Brace yourself, NFL. It looks like Bill Belichick plans to come back from the lockout with guns blazing.

[PatriotReign37]

Why are you talking about the Jets?

This thread is about how awesome and perfect the Pats are and you said they would only win 8-9 games.

Sanchez = Matt Cassel + Donovan McNabb

[JiFtheOracle]

Sanchezs alleged improvement is a myth.

His completion percentage still sucks after 2 years and hes been dinking and dunking this preseason trying to bring it up close to the elite QBs of the league. Hes a Wannabe.

In 2009 he threw the ball 392 times for a 54.6 completion %. 13 TDs and 20 INTs. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb2009'>http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb2009

In 2010 he threw the ball 537 times for a 55.5 completion %. 17 TDs and 13 INTs. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb

So, Sanchez threw the ball 145 more times in 2010 and only had 4 more TDs. Thats improvement? No, its not. Its the same amount of attempts per TD as 2009. And, before you try to spin that Sanchez had less INTs in 2010. Sanchez led the NFL in dropped INTs, AGAIN! http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/38447/sheer-luck-buoyed-mark-sanchezs-stats. Sooner or later luck is going to run out and he wont have the Jim Caldwells of the league calling timeouts allowing him a desperate chance to win a playoff game.

While, this thread isnt about the Jets and its about the Pats greatness...this is a very good post.

I see no improvement whatsoever from Sanchez. I mean flipping your TD:INT ratio really doesnt mean you've improved. Bust.

[Bleedin Green]

Sanchezs alleged improvement is a myth.

His completion percentage still sucks after 2 years and hes been dinking and dunking this preseason trying to bring it up close to the elite QBs of the league. Hes a Wannabe.

In 2009 he threw the ball 392 times for a 54.6 completion %. 13 TDs and 20 INTs. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb2009'>http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb2009

In 2010 he threw the ball 537 times for a 55.5 completion %. 17 TDs and 13 INTs. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb

So, Sanchez threw the ball 145 more times in 2010 and only had 4 more TDs. Thats improvement? No, its not. Its the same amount of attempts per TD as 2009. And, before you try to spin that Sanchez had less INTs in 2010. Sanchez led the NFL in dropped INTs, AGAIN! http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/38447/sheer-luck-buoyed-mark-sanchezs-stats. Sooner or later luck is going to run out and he wont have the Jim Caldwells of the league calling timeouts allowing him a desperate chance to win a playoff game.

Sanchez = Matt Cassel + Donovan McNabb

54/89 (60.7%), 616 yds (6.9 YPA), 5 TDs, 1 INT, 95.5 passer rating

[Klecko73isGod]

Sanchez = Matt Cassel + Donovan McNabb

This is getting sad. Every one of your posts reads like a desperate man trying to convince himself.

[gangreenman]

While, this thread isnt about the Jets and its about the Pats greatness...this is a very good post.

I see no improvement whatsoever from Sanchez. I mean flipping your TD:INT ratio really doesnt mean you've improved. Bust.

Correct. Same for increasing your completion % despite throwing 145 more times. Neither indicate any sort of improvement whatsoever.

[PFSIKH]

LOL, of course!

Brady is a great player, but at 34 and no longer clutch (his string of sub-par postseason performances eveidence of such) he's not going to lead you guys to a championship again. It's what naturally happens in the NFL.

The inherent flaw in the Patriots is that it's a team of mediocre talent led by a HOF QB whom the HC gameplans on being perfect every game. Whenever Brady does not play well the Pats are on the verge of losing by 2 TDs. There is not a single "big game" player left on the Pats roster. There's no player on there who can snatch victory from the jaws of defeat.

What's truly troubling is that the Pats haven't just lost postseason games in recent years, but HOME games and Brady has looked like crap in them. With that as a prologue, whenever the situation gets tough the players seem to get tight. We saw that in the Jets game.

