Eagles Steelers in game

[JustInFudge]

The list grows!

Things we agree on:

1. Eric Smith

2. Michael Vick

GFY

[Bleedin Green]

GFY

3. JiF loves the fatties.

[GREENBEAN]

Like I said in my initial post, you don't have to agree with everything the front office does, but actually going out of your way to try to twist the facts in order to place additional blame on them is beyond unnecessary. You don't have to like that Cotchery is gone, but the facts are clear as day, Cotchery asked for his release, and asked for it over 5 months before Burress or Mason were anywhere close to being New York Jets. The only way the Jets might have possibly resolved that was agreeing to hand the starting job to a player who was not only coming off an injury, but had an unquestionably awful year last year (and who knows if that even would have done it). While I actually was a big Cotchery fan, I hate to have to break it to you, the fact that the Jets have continuously brought more and more receivers in over Cotchery ever since Ryan gets here tells you all you need to know about how this coaching staff feels about him. Let's not forget, this team and particularly this coaching staff once gave Cotchery the opportunity to be this team's #1 receiver, at the start of the 2009 season, before eventually getting to the point where they clearly wanted him no higher than #3 on the depth chart. Meanwhile, there doesn't seem to be a team in the league who disagreed with the Jets evaluation there.

Don't get me wrong, this team certainly hasn't been perfect with their transactions, no team is, and the Kendall situation is no doubt a very valid example, but that doesn't validate your attempts to put all of the blame on the team for something that was put in motion by the player himself and the only possible resolution would have been for the Jets to change their plans for their their roster and depth chart in a way they were clearly not comfortable with, simply to satisfy Cotchery's ego. Then again, that's even an assumption that he would want to stay even if guaranteed a starting spot considered he asked for his release when the only WRs under contract were him, Patrick Turner and a bunch of practice squad players. The bottom line, is there is really no justification whatsoever to say that this is 100% the fault of the Jets front office, as you so emphatically claimed. The fact that this is all coming on the heels of Cotchery catching a TD thrown by Byron Leftwich while lined up against backup CBs in a preseason game for the team he's the new #4 WR for just makes it that much worse.

Naaaah it's not the Pittsburgh game that did it to me. I've been waiting for a chance to spew my distaste for our offseason moves this year.

The truth is I never heard anything about Cotch wanting out of here 5 months ago. I only heard, and based my opinion, on the idea that he asked to leave after we signed plax. When it all comes down to it I think I wish that there was just a little more loyalty than there is. We have this idea that people WANT to play here because of Rex etc yet we lost more than we gained IMO. I would like to see us take care of the Shaun Ellis' and cotcherys of the world. I'm not saying to dump boat loads of money on aging players. Look at Pitt. They NEVER break the bank for an aging great like Greg Lloyd or Kevin Green ( NE gave ellis way more than I thought was required) but I think if we offered Shaun 2.5 mil he never would have gone to NE and would have signed. Now we're counting on some unproven rooks. It's that type of stuff that bothers me. I feel how I feel. I hope we can cover all the loses of course, but this stinks like feet to me.

[GREENBEAN]

I'll say it again, the Eagles will not make the playoffs.

Vick sucks.

agreed. I'm rooting so hard against the eagles it actually hurts my testicles when I think about it.

[Jetsfan80]

Naaaah it's not the Pittsburgh game that did it to me. I've been waiting for a chance to spew my distaste for our offseason moves this year.

The truth is I never heard anything about Cotch wanting out of here 5 months ago. I only heard, and based my opinion, on the idea that he asked to leave after we signed plax. When it all comes down to it I think I wish that there was just a little more loyalty than there is. We have this idea that people WANT to play here because of Rex etc yet we lost more than we gained IMO. I would like to see us take care of the Shaun Ellis' and cotcherys of the world. I'm not saying to dump boat loads of money on aging players. Look at Pitt. They NEVER break the bank for an aging great like Greg Lloyd or Kevin Green ( NE gave ellis way more than I thought was required) but I think if we offered Shaun 2.5 mil he never would have gone to NE and would have signed. Now we're counting on some unproven rooks. It's that type of stuff that bothers me. I feel how I feel. I hope we can cover all the loses of course, but this stinks like feet to me.

