Muhammad Wilkerson Windy City Bound?

[ylekram]

48 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

Don't we have cap room next season? We could make a decision to extend either him or Sheldon and let the other go.

imo, i dont think a new contract is in the cards for sheldon,either. drafting williams sealed mo's fate. he is off to the highest bidder come draft time. they will use sheldon the same way as mo. they have 3 drafts to find richardsons replacementonce thats done, richardson will be off to the highest bidder

[Integrity28]

Just now, Raideraholic said:

Well I guess he can have his opinion that the Jets can get more than a number 1 for Wilkerson.    That doesn't make it any closer to reality, until some team actually does pony up those draft picks for Wilkerson.  Let's see what Wilkerson does bring back in a trade( if they can even trade him). 

"let's see what he brings back in a trade" ---- as if we have any other option other than to wait?

"that doesn't make it any closer to reality" ---- neither does coming here to tell us how good the Raiders are going to be, but that doesn't stop you.

 

[pointman]

1 hour ago, Patriot Killa said:

Good point. But I do believe Wilk is worth a first and i don't understand why we would have to give up ours.

Supply and demand? DL heavy draft (even if few grade out that high), heavy pricetag, and few needing a guy like Mo. Shoot, even his own team doesn't really want him all that much.

[Powpow]

1 minute ago, Integrity28 said:

for **** sake, click the link in the quote you just referenced... lol

Christ you're so efficient lol

[Rangers9]

18 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Look at the average per year column: http://overthecap.com/position/cornerback/

I think this means you may be wrong.

You have to go by guaranteed money and Revis is getting way over any other corner like 39 mil. Look I used to hate Sherman bragging how he was better than Revis when he couldn't hold Revis's jockstrap. But last season Sherman was better than Revis. And he's only getting in the mid teens guaranteed. 

[SenorGato]

Just now, pointman said:

Shoot, even his own team doesn't really want him all that much.

You can tell they don't want him at all because of the franchise tag. #hittingWilkersonisWattwithreality

[pointman]

1 hour ago, First_Blood said:

I am a noob here, but I will post this anyway.

 

Muhammad Wilkerson is not JJ Watt. But, he is easily a top 3 if not top 5 defensive end in this league right now. The Jets are idiots for not resigning him. He's been nothing but class his time here... A true leader for this defense. He never held out like Mevis. It just disgusts me that people are complaining about overpaying to resign Mo, but Revis is the highest paid player on the team AND HE IS 30. 30. Wilkerson is 27, and is maybe behind Watt and maybe another player or 2. The guy is a top 5 defensive end in football and the Jets cannot afford to resign him.

Resigning Revis to that magnitude of a contract is hurting us. Along with Skrine, Harris, and Gilchrist deals.

 

I know I am not a seasoned poster on here but still. It was wrong giving Revis that contract in the first place, because he was not the same damn Revis we had 4 years ago.

Hi. Welcome to the forum. Mo has a few guys that play his role and the front office is hopeful they can fill his shoes. Many think Mo is a product of this D. 

 

As far as Revis... Leonard and Sheldon behind Mo. Who fills in for Revis? A CB and safety help over the top. Teams line up for a shot at Revis. We say Mo is available and we hear crickets. That is the difference.

[pointman]

1 hour ago, AFJF said:

Interesting take from former Bears director of college scouting Greg Gabriel.

 

Nice. Thanks for posting that!

[pointman]

2 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

You can tell they don't want him at all because of the franchise tag. #hittingWilkersonisWattwithreality

#Hashtaghardtodeciphermyeyeshurtthanksforthat

[Sperm Edwards]

7 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

At best it's 10%, but feel free to yet again attempt to drop a hammer. I do have to warn you, you're starting at -100 sacks. I'll even give you this head start - Wilkerson isn't JJ Watt.

I was thinking more along the lines of "Revis isn't looking for $16M per season!"

Lather, rinse, repeat. 

[SenorGato]

5 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I was thinking more along the lines of "Revis isn't looking for $16M per season!"

Lather, rinse, repeat. 

Is that an exact quote? Pretty sure the other side of that discussion was that he was looking for all the garaunteeed money, at least $32 million, of which he got zero. IIRC, my argument was that he was worth that aaaaaand he was (still is). 

-5 sacks for yet another failed attempt at rewriting history

[T0mShane]

GOD JAY CUTLER IN NY VS MANISH WOULD BE A WET DREAM COME ON

[Integrity28]

1 minute ago, Rangers9 said:

You have to go by guaranteed money and Revis is getting way over any other corner like 39 mil. Look I used to hate Sherman saying he was better than Revis when he couldn't hold Revis's jockstrap. But last season Sherman was better than Revis. And he's only getting in the mid teens guaranteed. 

