nvot9 Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 Think about this guys. Cutler as a Jet...whether Leinart is availible or not. Cutler has only two flaws, and that is his mechanics and touch. Both of which can be fixed. The Jets have one of the best QB coaches in the league, and one of the most accuract QB's in the NFL who puts the most touch and has the best mechanics of maybe any QB in the entire NFL in Chad Pennington. Don't you think that if Cutler sits a year, that he can learn from Chad and can refine his mechanics from Schotty etc. Also, they have a player EXACTLY like Cutler, who has all the physical gifts, but limited touch, and has been a bust so far in Ramsey. Don't you think that he can show Jay what he did wrong along the way etc. I mean, yea, Leinart is the safe and nice pick, but if we have learned one thing from Herman Edwards' departure and overall mediocre, conservative career with the Jets, it is that maybe safe is not always the best. I mean Leinart had a tremendous line through out his entire career, while Cutler has never even had a decent one, much like the Jets. He can obviously play w/o a line, and imagine him playing with a new, young, rebuilding line? I don't doubt that Leinart has a bright future, but as a Jet fan, I would much rather trade down and get Cutler, EVEN if we coulud take Leinart. I mean imagine what kinds of proposals would be thrown our way just to get Leinart? Some good articles on him http://nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18768 http://nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18689 I'm sorry, but I would honestly have to say that I have fallen in love with Cutler. Do you think we can trade down to get him? Or, would it be too risky because the Raiders might want him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deadringer Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 we can stay put and draft the greatest quarterback ever to put on a tshirt and sneakers...i mean, the way he runs those non contact workouts shows me that he's the real deal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nvot9 Posted April 9, 2006 Author Share Posted April 9, 2006 we can stay put and draft the greatest quarterback ever to put on a tshirt and sneakers...i mean, the way he runs those non contact workouts shows me that he's the real deal... What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormshadow19 Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 That was sarcasm. Welcome to Jetnation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quietjets Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 Think about this guys. Cutler as a Jet...whether Leinart is availible or not. Cutler has only two flaws, and that is his mechanics and touch. Both of which can be fixed. The Jets have one of the best QB coaches in the league, and one of the most accuract QB's in the NFL who puts the most touch and has the best mechanics of maybe any QB in the entire NFL in Chad Pennington. Don't you think that if Cutler sits a year, that he can learn from Chad and can refine his mechanics from Schotty etc. Also, they have a player EXACTLY like Cutler, who has all the physical gifts, but limited touch, and has been a bust so far in Ramsey. Don't you think that he can show Jay what he did wrong along the way etc. I mean, yea, Leinart is the safe and nice pick, but if we have learned one thing from Herman Edwards' departure and overall mediocre, conservative career with the Jets, it is that maybe safe is not always the best. I mean Leinart had a tremendous line through out his entire career, while Cutler has never even had a decent one, much like the Jets. He can obviously play w/o a line, and imagine him playing with a new, young, rebuilding line? I don't doubt that Leinart has a bright future, but as a Jet fan, I would much rather trade down and get Cutler, EVEN if we coulud take Leinart. I mean imagine what kinds of proposals would be thrown our way just to get Leinart? Some good articles on him http://nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18768 http://nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18689 I'm sorry, but I would honestly have to say that I have fallen in love with Cutler. Do you think we can trade down to get him? Or, would it be too risky because the Raiders might want him? I doubt Raiders will draft any qb in the first round because they have Walter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudcat21 Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 The Jets have one of the best QB coaches in the league And just who would that be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deadringer Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 What? simply put, i feel that jay cutler is a human hype machine... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormshadow19 Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 simply put, i feel that jay cutler is a human hype machine... Zeus was the Human Wrecking machine.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deadringer Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 Zeus was the Human Wrecking machine.... and we all remember what happened to him after he messed with the hulkster... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormshadow19 Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 and we all remember what happened to him after he messed with the hulkster... True enough... The lesson learned? Don't f*ck with Hulkamania. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 Pennington has plenty of mechanic problems. He doesnt step into his throws and he doesnt know when to slide in the pocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIGHT STALKER Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 Jay "veal" Cutler will not be wearing a Jets uniform and you can take that to the bank. In fact, we better not be taking a QB in the first round...period. We need line help in the worst way...forget about these QB's this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bman Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 Is Brick 10x's better than an OT you can get later in rd 1? NO... Is Leinert and Cutler MUCH better than rd 2 QBs..YES.. DO NOT DRAFT an OT at 4.... an OT will not get you to a superbowl... But a great QB may. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 Is Brick 10x's better than an OT you can get later in rd 1? NO... Is Leinert and Cutler MUCH better than rd 2 QBs..YES.. DO NOT DRAFT an OT at 4.... an OT will not get you to a superbowl... But a great QB may. You are assuming that leinart and Cutler are going to be great QB's-big assumption to make and if wrong the Jets are screwed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIGHT STALKER Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 Is Brick 10x's better than an OT you can get later in rd 1? NO... Is Leinert and Cutler MUCH better than rd 2 QBs..YES.. DO NOT DRAFT an OT at 4.... an OT will not get you to a superbowl... But a great QB may. And who will protect this high priced prima donna that will be taking snaps for us? The way the line is right now, it's worse than last year. I say build it (the line) and they will come. Why put the cart before the horse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phinsuck Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 You are assuming that leinart and Cutler are going to be great QB's-big assumption to make and if wrong the Jets are screwed And you're assuming there are no other good OT's after D'Brickashaw Ferguson. Marcus McNeill, Darryn Colledge, Andrew Whitworth and Ryan O'Callaghan will all be available at 29 and 35. I would rather take a risk and draft Leinart, Cutler or Young than stay with bums like Patrick Ramsey and Brooks Bollinger. That would be the typical Jets move, pass up a franchise quarterback to get an offensive lineman we could have had at 29 or 35. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 And you're assuming there are no other good OT's after D'Brickashaw Ferguson. Marcus McNeill, Darryn Colledge, Andrew Whitworth and Ryan O'Callaghan will all be available at 29 and 35. I would rather take a risk and draft Leinart, Cutler or Young than stay with bums like Patrick Ramsey and Brooks Bollinger. That would be the typical Jets move, pass up a franchise quarterback to get an offensive lineman we could have had at 29 or 35. We could argue all day with this -the odds are against you if you look at past history of a top pick at QB - look through the league and you actually do not see too many QB's that were very high picks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIGHT STALKER Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 And you're assuming there are no other good OT's after D'Brickashaw Ferguson. Marcus McNeill, Darryn Colledge, Andrew Whitworth and Ryan O'Callaghan will all be available at 29 and 35. I would rather take a risk and draft Leinart, Cutler or Young than stay with bums like Patrick Ramsey and Brooks Bollinger. That would be the typical Jets move, pass up a franchise quarterback to get an offensive lineman we could have had at 29 or 35. D'Brick is the best OT coming out of college in the past decade...are these three QB's looked at in the same way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nvot9 Posted April 10, 2006 Author Share Posted April 10, 2006 I think that a case could be made, that D'Brick is the obvious pick. Didn't Ogden win a championship? Yes. Didn't Pace win a couple? Yes. Didn't Walter Jones make it to the Chip? Yes. And while recent guys like Kyle Boller, J.P. Lossman, Akili Smith, Alex Smith, and Joey Harrington, who have had all of the physical tools and superb arm, but sickening mechanics, less than average accuracy, and lousy touch (hence Jay Cutler) have all panned out...well pathetically. But, the fact of the matter is, D'Brick could very easily, and in fact is excpected to go number 2 and Leinart, number 3, leaving us to pick at the "scraps" of Cutler, Williams, Hawk, and Justice. The thing is, Cutler does not have bad accuracy. He completed 44 of 45 passes, long and short, at his pro-day, in harsh conditions including rain and wind. Also, he adds very nice touch on some of his deep balls, double coverage or not. I don't know, call me a homer, but to me, Cutler will have a bright future working behind a rebuilding line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 I know you guys want to sound tough and like you know about the fundamentals of football but the brutal elitist truth is a franchise qb is more likely to win you a Super Bowl than a franchise lineman. I know guys who played offensive line in college and almost made it to the nfl and even they would agree with me. Who is the franchise offensive lineman on the New England Patriots teams that won 3 Super Bowls? Who is the superstar offensive lineman on the Pittsburgh Steelers Super Bowl squad? I do know that New England has a hall-of-fame qb in Brady and Pittsburgh has an emerging superstar qb in Ben Roethlisberger. Does every first round qb become a superstar? No, but you're odds of finding one there is a lot better than on Day 2 which is what alot of you guys are calling for. There aren't any bust offensive linemen taken Round 1? Robert Gallery and Leonard Pope. Wasn't there an offensive lineman who was taken before Barry Sanders in that draft years ago? Robert Gallery was getting the same great reviews that Ferguson is getting now. Al Davis passed over some excellent players to pick Gallery 2nd overall and the guy can't even hack it at Right Tackle. I am not saying Ferguson will be a bust but if you want to win a Super Bowl a franchise qb will help your chances a lot more. Sorry if you think that sounds shallow or whatever but that is the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greensince69 Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 Sorry Peter, the facts don't support your argument. Most QB's who win the SB are not franchise QBs. Defense and solid line play win SB's. I am not saying I want to draft a QB at 4 or Dbrick at 4. I would rather trade down and get more picks and help the OL NT and LB position. 