geno progresses), it's a good idea to make sure we surround him with plenty of talent, and not just at the skill positions. Wouldn't it be great to have a line like the Chiefs, who didn't just perform "fairly" this season, but dominated at the line of scrimmage? We used to have a dominant o-line as recently as 2010. We can get back to that point again now that we have a GM who seems to understand this (as Ape mentioned). And as I mentioned before, we're also still a running team until we find that QB, because Rex is still here. We were 5th in the NFL in total carries last season even with a pass-first offensive coordinator and despite playing from behind with steep deficits in half our games. Until that changes, we'll need to get better on the o-line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCJETSFAN Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Fixing the skill postion players is no easy task alot of the FA have better options where to play. NE. Indy. To name 2 of them so unless we overpay it will be a tough sell to have someone come here ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Yeah but those individual variables get washed out with large samples, which we have with the data presented. If a guy misses a block here or there but has a strong season overall, that won't matter much. What we don't know is if, say, Willie Colon had a rough year and Howard's numbers suffered as a result (or vice versa). That would only come from watching the tape. That's what makes advanced stats much more difficult to understand and analyze in football than, say, baseball, where it's hitter vs. pitcher and there's less complexity to deal with. But they aren't useless data either. those stats come from a guy who watched the tape and makes a judgement call, right ? he doesn't know that the call was, who was where they were supposed to be, who wasn't etc. they aren't useless, but idzik won't ever even see them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pac Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Cutting mangold is probably the worst suggestions that anyone i actualy respect on this board has made in a long time. Actually 80 is the one that came up with that filth. He forgot Mangold also makes all the line calls. Remember what happened last time he was out a few games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Actually 80 is the one that came up with that filth. He forgot Mangold also makes all the line calls. Remember what happened last time he was out a few games. Yeah, Sanchez got mauled after like .3 seconds even though, he would have still had the ball had the line held up for 10 minutes. But your point is well taken. They collapsed without the big guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I'm just glad we're not paying him that money. It's going to show up more this year as they're only 9mil or so under the cap and would love to reunite Jared Allen with Frazier. I think they'll cut Revis on the quick as soon as a new GM is hired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 They're not mutually exclusive. Paying $16M to a corner is indicative of a front office/coaching staff that doesn't know what it's doing. It took until midseason for Schiano to finally use Revis like he was meant to be used, and by then it was too late for him to make a positive impact. Now they're hiring Lovie Smith, a Cover 2 guy, to once again misuse Revis. The Glazers man. Just terrific owners, I tell ya. They have one more RING than Woody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I think they'll cut Revis on the quick as soon as a new GM is hired. Revis will get 7 mill from Belichick for 1 year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I think they'll cut Revis on the quick as soon as a new GM is hired. You think. You think. I don't PAY you to think! (I also don't think they cut him) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 Actually 80 is the one that came up with that filth. He forgot Mangold also makes all the line calls. Remember what happened last time he was out a few games. That's because we had no capable backup. Robert Turner was also hurt so we turned to Caleb Schlauderauff. Obviously that was a unique circumstance. Not only am I not suggesting cutting Mangold outright until 2016 the earliest, I'm strongly preferring restructuring over any scenario where we lose Mangold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 They have one more RING than Woody. This is true. But can we really credit them for that? That was a weird year for the NFL. Sort of like when the Pistons won the 2005 NBA Title without a superstar. We've never had a season where a QB the caliber of a Brad Johnson has won a title since that 2002 NFL season. It was the end of an era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 You think. You think. I don't PAY you to think! (I also don't think they cut him) Watch this: 1. Cut Revis, imply that Mark Dominik was a psychopath 2. Give the Jets your fourth rounder instead of your third rounder as a result. 3. Save $16 milly. 4. Draft Darqueze Dennard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 Watch this: 1. Cut Revis, imply that Mark Dominik was a psychopath 2. Give the Jets your fourth rounder instead of your third rounder as a result. 3. Save $16 milly. 4. Draft Darqueze Dennard. Add that to the Glennon-Martin-Jackson trio on offense and that's a playoff team under Lovie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Add that to the Glennon-Martin-Jackson trio on offense and that's a playoff team under Lovie. I'm not sure that's how it works. I know Jets fans in particular like to use the formula Mediocre Team + X=Great team (where X equals some nebulous, unquantifiable player type), but it takes a little more than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted January 8, 2014 Author Share Posted January 8, 2014 I'm not sure that's how it works. I know Jets fans in particular like to use the formula Mediocre Team + X=Great team (where X equals some nebulous, unquantifiable player type), but it takes a little more than that. I never said great team. I said playoff team. You know, the same playoffs that contained the 8-7-1 Green Bay Packers. Teams go from a down year to the postseason all the time. The Bucs were 7-9 two seasons ago and "on the rise" with Josh Freeman at QB. Now they have a competent coach (who went 29-19 over his final 3 seasons in Chicago) and what appears to be the best QB of the 2013 draft class. 9-7 sounds perfectly reasonable to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Watch this: 1. Cut Revis, imply that Mark Dominik was a psychopath 2. Give the Jets your fourth rounder instead of your third rounder as a result. 3. Save $16 milly. 4. Draft Darqueze Dennard. Or they can keep Revis for as long as they wish to keep paying him, restructure contracts (not sure what the Nicks situation is for their cap either, and he's a goner plus they're still 9mil under the cap with Revis' contract), don't sweat the third rounder instead of fourth rounder and draft Sammy Watkins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Or they can keep Revis for as long as they wish to keep paying him, restructure contracts (not sure what the Nicks situation is for their cap either, and he's a goner plus they're still 9mil under the cap with Revis' contract), don't sweat the third rounder instead of fourth rounder and draft Sammy Watkins. Watkins is going to the Raiders at 5. I'm working on my mock draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Watkins is going to the Raiders at 5. I'm working on my mock draft. They're going QB. Get in on that. Don't ruin your mock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 They're going QB. Get in on that. Don't ruin your mock. Shhhh! T0m knows what Al Davis wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Shhhh! T0m knows what Al Davis wants. LMAO he has them taking Fred Biletnikoff, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Shhhh! T0m knows what Al Davis wants. Al Davis is dead, but his son is something of a dope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 They're going QB. Get in on that. Don't ruin your mock. My mock falls apart after 12, but it's GOLD before that. I think the Raiders will punt on a QB until next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed4 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 My mock falls apart after 12, but it's GOLD before that. I think the Raiders will punt on a QB until next year. They can Tahj Boyd it up in the 2nd or 3rd and convince the fan base that the position has been addressed. Kinda like we did with Geno Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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