Average QB Salary Cap Charge is 10.9 Million

[Maxman]

It was just on Sunday night football. So I think that means that Fitz is above average. When it comes to the salary cap anyhow. At least there is that.

[Jetsfan80]

12 minutes ago, Maxman said:

It was just on Sunday night football. So I think that means that Fitz is above average. When it comes to the salary cap anyhow. At least there is that.

Fitz's cap number this year is $7M:

http://overthecap.com/player/ryan-fitzpatrick/1338/

 

The money was never a big deal.  The biggest problems are twofold, depending on the truth of the matter:  Either we don't have a QB on the roster good enough to turn to, or the coaching staff is not WILLING to turn to a new one (ideally Petty). 

Couple the QB situation with a talented (at least when you look at it through the lens of draft capital and FA dollars spent on it over the years) and expensive defense that is playing awful under a supposed defensive genius, and those are our biggest problems as an organization at the moment.

But don't let me stop people from yelling about the $12M (which will really be $7M with the 2nd year voided), as if that actually matters.  QB's are expensive.  Good ones even moreso.  One day hopefully we'll have a good enough QB to give a bloated contract to.

[Maxman]

How is his cap number 7 million. I am not following. He didn't have a contract, and then the Jets signed him to this: http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000677227/article/ryan-fitzpatrick-jets-strike-oneyear-contract

Quote

The contract is worth $12 million, but the QB has a chance to make $3 million more based on team performance NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport reported, according to a source. The news ends a stalemate that dragged on all offseason with countless stories and little drama about how it would end.

 

So if it is one year, 12 million guaranteed, maybe more with bonuses....wouldn't that make it 12 million against the cap?

[Maxman]

@jason423 can you shed some light on this for us?

[Jetsfan80]

It's a 2-year deal, and the last one is voidable:
 

Quote

 

Ryan Fitzpatrick signed a one year, $12 million contract with the Jets on July 28, 2016. Fitzpatrick’s entire contract is guaranteed including a $10 million signing bonus. Fitzpatrick’s contract contains a voidable contract year to lessen the 2016 cap charge.

 

 

The downside you're probably wondering about is that it'll cost us $5M in dead money to void that last year, since his contract is fully guaranteed.  But given that we're due to have about $80M in cap space in 2018, it's probably not a big deal. 

[RutgersJetFan]

I know this is gonna sound ****ed up but honestly $1 million above the mean...I mean yeah that's technically above average but not really. In terms of NFL money and especially when it comes to quarterbacks that's not a lot at all. $12 mill is pretty on the spot of average.  

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

I know this is gonna sound ****ed up but honestly $1 million above the mean...I mean yeah that's technically above average but not really. In terms of NFL money and especially when it comes to quarterbacks that's not a lot at all. $12 mill is pretty on the spot of average.  

 

Not only is the cap charge $7M, not $12M.....but wouldn't the MEDIAN QB cap charge among starters be a better way to look at it anyways? 

[RutgersJetFan]

5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Not only is the cap charge $7M, not $12M.....but wouldn't the MEDIAN QB cap charge among starters be a better way to look at it anyways? 

Maybe. But it would have to be for only starters. 

[drdetroit]

Sign Tebow

[Jetsfan80]

15 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

Maybe. But it would have to be for only starters. 

Well, if we go with the top 32 (which includes rookie starter Carson Wentz, rookie backup Jared Goff, and RG3, who was paid to be a starter...so basically Chase Daniel just takes Case Keenum's spot and doesn't really impact the data for median purposes), this is what it looks like:

 

