Rex: "You see the difference a great quarterback makes in this league."

[JoeWillie]

Wait... You think Favre actually listened to Schotty?

Ok.

If you remember during that season, Favre caught alot of heat from Mangini about stupid picks down the field early in the season.

Now I know Favre was a stubborn prick, but there is no denying that he threw the ball short more in his days as a Jet than any other team he ever played for.

[PFSIKH]

Anybody see the stat last night that the Jets have the least amount of pass attempts in the league over 30 yards?

I believe they threw 1 pass over 30 yards last night?

Maybe it wasn't Chad after all?

Even when one of the greatest gunslingers in the history of the league, Brett Favre was here, there were complaints about the excessive check downs ... even Favre.

Now Sanchez.

What do they all have in common again?

Not for nothing....Sanchez was 5-29 1 TD and 3 INTs. It is not like he was a Peytonesque 10-30 with 6 TDs.

I get the point you are trying to make, but Brady has thrown 12 passes over 20 yards this year and that list does not include Welker's 99 yard TD. No one thinks the Patriots can stretch the field because of Tom's 12 passes.

While the Jets probably should take a few more shots when the down and distance does not hurt the team, it is not like you are a vertical passing team.

[JoeWillie]

Not for nothing....Sanchez was 5-29 1 TD and 3 INTs. It is not like he was a Peytonesque 10-30 with 6 TDs.

I get the point you are trying to make, but Brady has thrown 12 passes over 20 yards this year and that list does not include Welker's 99 yard TD. No one thinks the Patriots can stretch the field because of Tom's 12 passes.

While the Jets probably should take a few more shots when the down and distance does not hurt the team, it is not like you are a vertical passing team.

Tom Brady has proven over the course of his career that he is a consistent, terrific downfield passer, even though perhaps this year he is not doing it as much.

For whatever reason, Sanchez has not.

There in lies the difference.

[Bleedin Green]

I don't want him extended, my only point was that it didn't matter if Peyton came.. Since that's a dream, Schotty has to go as does Callahan, imo.. the run game / oline has been terrible

I hate Schotty as much as anyone, but I agree that if the Jets got Peyton it wouldn't make much difference who was OC. If Peyton were here, it would be his offense, not Schotty's, period. There's not even any question about that. Granted, I would still want him gone, but considering Peyton would audible out of every call Schotty made anyway, what difference would it really make?

[jason423]

Not for nothing....Sanchez was 5-29 1 TD and 3 INTs. It is not like he was a Peytonesque 10-30 with 6 TDs.

I get the point you are trying to make, but Brady has thrown 12 passes over 20 yards this year and that list does not include Welker's 99 yard TD. No one thinks the Patriots can stretch the field because of Tom's 12 passes.

While the Jets probably should take a few more shots when the down and distance does not hurt the team, it is not like you are a vertical passing team.

The teams have different personnel though. The Pats dont have down field players. Holmes at the very least used to be one in Pittsburgh. Plax is probably too far removed from those days, but Holmes shouldnt be. He averaged in the ballpark of 16-17 YPC and with the Jets he is down to 14. Last season they didnt need him to be that type of player because Edwards played the role. He was right up there at the top of the NFL in big plays with the 17 YPC average. The Jets didnt throw deep every play but the threat of it was real and helped players underneath be able to split guys once they caught the ball. The Jets havent replaced that at all and the offense has pretty much been totally grounded.

[Matt39]

Tom Brady has proven over the course of his career that he is a consistent, terrific downfield passer, even though perhaps this year he is not doing it as much.

For whatever reason, Sanchez has not.

There in lies the difference.

Brady throws a crappy deep ball. He's never been an elite down field passer.

[PFSIKH]

Tom Brady has proven over the course of his career that he is a consistent, terrific downfield passer, even though perhaps this year he is not doing it as much.

For whatever reason, Sanchez has not.

There in lies the difference.

I agree with you to a point.

Brady has usually been brilliant under 10 and has gotten a lot better at the 11-20 routes as his career progressed.

Short of 2007, his 20+ and 30+ yard passes have always been meh.

[PFSIKH]

The teams have different personnel though. The Pats dont have down field players. Holmes at the very least used to be one in Pittsburgh. Plax is probably too far removed from those days, but Holmes shouldnt be. He averaged in the ballpark of 16-17 YPC and with the Jets he is down to 14. Last season they didnt need him to be that type of player because Edwards played the role. He was right up there at the top of the NFL in big plays with the 17 YPC average. The Jets didnt throw deep every play but the threat of it was real and helped players underneath be able to split guys once they caught the ball. The Jets havent replaced that at all and the offense has pretty much been totally grounded.

