Camp Report - Cimini - 30-7-08

[Irish Jet]

Practice notes: As usual, Clemens gets picked off

A few observations from today

[NY JETS 29]

Ratliff ahead of Clemens, wow! I'm going to say by the end of our first pre season game vs. Clev that Mangini will throw Ratliff's name into the mix as our starter and I really wouldnt mind it at all. I would kind of be pumped about it.

[NY JETS 29]

PS- Cimini is a tool

[NFLs StepChild]

No report on how many TDs each has thrown. I'd be interested in that nugget. Also how many long passes for each? Can we get a big picture view of this whole thing? I mean I know the Media loves to tell us all is lost, and the Jets are garbage at every turn, so this coverage does not shock me, but come on, can we just hear how both are doing without them slanting it to make their whiny little pitches for Favre?

OH NO!!! THEY SUCK!!! ALL IS LOST!!! Please. Let's see for ourselves in the preseason games how far along these guys are coming. Cimini is an anti-Jets assh0le, always has been always will be.

[BroadwayJ667]

No report on how many TDs each has thrown. I'd be interested in that nugget. Also how many long passes for each? Can we get a big picture view of this whole thing? I mean I know the Media loves to tell us all is lost, and the Jets are garbage at every turn, so this coverage does not shock me, but come on, can we just hear how both are doing without them slanting it to make their whiny little pitches for Favre?

OH NO!!! THEY SUCK!!! ALL IS LOST!!! Please. Let's see for ourselves in the preseason games how far along these guys are coming. Cimini is an anti-Jets assh0le, always has been always will be.

couldn't be said better, has he said one good thing that Gholston has done, all he says is that he is lost. no f'ing sh*t sherlock, the guy is a rookie in a new system, lets be positive but no rich is a douche

[SoFlaJets]

Ratliff ahead of Clemens, wow! I'm going to say by the end of our first pre season game vs. Clev that Mangini will throw Ratliff's name into the mix as our starter and I really wouldnt mind it at all. I would kind of be pumped about it.

me too...who ever thought Trent Edwards would ever be the starter over JP Losman? How about what happened down in Jacksonville? I'd like to see us be bold like that the only thing that is pissing me off is Chad will never be intercepted throwing passes on checkdowns-he's playing not to lose and cowardly too safe football-I'd rather take my chances with Clemens and Ratliff or even Brett Farve-I'm sick of Penny football-I have seen enough...I want change ABCP

[NFLs StepChild]

The other side of the coin, is that you can protect your young QBs with your offenive gameplan. Bears went to the Playoffs on the arm of KYLE FRIGGIN ORTON!!! Look at Tom Brady's first year, they ran like 50 times a game. Same with Big Ben. Same with "de de de" Eli. Protect a developing QB with a strong running game and ask him to throw 20 times a game while he becomes better, all while developing him on the field.

Can we please set this team up for success LONG TERM for once? STOP listening to the idiots in the media and equally stupid fanbase in NYC.

Woody, Eric and T get the big picture. NOW STFU and STAY THE *****ING COURSE with your plan.

[SoFlaJets]

The other side of the coin, is that you can protect your young QBs with your offenive gameplan. Bears went to the Playoffs on the arm of KYLE FRIGGIN ORTON!!! Look at Tom Brady's first year, they ran like 50 times a game. Same with Big Ben. Same with "de de de" Eli. Protect a developing QB with a strong running game and ask him to throw 20 times a game while he becomes better, all while developing him on the field.

Can we please set this team up for success LONG TERM for once? STOP listening to the idiots in the media and equally stupid fanbase in NYC.

Woody, Eric and T get the big picture. NOW STFU and STAY THE *****ING COURSE with your plan.

great post Step...I've been saying the same thing for months now, how this team is actually BUILT for a Kellen Clemens with the re-vamped OL and the best corps of RBs in the division (I also nominatred the new guy with a POTWN)

[Irish Jet]

The other side of the coin, is that you can protect your young QBs with your offenive gameplan. Bears went to the Playoffs on the arm of KYLE FRIGGIN ORTON!!! Look at Tom Brady's first year, they ran like 50 times a game. Same with Big Ben. Same with "de de de" Eli. Protect a developing QB with a strong running game and ask him to throw 20 times a game while he becomes better, all while developing him on the field.

Can we please set this team up for success LONG TERM for once? STOP listening to the idiots in the media and equally stupid fanbase in NYC.

Woody, Eric and T get the big picture. NOW STFU and STAY THE *****ING COURSE with your plan.

