What is the personal vendetta that Belichick has against the Jets?

[20andOut]

3 hours ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

He was hired to be our coach, then a few weeks later we hired Tuna pushing him to the background with the promise of head coach once Tuna leaves.  That pissed him off, but he stayed on knowing it was his best chance at success in the short term.  Once he got the first opportunity to bolt as a head coach he took it.  That forced Tuna into "retiring" so we wouldn't lose him to a division rival.  He had the contract that said he was the next head coach after Parcells. That REALLY pissed him off since I'm sure Tuna talked it over with Woody before proceeding and almost cost him the Pats job

Everybody seems to completely forget this! In 1997 the Jets hired Belichick as Head Coach. Then when Parcells split with NE the Jets hired him in a consulting roll. New England filed a grievance, because he quit under contract and it was all negotiated by the Commissioner. In the end Jets paid compensation to NE to allow Parcells to coach. End result Belichick was demoted to Def Coordinator right after signing on to be head coach. That would piss me off too!

[20andOut]

3 hours ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

He was hired to be our coach, then a few weeks later we hired Tuna pushing him to the background with the promise of head coach once Tuna leaves.  That pissed him off, but he stayed on knowing it was his best chance at success in the short term.  Once he got the first opportunity to bolt as a head coach he took it.  That forced Tuna into "retiring" so we wouldn't lose him to a division rival.  He had the contract that said he was the next head coach after Parcells. That REALLY pissed him off since I'm sure Tuna talked it over with Woody before proceeding and almost cost him the Pats job

Everybody seems to completely forget this! In 1997 the Jets hired Belichick as Head Coach. Then when Parcells split with NE the Jets hired him in a consulting roll. New England filed a grievance, because he quit under contract and it was all negotiated by the Commissioner. In the end Jets paid compensation to NE to allow Parcells to coach. End result Belichick was demoted to Def Coordinator right after signing on to be head coach. That would piss me off too!

[j4jets]

Inter-division trade is like incest. It's rare and only happen out of desperation. Well...

[JoeC36]

3 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Welker.

Seriously?

[jetophile]

Oh, I dunno, I still enjoyed my 15 minutes of joy when this happened:

Jim Nantz is choking on a giant cock to this day.

[Jets1214]

6 hours ago, Lil Woody said:

Im going entirely on memeory here, so you instant google nerds may want to research and correct me. The reason for the vendetta is Steve Gutman and the Jets front office when he was here. Gutman and him did not get along and Gutman publicly blasted him telling everyone that he was an unbalanced, snide little douchebag when he left for the Patriots. While Gutman was a total joke as a front office executive, he wasn't wrong. Billy felt betrayed by the Jets, a team he didn't want to coach for, and left stranded and was angered that he lost picks as a result of his back door deal with Kraft to come to the Patriots. He is a small, pathetic person and possibly a total sociopath, but it works for him and he's created a very successful program because of it (and having an owner who empowers him to create his dictatorship). 

Very well said with a couple of corrections.  Gutman was indeed the catalyst of the hatred.  Gutman ripped BB when he left and he had his reasons.  

BB came here in 1997 as PART of the rouse to get Parcels here.  Kraft knew Tuna wanted out but showed no interest in making BB his HC so BB "agreed" to leave the Pats (and Kraft) to be the Jets HC (since Tuna was still under contract with NE).  Then Tuna quit the Pats and came here as a "consultant".  The whole world (including BB) knew it was a BS setup to get Tuna here as HC.  So eventually it got worked out, Tuna became HC, BB became DC and AGREED under contract to succeed Parcells when Parcels would move up to be just GM.  Remember, BB was no hot commodity.  He was passed over for ray Handley the Tuna quit the Giants after 1990 and then had an awful stint as HC with Cleveland before coming crawling back to Tuna in NE as secondary coach in 1996.  So he was probably thrilled to know he'd have another shot as HC once Tuna inevitably retired.  After the 1998 season, some teams came sniffing or BB and Leon Hess gave BB a 1 million dollar bonus to make sure he abided by his agreement to succeed Parcels.  Then after 1999, Tuna got wind that Kraft was coming after BB...so he immediately retired (whihc he  was planning to do anyway) which elevated BB to HC.  But BB, despite taking the 1MM the prior year and knowing full well this was the plan, suddenly didn't like the idea of being in Tuna the GMs shadow and saw a better deal in NE.  So we "resigned as HC of NYJ" after 2 days to try and get to NE.