The Jets weren't up by that much and Jim Nance was BEGGING the Pats for a comeback, but every Pats player was as tight as can be. Players don't forget that. "Oh no, it's happening again," can't be easily forgotten.

Finally, the worst thing for the Pats is that everything is meaningless until January. They can go 16-0 again and it won't matter until their first playoff game. What happens if Brady throws an early pick again? Will the Pats crumble again?

You do not think these issues are part of Brady's problems?

First, your numbers are wrong, Brady has 30TDs and 16 INTs in the post season.

Second, everything before 2004 is largely irrelevant. That was a special team (especially on D). After the 2004 Superbowl, things started to unravel. Tedy had his heart issue at the pro bowl. Rodeny Harrison missed most of the next year. Ted Johnson left. The players got old and left due to age or money.

Last, is the book closed on titles for Belichick and Brady? Remains to be seen. I do not buy into the age thing as much as you do. At 32 and 33, Montana was an incredible 6-0 w/18 TDs and 1 INT. Go look at his numbers before and after that. Before: 0-3 0 TDs-4 INTs. After 3-3 9 TDs-5 INTs.

While Brady is not Montana, an over 30 QB can excel, he just needs talent as does every QB. Dynasties do not die as much as they get old. If the young talent turns [otential into reality, the Patriots could make another run and take a title or two before Brady retires.

[SMC]

You do not think these issues are part of Brady's problems?

First, your numbers are wrong, Brady has 30TDs and 16 INTs in the post season.

Second, everything before 2004 is largely irrelevant. That was a special team (especially on D). After the 2004 Superbowl, things started to unravel. Tedy had his heart issue at the pro bowl. Rodeny Harrison missed most of the next year. Ted Johnson left. The players got old and left due to age or money.

Last, is the book closed on titles for Belichick and Brady? Remains to be seen. I do not buy into the age thing as much as you do. At 32 and 33, Montana was an incredible 6-0 w/18 TDs and 1 INT. Go look at his numbers before and after that. Before: 0-3 0 TDs-4 INTs. After 3-3 9 TDs-5 INTs.

While Brady is not Montana, an over 30 QB can excel, he just needs talent as does every QB. Dynasties do not die as much as they get old. If the young talent turns potential into reality, the Patriots could make another run and take a title or two before Brady retires.

LOL, you're really going to go the "numbers are wrong" route. Well, I corrected it which makes Brady look even worse in comparison.

Postseason Record & TD/INT

10-0 - 14 TDs 3 INTs

4-5 - 16 TDs 13 INTs

Dynasties certainly get old and the Pats dynasty did. Now all that remains is the unclutch Brady and a team of front running players afraid of the big moment. You mention the "young talent turn[ing] potential into reality" but what talent is that on offense? The TEs? Brady's postseason success hinges on 2 young TEs?

The bottom line is that Brady has thrown a ton of killer INTs in the last 9 postseason games resulting in a 4-5 record, despite stellar regular seasons in between. That is endemic.

[Klecko73isGod]

LOL, you're really going to go the "numbers are wrong" route. Well, I corrected it which makes Brady look even worse in comparison.

Postseason Record & TD/INT

10-0 - 14 TDs 3 INTs

4-5 - 16 TDs 13 INTs

Dynasties certainly get old and the Pats dynasty did. Now all that remains is the unclutch Brady and a team of front running players afraid of the big moment. You mention the "young talent turn[ing] potential into reality" but what talent is that on offense? The TEs? Brady's postseason success hinges on 2 young TEs?

The bottom line is that Brady has thrown a ton of killer INTs in the last 9 postseason games resulting in a 4-5 record, despite stellar regular seasons in between. That is endemic.

I also have to keep mentioning the Pats stunning inability to make effective adjustments in recent years. Can you remember a notable comeback against a good team in the last few years?

If you take a lead into halftime against that team these days, there is very little chance they are mounting a comeback. That never used to be the case.

[PFSIKH]

LOL, you're really going to go the "numbers are wrong" route. Well, I corrected it which makes Brady look even worse in comparison.