Normally, I'd agree... you have to look at the guaranteed money to evaluate the true worth of a contract. However, in this context, all the other guys are rostered and will receive the full worth of their contracts this season (guaranteed and not). Most of which are close to Revis in what they make. Sure, he's the highest paid, but the disparity is not what you suggested it was earlier. His peer group, and even some that can't hold his jock, make $14m+ per year.

Janoris Jenkins is getting $28m guaranteed starting this year. Revis has $23m guaranteed left on his contract between this year and next. 

 

[no psls]

3 hours ago, JetNation said:

By Glenn Naughton

 

While the Jets’ shopping of defensive lineman Muhammad Wilkerson is one of the worst kept secrets in the NFL, the lack of apparent suitors as come as somewhat of a surprise as reports of teams expressing interest have been almost non-existent.  At least until now.

Aaron Leming of Bear Report had this to say via twitter earlier today:

For those unfamiliar with Leming, he was responsible for breaking the Brandon Marshall trade to the Jets from Chicago last season, and now he’s chiming in again, saying the two teams have spoken several times in regards to a possible deal that could send Wilkerson to the Windy City.

As Leming mentioned in his tweets above, the Bears currently hold the 11th pick in the draft with the Jets sitting at 20.  A swap of first round picks would likely be the starting point in negotiations.

Click here to read the full story...

We'll use the 11th pick to draft a Left Tackle and then cut D'Brickashaw for cap relief .

[Raideraholic]

6 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

"let's see what he brings back in a trade" ---- as if we have any other option other than to wait?

"that doesn't make it any closer to reality" ---- neither does coming here to tell us how good the Raiders are going to be, but that doesn't stop you.

 

The only point I was making is your taking a former Bears opinion, and treating it like it's a fact of what the Jets can get.   ( you hope he right but no one knows).   

We don't know this former Bears employee motive as he could be a friend of your Gm.    The Jets should get a pretty good package for Wilkerson. ( if all these recent rumors are believable.  The Cowboys are willing to give up the fourth pick, and now the Bears are willing to give up the eleventh  pick.

Anything less than that  at this point , and you have to be disappointed as a Jet fan. 

[pointman]

1 minute ago, Raideraholic said:

The only point I was making is your taking a former Bears opinion, and treating it like it's a fact of what the Jets can get.   ( you hope he right but no one knows).   

We don't know this former Bears employee motive as he could be a friend of your Gm.    The Jets should get a pretty good package for Wilkerson. ( if all these recent rumors are believable.  The Cowboys are willing to give up the fourth pick, and now the Bears are willing to give up the eleventh  pick.

Anything less than that  at this point , and you have to be disappointed as a Jet fan. 

Wouldn't the lack of rumors mean we couldn't get a "pretty good package" for Mo?

[Integrity28]

Just now, Raideraholic said:

The only point I was making is your taking a former Bears opinion, and treating it like it's a fact of what the Jets can get.   ( you hope he right but no one knows).   

We don't know this former Bears employee motive as he could be a friend of your Gm.    The Jets should get a pretty good package for Wilkerson. ( if all these recent rumors are believable.  The Cowboys are willing to give up the fourth pick, and now the Bears are willing to give up the eleventh  pick.

Anything less than that  at this point , and you have to be disappointed as a Jet fan. 

No, nobody treated it as a fact. People either agree with it, or don't. I was of the opinion that Wilk is worth a 1st before this guy tweeted.

You aren't making any point at all. As per usual.

[Raideraholic]

4 minutes ago, pointman said:

Wouldn't the lack of rumors mean we couldn't get a "pretty good package" for Mo?

let's see 24 hours early the Jets were getting the fourth pick for switching their  20th pick with the Cowboys .   Now the Jets are be offered the 11th pick for their  twenty pick.   ( shouldn't the offer be getting better with that much competition for M Wilkerson service.     Excuse me if I don't believe these, until incarnated Bob confirms there is a trade.

[pointman]

2 minutes ago, Raideraholic said:

let's see 24 hours early the Jets were getting the fourth pick for switching their  20th pick with the Cowboys .   Now the Jets are be offered the 11th pick for their  twenty pick.   ( shouldn't the offer be getting better with that much competition for M Wilkerson service.     Excuse me if I don't believe these, until incarnated Bob confirms there is a trade.

Several have commented at the lack of interest, some with the inside track. 1 or 2 conversations aren't that many for an All Pro.

