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will the Jets keep 4 QB's going into week 1 or will Garrard or Mcelboy be dropped?


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#51 Jetsfan80

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 09:46 PM

Someone is getting cut.

 

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#52 CrazyCarl40

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 09:48 PM

17 million reasons Sanchez doesn't get cut. Come on guys. Woody doesn't have the scrotal capacity for that. None.
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#53 SenorGato

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 10:10 PM

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#54 stugotz81

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 10:11 PM

And going into a season with Sanchez as the starter isn't (a recipe for disaster)?  

 

Sanchez is the best chance to win games?  In what pinochle?  monopoly?  It certainly isn't football, at least not in this dimension.

Even if it is a recipe for disaster, he may be the most "ready" to start over Garrad and Geno.  And at this point with Sanchez it will probably play out as a sink or swim kinda thing.  He is either gonna go out there and do well and start to win back the trust of fans and his team..or he is gonna go out there and stink it up again and get benched for the next best guy...probably at that point, Geno.  


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#55 SenorGato

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 10:11 PM

Marty Mornhinweg will get Sanchez to do something. 


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#56 Jetsfan80

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 10:13 PM

Even if it is a recipe for disaster, he may be the most "ready" to start over Garrad and Geno.  And at this point with Sanchez it will probably play out as a sink or swim kinda thing.  He is either gonna go out there and do well and start to win back the trust of fans and his team..or he is gonna go out there and stink it up again and get benched for the next best guy...probably at that point, Geno.  

 

Nope, he won't, and everyone knows it.


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#57 Integrity28

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 10:29 PM

Someone is getting cut.

 

 

I knew, in time, we'd come to agree upon something.


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#58 TechJet

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 10:47 PM

Garrard, Smith and Mcelroy or Simms will be the only 3 on the roster for the start of the season. Bank.

I second the motion


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#59 JoeKlecko

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 10:36 AM

There's no system out there that can make Sanchez look good, none.  Normally you mold the system to fit the QB's strengths.  Sanchez has no strengths.  He can't do anything a QB needs to do.  He's worthless.

 

I know this is common knowledge but there's still people out there who think this guy can be serviceable.  He's not capable of doing so, even if one of the Harbaughs coached him.

 

You won't get any argument from me on this.  I was NEVER a fan of Sanchez.  I thought drafting him was a mistake, much less trading up to get him.  Of course, once he was drafted, I hoped for the best, but knew with the morons they had coaching and teaching him, his chances of success were nil.  He needs to go.

 

I don't blame Mark really.  He can't help it that he doesn't have the talent or right kind of "smarts" to be a successful NFL QB.  He can't help it that the Jets trade up to get him or that he was saddled with such awful coaching in Cavanaugh, Schitthebedenheimer, Sparano and Rex.  I feel sorry for him, but he needs to go.


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#60 JoeKlecko

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 10:46 AM

Even if it is a recipe for disaster, he may be the most "ready" to start over Garrad and Geno.  And at this point with Sanchez it will probably play out as a sink or swim kinda thing.  He is either gonna go out there and do well and start to win back the trust of fans and his team..or he is gonna go out there and stink it up again and get benched for the next best guy...probably at that point, Geno.  

 

I understand how he could be more "ready" to start than Geno, since Geno is a rookie, has to learn the nuances of playing in an NFL type system, playing under center, adjusting to the speed of the game, the complexities of pro defenses, etc., but just how would he be more ready than Garrard, because Garrard didn't play last year?  Garrard's health?  Sorry, but I don't get that one.  Sanchez is awful, and totally a bad fit for the WCO, perhaps moreso than any other offensive system.

 

If he's still on the roster, it's because of his contract, or a miracle of Biblical proportions has occurred and he suddenly has developed real talent and football intelligence.  


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#61 stugotz81

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 12:52 PM

I understand how he could be more "ready" to start than Geno, since Geno is a rookie, has to learn the nuances of playing in an NFL type system, playing under center, adjusting to the speed of the game, the complexities of pro defenses, etc., but just how would he be more ready than Garrard, because Garrard didn't play last year?  Garrard's health?  Sorry, but I don't get that one.  Sanchez is awful, and totally a bad fit for the WCO, perhaps moreso than any other offensive system.