Postseason Record & TD/INT

10-0 - 14 TDs 3 INTs

4-5 - 16 TDs 13 INTs

Dynasties certainly get old and the Pats dynasty did. Now all that remains is the unclutch Brady and a team of front running players afraid of the big moment. You mention the "young talent turn[ing] potential into reality" but what talent is that on offense? The TEs? Brady's postseason success hinges on 2 young TEs?

The bottom line is that Brady has thrown a ton of killer INTs in the last 9 postseason games resulting in a 4-5 record, despite stellar regular seasons in between. That is endemic.

It is all I got man.

I am talking more on the defensive side.

For all the talk about Brady not coming up in the playoffs, he did drive the Patriots to the go ahead TD against the Giants with less than 3 minutes to go, but the D literally let ball slip through their hands. Same with the Jets last year. He did throw the horrible momentum killing INT. However, as Bart said, the D not stop a nose bleed as Brady kept getting close only to have the Jets respond and all props to the Jets for their role in the matter.

I am not saying he is not culpable to a degree. He certainly is responsible. All I am saying is the door is not completely closed yet. It is not completely open either.

I also have to keep mentioning the Pats stunning inability to make effective adjustments in recent years. Can you remember a notable comeback against a good team in the last few years?

If you take a lead into halftime against that team these days, there is very little chance they are mounting a comeback. That never used to be the case.

Last year down by 10 in the 4th to the Ravens?

[Klecko73isGod]

It is all I got man.

I am talking more on the defensive side.

For all the talk about Brady not coming up in the playoffs, he did drive the Patriots to the go ahead TD against the Giants with less than 3 minutes to go, but the D literally let ball slip through their hands. Same with the Jets last year. He did throw the horrible momentum killing INT. However, as Bart said, the D not stop a nose bleed as Brady kept getting close only to have the Jets respond and all props to the Jets for their role in the matter.

I am not saying he is not culpable to a degree. He certainly is responsible. All I am saying is the door is not completely closed yet. It is not completely open either.

Last year down by 10 in the 4th to the Ravens?

Did they? Pats comebacks used to get all kinds of national media attention.

Was it the Pats making plays or did Flacco fold like cheap suit like he does in the postseason?

[Klecko73isGod]

Last year down by 10 in the 4th to the Ravens?

Meh, looks like a typical Brady comeback - relying on the kicker to win the game because he can't punch it in like a real man.

[Bleedin Green]

It is all I got man.

I am talking more on the defensive side.

For all the talk about Brady not coming up in the playoffs, he did drive the Patriots to the go ahead TD against the Giants with less than 3 minutes to go, but the D literally let ball slip through their hands. Same with the Jets last year. He did throw the horrible momentum killing INT. However, as Bart said, the D not stop a nose bleed as Brady kept getting close only to have the Jets respond and all props to the Jets for their role in the matter.

I am not saying he is not culpable to a degree. He certainly is responsible. All I am saying is the door is not completely closed yet. It is not completely open either.

Last year down by 10 in the 4th to the Ravens?

I do think that's a fair point. There's no single player responsible for the change in the Pats postseason fortunes, and while Brady himself hasn't played at the same level in some of these playoffs losses than he was early in his career, it's also difficult to argue against the fact that he's also got a lot less support than he used to have, particularly on the defensive side. Of course that also then gets into the debate about whether Brady got too much credit for the Pats fortunes to begin with, but that's a whole different discussion.

I guess not even necesarily from a statistical standpoint, but just expectations, the biggest changes were when he was a guy who pretty much everyone expected that if he had the ball in his hands late in a game and they were within a score he would pull it off. While it's not that he's incapable of it, it's just that it's certainly no longer a given with him any longer. As much as I enjoyed it as a Jets fan, I still remember not believing see Brady essentially tossing game-losing INTs in back to back playoff games in the 06 playoffs (getting ridiculously lucky to get the ball back the first time).

