Bucs agree to one-year contract with free-agent RB LeSean McCoy

[FidelioJet]

4 minutes ago, slats said:

I'd also prefer it if the Jets signed players whose name I recognize from a few years ago over finding young talent with potential to grow. 

It’s not about names. It’s about making even the slightest effort to compete. 
like keeping the few good players you have. 

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Lurker89 said:

So McCoy isn't washed up and hasn't lost a step in your opinion? .... Interesting.

No, Bell has in his estimation.

Signing McCoy is trying, Bell isnt

Follow along

[Jet Nut]

22 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

That’s not the point really.  The Bucs are clearly making an effort to build the best team they can. Trying to put a team on the field this year that can win.  

The Jets, right now, are the polar opposite.  

People on this board are mocking them for it.  I applaud them for it. 

When were you last happy, before the 2015 season when Macc signed every available FA?

 

[Snell41]

Brady Shady and Gronk reminds me of that movie where the old geriatric dudes go to space one last time.


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[slats]

14 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

It’s not about names. It’s about making even the slightest effort to compete. 
like keeping the few good players you have. 

At least you'll never be disappointed. I guess that's something. 

[Lurker89]

38 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

That’s not the point really.  The Bucs are clearly making an effort to build the best team they can. Trying to put a team on the field this year that can win.  

The Jets, right now, are the polar opposite.  

People on this board are mocking them for it.  I applaud them for it. 

They forced themselves into a two year window....you do see that right?

They have two years to make it work with Old Man Brady... so yes they are trying to put out the best team in the field with little foresight into their future beyond 2021. We are in a completely different situation. We are trying to develop players not pay mercenaries to eat up the playing time and keep us from developing players. 

Yes Tampa is going for it all right now, no s***, you don't say. We are in the first year of full on player aquisition for what seems to be a promising GM. These are two very different teams in very different places. Sometimes It seems like you have no situational awareness or just don't believe in developing players.

KC made it seem like they were saving McCoy for their playoff run but barely used him the whole year. He had 465 yards on the year. I'll give you that he had a very healthy YPA. It's a good move for tampa, He's a good contributing piece for a team chasing a championship not the Shady of days gone past. 

[FidelioJet]

11 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

When were you last happy, before the 2015 season when Macc signed every available FA?

 

Why, because our basically decade long rebuild has worked so well?

Still didn’t have a QB that year but yes. I liked that he tried, but should gotten a legit QB first.  

We have our QB now. It’s time to try and win.  Teams turn around in the NFL very quickly - especially since we have a super talented QB.

Surround this guy with a starting caliber OL and a couple of quality weapons and you’re a competitive team capable winning playoff games. All of which could have been done this off-season. 

We chose to continue the rebuild.  

[More Cowbell]

On 7/30/2020 at 8:31 PM, Trolly McTrollface said:

Winning beats losing...

which fan base do you think is more excited about the '20 season?

Let's see, an organization that has a young future star at QB, a young group of receivers with good potential, Possibly the best group of LB's in the league, good talent on the DL, or the one with the QB who is over 40 years old and has gotten progressively worse each of the last two seasons, A TE who is a question mark if he can even stay healthy,  and who's best RB is 32 years old and can't stick on  a team.  

[FidelioJet]

7 minutes ago, slats said:

At least you'll never be disappointed. I guess that's something. 

That’s more your position than mine. I want to win. Or at least try. 
 

Most of you seem To be happy to give up our best players and be in a perpetual rebuild. Keeping low expectations makes many around here happy. 
 

I wan to win, at worst make an attempt to win. 

[Jet Nut]

18 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Why, because our basically decade long rebuild has worked so well?

Still didn’t have a QB that year but yes. I liked that he tried, but should gotten a legit QB first.  

We have our QB now. It’s time to try and win.  Teams turn around in the NFL very quickly - especially since we have a super talented QB.

Surround this guy with a starting caliber OL and a couple of quality weapons and you’re a competitive team capable winning playoff games. All of which could have been done this off-season. 

We chose to continue the rebuild.  