Gutman was VERY close to Hess.  He was furious that BB would take Hess bonus money and then bolt anyway.  He told the world BB was an unstable, conflicted man (all true btw) and BB never forgave him or the organization for that.  Toss in Mangini leaving for NY and then Spygate (as well as a few big victories over the Pats here and there) and BB hates the Jets and always will.  But BB, while being a winning coach, is a scumbag of a human being as evidenced by what he did to the Jets, what he did to Hess, his very public extramarital issues, and his constant "bending of the rules".

[Jets1214]

3 hours ago, 20andOut said:

Everybody seems to completely forget this! In 1997 the Jets hired Belichick as Head Coach. Then when Parcells split with NE the Jets hired him in a consulting roll. New England filed a grievance, because he quit under contract and it was all negotiated by the Commissioner. In the end Jets paid compensation to NE to allow Parcells to coach. End result Belichick was demoted to Def Coordinator right after signing on to be head coach. That would piss me off too!

Thats not how it happened.  BB was a PART of the orchestration to get Tuna here.  The whole world knew, even at the SB that year, that the Jets were after Tuna and he wanted to go there to get away from Kraft.  Making BB HC was all part of the plan and he was well aware of the plan from the beginning.  Otherwise why would he do it?  He needed an opportunity to get his HC career back on track after the disaster in Cleveland and Kraft showed no interest in him to replace parcells if he left NE.  BB knew Tuna would only coach 2or 3 years and then the job would be his.  But his ego got in the way and he didn't want to work under Parcells anymore once Kraft came calling after 1999.

[Dcat]

1 hour ago, Jets1214 said:

Very well said with a couple of corrections.  Gutman was indeed the catalyst of the hatred.  Gutman ripped BB when he left and he had his reasons.  

BB came here in 1997 as PART of the rouse to get Parcels here.  Kraft knew Tuna wanted out but showed no interest in making BB his HC so BB "agreed" to leave the Pats (and Kraft) to be the Jets HC (since Tuna was still under contract with NE).  Then Tuna quit the Pats and came here as a "consultant".  The whole world (including BB) knew it was a BS setup to get Tuna here as HC.  So eventually it got worked out, Tuna became HC, BB became DC and AGREED under contract to succeed Parcells when Parcels would move up to be just GM.  Remember, BB was no hot commodity.  He was passed over for ray Handley the Tuna quit the Giants after 1990 and then had an awful stint as HC with Cleveland before coming crawling back to Tuna in NE as secondary coach in 1996.  So he was probably thrilled to know he'd have another shot as HC once Tuna inevitably retired.  After the 1998 season, some teams came sniffing or BB and Leon Hess gave BB a 1 million dollar bonus to make sure he abided by his agreement to succeed Parcels.  Then after 1999, Tuna got wind that Kraft was coming after BB...so he immediately retired (whihc he  was planning to do anyway) which elevated BB to HC.  But BB, despite taking the 1MM the prior year and knowing full well this was the plan, suddenly didn't like the idea of being in Tuna the GMs shadow and saw a better deal in NE.  So we "resigned as HC of NYJ" after 2 days to try and get to NE.

Gutman was VERY close to Hess.  He was furious that BB would take Hess bonus money and then bolt anyway.  He told the world BB was an unstable, conflicted man (all true btw) and BB never forgave him or the organization for that.  Toss in Mangini leaving for NY and then Spygate (as well as a few big victories over the Pats here and there) and BB hates the Jets and always will.  But BB, while being a winning coach, is a scumbag of a human being as evidenced by what he did to the Jets, what he did to Hess, his very public extramarital issues, and his constant "bending of the rules".

Gutman publicly labeled him a "tormented soul".  

Yep... it was ugly and nasty. And Belichick will always hate the Jets for it.  And although Belichick didn't have any legal obligation to return the million dollars, or any part thereof, his failure to do so showed his true character and he has continued to display his dishonest sneaky character ever since.  

[Gas2No99]

21 minutes ago, Dcat said:

Gutman publicly labeled him a "tortured soul".  

Yep... it was ugly and nasty. And Belichick will always hate the Jets for it.  And although Belichick didn't have any legal obligation to return the million dollars, or any part thereof, his failure to do so showed his true character and he has continued to display his dishonest sneaky character ever since.  