Player	Team	Salary Cap Value

Eli Manning	Giants	$24,200,000
Ben Roethlisberger	Steelers	$23,950,000
Matt Ryan	Falcons	$23,750,000
Joe Flacco	Ravens	$22,550,000
Matt Stafford	Lions	$22,500,000
Tony Romo	Cowboys	$20,835,000
Kirk Cousins	Redskins	$19,953,000
Cam Newton	Panthers	$19,500,000
Aaron Rodgers	Packers	$19,250,000
Russell Wilson	Seahawks	$18,542,000
Andrew Luck	Colts	$18,400,000
Carson Palmer	Cardinals	$18,375,000
Alex Smith	Chiefs	$17,800,000
Drew Brees	Saints	$17,250,000
Jay Cutler	Bears	$17,000,000
Philip Rivers	Chargers	$16,500,000
Colin Kaepernick	49ers	$15,890,753
Tom Brady	Patriots	$13,764,706
Andy Dalton	Bengals	$13,100,000
Brock Osweiler	Texans	$12,000,000
Ryan Tannehill	Dolphins	$11,640,000
Sam Bradford	Vikings	$7,000,000
Ryan Fitzpatrick	Jets	$7,000,000
Tyrod Taylor	Bills	$6,913,333
Jameis Winston	Buccaneers	$5,761,654
Blake Bortles	Jaguars	$5,633,128
Marcus Mariota	Titans	$5,503,176
Jared Goff	Rams	$5,079,577
Robert Griffin III	Browns	$5,046,875
Josh McCown	Browns	$5,041,666
Chase Daniel	Eagles	$5,000,000
Carson Wentz	Eagles	$4,850,243

[Jetsfan80]

^^^  As I bolded above, the median falls between Rivers ($16.5M) and Kaepernick ($15.9M). 

So yeah, this argument is pretty dumb.  Even if you want to say that Fitz is costing us $12M, He's still making a good bit less than the cap figure of the median starting QB in the league.  Including backups and creating a "mean QB salary" figure is stupid, because there's a huge dropoff in salary when you drop from a starting QB to a backup.  Oh, and when you take the mean of the 32 QB's above, it comes out to a little above $14M.

And lol that Brady is costing under $14M against the cap in '16.  They're probably matching that cap figure under the table. 

 

Source for table above:  http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/2016/

[win4ever]

His cap hit is $12 million, it's just spread out over two years to fit him into the cap this year.  In reality, he gets $12 million.  I'm going to go out on a limb and say he's not achieving any of his escalator clauses.  While his contract is voidable, it's not like the cap hit just goes away, it's just spread out for salary cap purposes.   

If you do average guaranteed per year (since it's a one year contract) he's the 6th highest on the list.  

He could be paid backup money, and still not live up to the contract, so it's a moot point.  

[Jetsfan80]

7 minutes ago, win4ever said:

If you do average guaranteed per year (since it's a one year contract) he's the 6th highest on the list. 

 

Oh for pete's sake.  Only players care about the guaranteed money, and they only care about the TOTAL.  Listing this as a reason to claim he was overpaid is silly.  All that matters for the organization's purposes, and for the interests of the fans, is cap charge, and $12M spread out over 2 is cheap for a starting QB.  

We have plenty of threads complaining about Fitz's performance, and rightly so.  This is probably the least useful one to do so in.  No offense to Max. 

[RutgersJetFan]

27 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Well, if we go with the top 32 (which includes rookie starter Carson Wentz, rookie backup Jared Goff, and RG3, who was paid to be a starter...so basically Chase Daniel just takes Case Keenum's spot and doesn't really impact the data for median purposes), this is what it looks like:

 

Player	Team	Salary Cap Value

Eli Manning	Giants	$24,200,000
Ben Roethlisberger	Steelers	$23,950,000
Matt Ryan	Falcons	$23,750,000
Joe Flacco	Ravens	$22,550,000
Matt Stafford	Lions	$22,500,000
Tony Romo	Cowboys	$20,835,000
Kirk Cousins	Redskins	$19,953,000
Cam Newton	Panthers	$19,500,000
Aaron Rodgers	Packers	$19,250,000
Russell Wilson	Seahawks	$18,542,000
Andrew Luck	Colts	$18,400,000
Carson Palmer	Cardinals	$18,375,000
Alex Smith	Chiefs	$17,800,000
Drew Brees	Saints	$17,250,000
Jay Cutler	Bears	$17,000,000
Philip Rivers	Chargers	$16,500,000
Colin Kaepernick	49ers	$15,890,753
Tom Brady	Patriots	$13,764,706
Andy Dalton	Bengals	$13,100,000
Brock Osweiler	Texans	$12,000,000
Ryan Tannehill	Dolphins	$11,640,000
Sam Bradford	Vikings	$7,000,000
Ryan Fitzpatrick	Jets	$7,000,000
Tyrod Taylor	Bills	$6,913,333
Jameis Winston	Buccaneers	$5,761,654
Blake Bortles	Jaguars	$5,633,128
Marcus Mariota	Titans	$5,503,176
Jared Goff	Rams	$5,079,577
Robert Griffin III	Browns	$5,046,875
Josh McCown	Browns	$5,041,666
Chase Daniel	Eagles	$5,000,000
Carson Wentz	Eagles	$4,850,243

I don't know, the sample size isn't that large here and at face value the curve seems like a pretty normal distribution. In statistics we generally use medians over means when the kurtosis values are skewed and/or with large-N analyses. That doesn't look to be the case here.

