Bye Week Changes

[Maxman]

What changes would you make to this team after the bye? They are 4 and 4. It could have been much worse. This was the first game that I think they should have won and didn't.

What changes are in order if any?

[Gainzo]

What changes would you make to this team after the bye? They are 4 and 4. It could have been much worse. This was the first game that I think they should have won and didn't.

What changes are in order if any?

Do not play the Pats on November 12th? That would be a good change.

[Maxman]

Do not play the Pats on November 12th? That would be a good change.

You call Mumbles and set it up. We have no problem accepting the forfeit.

[afosomf]

play clemens

[serphnx]

What changes would you make to this team after the bye? They are 4 and 4. It could have been much worse. This was the first game that I think they should have won and didn't.

What changes are in order if any?

I think it's time to put Kellen Clemens in, if this staff really thinks he is the future. I think we've seen about what 1 cent can do for us. The problem is Clemens is a little short, and I think he has happy feet right now, but he is supposed to be able to make all the throws. After seeing 1 cents ducks to close out the game, I've pretty much had it. With the bye week coming up, and the easiest schedule we'll get in years, we should let Clemens make those mistakes now, and just hope he has what it takes.

[Gainzo]

You call Mumbles and set it up. We have no problem accepting the forfeit.

I'll leave that to Garb!

[The Troll]

Scrap the useless ****ing 3-4 base. We just don't have the players.

[DireJet38]

1) Cut out the cute brad smith gimmick...

Either commit to him as a real player on this offense in the wide reciever position or stop running pointless gadget plays...

It doesn't take a mensa mind to realize that when Brad Smith is in the game under center he is going for a draw or handing it off.

2) Watch film of LT...focusing on qb PRESSURE.

3) Let Justin Miller return punts, dwight has good hands, but if miller had gotten the block dwight had gottenhe would've taken it to the house.

[gg]

they need to be consistent... they are so manic... they go from awful to terrific in seconds...

the defense was pathetic for a good portion of the game... and then.... they had some great stops...

chad did not have the best game...

consistent.. the only one who is so.. is graham...

arg i am frustraated!@!!!

[Sperm Edwards]

Get DRob off NT. He clearly can't occupy space or move laterally well enough. Want to try him at DE? Fine. But get him out of the middle.

Give the kid a try at QB. We're not going to the superbowl anyway. Pennington can't hit guys deep unless it's blown coverage & everyone we play knows it. This will not change.

Demote JMac - he's earned it. Standing there instead of using his 6'2 frame to jump for the ball while that floater was in the air is just an instinct that he either has or doesn't - and he doesn't. Give his spot to Smith. At least everyone won't guess the trick play when he's in there every time. Guy's a player.

Trey Teague replacing Moore at RG. Could he really be any worse?

[war ensemble]

3) Let Justin Miller return punts, dwight has good hands, but if miller had gotten the block dwight had gottenhe would've taken it to the house.

That's suicide. Miller can't handle punts. Once he has the ball he's good, but he can't handle it. He muffs too many punts, and I'd rather have Dwight's decent returns than one Miller touchdown and many Miller muffs.

[DireJet38]

That's suicide. Miller can't handle punts. Once he has the ball he's good, but he can't handle it. He muffs too many punts, and I'd rather have Dwight's decent returns than one Miller touchdown and many Miller muffs.

If Mangini is such a 'teacher,' he will work with Miller.

[TheShow]

here it starts, everyone loved to hate chad befor the season, and the season started and everyone loves him again! now 1 bad game and now it's LETS START THE ROOK! wtf? sometimes you guys embarrass me to be a jets fan.

[serphnx]

here it starts, everyone loved to hate chad befor the season, and the season started and everyone loves him again! now 1 bad game and now it's LETS START THE ROOK! wtf? sometimes you guys embarrass me to be a jets fan.

No, it's more like the people that dislike Chad are always here, but the people that support Chad dissappear until he has good games. So when Chad has a bad game, there is no opposition to those of us that have criticisms of him. You should hate on those people. I've said all along I thought Clemens at the half would be a good idea. I've also said that I don't think Chad has the arm and is always injured. The way he was throwing today, he's probably injured again.

[#27TheDominator]

No, it's more like the people that dislike Chad are always here, but the people that support Chad dissappear until he has good games. So when Chad has a bad game, there is no opposition to those of us that have criticisms of him. You should hate on those people. I've said all along I thought Clemens at the half would be a good idea. I've also said that I don't think Chad has the arm and is always injured. The way he was throwing today, he's probably injured again.

I'm here. I support Chad. He had a very bad game. Am I supposed to lie and say he didn't? I don't see any reason to annoint Clemens as the QB of the future at this point. If he's been showing something in practice or they think it'll help find out about him, then fine, play him some. Personally, I don't think he's ready and I think it'll stunt his development.