The Bears had the best D seen since the 2000 Ravens, that's why they made the playoffs with Orton and the Superbowl with Grossman the year after.

Tom Brady did not play in his first year.

Pittsburgh had an elite D, elite running game and elite weapons in Bens first season. We may look good right now, but we're not the 2004-2005 Pittsburgh Steelers.

Eli Manning sucked up until a good run of form at the right time last season. Fair play to him, he got the SB ring which he deserved for coming through in the clutch. He still hasn't proven though that he can be a consistent QB, some of his performances last season could have cost the Giants their Wild Card status.

[Irish Jet]

great post Step...I've been saying the same thing for months now, how this team is actually BUILT for a Kellen Clemens with the re-vamped OL and the best corps of RBs in the division (I also nominatred the new guy with a POTWN)

Funnily enough, I've been saying that this team has been designed around Penny Boy. Think about it. New O-line creates a strong running game, opening up play action for Chad, who is outstanding off of Play Action. The lack of deep threats brought in made me think Mangini wanted to keep the possesion WR's we have to play possesion based football. Who better than Captain Checkdown for that job?

I said that from the start. With the established vets Mangini brought in he was always designing a win now type team. I'm not sure if he's willing to put possibly his own faith in the hands of the unproven Clemens.

He's going to go with Chad, you'll see.

[SoFlaJets]

Funnily enough, I've been saying that this team has been designed around Penny Boy. Think about it. New O-line creates a strong running game, opening up play action for Chad, who is outstanding off of Play Action. The lack of deep threats brought in made me think Mangini wanted to keep the possesion WR's we have to play possesion based football. Who better than Captain Checkdown for that job?

I said that from the start. With the established vets Mangini brought in he was always designing a win now type team. I'm not sure if he's willing to put possibly his own faith in the hands of the unproven Clemens.

He's going to go with Chad, you'll see.

I considered that too IJ, and you're right CP is great at play action fakes, right up there with Peyton, but the problem remains; defenders will still only have to defend our offense 10 yards ahead in every situation-sadly, Chad Pennington doesn't scare anyone anymore my Blarney friend...

[DMaynard]

Football Gods. Please. No hamstring for Coles. You f#@ks.

As horrible as the QB situation sounds from these reports, I am anxious to see both Clemens and Chad in an actual pre-season game with my own eyes. Should tell us a lot more than these training camp reports.

[Barton]

Practice performance means nothing. Good or bad. Wake me up when the preseason starts.

[SoFlaJets]

Football Gods. Please. No hamstring for Coles. You f#@ks.

As horrible as the QB situation sounds from these reports, I am anxious to see both Clemens and Chad in an actual pre-season game with my own eyes. Should tell us a lot more than these training camp reports.

Did anybody sign Eric Parker yet DM? If not, we need to now

[faba]

Practice performance means nothing. Good or bad. Wake me up when the preseason starts.

True

Since we have everyone pre judging on simulated playing lets see these guys line up in a real game to draw conclusions.

[slats]

It's a floorwax!

It's a desert topping!

You're both right!

The offense is -wisely- built for a weak QB. Be it a weak-armed one, or an inexperienced one. I hate to see Clemens continuing to dig his hole. I don't think teams will be respecting the pass at all with Pennington at QB. I think it's eight men in the box all season long.

Clemens, warts and all, at least forces the opposition to respect the pass. And that, in turn, should help boost what should be a strong running game.

I don't hate Pennington at all, and I'd love to see him prove all his detractors wrong - me included. I just really don't see it. I also still have some hope left that Clemens can shake these practice jitters and actually perform if given the chance on the field.

[Irish Jet]

I considered that too IJ, and you're right CP is great at play action fakes, right up there with Peyton, but the problem remains; defenders will still only have to defend our offense 10 yards ahead in every situation-sadly, Chad Pennington doesn't scare anyone anymore my Blarney friend...

I know he doesn't scare anyone downfield. He might not have to either.

I genuinely believe our running game will be tough force next season. Chad will be able to throw the ball downfield if that's the case, because like I said when the running game is working and he's throwing off of PA, #10 is a different QB. I think we would still be a good team with Chad at the helm this season.

Clemens? I don't have ****ing clue about, and no other Jet fan would know just how good or bad he is either simply because he's still completely proven. I didn't think Mangini would give him the team unless he tore it up in TC and pre-season. That doesn't seem to be the case.

