Curtis Martin

[CTM]

Cocaine is a hell of a drug.

what did the five fingers say to the face?

[Bugg]

The negativity is mind boggling!

This playoff game Martin was the difference....you have one? Because I gave you the logs, and there isn't one with the Jets.

[JetsFanInDenver]

This playoff game Martin was the difference....you have one? Because I gave you the logs, and there isn't one with the Jets.

As i said earlier after reading the cherry picked data i am now convinced he was a very mediocre player who did not deserve HOF consideration.

Not sure how he got to 4th all time leading rusher in the history of the NFL. Must have been the great Oline. Or the HOF QBs he played behind who bailed him out. Or maybe he stayed healthy long enough when almost all RBs in the NFL for some reason do not seem to stay healthy for that long a period of time. I am sure someone can explain how that happened indeed.

[JiFtheOracle]

I meant Walter Payton

Dude...its the most ridiculous argument these guys come up with.

Barry Sanders once had negative yardage in a playoff game...lol. Jim Brown once had 8 yards and averaged 3.6 yards per carry in postseason career.

Seriously, when you have some time and are super bored...go look up some of the "elite" HOF'ers playoffs performance. You'll see a ton of terrible performances...a ton. Earl Campbell who every one loves on this board (and I agree was better than Curtis). Averaged 3.1 yard per carry in the postseason. lol. Its comical how hard people try to hate on Curtis.

[Falcon63]

As i said earlier after reading the cherry picked data i am now convinced he was a very mediocre player who did not deserve HOF consideration.

Not sure how he got to 4th all time leading rusher in the history of the NFL. Must have been the great Oline. Or the HOF QBs he played behind who bailed him out. Or maybe he stayed healthy long enough when almost all RBs in the NFL for some reason do not seem to stay healthy for that long a period of time. I am sure someone can explain how that happened indeed.

+1. Haters gonna hate.

[Matt39]

Dude...its the most ridiculous argument these guys come up with.

Barry Sanders once had negative yardage in a playoff game...lol. Jim Brown once had 8 yards and averaged 3.6 yards per carry in postseason career.

Seriously, when you have some time and are super bored...go look up some of the "elite" HOF'ers playoffs performance. You'll see a ton of terrible performances...a ton. Earl Campbell who every one loves on this board (and I agree was better than Curtis). Averaged 3.1 yard per carry in the postseason. lol. Its comical how hard people try to hate on Curtis.

I'm not a huge Curtis guy either though....but a lot of these all time backs were sh*tty in the post season. Save Emmitt and Davis who both had all world offensive lines.

The problem with Curtis was you kind of new going into every game if he'd be effective or not. Same thing with Pennington.

That era of Jets football sucked. Beat the bad teams, lose to the good ones.

[JiFtheOracle]

I'm not a huge Curtis guy either though....but a lot of these all time backs were sh*tty in the post season. Save Emmitt and Davis who both had all world offensive lines.

The problem with Curtis was you kind of new going into every game if he'd be effective or not. Same thing with Pennington.

That era of Jets football sucked. Beat the bad teams, lose to the good ones.

I understand a lot of the arguments on Curtis but doodooing his playoff performances is by far the dumbest.

[Jetsfan80]

I understand a lot of the arguments on Curtis but doodooing his playoff performances is by far the dumbest.

It is what it is JiF. If Curtis performs a little better in 1998 maybe we win a title, who knows. Either way, you can't simply remove aspects of his career from memory. Curtis never really had a watershed moment. He was a very good back for a long time. That's about it. Some choose to glorify him for that, I choose to say that us glorifying him shows just how sh*tty its been to be a Jets fan.

The Niners have Montana. The Cowboys had Aikman, Irvin and Smith. The Steelers had the Steel Curtain, Terry Bradshaw, and now Big Ben. The Packers had Starr, Favre, and now Rodgers. The Colts had Unitas and Manning. We have Curtis Martin. Hooray.