They upgraded the OL to anyone not named Fidelio

They upgraded the WRs

They upgraded the RBs

They upgraded the DBs

Stop complaining and let things play out instead of just claiming they havent done a thing.

 

[BROOKLYN JET]

22 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

That’s more your position than mine. I want to win. Or at least try. 
 

Most of you seem To be happy to give up our best players and be in a perpetual rebuild. Keeping low expectations makes many around here happy. 
 

I wan to win, at worst make an attempt to win. 

The most you are referring to, realize the shambles the past regime left the team in.

So they understand that what Douglas is doing is necessary, if we ever want to have a shot at seeing a perennial contender.

[More Cowbell]

22 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Why, because our basically decade long rebuild has worked so well?

Still didn’t have a QB that year but yes. I liked that he tried, but should gotten a legit QB first.  

We have our QB now. It’s time to try and win.  Teams turn around in the NFL very quickly - especially since we have a super talented QB.

Surround this guy with a starting caliber OL and a couple of quality weapons and you’re a competitive team capable winning playoff games. All of which could have been done this off-season. 

We chose to continue the rebuild.  

This is a ridiculous. 

[slats]

13 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

That’s more your position than mine. I want to win. Or at least try. 
 

Most of you seem To be happy to give up our best players and be in a perpetual rebuild. Keeping low expectations makes many around here happy. 
 

I wan to win, at worst make an attempt to win. 

Are you still upset about Jamal Adams? Dude who plays maybe the 22nd most important position on a football field? You think paying him $15-$20M would be better for this team than getting two firsts, a third, and a suitable SS replacement for him and a fourth? I mean, if that's really your honest opinion, there's nothing I can do for you. I'm not sure it is, I think you just like taking daily dumps on Gase and/or Douglas. 

My feeling is that this team has it's first real GM, doing real, smart, long-range moves that smart GMs make since forever. Spending money to win a little more today at the expense of tomorrow would be dumb. According to Vegas, the team is two-tenths of a win worse than it was before the trade. Heavens to Murgatroyd! What a set back!

Next year the team has five picks in the top 100, and a decent amount of cap space. If/when Darnold steps it up this year (I remain optimistic that it will happen), they will be well-stocked to build a team around him and be in "win now mode," starting at that time. And then they'll have two first rounders again in 2022! 

Again, if you can't see how that's infinitely better, I can't help you. 

[FidelioJet]

4 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

They upgraded the OL to anyone not named Fidelio

They upgraded the WRs

They upgraded the RBs

They upgraded the DBs

Stop complaining and let things play out instead of just claiming they havent done a thing.

 

They drafted players because they had to. He is trying to win eventually, I’ll give him that -  but you can compete and try and build at the same time.
 

They downgraded the OL (we have no idea what Becton is)

They downgraded WR (we don’t know what Mims is yet - I love the pick though)

They downgraded RB (We don’t know what Perine is yet - I like pick) Gore is a million years old. Bell is a year older and I’m sure a year slower. 

They did upgrade CB but the overall Defensive Backfield is now heavily downgraded. 
 

if you’re not being a homer there’s just no way you can look at the roster this year and say it’s better than last year’s, unless you’re banking on rookies contributing. Which we should be pretty hard pressed to do

[FidelioJet]

32 minutes ago, BROOKLYN JET said:

The most you are referring to, realize the shambles the past regime left the team in.

So they understand that what Douglas is doing is necessary, if we ever want to have a shot at seeing a perennial contender.

I hear ya. and at this point I’m okay with it. If the new GM feels as if we need to continue the rebuild I’ll be onboard. The people here should at least accept that’s what’s happening and not pretend like there’s any effort at all to win this year and stop telling me things like:
 

Adams isn’t very good and wouldn’t help the team anyway. 
Robby was just a JAG and a guy with half his production is better anyway. 
George Fant is going to all of a sudden not be one of the worst T in all of football because he’s going to figure it out in his 5th year. 
Becton wasn’t a very average pass blocker in college will go from being just average in college to stud LT in the NFL right away. 
GVR was just relegated to the CFL just a few short years ago

Bell isn’t slow and is just as good as he was in PItt. Doesn’t matter that he’s way slower now because speed wasn’t his thing anyway. 

