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Anyone still think Aaron Rodgers is GOAT?

TuscanyTile2

By TuscanyTile2
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legler82

legler82

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

just to clarify, they were 10-5 in games cassell started in 2008.  they went UNDEFEATED the year before against a MUCH tougher schedule.  5 more losses is a HUGE difference.  we'll be 0-16 if we lost 5 more next year, NE will 9-7.  it's awesome they had a nice record BUT they couldn't even get to the playoffs w/ talent Brady was 16-0 w/ against an easier sched.  this year they were 3-1, 2-0 w/ a highly though of 2nd rd pick against a soft sched.  

the bottom line is this, in his NE career he is under .500 w/ QBs other than Brady starting, for his entire career he is well under .500 w/ QBs other than Brady starting and he has just ONE playoff app and ONE playoff win w/o him which was a WC game at home which would be a road game today w/ the different playoff format.  

what would Brady in HS and college have to do w/ BB in the NFL as a HC? when you start throwinf silly things like that out you know you have lost.

 

where did I say it was ALL Brady? BB is a great coach but he'd be a DC somewhere today if it wasn't for Brady saving his HC career.

Brady in HS and college has as much to do about BB in the NFL as

  • "...they were 10-5 in games cassell started in 2008"
  • "...we'll be 0-16 if we lost 5 more next year..."
  • "...it's awesome they had a nice record BUT they couldn't even get to the playoffs"
  • "...this year they were 3-1, 2-0 w/ a highly though of 2nd rd pick against a soft sched"

None of it is really relevant except in your mind.  That said, I'm LMAO at managing to win 10 games with Matt "*******" Cassell as being an indictment on BB's coaching and the implication that 2-0 is not really all that impressive when you consider it was with "a highly though of 2nd rd pick".  Based on this logic, I'm guessing that if BB had "a highly though of 2nd rd pick" in 08, he could have gone undefeated again.  I'm also guessing that Geno was NOT "a highly though [enough] 2nd rd pick" as we can't seem to win sh*t with him.  SMH...You're a funny guy.  Go ahead man you won as I had already lost the second I responded initially.  

 

 

 

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nyjunc

nyjunc

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3 minutes ago, legler82 said:

Brady in HS and college has as much to do about BB in the NFL as

  • "...they were 10-5 in games cassell started in 2008"
  • "...we'll be 0-16 if we lost 5 more next year..."
  • "...it's awesome they had a nice record BUT they couldn't even get to the playoffs"
  • "...this year they were 3-1, 2-0 w/ a highly though of 2nd rd pick against a soft sched"

None of it is really relevant except in your mind.  That said, I'm LMAO at managing to win 10 games with Matt "*******" Cassell as being an indictment on BB's coaching and the implication that 2-0 is not really all that impressive when you consider it was with "a highly though of 2nd rd pick".  Based on this logic, I'm guessing that if BB had "a highly though of 2nd rd pick" in 08, he could have gone undefeated again.  I'm also guessing that Geno was NOT "a highly though [enough] 2nd rd pick" as we can't seem to win sh*t with him.  SMH...You're a funny guy.  Go ahead man you won as I had already lost the second I responded initially.  

 

 

 

so comparing HS and college games is the same as the NFL? you have a unique argument here.  why not bring up Brady's pee wee days next?

 

you do know Matt *******Cassell won a division title with Kansas City, right?

 

the bottom line is BB w/ Brady has been a failure as a HC.  7+ seasons w/ ONE playoff app, ONE playoff win, not even a title game app.  People make fun of rex but Rex's record is much better than BB's is w/o Brady.

 

I know I won, when someone starts bringing up HS and college comparing that to a coach in the NFL then it's a layup. at least present somewhat of a challenge.

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SMC

SMC

Posted
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19 hours ago, PCP63 said:

Ridiculous. Football is a team sport. I guess any QB with a ring is better than Marino? Of course not. Get out of here with that fallacious thinking. 

 

The 1 ring is not the determining factor.  Thus, your Marino point is misplaced.

But when comparing a QB who has 1 ring compared to another QB who has multiple rings, yeah, rings matter.  It's part of the resume.  There is no way Rodgers can be GOAT if other comparable QBs have more rings.