[Matt39]

I understand a lot of the arguments on Curtis but doodooing his playoff performances is by far the dumbest.

98 sucked. He had a bad game....it was the latter part of his career that was a bit frustrating when we had Jordan. The Steeler game in 04 would have been won if we gave Jordan more carries.

I remember Boomer Esiason at halftime on CBS screaming to give Jordan the ball. Those Jets teams were so poorly coached....err.

[JiFtheOracle]

It is what it is JiF. If Curtis performs a little better in 1998 maybe we win a title, who knows. Either way, you can't simply remove aspects of his career from memory. Curtis never really had a watershed moment. He was a very good back for a long time. That's about it. Some choose to glorify him for that, I choose to say that us glorifying him shows just how sh*tty its been to be a Jets fan.

The Niners have Montana. The Cowboys had Aikman, Irvin and Smith. The Steelers had the Steel Curtain, Terry Bradshaw, and now Big Ben. The Packers had Starr, Favre, and now Rodgers. The Colts had Unitas and Manning. We have Curtis Martin. Hooray.

Who's removing? It happened, it sucked...but that wasnt the only thing that sucked from those games. I'm just pointing out that there are plenty of RB's who many consider "elite" that are in the HOF who have been awful in the postseason. And if thats what you are going to use to poopoo Curtis's career, then I laugh in your face. When you're bored, go look it up. I've done it before on these boards and its really not worth my time anymore.

Hey, I love Curtis Martin he's the player I associate with the Jets turnaround and I dont think he gets the respect he's due. Especially from his own fanbase, but I know I'm fighting a losing battle and honestly, I gave up a long time ago. So now I just do brief laugh your face moments when the hating begins.

[Bleedin Green]

98 sucked. He had a bad game....it was the latter part of his career that was a bit frustrating when we had Jordan. The Steeler game in 04 would have been won if we gave Jordan more carries.

I remember Boomer Esiason at halftime on CBS screaming to give Jordan the ball. Those Jets teams were so poorly coached....err.

The 2004 Steelers game would have been won if the Jets had just one of a competent head coach, quarterback or kicker. RB was the least of their problems that game.

[Jetsfan80]

Who's removing? It happened, it sucked...but that wasnt the only thing that sucked from those games. I'm just pointing out that there are plenty of RB's who many consider "elite" that are in the HOF who have been awful in the postseason. And if thats what you are going to use to poopoo Curtis's career, then I laugh in your face. When you're bored, go look it up. I've done it before on these boards and its really not worth my time anymore.

Hey, I love Curtis Martin he's the player I associate with the Jets turnaround and I dont think he gets the respect he's due. Especially from his own fanbase, but I know I'm fighting a losing battle and honestly, I gave up a long time ago. So now I just do brief laugh your face moments when the hating begins.

All I'm saying is in order for Martin to be great, he needed to have more of these types of moments that even a back without much of a track record has had:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EexZYDqzM1U

Bigtime runs, that's what you get remembered for. And it keeps Martin from being considered elite in my book.

[Matt39]

All I'm saying is in order for Martin to be great, he needed to have more of these types of moments that even a back without much of a track record has had:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EexZYDqzM1U

Bigtime runs, that's what you get remembered for. And it keeps Martin from being considered elite in my book.

He had them...just with the Patriots. That run against Pittsburgh in the fog was great.

[JiFtheOracle]

All I'm saying is in order for Martin to be great, he needed to have more of these types of moments that even a back without much of a track record has had:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EexZYDqzM1U

Bigtime runs, that's what you get remembered for. And it keeps Martin from being considered elite in my book.

Cant see the vid at work.

He had plenty of great runs...there just werent the 90 yard dash types. There's different types of runners in the world and Curtis was one of the greatest at his style.

[Jetsfan80]

Cant see the vid at work.

It was Shonn Greene's 53-yd TD run against San Diego.

[Falcon63]

I'd take consistent 4 yard runs all day then a bunch of 2 yard runs and a 60 yard run.....