 

When people stop spinning that nonsense.  We’re on full on rebuild mode right now. Just accept it. 

[Jet Nut]

14 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

They drafted players because they had to. He is trying to win eventually, I’ll give him that -  but you can compete and try and build at the same time.
 

They downgraded the OL (we have no idea what Becton is)

They downgraded WR (we don’t know what Mims is yet - I love the pick though)

They downgraded RB (We don’t know what Perine is yet - I like pick) Gore is a million years old. Bell is a year older and I’m sure a year slower. 

They did upgrade CB but the overall Defensive Backfield is now heavily downgraded. 
 

if you’re not being a homer there’s just no way you can look at the roster this year and say it’s better than last year’s, unless you’re banking on rookies contributing. Which we should be pretty hard pressed to do

Drafted players because they had to, what is that?  Did they improve those positions?
No one, not a single person thinks the downgraded the OL.  

No kidding, no one knows what a draft pick will be but some, like Becton leave you having a pretty good idea.  To just throw "we have no idea" is a joke.  Same for Mims.  

Perine and Gore are worse than Montgomery and Powell?  To who, you and who else? Gore is better than both, combined.  And more reliable, DOWNGRADE!

And they improved both DB spots a huge upgrade but let me guess because of S the backfield was HEAVILY downgraded.

Black clouds everywhere.  Woe is me

[Lurker89]

2 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

They drafted players because they had to. He is trying to win eventually, I’ll give him that -  but you can compete and try and build at the same time.
 

They downgraded the OL (we have no idea what Becton is)

They downgraded WR (we don’t know what Mims is yet - I love the pick though)

They downgraded RB (We don’t know what Perine is yet - I like pick) Gore is a million years old. Bell is a year older and I’m sure a year slower. 

They did upgrade CB but the overall Defensive Backfield is now heavily downgraded. 
 

if you’re not being a homer there’s just no way you can look at the roster this year and say it’s better than last year’s, unless you’re banking on rookies contributing. Which we should be pretty hard pressed to do

I like you as a fan  and an absurd character here on the boards, we can agree on plenty but your player evaluation takes are generally way off imo.

The O-line as a unit is better today.

The only WR we lost was THE Robby Anderson.... .. your take on Robby being awesome is wrong. Adding Mims an Perriman is a plus. Adding Perine to the backfield is a plus. You Know RBs contribute from day one but acknowledging that wouldn't fit your sad sack narrative.

We lost Robby, Adams, Beachum, and Trumaine. Considering the comp for Adams there is no one there I miss. Beachum as an insurance policy maybe.

You want to be sad be sad, it's amusing.....  But your schtick looks foolish on a lot of fronts.

 

[FidelioJet]

1 hour ago, Lurker89 said:

I like you as a fan  and an absurd character here on the boards, we can agree on plenty but your player evaluation takes are generally way off imo.

The O-line as a unit is better today.

The only WR we lost was THE Robby Anderson.... .. your take on Robby being awesome is wrong. Adding Mims an Perriman is a plus. Adding Perine to the backfield is a plus. You Know RBs contribute from day one but acknowledging that wouldn't fit your sad sack narrative.

We lost Robby, Beachum and Trumain, considering the comp for Adams there is no one there I miss. Beachum as an insurance policy maybe.

You want to be sad be sad, it's amusing.....  But your schtick looks foolish on a lot of fronts.

 

And we replaced each of them with a lesser player.  Perriman (half of Robby’s production) Beachum, middle of the road T while Fant is at the bottom of the league and Adams, our only all-pro is gone and replaced with a JAG.  

Again, I’m not saying the comp for Adams was bad - it was a solid deal for sure and I’ll be happy come draft time over the next two years.  But it’s not a move you make if you’re trying to build a winning team this year.

Tell, where am I off in that talent evaluation? So for off that I look foolish?

But outside of draft picks this team didn’t upgrade anywhere and EVERY TEAM has draft picks.  So in that case our bottom of the league talent level is worse than it was last year.

I’m very big in the Darnold camp and believe he can be a great QB - and if they put some faith in him and built a team around him, instead of being scared and continuing the rebuild this team had a chance to be competitive this year.  JD chose not to - it’s fine.