Good point.

I think you throw deep just to keep them a little honest, but yeah...it also helps when you have a person that can stretch the field.

[SMC]

I agree with you to a point.

Brady has usually been brilliant under 10 and has gotten a lot better at the 11-20 routes as his career progressed.

Short of 2007, his 20+ and 30+ yard passes have always been meh.

I think it gets overlooked because Brady seems to always overthrow the ball. You never see Brady under throw a deep ball. It's always too far.

[Il Mostro]

if we're lucky...

THe stage is set for the Colts to trade Manning and draft luck... We're one of the teams I think that would think they are only a QB away from a SB and overpay for him

Even if this were a good idea, with our luck watch the Colts go on a tear for the rest of the season and run the table.

[SMC]

Back in 2009 I said the division was all about Sanchez. If Sanchez was good, the Jets would control the division and if not, the Jets would continue to chase the Pats.

It's unfortunate that Sanchez has sucked and the Jets haven't been able to exploit the Pats' poor personnel decisions as a result.

[Bleedin Green]

Back in 2009 I said the division was all about Sanchez. If Sanchez was good, the Jets would control the division and if not, the Jets would continue to chase the Pats.

It's unfortunate that Sanchez has sucked and the Jets haven't been able to exploit the Pats' poor personnel decisions as a result.

My guess is that unless the Jets can pull off a trade for a legit starting QB, they're nearly a lock to go QB in rounds 2 - 4, picking up a decent propsect who they think has the ability to be a future starter without too heavy of an investment and being able to use the bullsh*t "backup" excuse to try to keep things from getting too out of hand. Sanchez gets his one last shot to be the guy to start the year next season with (hopefully) a new OC and let his performance determine how long he's the QB. If he fails again, then it will depend on the development of the rook whether the first shot at the starting job goes to him or McElroy.

[PFSIKH]

I think it gets overlooked because Brady seems to always overthrow the ball. You never see Brady under throw a deep ball. It's always too far.

Brady Apologist.

[SMC]

My guess is that unless the Jets can pull off a trade for a legit starting QB, they're nearly a lock to go QB in rounds 2 - 4, picking up a decent propsect who they think has the ability to be a future starter without too heavy of an investment and being able to use the bullsh*t "backup" excuse to try to keep things from getting too out of hand. Sanchez gets his one last shot to be the guy to start the year next season with (hopefully) a new OC and let his performance determine how long he's the QB. If he fails again, then it will depend on the development of the rook whether the first shot at the starting job goes to him or McElroy.

I don't see them drafting a QB high. They're going to use high picks to fill needs. The Jets need rotation guys.

I think Sanchez gets his rookie deal (next 2 years) unless the Jets sigh/trade for a bona fide starter.

[SMC]

Brady Apologist.

LOL.

I've come to grips why I hate the Patriots--because they totally lucked out with an all-time great QB. They extend Bledsoe for $100+ million franchise killing contract and draft a QB in the 6th, who turns out to be a HOFer. How ******* unfair is that? That was pure dumb luck. Bledsoe was supposed to be your guy. Belichick had only 1 winning season as a HC before 2001.

The Pats hit ******* Powerball, not just the regular lottery. A 6th round college backup QB turns into a HOFer. Incredible. Every other elite QB we have out there was at least a 1st rounder or big FA signing. Then there's Brady.

Un****inbelievable.

[Bleedin Green]

I don't see them drafting a QB high. They're going to use high picks to fill needs. The Jets need rotation guys.

I think Sanchez gets his rookie deal (next 2 years) unless the Jets sigh/trade for a bona fide starter.

Rex and Tanny aren't idiots, they know the only way to keep their jobs from ending along with Sanchez's contract is to have his replacement already ready to go, and that means having someone ready before entering the last year of Sanchez's deal. They certainly won't go first round, but they're going to want to get somebody they think has a legit chance to be a future starter. So unless they still actually believe Sanchez is the long-term answer, it's either get an established vet via trade or go to the draft. The only other option would be to see if you could work out a trade on the cheap for another team's backup you like (e.g., Packer's Flynn).

[jason423]

I don't see them drafting a QB high. They're going to use high picks to fill needs. The Jets need rotation guys.

I think Sanchez gets his rookie deal (next 2 years) unless the Jets sigh/trade for a bona fide starter.