[Jetsfan80]

I'd take consistent 4 yard runs all day then a bunch of 2 yard runs and a 60 yard run.....

Thing is, Curtis had plenty of his share of 2-yard runs and all too few 60 yard runs. Give me an explosive back any day over a guy who just takes what his OL gives him.

[Bugg]

It is what it is JiF. If Curtis performs a little better in 1998 maybe we win a title, who knows. Either way, you can't simply remove aspects of his career from memory. Curtis never really had a watershed moment. He was a very good back for a long time. That's about it. Some choose to glorify him for that, I choose to say that us glorifying him shows just how sh*tty its been to be a Jets fan.

The Niners have Montana. The Cowboys had Aikman, Irvin and Smith. The Steelers had the Steel Curtain, Terry Bradshaw, and now Big Ben. The Packers had Starr, Favre, and now Rodgers. The Colts had Unitas and Manning. We have Curtis Martin. Hooray.

This. By virtue of long-term suckitude Jets fans are defining greatness down.

[Bugg]

The 2004 Steelers game would have been won if the Jets had just one of a competent head coach, quarterback or kicker. RB was the least of their problems that game.

Or a back who get get 3 or 4 first downs late in the game. And they may have had one in Jordan, but the HC was an incompetent buffoon whow as worried about being 2nd guessed for not going with his feature back at that point instead of worrying about winning the game.

[CTM]

Cant see the vid at work.

He had plenty of great runs...there just werent the 90 yard dash types. There's different types of runners in the world and Curtis was one of the greatest at his style.

Are we actually calling his lack of break-away speed and quickness a "style" now.. lol

[shawn306]

It is what it is JiF. If Curtis performs a little better in 1998 maybe we win a title, who knows. Either way, you can't simply remove aspects of his career from memory. Curtis never really had a watershed moment. He was a very good back for a long time. That's about it. Some choose to glorify him for that, I choose to say that us glorifying him shows just how sh*tty its been to be a Jets fan.

The Niners have Montana. The Cowboys had Aikman, Irvin and Smith. The Steelers had the Steel Curtain, Terry Bradshaw, and now Big Ben. The Packers had Starr, Favre, and now Rodgers. The Colts had Unitas and Manning. We have Curtis Martin. Hooray.

If Curtis plays a little better, if the Jets don't turn the ball over a zillion times in the second half, if Victor Green keeps McCaffery from blowing by him. Alot of if's in that game. Wasn't just Martin.

I love how people use his durability and his lack of fumbling as some kind of freak of nature. I'll take over 3,500 carries, 14,000 yards and 29 fumbles for a career any time. I'll take it over McNeil's electric running but injury prone style.

In my opinion. if I had to choose between Faulk or Martin I would have taken Faulk for the HOF. I don't think Martin is a first ballot HOF'er but the hate for Martin out of some folks is just ridiculous. He is arguably the best back this franchise has had.

Curtis will have his day. Might even be next year when he and Parcells could go in together.

Interesting article from a a few years back on probably the second best RB in NFL and his post sesasons.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=paolantonio_sal&id=3055421

[Bleedin Green]

Or a back who get get 3 or 4 first downs late in the game. And they may have had one in Jordan, but the HC was an incompetent buffoon whow as worried about being 2nd guessed for not going with his feature back at that point instead of worrying about winning the game.

While I get the criticism of Martin's postseason performances overall, trying to put that loss onto him is a joke. Just to be clear, here were the stat lines of our two RBs on those two drives that resulted in missed FG attempts:

Martin: 4 rushes for 11 yards, 2 catch for 26 yards

Jordan: 2 rush for 3 yards

I'm not exactly sure what about that world-beater type stat line from Jordan makes you think he was the key to victory, or that anything would have made a difference with a pansy choke-artist QB, a dipsh*t HC and a joke of a kicker.

[THE ILK]

He deserved to get in.

Sabol belongs, but he should not be taking the place of a player.

Also I don't see how someone who was passed up for years gets in over the 4th all time rushing leader.