 

If he's still on the roster, it's because of his contract, or a miracle of Biblical proportions has occurred and he suddenly has developed real talent and football intelligence.  

Yes, because he didn't play last year and because he didn't play with the Jets last year so he wont be as familiar with Mangolds sac as Sanchez is.  If Garrad has a bad opening game week 1, he will be boo'd out the stadium by week 2 as being an old washed up QB who has no place on this roster as a starting QB.  If Garrad comes in to replace Sanchez, then anything we get out of Garrad will be sufficient until Geno goes in. So there is a big big difference in starting Garrad week 1 rather than Sanchez. And if we had to bench Garrad....and then we bring in Sanchez over Geno there will be riots in the stadium I guarantee you. So clearly the best option is to let Sanchez go out there week 1...let him fry himself the first few weeks then let Garrad come in till Geno is ready to take over. 


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#62 JoeKlecko

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 01:16 PM

Yes, because he didn't play last year and because he didn't play with the Jets last year so he wont be as familiar with Mangolds sac as Sanchez is.  If Garrad has a bad opening game week 1, he will be boo'd out the stadium by week 2 as being an old washed up QB who has no place on this roster as a starting QB.  If Garrad comes in to replace Sanchez, then anything we get out of Garrad will be sufficient until Geno goes in. So there is a big big difference in starting Garrad week 1 rather than Sanchez. And if we had to bench Garrad....and then we bring in Sanchez over Geno there will be riots in the stadium I guarantee you. So clearly the best option is to let Sanchez go out there week 1...let him fry himself the first few weeks then let Garrad come in till Geno is ready to take over. 

 

I totally disagree.  Just because he didn't play during the season last year, doesn't mean that he has forgotten how to play football or how to take a snap from center.  That's totally absurd.  Nor will Garrard be booed out of the stadium if he has a bad game in game 1.  Again, that's totally ridiculous!  What's the alternative?  Sanchez?  Roflmao!!!  Smith?  McElroy?  Simms?  Please.  

 

You wanna talk about someone getting booed out of the Stadium?  If Sanchez goes out there as the starter in game 1, both he and Rex will get booed out of the stadium.  Sanchez should never see the playing field as a Jet again.  He shouldn't even be on the team coming out of TC.

 

If you're right and there are riots and/or Garrard starts and gets booed out of the Stadium, then that just shows how drunk or how stupid (or both) many Jets fans can be.  We ALL know how true that can be.  We've seen it at the Draft when they boo players selected, we've seen it at games, where they leave early, and posting on Jets boards with insane ideas of players, draft picks and moves they want the Jets to make.


Edited by JoeKlecko, 08 May 2013 - 01:18 PM.

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#63 stugotz81

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 02:13 PM

I totally disagree.  Just because he didn't play during the season last year, doesn't mean that he has forgotten how to play football or how to take a snap from center.  That's totally absurd.  Nor will Garrard be booed out of the stadium if he has a bad game in game 1.  Again, that's totally ridiculous!  What's the alternative?  Sanchez?  Roflmao!!!  Smith?  McElroy?  Simms?  Please.  

 

You wanna talk about someone getting booed out of the Stadium?  If Sanchez goes out there as the starter in game 1, both he and Rex will get booed out of the stadium.  Sanchez should never see the playing field as a Jet again.  He shouldn't even be on the team coming out of TC.

 

If you're right and there are riots and/or Garrard starts and gets booed out of the Stadium, then that just shows how drunk or how stupid (or both) many Jets fans can be.  We ALL know how true that can be.  We've seen it at the Draft when they boo players selected, we've seen it at games, where they leave early, and posting on Jets boards with insane ideas of players, draft picks and moves they want the Jets to make.

I disagree.  If Garrad had hopes of being our future then i can see them putting him out there week 1, but he doesn't.  He is this years mark brunell and thats it.  He will sub in for sanchez when he blows it and from there he will just be filling the QB spot till Geno is ready... but Garrad aint starting in week 1.  Garrad is not our future and a bad game from a QB who is not our future will not be tolerated by fans/media/Jets. Sanchez, who is also not our future...we don't have much choice with bc so much has been invested in this loser they're gonna try n get their moneys worth before they completely sht can him

 

McElroy blows and Sims blows more so help me God if either of them are out there week 1.  

