Jets and Quinnen NOT Close on Contract

[Creepy Lurker]

1 minute ago, jgb said:

Like I said — guys sunset cruising/not other options/dramatic Macc attack overpay.

Pay our one lousy homegrown talent in 10+ years. No brainer.

What do you think he should be paid? Just wondering. 

[jgb]

1 minute ago, Creepy Lurker said:

What do you think he should be paid? Just wondering. 

Fair market rate. 

[bla bla bla]

Just now, jgb said:

Fair market rate. 

Which is

[Creepy Lurker]

Just now, jgb said:

Fair market rate. 

I get that. What do you think is current fair market rate based on the recent DT contracts?

[jgb]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Sure.  But You don’t pay QW based on agent perception.  You pay QW based on how many games he can win us and nothing else.  

If you want to argue against someone who holds that position, you should go find them.

His skill underpins everything and should be obvious. I’m taking about icing here. 

[jgb]

1 minute ago, Creepy Lurker said:

I get that. What do you think is current fair market rate based on the recent DT contracts?

Somewhere between his current contract and Aaron Donald’s. I’m not a GM, I can’t give you a value.

[Creepy Lurker]

Just now, jgb said:

Somewhere north of his current contract and Aaron Donald’s. I’m not a GM, I can’t give you a value.

Do you mean in between? 

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, jgb said:

Fair market rate. 

He likely wants well above that.  He wants closer to Donald money.  You still good with that?  

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, jgb said:

If you want to argue against someone who holds that position, you should go find them.

His skill underpins everything and should be obvious. I’m taking about icing here. 

You just stated you care a great deal about agent perception.  

[jgb]

Just now, Jetsfan80 said:

You just stated you care a great deal about agent perception.  

Yes but your post intimates that’s the only or even major reason I want him extended. Which is obtuse at best, dirty pool at worst. 

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, jgb said:

Yes but your post intimates that’s the only or even major reason I want him expended. Which is obtuse at best, dirty pool at worst. 

Fine.  So what % of this would you say comes down to agent perception?   Cuz I’m saying that should matter exactly 0 % as a factor in these negotiations.

[Creepy Lurker]

Just now, Jetsfan80 said:

He likely wants well above that.  He wants closer to Donald money.  You still good with that?  

This is why I said split the difference between the Jets controlled cost and the Donald contract. You get about $24mil/year($25 max so they can say they got the better end of negotiations) and he is still the highest paid DT not named Donald.
 

That’s more than reasonable. If that is not good enough then he isn’t negotiating in good faith and you take advantage of controlling him for 3 years with no intention of signing long term. 

[jgb]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Fine.  So what % of this would you say comes down to agent perception?   Cuz I’m saying that should matter exactly 0 % as a factor in these negotiations.

My New Year’s resolution 2003 was don’t engage in garbage semantic games on the Internet, even with people I like.

[RutgersJetFan]

4 minutes ago, jgb said:

Which is obtuse at best

[Jetsfan80]

5 minutes ago, jgb said:

My New Year’s resolution 2003 was don’t engage in garbage semantic games on the Internet, even with people I like.

I don’t think it’s just semantics but rather philosophy.  whatever.

[jgb]

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I don’t think it’s just semantics but rather philosophy.  whatever.

If you’d like to either refrain from misstating my position or state it correctly, fine. You can’t “gotcha” this old salt.

[jgb]

9 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

Yeah I prefer the challenge of letting my opponent chose his own position but others don’t like to do that 

[jgb]

18 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

Do you mean in between? 

Yes I edited it but you also knew what I meant. Can we skip the foreplay and you unleash whatever gotcha trap you’re trying to set up?

[Jetsfan80]

8 minutes ago, jgb said:

If you’d like to either refrain from misstating my position or state it correctly, fine. You can’t “gotcha” this old salt.

Not trying to “gotcha” you dude. Though you knew me better than that.  

[jgb]

Just now, Jetsfan80 said:

Not trying to “gotcha” you dude. Though you knew me better than that.  

As did I. 

[Creepy Lurker]

5 minutes ago, jgb said:

Yes I edited it but you also knew what I meant. Can we skip the foreplay and you unleash whatever gotcha trap you’re trying to set up?