That's ridiculous IMO.

[JetsFanInDenver]

98 sucked. He had a bad game....it was the latter part of his career that was a bit frustrating when we had Jordan. The Steeler game in 04 would have been won if we gave Jordan more carries.

I remember Boomer Esiason at halftime on CBS screaming to give Jordan the ball. Those Jets teams were so poorly coached....err.

The Steelers game would have been won if we had a coach who had a pair or a kicker who could kick!

[#27TheDominator]

The main issue with '98 is that all we hear about is his lack of fumbling and he fumbled in the biggest spot the Jets had in 15 years.

Jordan had a much better ypc in that Steelers game, but Martin broke off a nice run that drive and had a nice catch the drive before. It did seem that they should have fed Jordan the ball to beat on the Steelers. Martin wasn't the problem, but he wasn't the solution either.

He is a rich man's Thomas Jones. Take that for what you will, but it's true.

Curtis deserves the Hall and he will get in. I'm not worried about that. I only think it is guys in the convo for GOAT that should get to complain about not getting in on the first ballot. Nobody got in ahead of him who didn't deserve it.

Shannon Sharpe deserves the HOF, but I don't think he revolutionized the position the Jets had guys like that for a decade in Caster and Barkum. Big WR converted to TE.

[Matt39]

Putting Martin in is basically celebrating his durability and consistency, which is fine...and its nice to see the Jets organization have someone else there.

But there were a lot of backs that probably wont get in that were better runners. I mean- is Jamal Lewis a Hall of Famer? Correy Dillon?

[Warfish]

The entire thing is a lolfest IMO.

Half of Jets Fandom were actively rrooting against Martin to get in. So no cause for shock he didn't.

I also have to express my hatred for the "percieved" difference between "first Ballot" and "seconf thru whatever ballot". It's such a joke, a guy either IS or ISN'T a Hof'er, he doesn't get better or worse between voting years.

The way it should work, is wait 10 years, you get ONE shot only, period. Unlimited allowables per year (no arbitrary 5 or 6 max/year). No voting to determine finalists, just a list of every player eligible that year, and you vote for all you think are HOF worthy.

Yes/No Vote. Is X a HOF'er or not.

All those who get whatever percentage get in, everyone else doesn't. End of story, end of elligibillity, end of all the sportwrter BS vote-trading and laugahble "convincing" of some players. And end the majority of "writers" having votes, give votes to alot more players/coaches, to end the foolish domination of the Peter Kings on the process.

The HOF as constituted today, is a joke with no integrity of any kind.

[JetsFanInDenver]

Or a back who get get 3 or 4 first downs late in the game. And they may have had one in Jordan, but the HC was an incompetent buffoon whow as worried about being 2nd guessed for not going with his feature back at that point instead of worrying about winning the game.

We all know Jordan had a great record setting career after he left the JETS.

[slats]

The way it should work, is wait 10 years, you get ONE shot only, period. Unlimited allowables per year (no arbitrary 5 or 6 max/year). No voting to determine finalists, just a list of every player eligible that year, and you vote for all you think are HOF worthy.

Yes/No Vote. Is X a HOF'er or not.

All those who get whatever percentage get in, everyone else doesn't. End of story, end of elligibillity, end of all the sportwrter BS vote-trading and laugahble "convincing" of some players. And end the majority of "writers" having votes, give votes to alot more players/coaches, to end the foolish domination of the Peter Kings on the process.

The HOF as constituted today, is a joke with no integrity of any kind.

All HoF's are jokes, with the Rock-n-Roll HoF leading the pack, but what are you gonna do?

I can see limiting the number that gets in, so everyone has their day. But there should be no minimum.

Don't mind players getting in years later, especially if something comes to light about their career that makes it deserve consideration later on. Not sure how that applies to Chris Hanburger, though.

[#27TheDominator]

The entire thing is a lolfest IMO.

Half of Jets Fandom were actively rrooting against Martin to get in. So no cause for shock he didn't.