We’ll wait until next year to see when we’re ready and see what kind of a GM JD is, right now we don’t know yet.  I’ll withhold judgement.

 

[Lurker89]

6 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

Tell, where am I off in that talent evaluation? So for off that I look foolish?

 

You don't take extenuating circumstances into consideration.

We'll start with Robby. Robby was miscast as the top receiver here and was force fed a WR1 target share.

Over the last three years Robby averaged 101 targets.

Over the same three years  Perriman averaged 43 targets playing as a third or fourth option on his team.

Based on their target share your comp of the players isn't apples to apples. In a "what have you done for me lately" league Perriman is being paid less than half of what Robby is before incentives after a mini breakout when given more opportunity last year. On a per attempt basis their numbers are very comparable over their careers and Perriman is far more athletically gifted.

On to Beachum.

With Beachum you have a tackle who ranked in the bottom third of starters in the league last year. He was signed as a quality back by the Cardinals. They didn't sign him as a starter, his upside is severely limited. Yet you want to fault us for not signing him. 

You and I both have a problem with the Fant signing at 10mil. It's major gamble but a gamble with massive upside with outs after this year. Along with that the bet was hedged by drafting Becton. I will gladly take Fant and Becton and their upside over locking in someone like Conklin long term and passing on Becton. I think that is somewhere you and I differ in opinion and somewhere I think you are severely wrong.

That being said I always liked Beachum, quality human being.

Let's lastly touch on Tru. I can admit I liked the Tru signing on day one and something tells me you did as well. How did that turn out? We have addition by subtraction there.

Without Adams we still have a competent Safety room .... My feelings on Adams are well documented.

You don't seem to see the idea behind the vision of what JD is trying to do with this team. This is a benchmark year, this year we see which bets pan out and who is part of the plans moving forward. The cream that rises will be kept and the fat will be trimmed.

So that's the long and short of why I think you are off on your analysis to the point that people rag on you. I think you liked Robby, overvalued him, and wanted to keep at an unnecessary cost for what he actually provides the team. I think that love for Robby clouds your judgement of his replacements. For me Perriman plus Mims is a replacement I am very happy with. 

 

I'm surprised I wasn't more of an ***hole in this post, guess I'm not trolling today.

[Philc1]

13 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

They upgraded the OL to anyone not named Fidelio

They upgraded the WRs

They upgraded the RBs

They upgraded the DBs

Stop complaining and let things play out instead of just claiming they havent done a thing.

 

We are about the same at WR.  We downgraded at DB even if Adams was ridiculously overrated 

[FidelioJet]

14 hours ago, Lurker89 said:

 

You don't take extenuating circumstances into consideration.

We'll start with Robby. Robby was miscast as the top receiver here and was force fed a WR1 target share.

Over the last three years Robby averaged 101 targets.

Over the same three years  Perriman averaged 43 targets playing as a third or fourth option on his team.

Based on their target share your comp of the players isn't apples to apples. In a "what have you done for me lately" league Perriman is being paid less than half of what Robby is before incentives after a mini breakout when given more opportunity last year. On a per attempt basis their numbers are very comparable over their careers and Perriman is far more athletically gifted.

On to Beachum.

With Beachum you have a tackle who ranked in the bottom third of starters in the league last year. He was signed as a quality back by the Cardinals. They didn't sign him as a starter, his upside is severely limited. Yet you want to fault us for not signing him. 

You and I both have a problem with the Fant signing at 10mil. It's major gamble but a gamble with massive upside with outs after this year. Along with that the bet was hedged by drafting Becton. I will gladly take Fant and Becton and their upside over locking in someone like Conklin long term and passing on Becton. I think that is somewhere you and I differ in opinion and somewhere I think you are severely wrong.

That being said I always liked Beachum, quality human being.

Let's lastly touch on Tru. I can admit I liked the Tru signing on day one and something tells me you did as well. How did that turn out? We have addition by subtraction there.

Without Adams we still have a competent Safety room .... My feelings on Adams are well documented.