I did not know since you didn’t give a dollar number. There is no trap. I bet we all want Q resigned and I completely agree about perception. You not staying a number makes it hard to quantify what a fair market value deal that also reflects Q’s potential.

Getting specific with these questions helps give me an idea is all. Surely you don’t think that we should sign Q at all cost. Are you saying he should be signed for $30 mil/yr? I was genuinely curious because I agree with you a lot but its difficult when you don’t put a number on it, hence this game. There is no trap. I just use chloroform and a rag when it’s time. 

[Jetsfan80]

3 minutes ago, jgb said:

As did I. 

Look.  This argument comes down to your fundamental belief that Jets fans hate paying homegrown players.  A sentiment that was disproven when Revis got paid in 2010.  From 2010 to 2020, the Jets drafted exactly one player worth paying:  Quinnen Williams.  I want him paid.  You want him paid.  We still disagree on the fundamental aspect of this though. 

Maybe the "agent perception" thing is just fluff?  But you also said you found it to be very important to you so I dunno, help me understand why you think me disagreeing with you puts me in the pile of folks on here you don't like all of a sudden.  

[Jetsfan80]

3 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

I did not know since you didn’t give a dollar number. There is no trap. I bet we all want Q resigned and I completely agree about perception. You not staying a number makes it hard to quantify what a fair market value deal that also reflects Q’s potential is.

Getting specific with these questions helps give me an idea is all. Surely you don’t think that we should sign Q at all costs? Are you saying he should be signed for $30 mil? I was genuinely curious because I agree with you a lot but its difficult when you don’t put a number on it, hence this game. There is no trap. I just use chloroform and a rag when it’s time. 

^^^ All of this

[#27TheDominator]

25 minutes ago, jgb said:

My New Year’s resolution 2003 was don’t engage in garbage semantic games on the Internet, even with people I like.

Oh cool.  So we can still do that!

[Jetsfan80]

37 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

He likely wants well above that.  He wants closer to Donald money.  You still good with that?  

 

35 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

This is why I said split the difference between the Jets controlled cost and the Donald contract. You get about $24mil/year($25 max so they can say they got the better end of negotiations) and he is still the highest paid DT not named Donald.

 

It's crazy how the DT market has shifted over a 1-year period or even less.  Months ago you had Jets fans scoffing at the idea that QW would ask for or reasonably be able to demand $19-21M per, which at the time would have made him the 4th-highest paid DT behind Donald, Leonard Williams and DeForest Buckner.

Now, the minimum you would expect a DT on QW's level to sign for would be a little over $22M per with at least 2/3 of his deal fully guaranteed. 

[JETS SB]

3 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Yes. I will take my "man lessons" from guys on Jet nation. Said no one

Yeah, you get your education by posting videos of yourself and watching them late at night with some hand lotion and tissues. 

[JETS SB]

5 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Just wish he would do it already. 

[Smashmouth]

48 minutes ago, jgb said:

Somewhere between his current contract and Aaron Donald’s. I’m not a GM, I can’t give you a value.

With Aaron Rodgers at QB this team has a 2- 3 year window to win a SB considering we don't have a QB to step up after Aaron leaves . Lets face it we don't.

Who at the DT position has around 2- 3 years left and could be a great addition ?  Aaron Donald.

I'm not sure what side of the Quinnen deal is holding things up but if Williams wants ridiculous money I say trade him straight up for Aaron Donald a player who is better than Quinnen and has shown his effort has not gone down since signing the big contract. 

I think the Rams are in a semi rebuild mode so Quinnen would fit them nicely being only 25/26 , while Donald would fit the Jets nicely with our 2-3 year Rodgers Window. 

Make it happen Tanny ...LOL 

[Sperm Edwards]

1 hour ago, bla bla bla said:

Lol we didn't even go after Suh. Orlando Brown Jr would have been awesome to get but there are plenty of reasons not to sign with us other than "lol Jets"

He signed with the Bengals to go from one great young QB to another great young QB. He's played for 10-14 win teams with young MVP-level QBs his whole career (once Jackson took over for Flacco in his rookie season). Also after the guaranteed $ runs out, on a good team protecting such an oft-sacked QB he's less likely to be a cap casualty (let alone be a cap casualty as part of a sucky team's next tear-down/tank process). 

He didn't just take less than the Jets offered him. He took an outright below-market contract by some $5-8MM per year. He just wanted to play there. If the Jets start winning games then more players will do the same for us than just McGovern. 