[PFSIKH]

I do think that's a fair point. There's no single player responsible for the change in the Pats postseason fortunes, and while Brady himself hasn't played at the same level in some of these playoffs losses than he was early in his career, it's also difficult to argue against the fact that he's also got a lot less support than he used to have, particularly on the defensive side. Of course that also then gets into the debate about whether Brady got too much credit for the Pats fortunes to begin with, but that's a whole different discussion.

I guess not even necesarily from a statistical standpoint, but just expectations, the biggest changes were when he was a guy who pretty much everyone expected that if he had the ball in his hands late in a game and they were within a score he would pull it off. While it's not that he's incapable of it, it's just that it's certainly no longer a given with him any longer. As much as I enjoyed it as a Jets fan, I still remember not believing see Brady essentially tossing game-losing INTs in back to back playoff games in the 06 playoffs (getting ridiculously lucky to get the ball back the first time).

Fair points as well BG.

It is the old saying, "too much credit for winning and too much blame for losing."

[Larz]

srsly, watching belicheat run up the score in august to make himself feel relevant is sad. ok, not sad, pathetic

[Drums]

The Giants broke the Patriots in the Super Bowl. They haven't been the same since. This is Bill's last straw.

[PatriotReign37]

Fair points as well BG.

It is the old saying, "too much credit for winning and too much blame for losing."

At Denver in 05 Brady threw that awful INT for a TD to Champ Bailey. The Pats were in the redzone and would have at least had 3 points on that drive. It went downhill from there and the defense didnt do a good job vs Jake Plummer.

At Indy in 06 the Pats were up big at the half, but couldnt stop Manning in the 2nd half. Still, the Pats had a chance to win the game in the 4th quarter by picking up a first down to run the clock out. Didnt happen.

You already mentioned 07.

[Garb]

srsly, watching belicheat run up the score in august to make himself feel relevant is sad. ok, not sad, pathetic

Handing the ball off and running is running up the score now? Gee, I guess he ought to instruct his qb to take a knee on every down. No need to evaluate players or anything....

[Garb]

At Denver in 05 Brady threw that awful INT for a TD to Champ Bailey. The Pats were in the redzone and would have at least had 3 points on that drive. It went downhill from there and the defense didnt do a good job vs Jake Plummer.

At Indy in 06 the Pats were up big at the half, but couldnt stop Manning in the 2nd half. Still, the Pats had a chance to win the game in the 4th quarter by picking up a first down to run the clock out. Didnt happen.

You already mentioned 07.

'06 was awful....and proof that road games - cross country road games - kill yah eventually. Reche Caldwell being your number 1 receiver doesn't help either. First, the defense totally got gassed. You can't choke away that kind of a lead unless you are gassed. The Game in San Diego (clutch play by my boy Troy Brown to secure the victory) just took the 60 minute umph out of 'em. (The same thing happened to your Jets last year when they unloaded too much emotion in Foxboro). Second, Reche bug-eyes Caldwell can kiss my a$$.

Honest to G-d, I sometimes think that choke job to Indy hurts more than the SB loss to the Giants. Why? 1) It was a choke. Giants game, on the other hand, well, the Giants Defense was amazing and d-bag Manning part Duex came up big when needed. Not a choke. They were out played, out schemed, out coached). 2) I KNOW the Pats would have beat Chicago. Even with the personnel they had - i.e., Caldwell, Gaffney, bad Corey, etc. 3) Indy - ugh.

[SMC]

It is all I got man.

I am talking more on the defensive side.

For all the talk about Brady not coming up in the playoffs, he did drive the Patriots to the go ahead TD against the Giants with less than 3 minutes to go, but the D literally let ball slip through their hands. Same with the Jets last year. He did throw the horrible momentum killing INT. However, as Bart said, the D not stop a nose bleed as Brady kept getting close only to have the Jets respond and all props to the Jets for their role in the matter.

I am not saying he is not culpable to a degree. He certainly is responsible. All I am saying is the door is not completely closed yet. It is not completely open either.