[SenorGato]

8 minutes ago, pointman said:

Several have commented at the lack of interest, some with the inside track. 1 or 2 conversations aren't that many for an All Pro.

Plus you have to put those 1-2 conversations into question and wonder if the count is actually at -1 or -2 conversations. 

[Rangers9]

32 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Normally, I'd agree... you have to look at the guaranteed money to evaluate the true worth of a contract. However, in this context, all the other guys are rostered and will receive the full worth of their contracts this season (guaranteed and not). Most of which are close to Revis in what they make. Sure, he's the highest paid, but the disparity is not what you suggested it was earlier. His peer group, and even some that can't hold his jock, make $14m+ per year.

Janoris Jenkins is getting $28m guaranteed starting this year. Revis has $23m guaranteed left on his contract between this year and next. 

 

You have to talk full contract and it isn't even close with him or any of these guys. And with the un-guaranteed money that's when players get cut and we've seen a lot of that this time of the year. 

[pointman]

4 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

Plus you have to put those 1-2 conversations into question and wonder if the count is actually at -1 or -2 conversations. 

You are... special. 

[SenorGato]

6 minutes ago, pointman said:

You are... special. 

Thanks, but not doing anything unique here. I'm just taking a realistic POV on things by keeping within reality. Like it's obvious from other several comments made, some even with an inside track.

[Integrity28]

Just now, Rangers9 said:

You have to talk full contract and it isn't even close with him or any of these guys. And with the un-guaranteed money that's when players get cut and we've seen a lot of that this time of the year. 

Yea, you're just going to keep stretching this out until you convince yourself of whatever.

You said nobody makes the kind of money Revis does except pass rushers. You were wrong, now you're making it about guaranteed money in contracts, because Revis has more guaranteed money than most other corners. 

The reality is, Revis makes slightly more than the other top paid corners. You're initial comment about only pass rushers making that kind of money is wrong.

Last year is on the books. The top paid corners (against the cap) were:

Revis: $16m
Peterson: $14,791m

Regardless of guaranteed money, bonuses, salary... the amount these guys were paid last year was NOT as big a disparity as you suggested. You are correct in that we pay Revis a ton, but he's not being paid anything substantial that separates him from his peers at his position. 

To boot, with newer contracts being given out, the price of a top corner is only increase, which is why I cited Janoris Jenkins contract. Starting this year, he has more guaranteed money than Revis. Revis is a far superior player.

There's really not much more to discuss. Your initial remark was wrong. I don't really feel like hanging in with you until you find something to be right about to save face. It's all good. Really not that big a deal at this point.

[Rangers9]

13 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Yea, you're just going to keep stretching this out until you convince yourself of whatever.

You said nobody makes the kind of money Revis does except pass rushers. You were wrong, now you're making it about guaranteed money in contracts, because Revis has more guaranteed money than most other corners. 

The reality is, Revis makes slightly more than the other top paid corners. You're initial comment about only pass rushers making that kind of money is wrong.

Last year is on the books. The top paid corners (against the cap) were:

Revis: $16m
Peterson: $14,791m

Regardless of guaranteed money, bonuses, salary... the amount these guys were paid last year was NOT as big a disparity as you suggested. You are correct in that we pay Revis a ton, but he's not being paid anything substantial that separates him from his peers at his position. 

To boot, with newer contracts being given out, the price of a top corner is only increase, which is why I cited Janoris Jenkins contract. Starting this year, he has more guaranteed money than Revis. Revis is a far superior player.

There's really not much more to discuss. Your initial remark was wrong. I don't really feel like hanging in with you until you find something to be right about to save face. It's all good. Really not that big a deal at this point.

Look I'm not going to argue with you. In the NFL the only real significant figure is guaranteed money and there is no one close to getting 39. The other part of the contract isn't worth the paper it's printed on. Players with big money deals that aren't guaranteed are cut all of the time. 

[Integrity28]

11 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

Look I'm not going to argue with you. In the NFL the only real significant figure is guaranteed money and there is no one close to getting 39. The other part the contract isn't worth the paper it's printed on. Players with big money deals that aren't guaranteed are cut all of the time. 

But, you are arguing... 

There's no debate to be had here about how guaranteed money works. I get that.

The actual discussion isn't about that though, it's about you saying that Revis makes $16m per year, and no other corners make close to that, only pass-rushers do. Revis made $16m last year, Peterson made almost $15m. You're wrong. That's what they made and/or cost against the cap - regardless of what portion was guaranteed. it's past tense. Neither were cut, both were rostered, both collected their checks already. You're wrong about how much other CBs make being so significantly less than Revis.

