NCJETSFAN Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Is there a reason why u didn't draft this guy in 3rd round? We had no skill players and this guy looks great!. This is why I don't trust our scouting dept Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neckdemon Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 peyton manning. he'd look like complete garbage on this offense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 peyton manning. he'd look like complete garbage on this offense Haha. What? He plays for the Chargers. Do you even football bro? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoicsentry Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Bizarre criticism. Why didn't any GM in the league take him in the 2nd? Because scouting is not an exact science. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Mostro Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Count the Chargers as smart for taking a big chance on him. Picking Allen in any round wasn't exactly a no-brainer at the time. He was considered as having good, but not great, speed when healthy and had not recovered from knee surgery -- so no combine workouts (other than his failed drug test). And he ran something like 4.7/4.8 40's in his private pre-draft workouts on a knee that still had not healed. Good move by the Chargers since they did this without the benefit of 20-20 hindsight like the coulda' woulda' shoulda's around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Is there a reason why u didn't draft this guy in 3rd round? We had no skill players and this guy looks great!. This is why I don't trust our scouting dept I agree. Keenan is a beast and he runs excellent routes. Very talented. But to answer your question, its because our scouts were terrible and we couldnt change up after signing Idzik. This is exactly why after the draft Idzik fired everyone and bought in his own scouting crew. We shouldnt be missing out on talent like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neckdemon Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Haha. What? He plays for the Chargers. Do you even football bro? meh......meant to write philip rivers. point is just as valid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCJETSFAN Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 I agree. Keenan is a beast and he runs excellent routes. Very talented. But to answer your question, its because our scouts were terrible and we couldnt change up after signing Idzik. This is exactly why after the draft Idzik fired everyone and bought in his own scouting crew. We shouldnt be missing out on talent like this. He didn't fire everyone in fact bradway is still there he's in charge of the dept. and besides idzik isn't a scout at all he's on the bussiness side Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Mostro Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 He didn't fire everyone in fact bradway is still there he's in charge of the dept. and besides idzik isn't a scout at all he's on the bussiness side Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 He didn't fire everyone in fact bradway is still there he's in charge of the dept. and besides idzik isn't a scout at all he's on the bussiness side lmao. Google is your friend pal. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000202017/article/john-idzik-changes-up-new-york-jets-front-office Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed4 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Um, Brian Winters....hello. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I agree. Keenan is a beast and he runs excellent routes. Very talented. But to answer your question, its because our scouts were terrible and we couldnt change up after signing Idzik. This is exactly why after the draft Idzik fired everyone and bought in his own scouting crew. We shouldnt be missing out on talent like this. Ehh, that same scouting department decided Sheldon Richardson was the way to go over guys like Star and Floyd and were spot on and seem to have done a solid job on Milliner as well. You can't always play arm-chair general manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 What's the big deal the Jets have Stephen Hill and Clyde Gates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Keenan Allen had a first round grade on a lot of boards and slipped due to an injury I believe. He would have been a steal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCJETSFAN Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 Ehh, that same scouting department decided Sheldon Richardson was the way to go over guys like Star and Floyd and were spot on and seem to have done a solid job on Milliner as well. You can't always play arm-chair general manager. Tell me the last skill postion player that worked out for us. ? It's been While. Keller ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Ehh, that same scouting department decided Sheldon Richardson was the way to go over guys like Star and Floyd and were spot on and seem to have done a solid job on Milliner as well. You can't always play arm-chair general manager. Those moves you speak of was on defense my friend. So you named Sheldon and Milliner. Do me a favor, name me the last two offensive players that have worked out just as well. . Kerley? He was nowhere near rookie of the year like a Sheldon Richardson. Kerley isnt even in the conversation of the top 20 WR's in the league. Who are you going to say, Bilal Powell? What would have been more accurate to say is that the same scouting deptartment that does well when drafting defensive players dont do so well when drafting offensive players, IF they decide to even do so. Mind you, this is the same scouting department that allowed the offense to go to sh_t so please, dont play me as an arm-chair GM. I've seen fans mock drafts on this very website that's been better than what that front office has done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Those moves you speak of was on defense my friend. So you named Sheldon and Milliner. Do me a favor, name me the last two offensive players that have worked out just as well. Kerley? He was nowhere near rookie of the year like a Sheldon Richardson. Kerley isnt even in the conversation of the top 20 WR's in the league. Who are you going to say, Bilal Powell? What would have been more accurate to say is that the same scouting deptartment that does well when drafting defensive players dont do so well when