[win4ever]

32 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Oh for pete's sake.  Only players care about the guaranteed money, and they only care about the TOTAL.  Listing this as a reason to claim he was overpaid is silly.  All that matters for the organization's purposes, and for the interests of the fans, is cap charge, and $12M spread out over 2 is cheap for a starting QB.  

We have plenty of threads complaining about Fitz's performance, and rightly so.  This is probably the least useful one to do so in.  No offense to Max. 

It's a one year, $12 million contract.  That's guaranteed money.  Yeah, it's spread out over 2 years for cap purposes, but we'll be paying dead money of $5 million for him next year.  Why do players care about guaranteed money?  Because it's guaranteed money.  They can play like crap and still earn it.  

If this was say a legit 2 or 3 year contract that we could have him signed, but the cost of cutting him is minimal thanks to cap maneuvering, then I'd care more.  But it's not, it's one year of service that is costing us $12 million, only that 5 of it is just transferred to next year.

How is he not overpaid?

I'm not saying he's the 6th highest paid QB by the way, but contract stats can be cherry picked both ways.  

[Maxman]

53 minutes ago, win4ever said:

His cap hit is $12 million, it's just spread out over two years to fit him into the cap this year.  In reality, he gets $12 million.  I'm going to go out on a limb and say he's not achieving any of his escalator clauses.  While his contract is voidable, it's not like the cap hit just goes away, it's just spread out for salary cap purposes.   

If you do average guaranteed per year (since it's a one year contract) he's the 6th highest on the list.  

He could be paid backup money, and still not live up to the contract, so it's a moot point.  

Oh so this is actually worse. There is going to be a 5 or 6 million dollar cap hit for him next year? Even if he isn't on the team?

This contract was worse than I realized.

[Maxman]

46 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Oh for pete's sake.  Only players care about the guaranteed money, and they only care about the TOTAL.  Listing this as a reason to claim he was overpaid is silly.  All that matters for the organization's purposes, and for the interests of the fans, is cap charge, and $12M spread out over 2 is cheap for a starting QB.  

We have plenty of threads complaining about Fitz's performance, and rightly so.  This is probably the least useful one to do so in.  No offense to Max. 

I disagree. He is costing them 12 million against the cap. Just over two years right? He won't be the starter next year. When you factor in that he is only starting probably 8 games this year, the contract (and cap hit for it) gets even worse.

[BurnleyJet]

19 minutes ago, Maxman said:

I disagree. He is costing them 12 million against the cap. Just over two years right? He won't be the starter next year. When you factor in that he is only starting probably 8 games this year, the contract (and cap hit for it) gets even worse.

It's only worse because he sucks.

He's still cheap in NFL terms, it's just he's terrible. At least Petty is cheap..

[win4ever]

20 minutes ago, Maxman said:

Oh so this is actually worse. There is going to be a 5 or 6 million dollar cap hit for him next year? Even if he isn't on the team?

This contract was worse than I realized.

Yeah there is a $5 million dead money hit from him next year.  I'm not 100% sure, but they might be able to split that into two and make it $2.5 for the next two years with a post June 1st cut designation, but I'm not 100% sure. 

Either way, he's guaranteed $12 million and the Jets will have that cap hit for him playing just this year.  They added the year because it would have been tough to fit him into this years cap so late.  It's really just an accounting maneuver.  

I was honestly surprised by the contract because Fitz pretty much got the best deal he could reasonably expect considering no one else seemed close to signing him.   

[j4jets]

2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Fitz's cap number this year is $7M:

http://overthecap.com/player/ryan-fitzpatrick/1338/

 

The money was never a big deal.  The biggest problems are twofold, depending on the truth of the matter:  Either we don't have a QB on the roster good enough to turn to, or the coaching staff is not WILLING to turn to a new one (ideally Petty). 

Couple the QB situation with a talented (at least when you look at it through the lens of draft capital and FA dollars spent on it over the years) and expensive defense that is playing awful under a supposed defensive genius, and those are our biggest problems as an organization at the moment.