Let's call it was it was, you were whining about Revis and exaggerated. It's fine.

Revis will make $17m this year, guaranteed. He's not getting cut. Sherman, I think, will cost almost $15m against the cap fro Seahawks. He's not getting cut. So you know what? That's how much they are getting paid.

Even if this argument was about Revis getting more guaranteed money than he deserves... which it's not... Janoris Jenkins has more guaranteed money coming to him for the remainder of his contract, than Revis does. Do you think Jenkins deserves more guaranteed money than Revis? Or any of the other top 5 corners? No way.

We're done here.

[chirorob]

3 hours ago, Savage69 said:

We got Thomas Jones swapping 2nd rd picks with the Bears in 2007..

That actually worked out really well for us.

Thomas Jones had 2 really good years for us.  2700 yards and 27 TD in 2 years.

[Rangers9]

17 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

But, you are arguing... 

There's no debate to be had here about how guaranteed money works. I get that.

The actual discussion isn't about that though, it's about you saying that Revis makes $16m per year, and no other corners make close to that, only pass-rushers do. Revis made $16m last year, Peterson made almost $15m. You're wrong. That's what they made and/or cost against the cap - regardless of what portion was guaranteed. it's past tense. Neither were cut, both were rostered, both collected their checks already. You're wrong about how much other CBs make being so significantly less than Revis.

Let's call it was it was, you were whining about Revis and exaggerated. It's fine.

Revis will make $17m this year, guaranteed. He's not getting cut. Sherman, I think, will cost almost $15m against the cap fro Seahawks. He's not getting cut. So you know what? That's how much they are getting paid.

Even if this argument was about Revis getting more guaranteed money than he deserves... which it's not... Janoris Jenkins has more guaranteed money coming to him for the remainder of his contract, than Revis does. Do you think Jenkins deserves more guaranteed money than Revis? Or any of the other top 5 corners? No way.

We're done here.

Look Revis had 39 mil and now it's down to 23 because he played a year on his deal. I don't mind being proved wrong and many times I've been wrong. But not this time. Jenkins is just starting his deal so he has 28. But the Revis contract is larger than the Jenkins deal. And per season doesn't matter if the money is not guaranteed. 

[Sperm Edwards]

1 hour ago, SenorGato said:

Is that an exact quote? Pretty sure the other side of that discussion was that he was looking for all the garaunteeed money, at least $32 million, of which he got zero. IIRC, my argument was that he was worth that aaaaaand he was (still is). 

-5 sacks for yet another failed attempt at rewriting history

No. You said he wasn't looking for $16M/year. Day after day, week after week, for a couple of months.

The rest is something new that you are making up right now out of thin air.

[SenorGato]

34 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

No. You said he wasn't looking for $16M/year. Day after day, week after week, for a couple of months.

The rest is something new that you are making up right now out of thin air.

Yeah....yeah, still no, but you run with that and give yourself +5 starters for sticktoitiveness if it brings you peace of mind. 

[Sperm Edwards]

3 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

Yeah....yeah, still no, but you run with that and give yourself +5 starters for sticktoitiveness if it brings you peace of mind. 

Lol sure. Because everyone on a message board casually talks of contract terms in guaranteed money around here. No one ever speaks of the amount per season. Just like no one is talking of what guaranteed $ Mo is seeking now; just the average compensation. Hence the comparisons to Watt. Chances are not 3 people making the comparison even are aware of how much guaranteed $ Watt received on his extension. But they remember the $16M/year.

Anyone here, who had to live through your endless, repeated denial of what everyone knew and what came to be, remembers. You were dead wrong then on Revis, and are dead wrong now on Mo.

[SenorGato]

2 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Lol sure. Because everyone on a message board casually talks of contract terms in guaranteed money around here. 

Oh man, good point. No one mentioned it at all, ever, so run with it. That's a really solid angle, another +5 starters for dropping the hammer.

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, SenorGato said:

Oh man, good point. No one mentioned it at all, ever, so run with it. That's a really solid angle, another +5 starters for dropping the hammer.

You are a strange person.

[SenorGato]

4 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

You are a strange person.

I'm just a man being hammered down by reality here. Garaunteed money is like the last thing anyone would mention over the course of weeks and months of contract arguments. You really got me, I can't deny the power of something that big and revealing. 

[Sperm Edwards]

21 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

I'm just a man being hammered down by reality here. Garaunteed money is like the last thing anyone would mention over the course of weeks and months of contract arguments. You really got me, I can't deny the power of something that big and revealing. 

You are a strange person.

And there was no "guaranteed money" debate for weeks on end prior to trading Revis.