 

And you keep forgetting something buddy...the Jets have millions invested in Sanchez, MILLIONS!!!  They're not gonna let him ride the bench this year for Garrad just to release him at the end of the season. Maybe for Geno, but not Garrad.  They are gonna put him out there so they can make 100% sure they really blew there money on a QB before they just let him go.  

 

And say Sanchez does go out there and stinks it up week 1 and 2 and maybe 3.. then here comes Garrad till Geno is ready.. which is fine by me.  But there gonna give Sanchez at least the first 2 games whether YOU like it or not.  Possibly from there I can see Garrad taking control until they feel Geno is ready, maybe week 8-10...who knows...depends on how well they're doing with Garrad.

 

fyi--I don't drink and I'm far from stupid...when I boo the Jets...99.9% of the time they deserve it


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#64 #27TheDominator

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 04:41 PM

I don't understand this "money's worth" argument.  They are paying these guys either way. The way to get their money's worth is to get the best performance.  The Jets have invested millions in Sanchez, but what do they get for playing him?  Not a discount.  The Seahawks paid Matt Flynn plenty, but they benched him for Wilson and the Jets should do the same.  For Smith or Garrard.  Whoever is playing better should play.  There may be something to letting Geno sit a bit, but the other two stiffs should fight it out and whoever sucks least wins!


Edited by #27TheDominator, 08 May 2013 - 04:41 PM.

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#65 JoeKlecko

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 09:45 PM

I disagree.  If Garrad had hopes of being our future then i can see them putting him out there week 1, but he doesn't.  He is this years mark brunell and thats it.  He will sub in for sanchez when he blows it and from there he will just be filling the QB spot till Geno is ready... but Garrad aint starting in week 1.  Garrad is not our future and a bad game from a QB who is not our future will not be tolerated by fans/media/Jets. Sanchez, who is also not our future...we don't have much choice with bc so much has been invested in this loser they're gonna try n get their moneys worth before they completely sht can him

 

McElroy blows and Sims blows more so help me God if either of them are out there week 1.  

 

And you keep forgetting something buddy...the Jets have millions invested in Sanchez, MILLIONS!!!  They're not gonna let him ride the bench this year for Garrad just to release him at the end of the season. Maybe for Geno, but not Garrad.  They are gonna put him out there so they can make 100% sure they really blew there money on a QB before they just let him go.  

 

And say Sanchez does go out there and stinks it up week 1 and 2 and maybe 3.. then here comes Garrad till Geno is ready.. which is fine by me.  But there gonna give Sanchez at least the first 2 games whether YOU like it or not.  Possibly from there I can see Garrad taking control until they feel Geno is ready, maybe week 8-10...who knows...depends on how well they're doing with Garrad.

 

fyi--I don't drink and I'm far from stupid...when I boo the Jets...99.9% of the time they deserve it

 

Sanchez may very well begin the season as the starter, but if he does, it's because Woody either orders that to be the case, or because Rex has a Woody for Sanchez.  It sure won't be because Sanchez is the best QB or because Garrard has forgotten how to play.  If they go with who plays best and gives the team the best chance to win, the starter will be either Garrard or Smith.

 

Unless Smith pans out and is ready to start or they just decide to go with him to see what he can do and let him learn while playing, the Jets don't have their QB of the future on the roster, so it won't really matter who starts from that perspective. Even if Smith proves to be the answer at QB, a strong case can be made for not starting him immediately.  Therefore, I believe that who the future is at QB is completely irrelevant, because we know that barring a miracle of Biblical proportions, that won't be Sanchez..  It won't be Garrard either because of his age and his limitations.  As you say, neither McElroy and Sims are the answer, so the only possibly QB who can be their future is Smith, and if he's not ready to start game 1, then whoever does start will just be a stopgap starter until Smith is ready.