3 Solid starters ( or even 2 given that one could be a bust) will do this team more good than one hope that makes it over hyped lineman or QB. If it were John Elway or Anthony Munoz there at 4 I may think differently but Lienart, Cutler, or Dbrick are not of that catagory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 I know you guys want to sound tough and like you know about the fundamentals of football but the brutal elitist truth is a franchise qb is more likely to win you a Super Bowl than a franchise lineman. I know guys who played offensive line in college and almost made it to the nfl and even they would agree with me. Who is the franchise offensive lineman on the New England Patriots teams that won 3 Super Bowls? Who is the superstar offensive lineman on the Pittsburgh Steelers Super Bowl squad? I do know that New England has a hall-of-fame qb in Brady and Pittsburgh has an emerging superstar qb in Ben Roethlisberger. Does every first round qb become a superstar? No, but you're odds of finding one there is a lot better than on Day 2 which is what alot of you guys are calling for. There aren't any bust offensive linemen taken Round 1? Robert Gallery and Leonard Pope. Wasn't there an offensive lineman who was taken before Barry Sanders in that draft years ago? Robert Gallery was getting the same great reviews that Ferguson is getting now. Al Davis passed over some excellent players to pick Gallery 2nd overall and the guy can't even hack it at Right Tackle. I am not saying Ferguson will be a bust but if you want to win a Super Bowl a franchise qb will help your chances a lot more. Sorry if you think that sounds shallow or whatever but that is the truth. I dont think anybody would disagree with that, but the people who dont want the Jets to draft Cutler or Leinart over Brick is they think Brick is the safer pick (and he is) - a pick the Jets cannot F up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIGHT STALKER Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 I know you guys want to sound tough and like you know about the fundamentals of football but the brutal elitist truth is a franchise qb is more likely to win you a Super Bowl than a franchise lineman. I know guys who played offensive line in college and almost made it to the nfl and even they would agree with me. Who is the franchise offensive lineman on the New England Patriots teams that won 3 Super Bowls? Who is the superstar offensive lineman on the Pittsburgh Steelers Super Bowl squad? I do know that New England has a hall-of-fame qb in Brady and Pittsburgh has an emerging superstar qb in Ben Roethlisberger. Does every first round qb become a superstar? No, but you're odds of finding one there is a lot better than on Day 2 which is what alot of you guys are calling for. There aren't any bust offensive linemen taken Round 1? Robert Gallery and Leonard Pope. Wasn't there an offensive lineman who was taken before Barry Sanders in that draft years ago? Robert Gallery was getting the same great reviews that Ferguson is getting now. Al Davis passed over some excellent players to pick Gallery 2nd overall and the guy can't even hack it at Right Tackle. I am not saying Ferguson will be a bust but if you want to win a Super Bowl a franchise qb will help your chances a lot more. Sorry if you think that sounds shallow or whatever but that is the truth. I don't know what that opening sentence is supposed to mean about "sounding tough"...it's a freaking football forum with different opinions. Anyway, I'm old enough to know that without an O line, our own Joe Willy is not going to win SB III. That O line back in the late 60's went to **** in a hurry and so did Joe's knees because of that and any chance of getting back to a championship caliber team. So much for a franchise QB. Ask Dilfer if he doesn't have an O line protecting his ass if he wins his bowl? That Raven D helped also, but we're talking O lines here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 I am far from MR. Tough Guy -I just stated the opinion the odds are against a very high draft pick of a QB leading you to a championship. Actually controlling the line of scrimmage in basic terms wins games in the NFL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.I.MikeBleedsGreen Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 JUST draft vince at #4 ,then o-line men with the other picks .And if the line doesn't hold up this kid can make things happen ,you know like 1 downs and touchdowns. If we take a Qb at #4 it should be him ,He gives us the best chance to win the game.WHY? because he can MOVE the other QB's in the draft CUTLER or LIENART can't even get out of their own way.To slow ,bad knee's, no touch etc... vince will put these guys to shame in the NFL. And time will tell all of this!