drafting offensive players. You said our scouts were terrible, I countered with they found Sheldon, thus showing that they aren't void of ability. If you were to change your initial argument to them not placing emphasis on skill position players, that's a different story. Do you know their bigboard? How are you sure Allen wasn't rated highly, but Idzik decided he wanted to go with an OG Winters instead? You are playing arm-chair GM and of course every move you make is going to be the correct one. It's lazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Tell me the last skill postion player that worked out for us. ? It's been While. Keller ? Once again, if you want to complain about not putting an emphasis on draft skill-position players highly, I'm with you. Who else besides Hill have we really drafted in the first couple rounds? For a long time we drafted guys on the line in the higher rounds and supplemented the skill guys via free agency. It's hard to hit on them if you don't draft them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCJETSFAN Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 You said our scouts were terrible, I countered with they found Sheldon, thus showing that they aren't void of ability. If you were to change your initial argument to them not placing emphasis on skill position players, that's a different story. Do you know their bigboard? How are you sure Allen wasn't rated highly, but Idzik decided he wanted to go with an OG Winters instead? You are playing arm-chair GM and of course every move you make is going to be the correct one. It's lazy. Would u agree that our scouts have a difficult time finding skill players on offense . That's what I'm saying we seem to find DL great but we have a lack of offense skill players. This has to change and fast . Look at these teams in playoffs all have QBs and skill players . This is what I'm worried about . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 You said our scouts were terrible, I countered with they found Sheldon, thus showing that they aren't void of ability. If you were to change your initial argument to them not placing emphasis on skill position players, that's a different story. Do you know their bigboard? How are you sure Allen wasn't rated highly, but Idzik decided he wanted to go with an OG Winters instead? You are playing arm-chair GM and of course every move you make is going to be the correct one. It's lazy. Im sorry broadway. Let me restate. Offensively they were terrible. I thought you understood given the topic of this thread being Keenan Allen, an offensive player. I honestly wasnt expecting anyone to talk about our DE and CB lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Would u agree that our scouts have a difficult time finding skill players on offense . That's what I'm saying we seem to find DL great but we have a lack of offense skill players. This has to change and fast . Look at these teams in playoffs all have QBs and skill players . This is what I'm worried about . I'm well aware of our void of offensive skill-position players, it's universally noted. However, I cannot say that our scouts have a difficult time finding skill position players, considering our GMs of late have not put in emphasis on drafting them. I find it lazy to say that our scouts are terrible, just because our team is lacking at WR, TE or RB. How can I possibly tell if they are good or not if I don't know their rankings on all the skill-position players of the last number of years? What I can say for certain is that our FO has not placed a priority on drafting said players and the one time that we have in the least couple of years has not turned out well at all. But missing on one person is hardly enough for me to label them as terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I'm well aware of our void of offensive skill-position players, it's universally noted. However, I cannot say that our scouts have a difficult time finding skill position players, considering our GMs of late have not put in emphasis on drafting them. I find it lazy to say that our scouts are terrible, just because our team is lacking at WR, TE or RB. How can I possibly tell if they are good or not if I don't know their rankings on all the skill-position players of the last number of years? What I can say for certain is that our FO has not placed a priority on drafting said players and the one time that we have in the least couple of years has not turned out well at all. But missing on one person is hardly enough for me to label them as terrible. Shone Greene and Stephen Hill lean towards they were terrible. Chris Baker, Dustin Keller too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Im sorry broadway. Let me restate. Offensively they were terrible. I thought you understood given the topic of this thread being Keenan Allen, an offensive player. I honestly wasnt expecting anyone to talk about our DE and CB lol. Well, when you make blanket statements like "our scouts are terrible" I'm assuming you meant that they are in fact, terrible. I didn't know we had to partition their scouting ability into offense and defense. Your ire should be directed at our general managers for not selecting the players that you are able to point out were the correct pick, after the fact. How do you know the scouts wanted Hill?? We know Bradyway like Wilson, but he wasn't the selection. For all we know the scouts loved Allen, but Idzik didn't want to gamble on a receiver coming off of knee surgery and off-the field issues and rather select an OG, much like how Seattle built their team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 No, I totally think we should have drafted a slow receiver with bad knees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCJETSFAN Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 I'm well aware of our void of offensive skill-position players, it's universally noted. However, I cannot say that our scouts have a difficult time finding skill position players, considering our GMs of late have not put in emphasis on drafting them. I find it lazy to say that our scouts are terrible, just because our team is lacking at WR, TE or RB. How can I possibly tell if they are good or not if I don't know their rankings on all the skill-position players of the last number of years? What I can say for certain is that our FO has not placed a priority on drafting said players and the one time that we have in the least couple of years has