 

Since Woody is a clueless doofus, you're probably right that he won't cut Sanchez because of what he owes him. A good owner, one who knows the game, has pride in his team and really wants to win, wouldn't allow that to be a factor.  In fact, he probably wouldn't be in this mess, because he never would have let his GM give Sanchez that big extension.

 

I didn't say or imply that you were stupid.  I'm sorry if you thought I did.  You said fans at the stadium without mentioning how you would think/feel about it, and so I rightfully thought you were talking about others, not yourself.  I never even considered including you in that category.  I haven't been around this site very long, but have been around long enough to think that you are a knowledgeable fan.

 

The Jets HAVE deserved to be booed a lot.  At the end of last season, I had had it with the Jets and their stupidity.  I had been a fan since 1964 and was done.  I never thought Woody would fire Tanny, and had little reason or hope to think that things would get any better as long as Woody owned the team.  So believe me, I don't have a problem with Jets fans booing the franchise or Woody.  For much of their history, they've deserved being laughed at, ridiculed, scorned and booed.  What does bother me is when the team makes a rare good move and then some knuckleheads boo.

 

We all have opinions on what we think the team should do and how they should fix their problems, and that's what makes these Jets' sites interesting.  Many, if not most, ideas have at least some merit and some connection with reality, but not all ideas are equal I've seen and heard a lot of ideas over the years that had NO basic connection with football facts or reality.  Some fans just aren't very knowledgeable.  Again, I'm NOT saying that you're one of those fans


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#66 stugotz81

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 10:26 PM

Sanchez may very well begin the season as the starter, but if he does, it's because Woody either orders that to be the case, or because Rex has a Woody for Sanchez.  It sure won't be because Sanchez is the best QB or because Garrard has forgotten how to play.  If they go with who plays best and gives the team the best chance to win, the starter will be either Garrard or Smith.

 

Unless Smith pans out and is ready to start or they just decide to go with him to see what he can do and let him learn while playing, the Jets don't have their QB of the future on the roster, so it won't really matter who starts from that perspective. Even if Smith proves to be the answer at QB, a strong case can be made for not starting him immediately.  Therefore, I believe that who the future is at QB is completely irrelevant, because we know that barring a miracle of Biblical proportions, that won't be Sanchez..  It won't be Garrard either because of his age and his limitations.  As you say, neither McElroy and Sims are the answer, so the only possibly QB who can be their future is Smith, and if he's not ready to start game 1, then whoever does start will just be a stopgap starter until Smith is ready.

 

Since Woody is a clueless doofus, you're probably right that he won't cut Sanchez because of what he owes him. A good owner, one who knows the game, has pride in his team and really wants to win, wouldn't allow that to be a factor.  In fact, he probably wouldn't be in this mess, because he never would have let his GM give Sanchez that big extension.

 

I didn't say or imply that you were stupid.  I'm sorry if you thought I did.  You said fans at the stadium without mentioning how you would think/feel about it, and so I rightfully thought you were talking about others, not yourself.  I never even considered including you in that category.  I haven't been around this site very long, but have been around long enough to think that you are a knowledgeable fan.

 

The Jets HAVE deserved to be booed a lot.  At the end of last season, I had had it with the Jets and their stupidity.  I had been a fan since 1964 and was done.  I never thought Woody would fire Tanny, and had little reason or hope to think that things would get any better as long as Woody owned the team.  So believe me, I don't have a problem with Jets fans booing the franchise or Woody.  For much of their history, they've deserved being laughed at, ridiculed, scorned and booed.  What does bother me is when the team makes a rare good move and then some knuckleheads boo.

 

We all have opinions on what we think the team should do and how they should fix their problems, and that's what makes these Jets' sites interesting.  Many, if not most, ideas have at least some merit and some connection with reality, but not all ideas are equal I've seen and heard a lot of ideas over the years that had NO basic connection with football facts or reality.  Some fans just aren't very knowledgeable.  Again, I'm NOT saying that you're one of those fans

No apology necessary, my friend..i was just busting your chops a little.... And you make many valid points and we both agree here that Geno is the future... so really anything that happens between now and then is like you said, a stopgap.  I guess we will have to see how it plays out over training camp but ultimately it will be interesting to see how Rex handles this QB situation as the season begins and progresses.  Go jets!