This is the thing: the rest of the Pats' players play up to form, more or less, in the postseason the 9 games, but Brady has played BELOW his regular season standard. That's why I call Brady culpable.

I agree with you about the notion that there is too much credit and too much blame, but if Brady plays like he normally plays, the Pats are not 4-5 in their last 9. I even think you'd have 2 more championships if Brady played like his regular season self (in 2006 AFCCG and 2007 SB). So if everything is equal and the 1 key player plays worse than normal and you lose? That key player deserves the lion share of the blame.

And, Garb, 2006 WAS worse than 2007. We love 2007 because it's the sexy fail, losing out on immortality, but 2006 was absolutely brutal. An 18 point lead (the biggest lead blown in the history of the NFL in a championship game, old NFL title, current conference, and SB) evaborates after a half. And it happened against an arch rival. That's 2004 Yanks-Sox. Your only hope is that the Pats rebound from that like the Yanks did in 2009.

[Larz]

LOOK OUT NFL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[JetsFanInDenver]

SO what happened to the blazing guns ?

[PatriotReign37]

SO what happened to the blazing guns ?

Hurricane Irene

[Klecko73isGod]

Hurricane Irene

That's some powerful hurricane to impact a game played indoors in Detroit.

How badly hurt was Welker? I heard he left the game with a neck injury.

[ZachEY]

Hurricane Irene

Well, that was pretty good.

[JetsFanInDenver]

Hurricane Irene

Ahhh...so that's what you call the Lions nowadays!

Not surprising. The way the Lions whipped the Pats i am sure it felt like a hurricane!

[Jetsin1999]

The Pats O-line still looking very vulnerable from last year to this one. Brady taking more hits than I can remember.

[RutgersJetFan]

Sanchez = Matt Cassel + Donovan McNabb

The funniest part about this post is that it's actually not as poor of a statistical analysis as the preceding one.

[RutgersJetFan]

Why is Boston so racist?

It is odd, one would think that a city populated by inbreeding, alcoholic Irishmen would be more tolerant of minorities.

[PatriotReign37]

The funniest part about this post is that it's actually not as poor of a statistical analysis as the preceding one.

The stats dont lie about Sanchez, but do bury your head in the sand.

[ZachEY]

I don't know. Each year, for at least the last 4-5, I've heard that the this is the year the Pats completely fall apart. They lost this guy, they lost that guy, they're too young, they're starting a rookie at this position. We can dance on their graves all we want because we beat them last year, but lets not forget they only lost to one other team the entire season. And in the playoffs, in all likelihood, they were an Alge Crumpler dropped pass away from beating us. While I like the Jets chances against the Pats right now, I just don't see any reason to predict their demise. They can beat us, they've proven that, and outside of the lions this preseason, and a flukey Browns game last season, I'm not seeing a lot of people beating them.

My guess is, they win at least 12 games again this season, and go into the playoffs with as real a shot as us, the Ravens, the Steelers, and if Manning is heathy, the Colts, to emerge from the AFC. Hasn't anyone learned anything from trying to dance on their graves every single year? I'll bury them when they lose 8 games in a season. Until then, we're going to have to fight it out with them again for the division. And, until then, they're still probably going to win the division because while we've proven them beatable, they make less mistakes than us.

[Ryno the Jet]

My guess is, they win at least 12 games again this season, and go into the playoffs with as real a shot as us, the Ravens, the Steelers, and if Manning is heathy, the Colts, to emerge from the AFC...they're still probably going to win the division because while we've proven them beatable, they make less mistakes than us.

Reverse psychology is a technique involving the advocacy of a belief or behavior that is opposite to the one desired, with the expectation that this approach will encourage the subject of the persuasion to do what actually is desired: the opposite of what is suggested. This technique relies on the psychological phenomenon of reactance, in which a person has a negative emotional response in reaction to being persuaded, and thus chooses the option which is being advocated against.

Ahh, I get it!