You don't seem to see the idea behind the vision of what JD is trying to do with this team. This is a benchmark year, this year we see which bets pan out and who is part of the plans moving forward. The cream that rises will be kept and the fat will be trimmed.

So that's the long and short of why I think you are off on your analysis to the point that people rag on you. I think you liked Robby, overvalued him, and wanted to keep at an unnecessary cost for what he actually provides the team. I think that love for Robby clouds your judgement of his replacements. For me Perriman plus Mims is a replacement I am very happy with. 

 

I'm surprised I wasn't more of an ***hole in this post, guess I'm not trolling today.

You’re a nice guy. And we agree in more than you think. But....

The Robby argument is silly.  By your rationale if I played for the Jets, got 1 target, caught it. I’m therefor better than Robby.  You get targets because you earn them.  

Adams was a difference maker. Whether the position is still competent doesn’t matter.  He was the only impact player we had and we shipped him off. 

Jets fans have a thing where they simply don’t like their good players and completely under value them. It’s sad but true. Just like Adams and just any other good player we’ve ever had.  

I just don’t see Fant as a gamble but simply a bad signing - I don’t care what the cost. Bring him in to be a starter says a lot to me about the teams intentions.   I don’t think guys “figure it out” in their 5th year. Never seen it happen before, don’t expect it to happen now. He’s clearly been a lesser player than Beachum. 

I love Mims, but we shouldn’t count on any rookie contributing  there’s just too many unknowns when dealing with rookies  

 

Let me be clear. I’m not saying JD is doing a bad job, just that he’s not trying or expecting to win this year. anyway, that’s how I see  

 

[Jets723]

2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

You’re a nice guy. And we agree in more than you think. But....

The Robby argument is silly.  By your rationale if I played for the Jets, got 1 target, caught it. I’m therefor better than Robby.  You get targets because you earn them.  

Adams was a difference maker. Whether the position is still competent doesn’t matter.  He was the only impact player we had and we shipped him off. 

Jets fans have a thing where they simply don’t like their good players and completely under value them. It’s sad but true. Just like Adams and just any other good player we’ve ever had.  

I just don’t see Fant as a gamble but simply a bad signing - I don’t care what the cost. Bring him in to be a starter says a lot to me about the teams intentions.   I don’t think guys “figure it out” in their 5th year. Never seen it happen before, don’t expect it to happen now. He’s clearly been a lesser player than Beachum. 

I love Mims, but we shouldn’t count on any rookie contributing  there’s just too many unknowns when dealing with rookies  

 

Let me be clear. I’m not saying JD is doing a bad job, just that he’s not trying or expecting to win this year. anyway, that’s how I see  

 

You are the most miserable “fan” I’ve ever seen lol.  The problem is that you equate not spending millions of dollars to not caring about winning.  Hate to break it to you buddy but we did that during the Macc era and wound up worse.  JD is doing the smart thing by building through the draft and avoiding headaches. Jamal was a headache who showed no loyalty to the Jets.  Plus Seattle  foolish enough To give a Kong’s ransom for a safety.  So JD has to pounce on that offer like any good GM would 

[Lurker89]

3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

The Robby argument is silly.  By your rationale if I played for the Jets, got 1 target, caught it. I’m therefor better than Robby.  You get targets because you earn them.  

You also get targets if your team has literally no other options because they are horribly mismanaged. I believe that's the case with Robby, if you believe he earned WR1 target that's your prerogative. I just disagree,  I think we had no other choice due to horrible GM work.

Saying that I would equate a single target equivalency to Robby's is a misrepresenting my logic, but you already know that. Let's not paint me out to be a halfwit and I'll try to afford you the same courtesy. I am willing compare their totals on a per target basis over their careers, you just want to look at totals and none of the minutiae surrounding those numbers. 

I look at it through a lens realizing sure Perriman has half the production but it's on half the targets in very different teams with very different WR situations. You and I disagree on the overall quality of receiver that both players are. As in I think they are both wr3s with upside and you think Robby is top 30ish while Perriman is a trash bag. 