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#67 SayNoToDMC

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 11:26 PM

Week 1 should be

1-Sanchez
2-Geno
3-McElroy

Garrard has always been a bum and now hasn't played in 2 years.
Simms has to be listed on roster as favor to father, I don't even count him.

 

 

Interesting take. We're doing a former Giants QB favor and dropping the most talented QB on the roster


Edited by SayNoToDMC, 08 May 2013 - 11:27 PM.

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#68 Sperm Edwards

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 07:42 AM

So the argument I've seen for using Sanchez over Garrard, even if Garrard wins the job on merit, is:

 

(a) don't want Geno Smith to be forced into starting;

(b) Sanchez is less likely to be forced from the starting role because he's less likely to get injured.  Even if he sucks Rex can keep him in there all season, but with a more injury-prone Garrard, Smith may be forced in there too early;

(c) Concern over Garrard getting hurt (and thus forcing Smith onto the field prematurely) can't be solved by having a trio of 1. Garrard, 2. Sanchez, 3. Smith, because fans would be very angry if Sanchez is brought in as #2 ahead of Smith.

 

They're going to be very angry if Sanchez is out there game 1, so I see little to be concerned about.  And if Garrard gets hurt and Sanchez is next in line, Rex can easily get out there and say Smith has looked really good in practice blah blah blah but he isn't ready to start yet.  If he can say all the glowing things he's said about Sanchez for the past 4 years, he can do it again for another half-season if needed in 2013.

 

I don't want Sanchez on the team but I'm really not very concerned with Smith learning bad things from Sanchez.  Of all the things he sees Sanchez do, he'll see him suck badly on the field, and see how he deals with pressure after the ball is snapped, and say to himself he's emulating anything this guy does.  If Smith isn't able to pick up on that much, then he's not too perceptive anyway and we still need to draft a QB.

 

If Sanchez loses to Garrard and McElroy can't beat out Sanchez, then the rest of the team needs to see performance rewarded and failure have its consequences.  And in that instance, which seems likely to me, the pecking order should be Garrard then Sanchez then Smith.  McElroy gets cut, and Simms QBs the practice squad.  If McElroy is eligible for the practice squad (was he on the active roster for less than 6 games?) then maybe he gets that job over Simms but that's it.  

 

We don't have 4 QBs worth holding onto; you do that MAYBE if you have two guys who are neck & neck for the #3 job and you feel one of them can be the team's long-term solution as the #2 guy (which is what the Jets have done in the recent past since they knew at 40 yeards old Brunell wasn't their long-term #2 QB).  Even then it's probably stupid.  It isn't that hard to draft another upgrade from McElroy or Simms in an upcoming draft if they chose poorly between the two on final cut-down day. 


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#69 Bleedin Green

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:44 AM

So the argument I've seen for using Sanchez over Garrard, even if Garrard wins the job on merit, is:

 

(a) don't want Geno Smith to be forced into starting;

(b) Sanchez is less likely to be forced from the starting role because he's less likely to get injured.  Even if he sucks Rex can keep him in there all season, but with a more injury-prone Garrard, Smith may be forced in there too early;

(c) Concern over Garrard getting hurt (and thus forcing Smith onto the field prematurely) can't be solved by having a trio of 1. Garrard, 2. Sanchez, 3. Smith, because fans would be very angry if Sanchez is brought in as #2 ahead of Smith.

 

They're going to be very angry if Sanchez is out there game 1, so I see little to be concerned about.  And if Garrard gets hurt and Sanchez is next in line, Rex can easily get out there and say Smith has looked really good in practice blah blah blah but he isn't ready to start yet.  If he can say all the glowing things he's said about Sanchez for the past 4 years, he can do it again for another half-season if needed in 2013.

 

I don't want Sanchez on the team but I'm really not very concerned with Smith learning bad things from Sanchez.  Of all the things he sees Sanchez do, he'll see him suck badly on the field, and see how he deals with pressure after the ball is snapped, and say to himself he's emulating anything this guy does.  If Smith isn't able to pick up on that much, then he's not too perceptive anyway and we still need to draft a QB.