Loyalty doesn't win football games. Loyalty gets you to overpay Curtis Martin and Wayne Chrebet when they're too old, and gets you to give Chad Pennington a $64 million deal with $18 million guaranteed.

F*** loyalty. I'm only loyal to the green & white, not players who don't want to be here. Its not like these athletes by and large give a damn about anyone but themselves anyways.

And really, you're worried about the D-Line? lol. NO ONE in the NFL is better at evaluating and progressing DL talent than Rex Ryan. We wouldn't have let Shaun Ellis and Trevor Pryce go so easily if we didn't think we had players in Wilkerson and Kenrick Ellis. I'm especially excited about Kenrick.

[Doggin94it]

You would have a point if Cotchery hadn't already proved he's a top receiver. All he needed to do was prove he was healthy, and he looks pretty healthy to me...

"Top receiver"?

You're anointing a guy who never had more than 1,130 yards receiving (and topped 1,000 only that year), never had more than 82 receptions (and topped 70 only 3 times in his career) and never had more than 6 receiving TDs in a season a "top receiver"?

Come on, now. Cotchery;s a good player, I liked him a lot when he was here (well, a lot until I heard he had asked out because his ego couldn't deal with being a No. 3), but the whining and doom saying over a guy who was - at best - a decent starting WR is insane.

Just let it go, already.

[Doggin94it]

I thought he looked great actually, especially with no name WRs since the starters were out.

More importantly, would you trade Vick and Lynch for Ray Rice and Big Ben? I have this trade offer open for me, that would essentially give me a team with LeSean McCoy and Ray Rice as my RBs, D-Jax and Maclin as my top 2 wideouts, Ben or Eli as my QB, Dallas Clark at TE. Sure I have no real 3WR but that's a loaded team. I had Braylon but I cut him for Roy Williams, and have Plax, those 2 will share 3WR duties.

Actually let me list the teams:

Current:

Vick/Eli

D-Jax

Maclin

Roy Williams/Plax/MSW

LeSean McCoy

Ryan Grant/Lynch/Daniel Thomas

Dallas Clark

After trade:

Ben/Eli

D-Jax

Maclin

Roy/Plax/MSW

LeSean McCoy

Ray Rice

Dallas Clark

Both teams look loaded to me, just which do you think is even more loaded? Probably one of the better teams I've had in fantasy.

Make the trade. Right now, you are starting the Eagles' QB and top two WRs. If the Eagles passing game has a bad game, you lose. Spread that risk out a bit.

[Matt39]

Would you trade Andre Johnson for Vick...fantasy question obviously.

[Lupz27]

Untrue. He didn't want to be an after thought any more. We were bringing in guys that haven't played in 2 1/2 years or are 37 years old and making them higher than him on the depth chart. he never did anything accept play his a$$ off for us and the last three seasons we brought guys in to be ahead of him. he was tired of it understandably. Last year he made that critical first down catch where he stretched out sideways with a torn groin. He earned more respect than we gave him. The same as Leon did. Just because we are jets fans does not mean we have to be behind every single move they make. That's for political parties. We screwed up with Cotch. It was 100% our front offices fault. I just hope these other two guys we brought in can hold up the weight of letting BE. brad Smith AND Cotch all go in one season.

No your statement is UNTRUE he asked for a trade in FEBRUARY, way before we signed ANY WR's including Holmes, as far as he knew he could have been No. 1 on the depth chart if the Jets couldnt find a way to sign any of the guys he did, unless Cotch has a crystal ball that tells the future, then I apologize and carry on.

[Barcs]

No your statement is UNTRUE he asked for a trade in FEBRUARY, way before we signed ANY WR's including Holmes, as far as he knew he could have been No. 1 on the depth chart if the Jets couldnt find a way to sign any of the guys he did, unless Cotch has a crystal ball that tells the future, then I apologize and carry on.