Pennington has his problems, but he is a solid NFL qb. His two picks today both came from pressure. The tipped ball might have been avoided if the back stepped up and hit the blitzer so that he didn't have a free jump and the other could have been helped if he wasn't hit in the legs and JMac came back and fought for the ball. Penny has a weak arm and 30 mph winds are not where you'd expect his best game.

[JetsMan57]

A change Id make is incorporate the 4-3 over the next two weeks.Put Moore and DROB in the middle and make Vilma run around and make plays. Really, what good is it teaching these guys the 3-4 when most of the players will be gone next year anyway. If the personnell actually stays the same then we have major problems. We need a NT, a strong side lienbacker, a Ted Johnson type middle linebacker, a DE to replace KIMO, a pass rusher. We need so much. Just play the 4-3 the rest of the way. Im sick and tired of giving up 140 yards rushing to absolute scrubs.

When Parcells took over in 97 and took over the Cowboys he didnt install the 3-4 right away because he didnt have the players. Mangini should have done the same rather than forcing square pegs into round holes.

[JetCane]

Really, what good is it teaching these guys the 3-4 when most of the players will be gone next year anyway.

That's the best argument for going to the 4-3.

It's apparent they dont have the right talent to run the 3-4, so why insist on putting a round peg in a square hole. After another off-season of getting guys to fit into the 3-4, run it then.

Running it now has been counter-productive.

[Barton]

A change Id make is incorporate the 4-3 over the next two weeks.Put Moore and DROB in the middle and make Vilma run around and make plays. Really, what good is it teaching these guys the 3-4 when most of the players will be gone next year anyway. If the personnell actually stays the same then we have major problems. We need a NT, a strong side lienbacker, a Ted Johnson type middle linebacker, a DE to replace KIMO, a pass rusher. We need so much. Just play the 4-3 the rest of the way. Im sick and tired of giving up 140 yards rushing to absolute scrubs.

When Parcells took over in 97 and took over the Cowboys he didnt install the 3-4 right away because he didnt have the players. Mangini should have done the same rather than forcing square pegs into round holes.

Great post.

Mangini is being stubborn sticking with this 3-4 as it is right now.

[GreenBeans]

I think it's time to put Kellen Clemens in, if this staff really thinks he is the future. I think we've seen about what 1 cent can do for us. The problem is Clemens is a little short, and I think he has happy feet right now, but he is supposed to be able to make all the throws. After seeing 1 cents ducks to close out the game, I've pretty much had it. With the bye week coming up, and the easiest schedule we'll get in years, we should let Clemens make those mistakes now, and just hope he has what it takes.

Let Clemens hold the clipboard and learn - there is no need to rush him into games in his first season as a pro. Most QB's need a year or two to absorb the position - rushing him will not speed that process. Also, Pennington, while having a crappy day, is still the best option for this team at this time. He ran into a defensive head coach that has owned him for 5 years, what did you expect to have happen. Let Pennington play and let Clemens learn.

[KSJets]

I couldn't really watch much of the game because I was at work, but at the end of the game, DRob was at DE and Moore was the NT. Was Kimo injured or was he completely ineffective?

[Gainzo]

I couldn't really watch much of the game because I was at work, but at the end of the game, DRob was at DE and Moore was the NT. Was Kimo injured or was he completely ineffective?

J E T S ...............sucked today!

[serphnx]

Let Clemens hold the clipboard and learn - there is no need to rush him into games in his first season as a pro. Most QB's need a year or two to absorb the position - rushing him will not speed that process. Also, Pennington, while having a crappy day, is still the best option for this team at this time. He ran into a defensive head coach that has owned him for 5 years, what did you expect to have happen. Let Pennington play and let Clemens learn.

You don't learn holding a clipboard past half a season. By now he's learned all he can by watching and studying. Now we have to see what he can do, and he has to learn by experience. Most good QBs recently have started by mid-season.

[KSJets]

J E T S ...............sucked today!

Ask a simple question and get a smartass answer. A-hole.

[JetCane]

Ask a simple question and get a smartass answer. A-hole.

Sooner or later they reveal themselves, you know that.

I couldn't really watch much of the game because I was at work, but at the end of the game, DRob was at DE and Moore was the NT. Was Kimo injured or was he completely ineffective?

They were playing a variation of the 4-3 at the end with Ellis, Hamilton, Robertson and Thomas. Kimo had one good series all day from what i saw.

[KSJets]

Sooner or later they reveal themselves, you know that.

They were playing a variation of the 4-3 at the end with Ellis, Hamilton, Robertson and Thomas. Kimo had one good series all day from what i saw.

Thanks Jetcane. Glad to know some around here can give a simple answer to a serious question without being a dick.

