Joe Must Go!

[#90]

Ewwwwww. It brings back such bad memories. But, the Yankees right now are being run like Kotite's Jets.

Tony Womack in field? It's time for the most over rated manager in baseball history to get canned!!!

"we don't bunt" - Joe Torre

[Maxman]

JOe can never be fired. He won 4 times. He has diplomatic immunity. He leaves when he wants to.

But I would like to see him get back to his NL roots and start running a little more. Don't play Tino\Giambi on the same day. DH Bernie or a kid and start running\bunting again.

Holy Earl Weaver this team is all or nothing.

[Latinlawyer]

JOe can never be fired. He won 4 times. He has diplomatic immunity. He leaves when he wants to.

But I would like to see him get back to his NL roots and start running a little more. Don't play Tino\Giambi on the same day. DH Bernie or a kid and start running\bunting again.

Holy Earl Weaver this team is all or nothing.

As a baseball fan, i will tell you the problem with the yanks is that they got old FAST! No farm system, aging vets and poor pitching...that is the prob. Torre is not the problem.

LL

[faba]

The Yankees are I think I read have the oldest average team in the majors- any team to be successful has to groom some young talent either in trades or your own farm system. Too much money on older declining players.

[shawn306]

JOe can never be fired. He won 4 times. He has diplomatic immunity. He leaves when he wants to.

But I would like to see him get back to his NL roots and start running a little more. Don't play Tino\Giambi on the same day. DH Bernie or a kid and start running\bunting again.

Holy Earl Weaver this team is all or nothing.

It's been like that for three years now. Just sit and wait for the 3 run homer. And when it doesn't come they start pressing.

Think about this. The White Sox came from behind yesterday to win 2-1. How did they do it. A pair of bases loaded walks.

Sound familiar ? Patientce at the plate, getting it to the next guy. If that had been the Yankees they would have been trying to hit the ball to the moon.

Guess who pitched for the ChiSox yesterday ?

Our old friend Contreras.

[shawn306]

The Yankees are I think I read have the oldest average team in the majors- any team to be successful has to groom some young talent either in trades or your own farm system. Too much money on older declining players.

There is no patientce for the young player again. The Jake Westbrooks, Ted Lilly's of the world are the Doug Drabek's and Jim Deshaies of the 80's.

Weaver and Vazquez were good pitchers when they got here and left shell's of what they were. Still trying to get their career's back on track.

Just have to ride this out. Right now they are playing with ZERO confidence and it shows. Look at the White Sox. They are playing with just incredible confidence right now and it shows. Garland, Beuhrle, El Duque and even Contreras are pitching well.

[Latinlawyer]

There is no patientce for the young player again. The Jake Westbrooks, Ted Lilly's of the world are the Doug Drabek's and Jim Deshaies of the 80's.

Weaver and Vazquez were good pitchers when they got here and left shell's of what they were. Still trying to get their career's back on track.

Just have to ride this out. Right now they are playing with ZERO confidence and it shows. Look at the White Sox. They are playing with just incredible confidence right now and it shows. Garland, Beuhrle, El Duque and even Contreras are pitching well.

You say ride it out....till when? they are 11-18...that is 29 games total played...what if at 40 games they are 16-24? What do you do? is there panic then? If you cant beat the d-rays....who can you beat? the royals?

LL

[GM]

Firing Torre is one of the dumbest things I have ever heard! You Bandwagon Yankee fans, who started being "fans" in 1996 go to hell. Do you remeber the '80s???

Torre is not the problem...George is. If he can stop tying Cashman's hands, and keep his fugly nose out of his business, the Yanks would be in first again.

Please, to all the "FIRE TORRE" jackasses, can you tell me who was the SS before Jeter? How many times did the Yanks make the playoffs from 1984-1995?????

[shawn306]

You say ride it out....till when? they are 11-18...that is 29 games total played...what if at 40 games they are 16-24? What do you do? is there panic then? If you cant beat the d-rays....who can you beat? the royals?

LL

There is not much you can do other than ride it out. In an ideal world. Guys like Brown and Giambi would be handed their walking papers and out they would be. No one though is willing to take them on at their salaries.