WHAT STEVE GUTMAN HAD TO SAY YESTERDAY:

 

ON BELICHICK'S COMMENTS: "We should have some feelings of sorrow and regret for him and his family. He's obviously in some turmoil. I have to wish him the best of whatever the future holds for him. I think, I'm not a psychologist, but I think I just listened for an hour to a person who is in some turmoil and deserves our understanding and our consideration.

" ON BELICHICK'S CONTRACT: "(We) had contracts signed with Bill Belichick which was clear and unambiguous and specific with respect to the areas of uncertainty that he has raised insofar as they relate to football and the New York Jets. (The contract) clearly and unimpeachably covers areas of ownership change. It covers the role Bill Parcells will have under the present circumstances. There is no question that he is obligated to work for the New York Jets as the head coach or not anywhere else in the National Football League.

" ON BELICHICK'S RESIGNATION: "The turmoil you witnessed today can only be driven by Bill's concern for his family and himself, not the contract. We should have some feelings of sorrow and regret for him and his family. He obviously has some inner turmoil.

" ON THE JETS' FUTURE: "(The Jets' interests cannot) be compromised by the fact that Bill was in the turmoil that he was in.

 

 

******************************************************************************************************

 

PRO FOOTBALL; Gutman Has Seen It All, and Then Some

Since 1977, Steve Gutman had been through all those bizarre Jets moments, including Walt Michaels screaming over the telephone at someone he thought was Al Davis and the players' strike when picketers spit at Mark Gastineau.

Add today to that list.

Gutman, president of the Jets, was waiting at the team's offices for a 2:30 p.m. news conference during which Bill Belichick would ascend the podium as the team's latest head coach. The assistant coach, known as the best defensive mind in football, was the hand-picked successor to Bill Parcells, who had resigned on Monday. But five minutes before the news conference was scheduled to begin, Belichick said he had to see Gutman first.

In Gutman's office, Belichick handed the team president a piece of paper on which he had written his brief resignation note. Belichick then went to the auditorium that held about half the crowd that had turned out for Parcells's resignation announcement the previous day.

Gutman watched without expression as Belichick listed his reasons for not taking the head-coaching job and implied that his contract, which has him signed with the Jets in some capacity for the next three years, might be invalid because the team owner, Leon Hess, had died.

Gutman shook Belichick's hand when the coach left the podium.

''Obviously I'm very surprised and disappointed,'' Gutman said after Belichick left.

But Gutman also said that the contract, which calls for Belichick to succeed Parcells, had been modified ''at least five times'' since Belichick signed it in 1997.

Gutman claimed the contract covered ownership changes, head-coaching responsibilities and Parcells's noncoaching duties. According to him, the ''contracts are unambiguous.''

Of the resignation, Gutman said: ''It will have an incalculable effect. I think we listened for an hour and a half to someone in turmoil.''

Belichick said he had written his note after spending an hour on a treadmill. He had been exercising alongside Kevin Williams, a Jets defensive back who had been hospitalized after a serious infection during the season. Williams had undergone three surgical procedures.

Belichick described his feelings being next to Williams, of looking out at the practice field, as solidifying his desire to quit.

The coach said he then wrote out his resignation letter in longhand. ''I don't know how to use a computer,'' he said.

Gutman later read the note in its entirety, using the abbreviated letters -- like H.C. for head coach -- Belichick had used.

Had Gutman experienced anything like this before? ''This doesn't remind me of anything that has happened to me in my life,'' he said. ''If it had, I wouldn't be here now.''

[Bleedin Green]

While Belichick clearly has a great despise for the Jets, and there have been numerous pieces of evidence of that, I don't really think the lack of a trade is any part of that.  Intra-divisional trades almost never happen in the NFL, and frankly it's extremely doubtful we'd be happy of any results if the Jets had one in the past with the Pats.  Consider that in the ones with Dolphins and Bills, neither really worked out for the other team.  The Dolphins trade was really just a matter of the Pats swiping Welker from them as an RFA.  It only went through as a trade because the Pats offered to give the Dolphins another pick to keep them from having to give the bloated contract to Welker that the Dolphins couldn't match.  In the case of the Bills, they got a 1st back for Bledsoe which did not work out so well for the Bills, although he's still probably the best they've had at the position since Kelly.