[uart]

Give the kid a try at QB. We're not going to the superbowl anyway. Pennington can't hit guys deep unless it's blown coverage & everyone we play knows it. This will not change.

I'm not 100% committed to replacing Chad, but lets bring Clemens into games when we're down in the 4th Quarter anyway.

Demote JMac - he's earned it. Standing there instead of using his 6'2 frame to jump for the ball while that floater was in the air is just an instinct that he either has or doesn't - and he doesn't. Give his spot to Smith. At least everyone won't guess the trick play when he's in there every time. Guy's a player.

Agreed. J-Mac is a mess. Bradd Smith needs to do more than special teams and gadget plays. Let him catch the ball a few times and maybe throw it. His skills fit much better than JMac.

[The Gun Of Bavaria]

1. If Clemens is your 'future' give him a shot

2. Scrap the 3-4 til futher notice. We DO NOT have the personnel.

3. Get D-Rob's ass off NT if we keep the 3-4.

4. Learn how to use Brent Smith. Putting him in the game and doing the same thing everytime he's in it won't work.

[hoping4ASuperBowl]

4. Learn how to use Brent Smith. Putting him in the game and doing the same thing everytime he's in it won't work.

Yeah when i saw him hand it to Washington who got smacked by 3 or 4 defense guys behind the line of scrimmage i agreed with the announcer who said, why didnt they just leave Chad in for that. Hes right, Chad throws more anyways Brad either runs or gives it to someone to run.

[KSJets]

1. If Clemens is your 'future' give him a shot

2. Scrap the 3-4 til futher notice. We DO NOT have the personnel.

3. Get D-Rob's ass off NT if we keep the 3-4.

4. Learn how to use Brent Smith. Putting him in the game and doing the same thing everytime he's in it won't work.

1. I'm not willing to throw in the towel with Chad just yet.

2. I'm getting sick of watching other teams running the 3-4 and being effective. Our DL just gets blown off the ball so far. It's depressing.

3. I agree here. move him to DE and get Kimo out of there. I haven't seen Kimo make one positive play all season. I missed most of this game, so if he did something this game I wouldn't have seen it. But I doubt it.

4. Maybe they're setting other teams up for later in the year? Imagine him going under center dropping back and faking a hand-off, only to throw it deep to...Pennington. That would be funny as hell to watch.

[adamprez2003]

you guys need houston back as the starter with washington spelling him. i know everyone here loves washington but houston is the best back you got

[#27TheDominator]

1. If Clemens is your 'future' give him a shot

2. Scrap the 3-4 til futher notice. We DO NOT have the personnel.

3. Get D-Rob's ass off NT if we keep the 3-4.

4. Learn how to use Brent Smith. Putting him in the game and doing the same thing everytime he's in it won't work.

1. Why is Clemens the future? He's a #2 pick. Give him some time. This game WAS NOT garbage time. Garbage yes, but not garbage time. If Miller didn't run the kick back we'd have seen him

2-3. If we don't run the 3-4 and give the square pegs a chance to fit the round holes, next season we'll be replacing 11 guys on D. I think he's trying to get it down to 4 or 5. DRob was one of the guys showing some life at the end. He's not a great NT, but I'd take 2 DRobs over 3 Kimos.

4. I know you like your liquor, but it's Brad Smith. If you like him so much, remember-Brent Smith was crappy OL we had a few years ago. I think the play (which I didn't like) was supposed to be a trick in that he usually rolls out or runs the option, the hand-off up the middle was probably looked at as misdirection. May have been looking at picking up a couple (wasn't it 3rd and 3?) and going for it on 4th. Be a better bet then cat scratch fever from 52, but the loss on the play made going on 4th improbable. I didn't like it either, but that's what I think.

[GreenBeans]

You don't learn holding a clipboard past half a season. By now he's learned all he can by watching and studying. Now we have to see what he can do, and he has to learn by experience. Most good QBs recently have started by mid-season.

Oh really? Going on that theory Clemens should have started week one, after all, he had all of training camp to learn the offense. Puh-lease, dude - this is a pro offense with how many sets, shifts, personnel groupings, that likes to run the no-huddle as well as the expectation of calling audibles at the line. If you think a rookie has all of that down, knows all of the personnel packages, formations, shift, sets, reads, and has the confidence to actually run it in a game, then by all means start Clemens. If not, let him watch, learn, and get comfortable. Why ruin the kid by throwing him out there too early in his career. Pennington has his faults, but it's not time to yank him right yet IMO.

[serphnx]

Oh really? Going on that theory Clemens should have started week one, after all, he had all of training camp to learn the offense. Puh-lease, dude - this is a pro offense with how many sets, shifts, personnel groupings, that likes to run the no-huddle as well as the expectation of calling audibles at the line. If you think a rookie has all of that down, knows all of the personnel packages, formations, shift, sets, reads, and has the confidence to actually run it in a game, then by all means start Clemens. If not, let him watch, learn, and get comfortable. Why ruin the kid by throwing him out there too early in his career. Pennington has his faults, but it's not time to yank him right yet IMO.