[#27TheDominator]

37 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

With Aaron Rodgers at QB this team has a 2- 3 year window to win a SB considering we don't have a QB to step up after Aaron leaves . Lets face it we don't.

Who at the DT position has around 2- 3 years left and could be a great addition ?  Aaron Donald.

I'm not sure what side of the Quinnen deal is holding things up but if Williams wants ridiculous money I say trade him straight up for Aaron Donald a player who is better than Quinnen and has shown his effort has not gone down since signing the big contract. 

I think the Rams are in a semi rebuild mode so Quinnen would fit them nicely being only 25/26 , while Donald would fit the Jets nicely with our 2-3 year Rodgers Window. 

Make it happen Tanny ...LOL 

Seriously?  You are talking about not knowing who the QB will be in 2-3 years as if it is an issue?  That's not a thing.  If we had a good young QB now we would: 1. not know if he sucked.  See Jordan Love.  2. probably have to pay him real money before we knew if he sucked.  See Jordan Love, Kirk Cousins.  How many teams have had a QB ready to take over two years in advance?  The Montana/Young 49ers and the Favre/Rodgers Packers.  That's it.  I guess you could say the Mahomes/Smith Chiefs, but the Chiefs knew Smith wasn't all that and were trying to improve.  That was more DeBerg/Montana or Elway.  Maybe Manning/Luck.  Maybe.

[jgb]

4 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Look.  This argument comes down to your fundamental belief that Jets fans hate paying homegrown players.  A sentiment that was disproven when Revis got paid in 2010.  From 2010 to 2020, the Jets drafted exactly one player worth paying:  Quinnen Williams.  I want him paid.  You want him paid.  We still disagree on the fundamental aspect of this though. 

Maybe the "agent perception" thing is just fluff?  But you also said you found it to be very important to you so I dunno, help me understand why you think me disagreeing with you puts me in the pile of folks on here you don't like all of a sudden.  

Wrong again. You're doing just fine arguing both sides of this conversation so I'll leave you to it. You can have the last word.

[jgb]

4 hours ago, Creepy Lurker said:

I did not know since you didn’t give a dollar number. There is no trap. I bet we all want Q resigned and I completely agree about perception. You not staying a number makes it hard to quantify what a fair market value deal that also reflects Q’s potential.

Getting specific with these questions helps give me an idea is all. Surely you don’t think that we should sign Q at all cost. Are you saying he should be signed for $30 mil/yr? I was genuinely curious because I agree with you a lot but its difficult when you don’t put a number on it, hence this game. There is no trap. I just use chloroform and a rag when it’s time. 

No, he's not worth infinity. Next question? Preferably one that doesn't rely on reductio ad absurdum.

Every other team seems to have cracked the code of paying studs that they draft. Seems like such a handwringing chore for this team. Pay the dude. Which they will, by the way, with nearly 100% certainty.

[Creepy Lurker]

6 minutes ago, jgb said:

No, he's not worth infinity. Next question? Preferably one that doesn't rely on reductio ad absurdum.

Every other team seems to have cracked the code of paying studs that they draft. Seems like such a handwringing chore for this team. Pay the dude. Which they will, by the way, with nearly 100% certainty.

Ok next question. Why won’t you give an actual annual figure? You seem to be going out of your way to avoid it for some reason and seem really defensive about it. I find this odd since you are usually VERY right about things and I’m not sure where this is coming from. You shouldn’t worry about a ball park figure being wrong since you have a great track record of being right about things and this is out of all of our control anyways. 

[Jetsfan80]

24 minutes ago, jgb said:

Wrong again. You're doing just fine arguing both sides of this conversation so I'll leave you to it. You can have the last word.

No thanks.  

[jgb]

19 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

Ok next question. Why won’t you give an actual annual figure? You seem to be going out of your way to avoid it for some reason and seem really defensive about it. I find this odd since you are usually VERY right about things and I’m not sure where this is coming from. You shouldn’t worry about a ball park figure being wrong since you have a great track record of being right about things and this is out of all of our control anyways. 

Because I don't know. I've said that. I'm not avoiding it. I do not know. The Jets need to find a way to fairly compensate the first worthy draft hit they've had since the turn of the century. It's not the Da Vinci Code here.