Sure it would be great if Pennington had the arm to 'scare' teams. He doesn't and we all know that. But does the name Kellen Clemens strike fear into the hearts and souls of Defensive Co-ordinators everywhere? Somehow I doubt it.

[SoFlaJets]

True

Since we have everyone pre judging on simulated playing lets see these guys line up in a real game to draw conclusions.

on that note I keep thinking back to a year ago to the opening PS game against Minnesota when Chad threw what, 3 INTs(?) and showed exactly what he was going to look like during the season while Clemens looked better and they still gave the starting job to Pennington

[Irish Jet]

Practice performance means nothing. Good or bad. Wake me up when the preseason starts.

LOL

I can just picture it now. Pennington has a decent game against the Browns first team and Clemens sucks vs the 2nd team, throwing pick after pick.

Barton to JN: 'Preseason means nothing!'

[#27TheDominator]

took a step backward today, throwing an ugly, wounded-duck interception, picked off by James Ihedigbo.

Ihedigbo seems like he has been having a nice camp. This pick, plus he supposedly had at least a couple of knockdowns in the prevent in one of the earlier sessions.

Ratliff ahead of Clemens, wow! I'm going to say by the end of our first pre season game vs. Clev that Mangini will throw Ratliff's name into the mix as our starter and I really wouldnt mind it at all. I would kind of be pumped about it.

I don't think it means anything. They may be happier giving Ratliff a portion of a session with the #1s. Plus Clemens is struggling a little and may benefit from some time watching.

great post Step...I've been saying the same thing for months now, how this team is actually BUILT for a Kellen Clemens with the re-vamped OL and the best corps of RBs in the division (I also nominatred the new guy with a POTWN)

Is Clemens who he meant? Under the circumstances he may have meant Ratliff or Ainge.

Did anybody sign Eric Parker yet DM? If not, we need to now

Nobody signed Parker and nobody is going to any time soon. He's still not making visits because he's still hurt and he's still not ready to practice. If you're worried about Coles better jump on the Terry Glenn bandwagon. Seems like a better option at this point.

[Irish Jet]

True

Since we have everyone pre judging on simulated playing lets see these guys line up in a real game to draw conclusions.

A 'real' game?

[faba]

on that note I keep thinking back to a year ago to the opening PS game against Minnesota when Chad threw what, 3 INTs(?) and showed exactly what he was going to look like during the season while Clemens looked better and they still gave the starting job to Pennington

They take the safe route or lack of trust in Clemens.

[SoFlaJets]

It's a floorwax!

It's a desert topping!

You're both right!

The offense is -wisely- built for a weak QB. Be it a weak-armed one, or an inexperienced one. I hate to see Clemens continuing to dig his hole. I don't think teams will be respecting the pass at all with Pennington at QB. I think it's eight men in the box all season long.

Clemens, warts and all, at least forces the opposition to respect the pass. And that, in turn, should help boost what should be a strong running game.

I don't hate Pennington at all, and I'd love to see him prove all his detractors wrong - me included. I just really don't see it. I also still have some hope left that Clemens can shake these practice jitters and actually perform if given the chance on the field.

I'm right there too Slats-that's the thing, there are a lot of guys who will immediately accuse you of being a "Chad-hater" (which is the most frigging ridiculous thing I've ever read on the boards) when all we want is to see THE JETS win-regardless of who the QB is...me? I've seen enough Pennington football to know what we have there and still think Clemens is the better bet

[faba]

A 'real' game?

Yes against opposing players desperate to make a team just like our jets should be.

[Irish Jet]

It's a floorwax!

It's a desert topping!

You're both right!

The offense is -wisely- built for a weak QB. Be it a weak-armed one, or an inexperienced one. I hate to see Clemens continuing to dig his hole. I don't think teams will be respecting the pass at all with Pennington at QB. I think it's eight men in the box all season long.

Clemens, warts and all, at least forces the opposition to respect the pass. And that, in turn, should help boost what should be a strong running game.

I don't hate Pennington at all, and I'd love to see him prove all his detractors wrong - me included. I just really don't see it. I also still have some hope left that Clemens can shake these practice jitters and actually perform if given the chance on the field.

I disagree because Clemens has yet to force teams to respect the pass. They will not respect him until he shows that he is capable of punishing them. Yes he has the arm-strength to do that but we're yet to see if he has the accuracy or desicion making to do so.

As of now. There is no way a D would show more respect when defending Clemens than they would Pennington. Not until Clemens does something about it.