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 If we take a Qb at #4 it should be him ,He gives us the best chance to win the game.WHY? because he can MOVE the other QB's in the draft CUTLER or LIENART can't even get out of their own way.To slow , the truth is that Vince Young ran a 4.6 at his pro day, Cutler ran a 4.7 at his combine workout. You can say either Young isn't all that fast or Cutler is just as fast as Young, either way Vince Young is a hype job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.I.MikeBleedsGreen Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 the truth is that Vince Young ran a 4.6 at his pro day, Cutler ran a 4.7 at his combine workout. You can say either Young isn't all that fast or Cutler is just as fast as Young, either way Vince Young is a hype job.V.y ran 4.6 and Cutler ran 4.7 thats great for cutler,But thats in a striaght line bro!. line men ,LB's will be coming from all angles, and vince can move better than some RB's in this draft, NOT slow a$$ cutler . Cutler will be sacked more than vince in there first year depending on who starts and who doesn't.I'd rather a proven passer ,runner and winner in Young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 V.y ran 4.6 and Cutler ran 4.7 thats great for cutler,But thats in a striaght line bro!. Mike Vick ran a 4.2 and they still caught him and broke his leg. You don't think vince young will get injured? it's not a matter of if but when. Vince can't even carry Vick's luggage in terms of pure athleticism. There's a reason why they don't run the option in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthernJet Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 Mike Vick ran a 4.2 and they still caught him and broke his leg. You don't think vince young will get injured? it's not a matter of if but when. Vince can't even carry Vick's luggage in terms of pure athleticism. There's a reason why they don't run the option in the NFL. classic,, POTW nominee,,Beans this was Funny and factually spot on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 classic,, POTW nominee,,Beans this was Funny and factually spot on thx but if my "blew out my flip flop" post didn't win POTW ill never with that thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 the truth is that Vince Young ran a 4.6 at his pro day, Cutler ran a 4.7 at his combine workout. You can say either Young isn't all that fast or Cutler is just as fast as Young, either way Vince Young is a hype job. That's more of a compliment to Cutler than it is a knock on Young. A lot of starting receivers in the nfl run a 4.6 40. Maurice Stovall runs a 4.6 40. There is also a difference between 40 time and functional quickness in a game which Young definitely has. Just ask Pete Carroll. About the "drafting D'Brick is the safe pick" argument. I thought the Herm-Bradway era of being conservative and playing not to lose was over. Anything worth doing in life is a risk. For every Ryan Leaf or Tim Couch you get a Peyton Manning or Carson Palmer. And it's not like there is no risk in drafting D'Brick. Al Davis would certainly agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 About the "drafting D'Brick is the safe pick" argument. I thought the Herm-Bradway era of being conservative and playing not to lose was over. playing not to lose and drafting not to lose are two different things. All things being equal (and they never are) it's harder to find a franchise LT than a franchise QB _past the first round_ it's a matter of personal preference. If Brick is there i'd personally take him over Cutler and Leinart. But if Brick was gone i'd probably take Cutler. if both are gone i'd take Ngata and if all three are gone i'd take Bush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 playing not to lose and drafting not to lose are two different things. All things being equal (and they never are) it's harder to find a franchise LT than a franchise QB _past the first round_ it's a matter of personal preference. If Brick is there i'd personally take him over Cutler and Leinart. But if Brick was gone i'd probably take Cutler. if both are gone i'd take Ngata and if all three are gone i'd take Bush How many franchise LT's win Super Bowls? Yeah, I know Walter Jones went to a Super Bowl this year but they lost. Ogden won in 2000 with the Ravens. The Pats and Steelers have a lot of good linemen but no franchise players on their O-line. How many franchise qb's win Super Bowls? Brady, Roethlisberger, Elway. That's 6 out of the last 9 Super Bowls. I don't see any potential franchise qb's after Leinart, Young and Cutler in this draft. Jacobs and Whitehurst don't impress me. Croyle is way too injury prone and will have a shortened nfl career. Obviously if you're not willing to take a risk on Vince Young you won't take a risk on Marcus Vick. We have a very good chance of getting a franchise qb with the #4 pick. The Big 3 all look like legit prospects. I could tell Tim Couch was overhyped and Alex Smith was a reach but Young and Cutler are excellent athletes. To take Ferguson over Leinart would be insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 To take Ferguson over Leinart would be insane. jMO to put noodle arm part II in the AFC East is even more insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greensince69 Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 Brady was not a "franchise" QB. Elway is a freak but it took a running game to get him to the SB. Rothi is a functional QB, not a superstar. He was the perfect complimet to Pitts D and power running game. So your past 9 SB's become one. D line and Oline, control the line of scrimmage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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