not turned out well at all. But missing on one person is hardly enough for me to label them as terrible. Allen is just an example of it. You don't just sudden become void of offensive talent this has been years of not finding the right guys . It's someone's fault and to me it's the whole front office including idzik and Rex . This isn't an easy fix at all but it needs to be addressed ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Shone Greene and Stephen Hill lean towards they were terrible. Chris Baker, Dustin Keller too. Two quality backup years, two 1000 yard seasons, 20+ tds and over 4 yards a carry isn't terrible for a 3rd round running back. He was never what we wanted him to be, but he was a 3rd round pick for a reason. Chris Baker was taken at the bottom of the 3rd round 12 years ago, surely you can find a better and more recent example? No he wasn't good, but the TE game wasn't what it was today. Keller was a pretty solid pick: he put up 500+ and 3 tds as a rookie when he had a real QB and then was forced to play with Mark the rest of his career. Again, our philosophy for a while now has been to supplement our skill-position guys via free agency and not through the draft. I'm finding it hard to blame the scouts for our GM's draft style. As far as Hill, the size-speed ratio strikes me as a Tanny move if anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Well, when you make blanket statements like "our scouts are terrible" I'm assuming you meant that they are in fact, terrible. I didn't know we had to partition their scouting ability into offense and defense. Your ire should be directed at our general managers for not selecting the players that you are able to point out were the correct pick, after the fact. How do you know the scouts wanted Hill?? We know Bradyway like Wilson, but he wasn't the selection. For all we know the scouts loved Allen, but Idzik didn't want to gamble on a receiver coming off of knee surgery and off-the field issues and rather select an OG, much like how Seattle built their team. Dude, they're f'ing terrible. Dont make it seem like Im trying to clean something up here. They couldnt draft offensively to save their jobs....literally. Jet fans here on this site has put together better mock drafts then what the Jets ultimately drafted offensively by way of these "terrible" ass scouts. If you're offended, cool. They're terrible. Now lets move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Allen is just an example of it. You don't just sudden become void of offensive talent this has been years of not finding the right guys . It's someone's fault and to me it's the whole front office including idzik and Rex . This isn't an easy fix at all but it needs to be addressed ! I'm aware of this. I'm just saying that calling our scouts terrible, because they missed players that you guys are pointing out a season after they were drafted is lazy. How about all of the players they passed on that are currently doing nothing? Does that not factor into it as well? Playing arm-chair QB or GM is always easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Two quality backup years, two 1000 yard seasons, 20+ tds and over 4 yards a carry isn't terrible for a 3rd round running back. He was never what we wanted him to be, but he was a 3rd round pick for a reason. Chris Baker was taken at the bottom of the 3rd round 12 years ago, surely you can find a better and more recent example? No he wasn't good, but the TE game wasn't what it was today. Keller was a pretty solid pick: he put up 500+ and 3 tds as a rookie when he had a real QB and then was forced to play with Mark the rest of his career. Again, our philosophy for a while now has been to supplement our skill-position guys via free agency and not through the draft. I'm finding it hard to blame the scouts for our GM's draft style. As far as Hill, the size-speed ratio strikes me as a Tanny move if anything. Greene was awful. Jets scouts had a first round grade on him(even more awful). You draft a tight end in the first round you expect a player that will be a big part of the offense for at least two contracts. Total disappointment. Used Baker as example because the scouts were the same and the Jets never really drafted offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsjetsjetss Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I agree. Keenan is a beast and he runs excellent routes. Very talented. But to answer your question, its because our scouts were terrible and we couldnt change up after signing Idzik. This is exactly why after the draft Idzik fired everyone and bought in his own scouting crew. We shouldnt be missing out on talent like this. keenan was a train wreck during his would be scouting period. ps: why didnt we draft brady! those bastard scouts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 keenan was a train wreck during his would be scouting period. ps: why didnt we draft brady! those bastard scouts TY Hilton wasnt a train wreck. And you know my favorite: Mr. Alshon Jeffery wasnt a Train wreck either. P.S. Stop reaching Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 BJ Askew in the 3rd round Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 jerry.rice emmitt.smith dan.marino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Mostro Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Allen is just an example of it. You don't just sudden become void of offensive talent this has been years of not finding the right guys . It's someone's fault and to me it's the whole front office including idzik and Rex . This isn't an easy fix at all but it needs to be addressed ! An example of what, exactly? Are you saying you had Allen on your board in the 3rd? It was a super high risk, home run pick for the Chargers. Good for them, but not drafting him wasn't a whiff for the Jets or any other team. Or any other person with a double digit IQ paying attention to the draft and events leading up to it. Talk about being dead from the neck up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCJETSFAN Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 Our front office needs to grasp the idea that in this new NFL. Offense wins and u need to load up . Go look at the saints they have 5 6 guys who can catch or run. SF same thing . If the scouts are getting ignored that has to stop . It has to change to be competitive . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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