But don't let me stop people from yelling about the $12M (which will really be $7M with the 2nd year voided), as if that actually matters.  QB's are expensive.  Good ones even moreso.  One day hopefully we'll have a good enough QB to give a bloated contract to.

Bullsh*t all around. Good QBs and Fitz are expensive. sh*t QBs cost 4-6mil. That's not expensive. And stop with the $7mil bs you Fitznut huggers talk about. 

[j4jets]

20 minutes ago, BurnleyJet said:

It's only worse because he sucks.

He's still cheap in NFL terms, it's just he's terrible. At least Petty is cheap..

He's not cheap. WTF do you guys really smoke? IDC if he's good or bad, even at the time of signing he wasn't cheap. 

[j4jets]

2 hours ago, RutgersJetFan said:

I know this is gonna sound ****ed up but honestly $1 million above the mean...I mean yeah that's technically above average but not really. In terms of NFL money and especially when it comes to quarterbacks that's not a lot at all. $12 mill is pretty on the spot of average.  

No it's not. And he's doesn't deserve an average deal, not even when he signed it. Don't compare him to franchise QBs or young QBs with a ton of potential. He's an old garbage that deserves to remain on the bench. 

[j4jets]

1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Oh for pete's sake.  Only players care about the guaranteed money, and they only care about the TOTAL.  Listing this as a reason to claim he was overpaid is silly.  All that matters for the organization's purposes, and for the interests of the fans, is cap charge, and $12M spread out over 2 is cheap for a starting QB.  

We have plenty of threads complaining about Fitz's performance, and rightly so.  This is probably the least useful one to do so in.  No offense to Max. 

We have some seriously delusional fans that think Fitz is actually making $7mil n that he'll lead this team to the playoffs. 

[ljr]

There's Bull$h*t all around on both sides of this

his 2016 salary will eventually be 12mil

that was a fair # for a veteran starting QB coming into this season

he was easily the best option we had coming into the season

he has easily also played poorly this year (along with many others)

if he can't pull a miracle out of his *$$ and turn it around it is going to s*ck

that still is better than having forfeited 2016 before it started by not trying to get the best person you could, for reasonable price, at starting QB

[Villain The Foe]

7 hours ago, Maxman said:

It was just on Sunday night football. So I think that means that Fitz is above average. When it comes to the salary cap anyhow. At least there is that.

 

7 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Fitz's cap number this year is $7M:

http://overthecap.com/player/ryan-fitzpatrick/1338/

 

The money was never a big deal.  The biggest problems are twofold, depending on the truth of the matter:  Either we don't have a QB on the roster good enough to turn to, or the coaching staff is not WILLING to turn to a new one (ideally Petty). 

Couple the QB situation with a talented (at least when you look at it through the lens of draft capital and FA dollars spent on it over the years) and expensive defense that is playing awful under a supposed defensive genius, and those are our biggest problems as an organization at the moment.

But don't let me stop people from yelling about the $12M (which will really be $7M with the 2nd year voided), as if that actually matters.  QB's are expensive.  Good ones even moreso.  One day hopefully we'll have a good enough QB to give a bloated contract to.

I wouldn't stop people from screaming 12 million, given that's what it cost the jets for him to play like the worst starting qb this season. If Macc had the cap room then of course that 12 mill would have been on the books this season. The fact that we had to spend "future money" for this below average inconsistent qb that has never beaten an average or better team on the road in 12 years, while only winning 7 of those games at home in the same time span shouldn't give anyone the indication that they should clarify how the money is broken down when the signing itself was a poor decision. He shouldn't have even been resigned.

Starting any of the 3 QB's we had on the roster would have been ideal rather than signing Fitz to 7 mill with another 5 paid out the day after the Superbowl...to be specific. 

But be real here, it's 12 million for this season because the money is to pay for these 16 games. Semantics is unnecessary.

[NYs Stepchild]

He's getting 12 million, which is too much, but it's only 4 mil more than it should be and we really were stuck between a rock and another rock. Fitz is obviously better at negotiating than playing QB. 

Now if you figure out the average per year salary of the other QBs then he is the 23rd highest paid QB. While that may be too high right now it's not as bad as people make it sound nor as good as others make it sound. 