As far as Belichick's hatred of the Jets, he probably could not care less about Woody.  He had years with this team before that, and Woody wasn't even the owner yet when Belichick left.  Quite frankly, despite Belichick's ongoing bitterness, there's probably not a single thing remaining with the Jets that has anything to do with him when he was here.  Of course, some things that went on with Mangini and Rex certainly helped to keep him hating this team.  It's probably not such a surprise that it doesn't seem to be nearly as constant hate these days, now that the likes of Bowles and Macc are hardly stirring things up either.

[roscoeword]

20 hours ago, 20andOut said:

Everybody seems to completely forget this! In 1997 the Jets hired Belichick as Head Coach. Then when Parcells split with NE the Jets hired him in a consulting roll. New England filed a grievance, because he quit under contract and it was all negotiated by the Commissioner. In the end Jets paid compensation to NE to allow Parcells to coach. End result Belichick was demoted to Def Coordinator right after signing on to be head coach. That would piss me off too!

Finally a voice of reason

[roscoeword]

during Mangini's first and second year, there was animosity between them since Mangini came from over there etc, exposed there spying tactics.. But sorry, all of this character assassination of Bellichick, Brady and Kraft is sour grapes and sounds petty.

[Jets1214]

40 minutes ago, roscoeword said:

Finally a voice of reason

Again...that is NOT how it happened.  BB was a PART of the scheme to get Parcells here as HC from the beginning.  BB being named HC first was a way to bring in Parcells as something other then HC since he was still under contract to NE.  Thus the "consultant" title. The plan was to negotiate Tuna away from NE, make him HC, make BB the DC and then BB was going to be named HC after 2 or 3 years when Tuna would become full time GM.  THAT was the plan from day 1 and BB was not only aware of it he was complicit in it.  He was NOT a hot HC candidate at that point after failing in Cle and he saw this as his best route back to a HC job.  So the idea that he was somehow "surprised" by his "demotion to DC" when Tuna was hired is absolutely, 100% false.  Think about it.  If it happened the way you think, WHY would he then sign a contract essentially locking him into the Jets DC job until Tuna retired?  Wouldn't he have wanted to get as far away from the organization that supposedly just duped and demoted him? It makes no sense.

Is there sour grapes by Jets fan over BB?  Of course there is!  The Pats have won 5 SBs and we still stink!  But that doesn't change the fact that BB was a part of the scheme, took 1MM dollars to continue the grand plan, and then broke his contract (which is why we got a #1 for him) and bolted anyway.  It was ALL in his contract with the Jets so there were no surprises and BB was no victim.

[joewilly12]

Maybe Woody stole the girl BB really wanted. 

[#27TheDominator]

Most of the points were covered, but I think that BB always had a good relationship with Kraft and in NE there are ton of people who claim he took issue with the way Parcells left.  In particular, the fact Parcells was supposedly making the deal on the plane on the way to the super bowl.  Pats fans will swear that is the only reason they lost to Favre.  Never mind the fact that Favre threw for the same amount as Bledsoe in half the attempts, that Dorsey Levens outrushed the compiler or that they let a returner be super bowl MVP.  Parcells was making phone calls from the plane, that is why they lost!

[Jets1214]

5 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Most of the points were covered, but I think that BB always had a good relationship with Kraft and in NE there are ton of people who claim he took issue with the way Parcells left.  In particular, the fact Parcells was supposedly making the deal on the plane on the way to the super bowl.  Pats fans will swear that is the only reason they lost to Favre.  Never mind the fact that Favre threw for the same amount as Bledsoe in half the attempts, that Dorsey Levens outrushed the compiler or that they let a returner be super bowl MVP.  Parcells was making phone calls from the plane, that is why they lost!

BB may very well have had a good relationship with Kraft, but Kraft was not considering BB as a replacement for Tuna (Kraft has even admitted that)...no one was really looking at BB as a HC at that point.  That's why he left for the Jets with Tuna...so he'd have another HC shot in 2 or 3 years.

As to Tuna's actions during the SB...they were deplorable. But thats who Tuna was.  He hated Kraft and wanted out and did what he could to get out.  Now is that WHY the Pats lost to GB?  I highly doubt it.  GB was a better team with a better QB.  

But BB could not have been too upset with what Parcells did because he was right there with Tuna, Hess and Gutman when they concocted this scheme to get Tuna to NY.

[nyjets782]

35 minutes ago, roscoeword said:

Finally a voice of reason

Never let the facts get in the way of making yourself look uninformed.