 

If Sanchez loses to Garrard and McElroy can't beat out Sanchez, then the rest of the team needs to see performance rewarded and failure have its consequences.  And in that instance, which seems likely to me, the pecking order should be Garrard then Sanchez then Smith.  McElroy gets cut, and Simms QBs the practice squad.  If McElroy is eligible for the practice squad (was he on the active roster for less than 6 games?) then maybe he gets that job over Simms but that's it.  

 

We don't have 4 QBs worth holding onto; you do that MAYBE if you have two guys who are neck & neck for the #3 job and you feel one of them can be the team's long-term solution as the #2 guy (which is what the Jets have done in the recent past since they knew at 40 yeards old Brunell wasn't their long-term #2 QB).  Even then it's probably stupid.  It isn't that hard to draft another upgrade from McElroy or Simms in an upcoming draft if they chose poorly between the two on final cut-down day. 

 

Agree with all of this, with the only thing being I'd bet on McElroy grabbing the PS spot, with the idea of him moving back into the #3 role next year if they don't end up drafting anyone else.  I'm pretty sure he's still PS eligible as he was on IR his entire rookie year and, if I'm not mistaken, that Arizona game he came in during was the first time he was even active in his career.

 

To your original point, the only reason Sanchez is still being kept around is insurance.  Insurance in case Garrard doesn't stay healthy AND the team is convinced Smith needs more time.  Only if both of those things happen does Sanchez have any chance of starting for this team.  That's also assuming that neither of McElroy or Simms manage to wrestle away a roster spot from Sanchez (although I wouldn't bet on that happening).


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#70 bitonti

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 11:01 AM

 To your original point, the only reason Sanchez is still being kept around is insurance.  Insurance in case Garrard doesn't stay healthy AND the team is convinced Smith needs more time.  Only if both of those things happen does Sanchez have any chance of starting for this team.  

 

Garrard hasn't played since 2010 and Geno doesn't know how to take a snap from under center.

 

Sanchez starting is actually the most likely outcome, if we are being honest with ourselves.  


Edited by bitonti, 09 May 2013 - 11:01 AM.

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#71 Bleedin Green

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 11:22 AM

Garrard hasn't played since 2010 and Geno doesn't know how to take a snap from under center.

 

Sanchez starting is actually the most likely outcome, if we are being honest with ourselves.  

 

We'll see, but for now we'll have to agree to disagree.  I think you have far too much faith in Idzik wanting anything to do with the worst of Tanny's worst (e.g., Sanchez, Vlad).  If anything, I think he'd be more than happy to send these guys packing if the rest of their competition does their part to make him feel confident enough.  Garrard's whole purpose for being here to begin with is so that the Jets' don't have to start Sanchez again unless they absolutely have to.  He'll be given every last possible chance to be this team's starter and considering the fact that all reports said he was by far the Dolphins' best QB in camp last year, I don't think it's that crazy to think that, health permitting, he'll succeed.


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#72 bitonti

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 12:28 PM

  I don't think it's that crazy to think that, health permitting, he'll succeed.

 

his health hasn't permitted for 3 seasons. btw I can agree that Garrard is the best QB on the roster but he's probably gonna get hurt. That's what he does. 


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#73 GandWFan

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 12:44 PM

Like LaRon Landry last season, Garrard is going to prove all of the naysayers wrong.  He is fully healed from the knee and the back.  He is good to go, and will win the job.  He is, by far, the best choice to start Week 1.


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#74 pointman

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 12:52 PM

Question. No way to get Sanchez to restructure in some fashion? Is the limiting factor that if we do, it would somehow extend him? We've gotten Holmes, someone I thought would be the last to agree to restructure. Is Sanchez impossible to redo so the hit is slightly better?


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#75 pointman

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Posted 09 May 2013 - 12:53 PM

Like LaRon Landry last season, Garrard is going to prove all of the naysayers wrong.  He is fully healed from the knee and the back.  He is good to go, and will win the job.  He is, by far, the best choice to start Week 1.

When did Garrard become so good?


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