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nyjunc

nyjunc

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7 minutes ago, SMC said:

The 1 ring is not the determining factor.  Thus, your Marino point is misplaced.

But when comparing a QB who has 1 ring compared to another QB who has multiple rings, yeah, rings matter.  It's part of the resume.  There is no way Rodgers can be GOAT if other comparable QBs have more rings.

I think he could make a case if he had a crappy team around him but he has had teams capable of making runs.Marino didn't always have the talent around, Peyton always had the most talented teams in the league and Rodgers has had teams capable of deep runs. 

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SMC

SMC

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My top 10 QBs, based on guys I've seen is (say 1980-present):

1. Brady

2. Montana

3. Marino

4. Peyton

5. Elway

6. Rodgers

7. Young

8. Favre

9. Warner

10. Kelly

As for Brady, it wasn't that he won 5 rings.  It's the body of work plus, this last SB was the icing on the cake.  His performance in the 4th quarter was legendary.  It will be up there with Montana marching the team down the field against the Bengals in SB, Elway's drive against the Browns and Peyton leading the Colts from down 18 against Brady and the Pats in the AFCCG.  The team was down 16 and you had the feeling that Brady couldn't be stopped.

I hate him, the Pats and everything about Boston, but his performance was greatness personified.

As to Rodgers, I can't put him above Elway just yet and it's not just the rings.  Of course, we know, football is a team sport, but Elway in the 1980s was the closest thing to a 1 man show in Denver.  He dragged that team to 3 SBs.  Yes, he lost them all, but to great all-around teams from the NFC.  

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SMC

SMC

Posted
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6 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

I think he could make a case if he had a crappy team around him but he has had teams capable of making runs.Marino didn't always have the talent around, Peyton always had the most talented teams in the league and Rodgers has had teams capable of deep runs. 

That leads right to my point about Elway and why I put him over Rodgers.  Elway did it in the 1980s with crappy teams.

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nyjunc

nyjunc

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2 minutes ago, SMC said:

That leads right to my point about Elway and why I put him over Rodgers.  Elway did it in the 1980s with crappy teams.

he did but then he had outstanding teams that he was able to win SBs with but in the 80s to get to those SBs w/ those teams was a great job.  

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bealeb319

bealeb319

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as long as that day of the week was a meaningless reg season game against a weak AFC South team I might agree with you.  Peyton had more talent around him and his D's allowed less PPG in the playoffs yet Brady has 5 SB titles and Manning has 2 where his D did all the heavy lifting for him.
 
Brady 5 SB wins, led O to 26.2 PPG, his D's allowed 22.4 PPG
Manning 2 SB wins, led O to 19.5 PPG, his D's allowed 10 PPGs
 
In Brady's 2 SB losses he left field late in each game w/ a lead.  In Peyton's 2 SB losses he threw a pick 6 to end one and led a team to 8 garbage time pts in the other.  a team LOADED w/ talent, a year later w/ half the talent Brady led NE to 14 pts in the FOURTH QUARTER and NE beat that same Sea D 28-24 in the SB.
 
PPG in regulation in postseason:
Brady's Ds: 20 PPG
Manning's Ds(Ind, Den): 18.8 PPG
 
I get we all hate Brady but let's not get crazy, Peyton wasn't half the QB Brady is.
 
Rodgers has a CHANCE to get in Brady territory but he has a LONG way to go.


Peyton won his super bowls on two different teams with two different coaching staffs. The only thing that has changed for Brady is the manner in which they cheat.

Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk

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wizwor

wizwor

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On 2/6/2017 at 4:27 PM, PCP63 said:

Ridiculous. Football is a team sport. I guess any QB with a ring is better than Marino? Of course not. Get out of here with that fallacious thinking. 

 

Brady has a lot more than a ring.  He has five of them and four SB MVPs.  We could go on and on, but did you see the fourth quarter of SB 51?

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nyjunc

nyjunc

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12 hours ago, bealeb319 said:

 


Peyton won his super bowls on two different teams with two different coaching staffs. The only thing that has changed for Brady is the manner in which they cheat.

Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk
 

 

maybe Peyton and Indy cheated too?  http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/02/08/nfl-networks-deion-sanders-says-colts-stole-other-teams-signals/

 

BB w/o Brady(7+ seasons): 1 playoff app, 1 playoff win, zero title game apps.  Cleveland 1985-1990 pre BB made the POs 5 times and 3 title games, post BB they won a SB in 2000 as the Ravens.

Dungy w/o Peyton(6 seasons): 4 playoff apps, 2 playoff wins, 1 title game app AND he had taken over the worst franchise in the sport.  1983-1995 TB made zero PO apps, 1996-2001 they made 4.  Post dungy 2002-2016 they have made just 3 PO apps

Fox w/o Peyton(11 seasons): 3 PO apps, made a SB where his team was crushed by Brady in the final minutes.  they lost that SB 32-29, w/ Peyton he lost a SB 43-8.

Kubiak w/o Peyton(9 seasons): 2 PO apps, 2 PO wins

 

so clearly the coaches w/.o Peyton had much more success than BB had w/o Brady.

 

and by the way, Peyton was dragged kicking and screaming to a SB last year.  that was the worst season for a QB for a SB champ ever.

 

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Ex-Rex

Ex-Rex

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On 2/6/2017 at 1:13 PM, Pac said:

my god don't we see enough blowing of Brady in the media?  we gotta bring it here too?

I don't give a flying fu-k who thinks Brady is the bestest ever.  To me he isn't and never will be.

I don't believe there is any such thing as Greatest Of All Time. That is patently ridiculous. Football is a TEAM GAME and Tom Brady did not win five Super Bowls, the Patriots won five SB's with him at QB. That does not make him GOAT, because NO ONE IS.

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nyjunc

nyjunc

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1 hour ago, Ex-Rex said:

I don't believe there is any such thing as Greatest Of All Time. That is patently ridiculous. Football is a TEAM GAME and Tom Brady did not win five Super Bowls, the Patriots won five SB's with him at QB. That does not make him GOAT, because NO ONE IS.

to be able to do what he has done w/ the mostly mediocre talent around him, he's the best I have ever seen.  we have to remember what BB looked like as a coach pre Brady and what NE looked like pre Brady. what he has done is the most amazing thing I have ever seen in sports.

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Hael

Hael

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Peyton doesn't belong in the best ever QB talk.  Guy played in a dome, with the best offenses money can buy for almost his entire career.  He never had half the accuracy, release and playmaking ability Brady/Rogers have.  Instead he had the great ability to read defenses and identify matchup problems with his arsenal of weapons (not unlike Atlanta this year) and then throw easy balls to wide open players.  It worked great, until he hits the playoffs or bad weather, and then when he had to make hard throws he'd eventually crumble.  That's why he had such a playoff dropoff.

He was a great, great QB, but he is not Rogers or Brady who do more with less and don't fold in big games.

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TuscanyTile2

TuscanyTile2

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5 minutes ago, Hael said:

Peyton doesn't belong in the best ever QB talk.  Guy played in a dome, with the best offenses money can buy for almost his entire career.  He never had half the accuracy, release and playmaking ability Brady/Rogers have.  Instead he had the great ability to read defenses and identify matchup problems with his arsenal of weapons (not unlike Atlanta this year) and then throw easy balls to wide open players.  It worked great, until he hits the playoffs or bad weather, and then when he had to make hard throws he'd eventually crumble.  That's why he had such a playoff dropoff.

He was a great, great QB, but he is not Rogers or Brady who do more with less and don't fold in big games.

I recall in 2002 he lost 41-0 to a certain team (in what is STILL that team's most recent home playoff win).

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Smashmouth

Smashmouth

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On ‎2‎/‎6‎/‎2017 at 0:15 PM, Jetsfan80 said:

The GOAT is Joe Montana, followed by Peyton Manning.