Careful about that. Logical factual posts aren't acceptable here. It gives the negative nancies less to hate and be angry about and we can't have that.

[GREENBEAN]

Loyalty doesn't win football games. Loyalty gets you to overpay Curtis Martin and Wayne Chrebet when they're too old, and gets you to give Chad Pennington a $64 million deal with $18 million guaranteed.

F*** loyalty. I'm only loyal to the green & white, not players who don't want to be here. Its not like these athletes by and large give a damn about anyone but themselves anyways.

And really, you're worried about the D-Line? lol. NO ONE in the NFL is better at evaluating and progressing DL talent than Rex Ryan. We wouldn't have let Shaun Ellis and Trevor Pryce go so easily if we didn't think we had players in Wilkerson and Kenrick Ellis. I'm especially excited about Kenrick.

LOL???? At the d line? Dude, come on. I'm as excited as anyone about the two young guys, but if we're being honest we have no idea what they will be able to do. Ellis had three sacks in the playoff game against the Pats LAST SEASON. This is not someone who didn't produce. Oh...lets' say one or both of them gets injured, which almost never happened to Ellis, and we are stuck with who again? The same D line we had last year, minus it's strongest player. Last season we had two guys Jenkins and Pito that got hurt and screwed us, but at least we had vets who could play. The idea that we are as confident in two kids who have never played in the NFL just show's how a lot of guys here are like sheep who just follow whatever is done. I agree with you that we shouldn't over pay and over commit to guys, but Ellis, Cotch, BE and Smith were contributors. Major contributors actually. We are weaker without them. Point blank. and please stop with all these question marks we have as being strengths. Plax has not played since nov of 08. and has already been hurt. Mason is 37, was cut from the Ravens and is already hurt. Kendrick and Wilk are completely unproven kids. Kerely is the same thing. Mcnight sucks IMO and ducked a block the other night that got the new kid QB killed. Pito has literally never done a single thing outside of rupture his Achilles on Hard Knocks. These are the guy who are supposed to take us from two time AFC championship games to the next level? really?

And to comment on curtis Martin. He will soon be the first Jet to enter the Hall Of Fame since Don Friggin Maynard. I think that warrants a little loyalty no? I'm seriously bothered by the way people talk sometimes.

[GREENBEAN]

No your statement is UNTRUE he asked for a trade in FEBRUARY, way before we signed ANY WR's including Holmes, as far as he knew he could have been No. 1 on the depth chart if the Jets couldnt find a way to sign any of the guys he did, unless Cotch has a crystal ball that tells the future, then I apologize and carry on.

Yeah Yeah. Ok so I had a lack of info there. That's my bad.

[GREENBEAN]

Careful about that. Logical factual posts aren't acceptable here. It gives the negative nancies less to hate and be angry about and we can't have that.

Give me a break dude. Try saying something with substance once in a while instead of just being a turd. Who asked you anyway?

[sirlancemehlot]

Like I said in my initial post, you don't have to agree with everything the front office does

WHAT?? YES YOU DO!! YES YOU ABSOLUTELY DOO!! THE FO IS NEVER WRONG!! Seriously, the FO knows what its doing and I'll defer to them at all times in all matters because they right! Cotch was slow and dumb! And not handsome! He is damaged goods! He is a whiner who should've been farmer-snotted on before he left. Before he ASKED TO LEAVE, which is in no way the fault of the front office. Cotch was just being surly. He is a disgruntled, creaky vet who catches TD's over 4th stringers! Big deal. We owe him nothing. The FO is right on this. And Vernon gholston is going to have a breakout year any season now and Vlad Ducasse has huge upside and Schlegel was on the cusp of greatness before our FO unceremoniously gave up on him due to pressure from guys like you!!! Please start agreeing with the Jets Organization and blindly follow. It is what's best for our collective psyche. All hail Tannenbaum! And screw Ellis, Ihedigbo, Cotchery Smith, Woodhead, and all those other retread pukes. And as for Aso...we didn't need him anyway. And as for Oline depth...we've got Vlad and that stubby center kid. We are going to rock...due to Tanny...not in spite of him!