Can no one on this planet be objective anymore?

[BurnleyJet]

5 hours ago, j4jets said:

He's not cheap. WTF do you guys really smoke? IDC if he's good or bad, even at the time of signing he wasn't cheap. 

I know 12mill is not a small about of money. It's just agents have set the bar for an NFL QB. So unless your under a rookie contract, all QB's are expensive, even for poor ones. Hey it's a one year deal, the Bears are playing Cutler 17mill and Joe Flacco 22 mill.

 

[slats]

8 hours ago, Maxman said:

@jason423 can you shed some light on this for us?

Stupid contract is stupid. 

The second year isn't voidable, it automatically voids a couple days into the NFL's next fiscal year. This year he costs $7M for crappy QB play, next year he costs $5 to be a lower paid backup on some other team. 

[Sperm Edwards]

7 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Oh for pete's sake.  Only players care about the guaranteed money, and they only care about the TOTAL.  Listing this as a reason to claim he was overpaid is silly.  All that matters for the organization's purposes, and for the interests of the fans, is cap charge, and $12M spread out over 2 is cheap for a starting QB.  

We have plenty of threads complaining about Fitz's performance, and rightly so.  This is probably the least useful one to do so in.  No offense to Max. 

If this past offseason we'd instead extended Brick at $8M/yr, and rationalized it's less than most starting LTs, he'd still be overpaid. 

Fitzpatrick is overpaid.

[ljr]

1 hour ago, Villain The Foe said:

 

I wouldn't stop people from screaming 12 million, given that's what it cost the jets for him to play like the worst starting qb this season. If Macc had the cap room then of course that 12 mill would have been on the books this season. The fact that we had to spend "future money" for this below average inconsistent qb that has never beaten an average or better team on the road in 12 years, while only winning 7 of those games at home in the same time span shouldn't give anyone the indication that they should clarify how the money is broken down when the signing itself was a poor decision. He shouldn't have even been resigned.

Starting any of the 3 QB's we had on the roster would have been ideal rather than signing Fitz to 7 mill with another 5 paid out the day after the Superbowl...to be specific. 

But be real here, it's 12 million for this season because the money is to pay for these 16 games. Semantics is unnecessary.

Agree to disagree with you

MM maneuvered his salary cap credit card in a normal way and has an average balance (not a Mike Tannenbaum balance) on it for when we head into 2017 ... His "working of the team's books " is the least of our issues.

the signing was a good decision ... His 2016 performance however has been poor so far.

Petty is the only other QB on the roster with any possible chance to have shown anything in 2016 & he was hurt and out the 1st quarter of the season ... So in essence , there was no other option.  The fact that you are even talking about having stuck Hack in this year only shows how blind your reasoning is due to your Fitz hate

[Warfish]

Whats funny is people think an NFL Head Coach wouldn't bench a 7 million cap number QB doing horribly, because of the money.

No HC is letting himself lose out and get fired over 7 million.

 

[ljr]

8 minutes ago, slats said:

Stupid contract is stupid. 

The second year isn't voidable, it automatically voids a couple days into the NFL's next fiscal year. This year he costs $7M for crappy QB play, next year he costs $5 to be a lower paid backup on some other team. 

Lol , disagree ... The contract was fair ... The 2016 performance has been stupid

[Sperm Edwards]

1 minute ago, Warfish said:

Whats funny is people think an NFL Head Coach wouldn't bench a 7 million cap number QB doing horribly, because of the money.

No HC is letting himself lose out and get fired over 7 million.

 

What is even funnier is thinking a single NFL HC thinks of his QB's compensation as being his present season's cap number rather than the amount paid to him in the current season. 

[Warfish]

2 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

What is even funnier is thinking a single NFL HC thinks of his QB's compensation as being his present season's cap number rather than the amount paid to him in the current season. 

You think they don't understand things like that?

LOL.

So lets summarize, you want us to lose out, and think NFL HEad Coaches are too dumb to know cap # from salary #, and that salary # alone forces their hands to play bad players.  Got it.

[ljr]

7 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

If this past offseason we'd instead extended Brick at $8M/yr, and rationalized it's less than most starting LTs, he'd still be overpaid. 

Fitzpatrick is overpaid.

What would you believe should have been a "fair" salary heading into this season?

if you are thinking anything below 10 or 11 you are not paying attention to current NFL economics