I guess Ben Roethlisberger, Carson Palmer, Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Matt Leinart, Vince Young, Tom Brady, Donovan McNabb, Troy Aikman, John Elway, Dan Marino and Phil Simms were all "ruined." Maybe a few of those didn't start their first season, but most of them did. Aside from Ben, maybe they didn't have great rookie years, but they learned a lot by making mistakes, and then came on strong after that year. You don't get "ruined" by making mistakes your first year. You're probably going to make them anyway, and if you're talented you'll learn from them. If you aren't talented, you will continue to suck, but you just wasted 3 years collecting paychecks without helping your team. There are a lot more QBs that started in their first years. Eli Manning is the most recent example I can think of on a guy that started halfway through his rookie year, and he's turned out pretty well.

[Sperm Edwards]

You don't see the speed on film (in the offseason) the way you see it right in front of your face (during live games). You also don't get an appreciation for what the in-game starter & OC say to each other during the game. You see little (if any) of this in camp.

I agree with not throwing him in there in game 1. But barring miracle-rookies like Big Ben or Marino, you expect a rookie to lose most games. Chad's contract prevents retaining him past 2007 anyway - he's getting cut unless we give him yet another 8-figure SB. So that leaves Clemens to do what? Get thrown in there when we figure to be making a realistic push for a superbowl?

We're not going to the superbowl this year. Accept it. Hope is fine, but at some point reality must set in. We took this guy over plenty of players so the coach & GM clearly wanted/believed in him. Unless the staff feels he's looked totally clueless in practice, throw him in there - give him the bye to work with the first team - it's good timing.

Won't happen though.

[GreenBeans]

I guess Ben Roethlisberger, Carson Palmer, Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Matt Leinart, Vince Young, Tom Brady, Donovan McNabb, Troy Aikman, John Elway, Dan Marino and Phil Simms were all "ruined." Maybe a few of those didn't start their first season, but most of them did. Aside from Ben, maybe they didn't have great rookie years, but they learned a lot by making mistakes, and then came on strong after that year. You don't get "ruined" by making mistakes your first year. You're probably going to make them anyway, and if you're talented you'll learn from them. If you aren't talented, you will continue to suck, but you just wasted 3 years collecting paychecks without helping your team. There are a lot more QBs that started in their first years. Eli Manning is the most recent example I can think of on a guy that started halfway through his rookie year, and he's turned out pretty well.

- Rothlisberger is over-hyped and is not a real good quarterback overall. He did not have to do much his first season besides hand-off to the Bettis. Do the Jets have a Bettis for him to hand off to?

- Palmer was behind Kitna year one and 3 games year two. Year two was so-so.

- Peyton Manning was mechanically and psychologically ready for the NFL in his sophmore year of college - that comparison sucks, unless you think Clemens is the same as Manning. PS- great stats and has not won jack sh-it (See Dan Marino Syndrome)

- Eli Manning is still suffering from the "happy feet" he developed as a clueless rookie. How many times a game are his throws high of his target? He's still trying to break his bad habits.

- Matt Leinart has done exactly what as a rookie? He's going to need some serious re-training after getting it handed to him this season. He's already gpt the happy feet and is making bad throws in a hurry.

- Vince Young? Are you kidding me? He's working on his athleticism at this point. He's not learning the position.

- Tom Brady started midway through the year thanks to Mo Lewis. That was not the plan for him, it just happened to work out (and work out pretty well).

- Donavan McNabb - Started 6 games as a rookie and it realistically took him three years to "get it" as a QB.

- Troy Aikmen started and sucked for 3 years before the Dallas O-Line became one of the best of all time.

- John Elway - Took him about 9 years to be a great QB after starting as a rookie and he was a freak athlete to boot.

- Dan Marino was great and his teams always sucked. F Dan Marino, you can keep him.

- Phil Simms was terrible from 79 until 87 and due to injuries and not being very good did not play as the full time starter until 84.

So what do all of these great players have in common - it took them time to get to where they ended up. IMO Clemens should sit and learn behind a smart quarterback and learn about the complicated system 'lil Schott brought with him from San Diego. Why put him out there to suck, get confused, pick up bad habits, and possibly lose confidence in his ability to play the game to win an extra game in a rebuilding year? Have some patience and let the kid grow before throwing him out there. No one has any patience anymore to let things develop, and that's a good part of the reason why the NFL has mediocre play with more talented athletes - no one is willing to be patient. So they throw kids out there that are clueless about the game to perform and we get to watch a league full of idiots who jump up and down after making a tackle.

We can agree to disagree. I'd rather see Clemens sit.