Whose side are you on, son? Don't you love your Jets? Then how about getting with the program? Why don't you jump on the team and come on in for the big win?

[Bleedin Green]

WHAT?? YES YOU DO!! YES YOU ABSOLUTELY DOO!! THE FO IS NEVER WRONG!! Seriously, the FO knows what its doing and I'll defer to them at all times in all matters because they right! Cotch was slow and dumb! And not handsome! He is damaged goods! He is a whiner who should've been farmer-snotted on before he left. Before he ASKED TO LEAVE, which is in no way the fault of the front office. Cotch was just being surly. He is a disgruntled, creaky vet who catches TD's over 4th stringers! Big deal. We owe him nothing. The FO is right on this. And Vernon gholston is going to have a breakout year any season now and Vlad Ducasse has huge upside and Schlegel was on the cusp of greatness before our FO unceremoniously gave up on him due to pressure from guys like you!!! Please start agreeing with the Jets Organization and blindly follow. It is what's best for our collective psyche. All hail Tannenbaum! And screw Ellis, Ihedigbo, Cotchery Smith, Woodhead, and all those other retread pukes. And as for Aso...we didn't need him anyway. And as for Oline depth...we've got Vlad and that stubby center kid. We are going to rock...due to Tanny...not in spite of him!

Whose side are you on, son? Don't you love your Jets? Then how about getting with the program? Why don't you jump on the team and come on in for the big win?

Solid contribution.

[#27TheDominator]

LOL???? At the d line? Dude, come on. I'm as excited as anyone about the two young guys, but if we're being honest we have no idea what they will be able to do. Ellis had three sacks in the playoff game against the Pats LAST SEASON. This is not someone who didn't produce. Oh...lets' say one or both of them gets injured, which almost never happened to Ellis, and we are stuck with who again? The same D line we had last year, minus it's strongest player. Last season we had two guys Jenkins and Pito that got hurt and screwed us, but at least we had vets who could play. The idea that we are as confident in two kids who have never played in the NFL just show's how a lot of guys here are like sheep who just follow whatever is done. I agree with you that we shouldn't over pay and over commit to guys, but Ellis, Cotch, BE and Smith were contributors. Major contributors actually. We are weaker without them. Point blank. and please stop with all these question marks we have as being strengths. Plax has not played since nov of 08. and has already been hurt. Mason is 37, was cut from the Ravens and is already hurt. Kendrick and Wilk are completely unproven kids. Kerely is the same thing. Mcnight sucks IMO and ducked a block the other night that got the new kid QB killed. Pito has literally never done a single thing outside of rupture his Achilles on Hard Knocks. These are the guy who are supposed to take us from two time AFC championship games to the next level? really?

And to comment on curtis Martin. He will soon be the first Jet to enter the Hall Of Fame since Don Friggin Maynard. I think that warrants a little loyalty no? I'm seriously bothered by the way people talk sometimes.

I completely disagree with you saying that the team is weaker. Completely. It's a matter of opinion and you are certainly entitled to yours, but please remember that it's no more factual than what any of us that have been accused of "ballwashing the FO" have been saying. We are supposed to value Ellis for being "a vet" who almost never got hurt, but Derrick Mason is a question mark? Quick, which one has played in all 16 games for the past 8 seasons? Which one was suspended for a drug related offense as recently as 2009? I feel that Burress will give us a dimension that we didn't get from Edwards. I understand your skepticism. Pitoitua is better than you are giving him credit. He was on roster all of '09 and played some. Rex said that he played around 150 snaps in 2009. When the Jets defense was ranked what? 3rd overall? Dixon is a capable DE and while I won't argue that Ellis wasn't effective, he wasn't our best Dlineman. He was our third best.

It's simple. Ellis wanted money. Brad Smith wanted money. It was money they weren't worth to the Jets. Certainly Smith whose deal will be on the books for years. I don't know what the **** was wrong with Cotchery, but they kept their word with him and he wasn't worth the money he had left on his deal. Edwards is the one guy you have a point about, but NOBODY would pay him. I can understand wanting to keep him, but I can't see killing the Jets FO for making the same decision as 31 other teams. Burress and Mason are on one year deals. That's a good thing. If the team likes them, they can bring them back. IF it doesn't they aren't on the hook.