[SoFlaJets]

[quote=#27TheDominator;

Nobody signed Parker and nobody is going to any time soon. He's still not making visits because he's still hurt and he's still not ready to practice. If you're worried about Coles better jump on the Terry Glenn bandwagon. Seems like a better option at this point.

Glenn is about to be a Dolphin if he isn't already according to this morning's south Florida sports talk radio

[SoFlaJets]

I disagree because Clemens has yet to force teams to respect the pass. They will not respect him until he shows that he is capable of punishing them. Yes he has the arm-strength to do that but we're yet to see if he has the accuracy or desicion making to do so.

As of now. There is no way a D would show more respect when defending Clemens than they would Pennington. Not until Clemens does something about it.

go back and watch the 4th quarter of the Ravens game IJ-Chad can't make those throws

[Irish Jet]

Yes against opposing players desperate to make a team just like our jets should be.

Pre-season football can still not be considered a 'real' game of football though. You have a good point regarding the players who are desperate to make a team, but most of those players aren't proven opposition, which is what you want to see your players tested against.

[Irish Jet]

go back and watch the 4th quarter of the Ravens game IJ-Chad can't make those throws

That's true, I'm not saying he can.

Clemens showed a lot of good in that game, he had me very excited for the future.

That being said, he still has yet to prove he can do that consistently to earn respect. I could also pull out some Kyle Boller clips from that game to show his potential but his problem is he could never do it consistently enough. Thus defenses show Kyle Boller no respect for his passing ability whatsoever.

Not saying Clemens is the next Kyle Boller, just saying that he needs to be consistently good to earn respect from defenses, a highlight 4th quarter does not cut it right now.

[slats]

I disagree because Clemens has yet to force teams to respect the pass. They will not respect him until he shows that he is capable of punishing them. Yes he has the arm-strength to do that but we're yet to see if he has the accuracy or desicion making to do so.

As of now. There is no way a D would show more respect when defending Clemens than they would Pennington. Not until Clemens does something about it.

Clemens is obviously in charge of throwing picks this summer, but he seems to have longer throws attributed to him as well. Once he connects a couple ropes over the stacked box, the opponent will have to pay attention. I think this is where Dustin Keller comes in.

Pennington can't do that. The secondary can react to any pass of Chad's over 15 yards.

[Irish Jet]

Clemens is obviously in charge of throwing picks this summer, but he seems to have longer throws attributed to him as well. Once he connects a couple ropes over the stacked box, the opponent will have to pay attention. I think this is where Dustin Keller comes in.

Pennington can't do that. The secondary can react to any pass of Chad's over 15 yards.

Even so, If Clemens is throwing more INT's than these 'ropes' then they will be happy to take the risk with him. Just like teams playing Grossman would, they know that he can beat them, they'll just fancy their chances and presume that he won't because of how erratic he is.

[#27TheDominator]

Glenn is about to be a Dolphin if he isn't already according to this morning's south Florida sports talk radio

I'm sure and it's probably true, but talk radio has had Brett Favre playing for about seven teams in the past week. Dewey Beats Truman!

Pre-season football can still not be considered a 'real' game of football though. You have a good point regarding the players who are desperate to make a team, but most of those players aren't proven opposition, which is what you want to see your players tested against.

I don't have too much of a problem with the level of players in the preseason. The problem to me is that most teams run a very vanilla scheme. I could be wrong, but this should actually help Clemens. Chad's arm strength problems will be exposed by almost any D and simply rolling up. Clemens youth and inexperience will have more trouble with complex coverages and things like the zone blitz-he even mentioned and "unusual" cover scheme as causing his pick today.

[SoFlaJets]

I'm sure and it's probably true, but talk radio has had Brett Favre playing for about seven teams in the past week. Dewey Beats Truman!

It does make a lot of sense though Dom-Miami needs another receiver to go with Ginn and Hagen and Glenn IS a Parcells guy-"she" has been since his New England days...they are talking about him maybe being the mentor Ginn Jr needs this year and then sliding over to a coach next season...

[#27TheDominator]

It does make a lot of sense though Dom-Miami needs another receiver to go with Ginn and Hagen and Glenn IS a Parcells guy-"she" has been since his New England days...they are talking about him maybe being the mentor Ginn Jr needs this year and then sliding over to a coach next season...

Of course you are correct. I don't think Mangini likes signing guys that are older than him.

What's with the guys Parcells bullies and insults being "Parcells guys"?

[Irish Jet]

I actually would have liked us to go after Glenn had he have been 100%. Sure he's probably still banged up and past his best but I'd be willing to bet he could still stretch the field better than anyone out of our current WR roster.