Agreed. I do think they will sign a possible "step in" backup. My guess is the options are Kyle Orton, David Garrard, Matt Cassel, Matt Hasselbeck, Donovan McNabb, and Chad Pennington. I think all will be available. If the Raiders implode Carson Palmer might be as well.

[Bleedin Green]

Agreed. I do think they will sign a possible "step in" backup. My guess is the options are Kyle Orton, David Garrard, Matt Cassel, Matt Hasselbeck, Donovan McNabb, and Chad Pennington. I think all will be available. If the Raiders implode Carson Palmer might be as well.

If the Jets re-sign Pennington my Jets fandom will officially come to an end.

[SMC]

If the Jets re-sign Pennington my Jets fandom will officially come to an end.

+1

I'm already having a thing for Eli

[Bleedin Green]

+1

I'm already having a thing for Eli

Ah screw that, I could never root for the Giants. Screw it, I figure if I'm going to dump a team might as well just completely sell out and go full on front-runner and get some enjoyment out of it. Go Pack!

[dbatesman]

Agreed. I do think they will sign a possible "step in" backup. My guess is the options are Kyle Orton, David Garrard, Matt Cassel, Matt Hasselbeck, Donovan McNabb, and Chad Pennington. I think all will be available. If the Raiders implode Carson Palmer might be as well.

But won't most of those guys will be looking for a starting job (or starting money)? Plus, the home crowds are already booing the offense. If we bring in a guy like Orton, the public pressure on the team to start him would be unrelenting.

This isn't a great draft for QBs, but I think spending a second-day pick would be a good investment.

[JohnnyHector]

Even if Manning's neck didn't recover fully, at least he'd have an excuse for locking onto a receiver and not going through his progressions.

[The Crusher]

If Manning is healthy, I give a #1+ and don't think twice, this team would have won 2 sb's with Manning already

Yeah but twat about potential?

[dbatesman]

Yeah but twat about potential?

Freudian slip?

[CTM]

If the Jets re-sign Pennington my Jets fandom will officially come to an end.

I think i agree as well. Can't take that guy, and he'll undermine sanchez and end up back on the field by midseason by letting rex suck his toes

[The Crusher]

Freudian slip?

Nope. But thanx for asking.

[JoeWillie]

I agree with you to a point.

Brady has usually been brilliant under 10 and has gotten a lot better at the 11-20 routes as his career progressed.

Short of 2007, his 20+ and 30+ yard passes have always been meh.

The point is that Brady scares people down the field because he has proven that he can and will throw the ball down the field, thus defenses know they need to defend it.

Sanchez does not scare defenses down the field because he rarely throws the ball down the field, thus defenses don't honor it and are able to play more guys closer to the line of scrimmage to both defend against the run and the short passing game.

Brady stretches the field, making the defense have to defend more of the field, where as Sanchez, or should I say, Schottenheimer, voluntarily shrinks it, making it easier for defenses to defend.

[JoeWillie]

Double post.

[The Crusher]

I think i agree as well. Can't take that guy, and he'll undermine sanchez and end up back on the field by midseason by letting rex suck his toes

Yeah but the REALZ question is do you think we win last nigh with him playing.

[jason423]

But won't most of those guys will be looking for a starting job (or starting money)? Plus, the home crowds are already booing the offense. If we bring in a guy like Orton, the public pressure on the team to start him would be unrelenting.

This isn't a great draft for QBs, but I think spending a second-day pick would be a good investment.

I think for most of them they realize the ship has sailed on being a starter. Certainly Chad, McNabb, Garrard, and Orton have all been replaced. Hasselbeck may want to start if the Titans release him (and they may not) but he signed last year for just 9 million and a 5 million cap charge knowing full well he may only have a handful of games to start. So I would think this situation might be appealing. Palmer would want to start and you would have to cut ties with Sanchez in that case. Cassel might want to start. His pricetag the next few years is 5.5 million and 7.5 million on his current deal so financially I cant see the Jets needing to break the bank for him either. Thats not to say any of these guys are good, but Id be stunned if one of them is not a backup.

Im not sure if the Jets can keep wasting picks on QBs. Since Tannenbaum arrived we took Clemens with a 2, Ainge with a 5, McElroy with a 7, and traded a 7th for O'Connell. 3 were total wastes and McElroy got hurt so who knows. Its not like they serve any other purpose. at least a guy like Drew Coleman who maybe isnt very good can contribute on specials or in certain packages. A bad QB is nothing but dead roster space. I think for the most part your good QBs come high in the draft or are totally overlooked. Those mid draft guys rarely seem to amount to much. It could change a bit now. With the new slotting scales we may see more QBs than before jump into round 1 so maybe that pushes a few UDFAs into round 7, but I wouldnt keep wasting my time hoping for a developmental prospect while I have slow linebackers and a right side of an offensive line that will soon need two new bodies.