[GREENBEAN]

I completely disagree with you saying that the team is weaker. Completely. It's a matter of opinion and you are certainly entitled to yours, but please remember that it's no more factual than what any of us that have been accused of "ballwashing the FO" have been saying. We are supposed to value Ellis for being "a vet" who almost never got hurt, but Derrick Mason is a question mark? Quick, which one has played in all 16 games for the past 8 seasons? Which one was suspended for a drug related offense as recently as 2009? I feel that Burress will give us a dimension that we didn't get from Edwards. I understand your skepticism. Pitoitua is better than you are giving him credit. He was on roster all of '09 and played some. Rex said that he played around 150 snaps in 2009. When the Jets defense was ranked what? 3rd overall? Dixon is a capable DE and while I won't argue that Ellis wasn't effective, he wasn't our best Dlineman. He was our third best.

It's simple. Ellis wanted money. Brad Smith wanted money. It was money they weren't worth to the Jets. Certainly Smith whose deal will be on the books for years. I don't know what the **** was wrong with Cotchery, but they kept their word with him and he wasn't worth the money he had left on his deal. Edwards is the one guy you have a point about, but NOBODY would pay him. I can understand wanting to keep him, but I can't see killing the Jets FO for making the same decision as 31 other teams. Burress and Mason are on one year deals. That's a good thing. If the team likes them, they can bring them back. IF it doesn't they aren't on the hook.

Ballwashing. lol I like that.

Very well spoken IMO. It's not that I don't want to see Pito and Plax and everyone else we have now flourish. I seriously support us. I've had arguments with miami fan morons and been on the same side you are on now. It goes both ways with me. I want the Jets FO to be correct on everything, but simply see things differently and hoped for different outcomes with some guys. Losing ellis, cotch, Smith, BE, Digs.....and ..... Clemens all in one year is a tough pill for me. Especially when the guys we brought in are question marks. I hear ya on Mason, but he's ooooooooold man.

Let this be known. I am in complete support of our Jets and will once again base my early weeks happiness on what we do on Sun. I just disagree with some moves. And I do think Ellis was our best D lineman last season, while I appreciate and highly value both Devito and Pouha

In Maybin we trust!!!!!! lol

[GREENBEAN]

Solid contribution.

agreed.

[#27TheDominator]

Ballwashing. lol I like that.

Very well spoken IMO. It's not that I don't want to see Pito and Plax and everyone else we have now flourish. I seriously support us. I've had arguments with miami fan morons and been on the same side you are on now. It goes both ways with me. I want the Jets FO to be correct on everything, but simply see things differently and hoped for different outcomes with some guys. Losing ellis, cotch, Smith, BE, Digs.....and ..... Clemens all in one year is a tough pill for me. Especially when the guys we brought in are question marks. I hear ya on Mason, but he's ooooooooold man.

Let this be known. I am in complete support of our Jets and will once again base my early weeks happiness on what we do on Sun. I just disagree with some moves. And I do think Ellis was our best D lineman last season, while I appreciate and highly value both Devito and Pouha

In Maybin we trust!!!!!! lol

I'm not asking you to blindly support everything. I am saying that it is silly to bash them for moves like Plaxico when we haven't even seen the guy play. Same with Mason. Judge the risk vs. the reward. They had Burress in. They saw him run. I've seen him with the juggs machine and he looks A LOT better catching the ball than Edwards. He's older and not as fast. I see too much - these guys are too old or these guys aren't proven posts. You can't have a proven vet between 26 and 28 at every position. Voice your concerns, but don't tell me they are worse because they very well might be MUCH better. For instance I saw where somebody said the Pats DLine is better than the Jets. It might be, but it might be a hell of a lot worse. They have a lot of fat old ****s, we have a lot of fat unproven ****s. We'll see whose fat ****s perform better.