And here's 5 reasons why Tom Brady is excluded from the conversation:

1.  *

2.  *

3.  *

4.  *

5.  The next cheating scandal that comes out this offseason.

Peyton Manning the Regular season wonder is not in the conversation of GOAT too many really good playoff QB's out there who performed outstanding when the chips were down Both Peyton Manning and Brett Favre sh*t the bed numerous times in the playoffs yet have amazing numbers. They are not in a league with Montana Brady Bradshaw and maybe even Rothlesberger all money players ...Rodgers plays on a team that has ZERO defense so he ALWAYS has to go out there and put up amazing numbers and that's just too much to handle when you face top defenses through out the playoffs every year. Aaron Rodgers is the best QB I have ever seen he can do things no other QB can do across the board he just does not have a good team to support him.

Also Aaron Rodgers and Tom Brady and possibly Big ben did something Peyton Manning could never do and that's play great under tremendous pressure. Brady is the GOAT when playing under Pressure and no one is even close

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Jetsfan80

Jetsfan80

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4 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

Peyton Manning the Regular season wonder is not in the conversation of GOAT too many really good playoff QB's out there who performed outstanding when the chips were down Both Peyton Manning and Brett Favre sh*t the bed numerous times in the playoffs yet have amazing numbers.

Peyton Manning played with one of the sh*ttiest organizations in the NFL.  Brady had Belichick, Ernie Adams, and cheating.  You're out of your mind. 

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Reynolds1029

Reynolds1029

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Talent wise I think Rodgers is better than Brady. Unlike Brady Rodgers can roll out of the pocket and extend plays and make plays with his feet. Brady with 2 lead feet cant get out of the pocket. If you can get pressure to him he can be beat. BUT Brady at the moment has the rings and most of the records. So right now he his the GOAT but time will tell. I think Rodgers will surpass him he is more talented than Brady hands down.

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TuscanyTile2

TuscanyTile2

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2 hours ago, Reynolds1029 said:

Talent wise I think Rodgers is better than Brady. Unlike Brady Rodgers can roll out of the pocket and extend plays and make plays with his feet. Brady with 2 lead feet cant get out of the pocket. If you can get pressure to him he can be beat. BUT Brady at the moment has the rings and most of the records. So right now he his the GOAT but time will tell. I think Rodgers will surpass him he is more talented than Brady hands down.

As in "win 6 Superbowls"???

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TuscanyTile2

TuscanyTile2

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19 minutes ago, Reynolds1029 said:

 


Ok put it this way.. if Rodgers had Belichick after 16 seasons they would have won at least 5 but probably 7+ super bowls together.

Sent from my SM-G930V using JetNation.com mobile app
 

So he's THAT good but he's only won 1 Superbowl w/ the Packers?  And he's THAT good but he's lost a Superbowl??

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Reynolds1029

Reynolds1029

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So he's THAT good but he's only won 1 Superbowl w/ the Packers?  And he's THAT good but he's lost a Superbowl??


Nobody gives coaches and management enough credit. Tom Brady would never win this many Super Bowls without BB. As much as I hate the Pats BB is the GOAT of coaches so it makes Tom that much better. Now put BB with a guy like Rodgers and they will easily win 7 SBs.

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nyjunc

nyjunc

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22 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

LOL. If Brady was drafted by the Browns he'd be a financial adviser in the Bay Area today.

I don't know if Cle becomes a dynasty but Cle becomes a lot better and wouldn't be a punchline if they drafted Brady and BB would be a DC somewhere today.

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TuscanyTile2

TuscanyTile2

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On 2/10/2017 at 8:54 AM, Reynolds1029 said:

 


Nobody gives coaches and management enough credit. Tom Brady would never win this many Super Bowls without BB. As much as I hate the Pats BB is the GOAT of coaches so it makes Tom that much better. Now put BB with a guy like Rodgers and they will easily win 7 SBs.

Sent from my SM-G930V using JetNation.com mobile app
 

 

(I think I posted this already but either it didn't go through or maybe it got removed?)

He easily wins 7 SBs?!?!  Give me a break!

 

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TuscanyTile2

TuscanyTile2

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23 hours ago, nyjunc said:

I don't know if Cle becomes a dynasty but Cle becomes a lot better and wouldn't be a punchline if they drafted Brady and BB would be a DC somewhere today.

Imagine the Browns did have Brady and somehow didn't win any superbowls.  They would've had Brady and Belichick (at different times) and never won a SB.  Now THAT would've been something!

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