I also have to express my hatred for the "percieved" difference between "first Ballot" and "seconf thru whatever ballot". It's such a joke, a guy either IS or ISN'T a Hof'er, he doesn't get better or worse between voting years.

The way it should work, is wait 10 years, you get ONE shot only, period. Unlimited allowables per year (no arbitrary 5 or 6 max/year). No voting to determine finalists, just a list of every player eligible that year, and you vote for all you think are HOF worthy.

Yes/No Vote. Is X a HOF'er or not.

All those who get whatever percentage get in, everyone else doesn't. End of story, end of elligibillity, end of all the sportwrter BS vote-trading and laugahble "convincing" of some players. And end the majority of "writers" having votes, give votes to alot more players/coaches, to end the foolish domination of the Peter Kings on the process.

The HOF as constituted today, is a joke with no integrity of any kind.

That doesn't work at all. The fact is, discussions like this one are what makes the HOF interesting and relevant.

[THE ILK]

All HoF's are jokes, with the Rock-n-Roll HoF leading the pack, but what are you gonna do?

I can see limiting the number that gets in, so everyone has their day. But there should be no minimum.

Don't mind players getting in years later, especially if something comes to light about their career that makes it deserve consideration later on. Not sure how that applies to Chris Hanburger, though.

Perhaps they considered that he would hold the fines record had he played in todays game.

[Bugg]

We all know Jordan had a great record setting career after he left the JETS.

He didn't. But on that day he was a better choice than Martin. Sadly we had an idiot for a head coach.

[JetsFanInDenver]

He didn't. But on that day he was a better choice than Martin. Sadly we had an idiot for a head coach.

But was he clutch ?

While I get the criticism of Martin's postseason performances overall, trying to put that loss onto him is a joke. Just to be clear, here were the stat lines of our two RBs on those two drives that resulted in missed FG attempts:

Martin: 4 rushes for 11 yards, 2 catch for 26 yards

Jordan: 2 rush for 3 yards

I'm not exactly sure what about that world-beater type stat line from Jordan makes you think he was the key to victory, or that anything would have made a difference with a pansy choke-artist QB, a dipsh*t HC and a joke of a kicker.

[Sperm Edwards]

I'd take consistent 4 yard runs all day then a bunch of 2 yard runs and a 60 yard run.....

From where do you get that Martin gave consistent 4 yard runs all day? Another total fabrication. That was more Bettis's game: no long ones but he's getting 3+Since you probably were too young to remember I'll give you a summary of almost every game against a non-awful defense: Martin killing drives and I had to listen to scores of sheep reciting, "Curtis needs those first 15-20 carries of accomplishing nothing so he can get warmed up." Same garbage we heard with Thomas Jones. Let him go ride a stationary bike on the sideline to get warmed up. Nevermind that it was nonsense anyway. Those 2 were both very strong, perfectly-conditioned athletes in the prime of life. They get warmed up plenty before a 15th handoff. It was just an excuse his apologists used.

My memory - particularly against non-sucky defenses - was this: 1 yard, 3 yards, 3 yards, 5 yards, 1 yard, -2 yards, 2 yards, etc with an occasional 6-8 yarder snuck in there. Then if we got a penalty or sack and it was 2nd & 20 or 3rd & 15-ish so against a 5-6-db defense, we'd run a draw play to Curtis up the middle, he'd get 10-12 yards through a 10-12 yard running lane, get no more than the OL and defense handed him, and we'd still punt. But it would bring his ypc up so it appeared he got 4 yards every time without a 60-yarder bringing up the average.

The Pittsburgh game in '04 was a prime example of that. If you were to look at the box score you'd think he had a solid game. Meanwhile he was killing us, but had draw-play gainers on 2nd & 15's or 3rd & 19's or whatever they were, where we still punted the ball and sent our defense onto the field. Teams were happy to let us do this since surrendering a potential extra 8-10 yards in field position is way better than risking a first down outright, and there was no chance Martin was going to break one for a first anyway.