[Bleedin Green]

I think for most of them they realize the ship has sailed on being a starter. Certainly Chad, McNabb, Garrard, and Orton have all been replaced. Hasselbeck may want to start if the Titans release him (and they may not) but he signed last year for just 9 million and a 5 million cap charge knowing full well he may only have a handful of games to start. So I would think this situation might be appealing. Palmer would want to start and you would have to cut ties with Sanchez in that case. Cassel might want to start. His pricetag the next few years is 5.5 million and 7.5 million on his current deal so financially I cant see the Jets needing to break the bank for him either. Thats not to say any of these guys are good, but Id be stunned if one of them is not a backup.

Im not sure if the Jets can keep wasting picks on QBs. Since Tannenbaum arrived we took Clemens with a 2, Ainge with a 5, McElroy with a 7, and traded a 7th for O'Connell. 3 were total wastes and McElroy got hurt so who knows. Its not like they serve any other purpose. at least a guy like Drew Coleman who maybe isnt very good can contribute on specials or in certain packages. A bad QB is nothing but dead roster space. I think for the most part your good QBs come high in the draft or are totally overlooked. Those mid draft guys rarely seem to amount to much. It could change a bit now. With the new slotting scales we may see more QBs than before jump into round 1 so maybe that pushes a few UDFAs into round 7, but I wouldnt keep wasting my time hoping for a developmental prospect while I have slow linebackers and a right side of an offensive line that will soon need two new bodies.

While I agree with what you're saying conceptually speaking, the Jets aren't going to go anywhere with one of those JAG backups and if Rex and Tanny want to keep their jobs, they're going to need to try to find this team's next QB. Unless they think Sanchez can turn this around, they have to at least give it a shot and hope for the best, even if it turns out to be a complete waste. Like I said earlier, the only other option is if there's another team's backup they like (meaning, a younger player with upside) that they think they can get for a decent price.

[JetsFanInDenver]

Wait, were getting Peyton Manning now?

Payton will be lucky to cross 300 yards with Schotty

[PFSIKH]

LOL.

I've come to grips why I hate the Patriots--because they totally lucked out with an all-time great QB. They extend Bledsoe for $100+ million franchise killing contract and draft a QB in the 6th, who turns out to be a HOFer. How ******* unfair is that? That was pure dumb luck. Bledsoe was supposed to be your guy. Belichick had only 1 winning season as a HC before 2001.

The Pats hit ******* Powerball, not just the regular lottery. A 6th round college backup QB turns into a HOFer. Incredible. Every other elite QB we have out there was at least a 1st rounder or big FA signing. Then there's Brady.

Un****inbelievable.

Knew it all along.

Sometimes it is nice to be lucky.

[Jetaholic]

I don't care who you put behind the center. As long as the QB is getting the plays from the sidelines and the plays being called are based on a gameplan that does not take advantage of the opponents weaknesses, then the results will be the same.

Sanchez can make the throws when he is allowed to - we saw that in the 4th quarter. I wonder what would have been the outcome if the shackles were removed in the 1st quarter? He's got the weapons and he's got the skills to connect downfield. Unless he is allowed to use them effectively, don't expect our running game to improve or our offense to put points on the board.

Opposing defenses must respect our long ball for us to be able to stretch the field. And without that the corners will be sitting on our routes just like they did when Pennington was still here.

[PFSIKH]

The point is that Brady scares people down the field because he has proven that he can and will throw the ball down the field, thus defenses know they need to defend it.

Sanchez does not scare defenses down the field because he rarely throws the ball down the field, thus defenses don't honor it and are able to play more guys closer to the line of scrimmage to both defend against the run and the short passing game.

Brady stretches the field, making the defense have to defend more of the field, where as Sanchez, or should I say, Schottenheimer, voluntarily shrinks it, making it easier for defenses to defend.

Sanchez scares me when he passes deep against the Patriots.

Ok...everybody scares me when they pass against the Patriots.

I think that is more telling of the Jets' game plan or lack thereof.....yes you want to establish the ground and pound, but you are facing the Patriots 3rd or 4th strings across the entire secondary. I for get which announcer brought it up, but why not motion to cause confusion like the Patriots did.