[JetsFanInDenver]

The stats dont lie about Sanchez, but do bury your head in the sand.

The same Sanchez that led the JETS offense when they beat the Pats in their own crib when it mattered the most!

The results don't lie, but do bury your heads in the sand!

[Klecko73isGod]

I don't know. Each year, for at least the last 4-5, I've heard that the this is the year the Pats completely fall apart. They lost this guy, they lost that guy, they're too young, they're starting a rookie at this position. We can dance on their graves all we want because we beat them last year, but lets not forget they only lost to one other team the entire season. And in the playoffs, in all likelihood, they were an Alge Crumpler dropped pass away from beating us. While I like the Jets chances against the Pats right now, I just don't see any reason to predict their demise. They can beat us, they've proven that, and outside of the lions this preseason, and a flukey Browns game last season, I'm not seeing a lot of people beating them.

My guess is, they win at least 12 games again this season, and go into the playoffs with as real a shot as us, the Ravens, the Steelers, and if Manning is heathy, the Colts, to emerge from the AFC. Hasn't anyone learned anything from trying to dance on their graves every single year? I'll bury them when they lose 8 games in a season. Until then, we're going to have to fight it out with them again for the division. And, until then, they're still probably going to win the division because while we've proven them beatable, they make less mistakes than us.

Maybe on Jets fans sites but certainly not in the media. According the media they are always insanely awesome and every move they make is hailed as brilliant and guaranteed to put them over the top (even if is something they would have eviscerated another team for doing.)

Even this year, they blow out two teams in the preseason (including in their first game against the Jags in which very few starters played) and all of a sudden they are the team to beat and Belichick is "putting the rest of the league on notice." Then they get their asses handed to them in the third preseason game (which the media always tells us is the only preseason game you can ever tell anything from) and it's written off by the same media as "meh, its just a preseason game."

I'm not saying they are going to be terrible, but I don't see any legitimate reason to fear them anymore. But this worship at the altar of Belichick by the media is beyond ridiculous at this point.

[SenorGato]

I don't know. Each year, for at least the last 4-5, I've heard that the this is the year the Pats completely fall apart. They lost this guy, they lost that guy, they're too young, they're starting a rookie at this position. We can dance on their graves all we want because we beat them last year, but lets not forget they only lost to one other team the entire season. And in the playoffs, in all likelihood, they were an Alge Crumpler dropped pass away from beating us. While I like the Jets chances against the Pats right now, I just don't see any reason to predict their demise. They can beat us, they've proven that, and outside of the lions this preseason, and a flukey Browns game last season, I'm not seeing a lot of people beating them.

My guess is, they win at least 12 games again this season, and go into the playoffs with as real a shot as us, the Ravens, the Steelers, and if Manning is heathy, the Colts, to emerge from the AFC. Hasn't anyone learned anything from trying to dance on their graves every single year? I'll bury them when they lose 8 games in a season. Until then, we're going to have to fight it out with them again for the division. And, until then, they're still probably going to win the division because while we've proven them beatable, they make less mistakes than us.

And they do this with Tom Brady, dat O-line, Vince Wilfork, and a group of really young DBs. It's complete and utter horesh*t I say.

[ZachEY]

Maybe on Jets fans sites but certainly not in the media. According the media they are always insanely awesome and every move they make is hailed as brilliant and guaranteed to put them over the top (even if is something they would have eviscerated another team for doing.)

Even this year, they blow out two teams in the preseason (including in their first game against the Jags in which very few starters played) and all of a sudden they are the team to beat and Belichick is "putting the rest of the league on notice." Then they get their asses handed to them in the third preseason game (which the media always tells us is the only preseason game you can ever tell anything from) and it's written off by the same media as "meh, its just a preseason game."

I'm not saying they are going to be terrible, but I don't see any legitimate reason to fear them anymore. But this worship at the altar of Belichick by the media is beyond ridiculous at this point.

Are there actually any articles that are saying, "it's just preseason"?