[Lurker89]

6 hours ago, Jets723 said:

I just don’t see Fant as a gamble but simply a bad signing - I don’t care what the cost. Bring him in to be a starter says a lot to me about the teams intentions.   I don’t think guys “figure it out” in their 5th year. Never seen it happen before, don’t expect it to happen now. He’s clearly been a lesser player than Beachum. 

On to this part of your post. Can't is here to compete for the tackle spots and is being paid handsomely for it. I do not believe he will be handed the spot based in his salary. We sat Tru last year we'll sit Fant if he isn't the answer to either tackle spot. I was just happy we didn't lock up Conklin to ridiculous money to play LT with his injury history and playing RT.

If Fant doesn't work out the intended escape hatch is built into the contract. I like Beachum but he wasn't the future he was barely hold the fort. Would I have liked to bring him or Peters in as insurance to make sure the floor doesn't fall out sure. But that's my point the spilled milk you are crying about is a WR3 and a fringe starter at tackle. You can call it not trying I'll call it actually cultivating a team properly. You don't waste time on Beachum or Peters if you goal is finding tomorrow's tackle today.

Not sure why this quoted 723

@FidelioJet

[Lurker89]

3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

You’re a nice guy. And we agree in more than you think. But....

On to the most disconcerting part of your post.

HOW DARE YOU CALL ME A NICE GUY!!!

those are fighting words?

I am a troll of the highest order.

 

But yeah I like messing with you Fidelio, we agree on plenty, but what we disagree on I must troll.... It is in my blood ?.

You're a good sport about it and get I'm just messing around when I make my points in the most d*ckish way possible, while dragging you for fun ....

I love a good trolling back and forth and don't mind when people try to eff with me ...

It's all in good fun, trolling and flame wars are the internet blood sport of old and some people get it while other people don't. 

There are some posters here who love a good troll war back and forth and will laugh at and upvote a good parry and riposte by their opponent.

There are others who turn all serious and take their ball and go home.... they are the most fun to continually harass ?. Some posters here don't know how to have fun and seem to hate my guts ... I love it.

I think most people here think you are a "schtick" troll and you're schtick is being the overly negative contrarian. In reality I think you are serious about your positions and are just a downtrodden Jets fan to the extreme. Thus you don't know why people think you are a troll.

My advice stop giving a **** and let what come comes we have no control over it anyway. I relish in the character it takes to continue rooting for the Jets year in and year out. We've made failure and ineptitude an art form learn to appreciate that art and take solace in the fact that you a loyal member of our ridiculous Jets tribe.

[RobR]

On 7/30/2020 at 7:52 PM, ageingjetfan said:

Thats two down in Kansas City. Andy picking Helaire will turn out big. thought he might go lower (he is 25 I think) due to age but no looks like a smart move

 

He's 21.

[Jets723]

27 minutes ago, Lurker89 said:

On to this part of your post. Can't is here to compete for the tackle spots and is being paid handsomely for it. I do not believe he will be handed the spot based in his salary. We sat Tru last year we'll sit Fant if he isn't the answer to either tackle spot. I was just happy we didn't lock up Conklin to ridiculous money to play LT with his injury history and playing RT.

If Fant doesn't work out the intended escape hatch is built into the contract. I like Beachum but he wasn't the future he was barely hold the fort. Would I have liked to bring him or Peters in as insurance to make sure the floor doesn't fall out sure. But that's my point the spilled milk you are crying about is a WR3 and a fringe starter at tackle. You can call it not trying I'll call it actually cultivating a team properly. You don't waste time on Beachum or Peters if you goal is finding tomorrow's tackle today.

I don’t remember ever writing that.  I actually didn’t dislike the Fant signing 

[Lurker89]

2 hours ago, Jets723 said:

I don’t remember ever writing that.  I actually didn’t dislike the Fant signing 

It was a Fidelio quote odd it quoted you?

[BROOKLYN JET]

On 8/1/2020 at 9:44 AM, slats said:

I'd also prefer it if the Jets signed players whose name I recognize from a few years ago over finding young talent with potential to grow. 

Yoenis Cespedes is available.

[Jets723]

3 hours ago, Lurker89 said:

It was a Fidelio quote odd it quoted you?

Yeah that was weird ?