Stottlymyre is in hot water right now. I would not be suprised if he was let go. Cashman is in hot water as well. If this team does not start playing better by Memorial Day they could both be outta here.

Torre would walk away first before he is fired.

[faba]

Even though I am a Met fan my view on the subject is Torre is and has been a class guy- George would get so much abuse to fire Torre- I agree he is not the major problem as a I stated too many older players with declining production.

Also the starting pitching was very overrated coming into the season IMO. Pavano and Wright got big contracts because they happened to be free agents at the right time. Pavano really has had one real good year last year and Wright last year was his career year.

[shawn306]

Here is what it comes down to.

The Yankees last year had a shot to get Vladimir Guerrero. George wanted Sheffield instead and the rumblings were they were worried about Vlad's back problems.

The Yankees then turn around and bring in Kevin Brown to replace Pettite. Brown has had a history of

1) Being a cancer in the clubhouse

2) CHRONIC BACK PROBLEMS !!!!!

WTF

So of course when Brown tanks they go after a another pitcher in Randy Johnson and pass on Carlos Beltran.

Well the Yankees look like the could use Beltran in Center right now. Don't they.

I said it on the other board last year when Pettite left that that could set this franchise back ten years.

Looks like I might be right.

[Barton]

^^^^^^

LOL. Pettite has don't jack sh** in houston

Giambi not swinging and bad bullpen and lack of clutch hitting kills us.

[shawn306]

^^^^^^

LOL. Pettite has don't jack sh** in houston

Giambi not swinging and bad bullpen and lack of clutch hitting kills us.

And bad starting pitching.

And A-Rod waving at anything hit to him.

And guys running on Posada like it is some drake relays.

The point I was trying to make is that Pettite was a guy who gave his heart and soul to the Yankees. He didn't even get a freakin phone call from the Yankees until he had already decided to sign with Houston.

Was his bad ? Yeah obviously since he had surgery last year. But didn't the Yankees give Jon Lieber something like 2 million dollars to basically sit out the 2003 season to rehab his arm ?

Then add to the fact that George decided to go for Sheffield instead of Vlad because he was worried about Vlad's back and then go and bring in Brown who HAD A HISTORY OF BACK PROBLEMS AND HAD A HUGE CONTRACT AND IS A LOCKER ROOM CANCER made absolutely no sense at all. This team last year had; count them ZERO Lefties in the rotation. ZERO.

A-ROD is a prima donna who is only worried about his numbers and is easliy intimidated at the plate. Giambi is a waste of a roster spot. Gordon still hasn't recovered for last year's ALCS.

Right now the only thing the Yankees should be worried about is winning A GAME !!!!

[Bugg]

Sorry-you're wrong about Pettitte. He was quietly offered a deal similar to what the Astros gave him. Take it at face that he wanted to go home and leave it at that.

Dumping Lieber was a total bonehead move.

Jake Westbrook

Yancey Brezobhan

Bob Wickman

Ted Lilly

Jose Contreras

And probably soon to be added to this list-

Brad Halsey

Brandon Claussen

The answer is-What are servicable MLB pitchers and former Yankee minor leaguers who Mel Stottelmyre couldn't figure out what they could do when they were here? So when you say the farm hasn't produced anything, that's only half right. they've produced guys, and dealt them away.

And when they've brought guys in that were good in the first place-Weaver, Vasquez, Benitez-Stott's no better with them.

The whole MO of Stott-don't strike people out-try to get them to hit it. And then they wonder why who ever it is he works with sucks. Ask Clemens or Nolan Ryan if that works, if they don't laugh at you. It's all fine and good if you're a crafty lefthander or a junkballer, but he tries to turn everyone into Greg Maddux, and it doesn't work. He amde the same mess in Flushing after he filled the whols staff's heads with nonsense. By all accounts, he's a nice man and a great story. But if the Yanks had Dave Wallace, we'd have had 6 or 7 titles over 4 in this run.

[shawn306]

Sorry-you're wrong about Pettitte. He was quietly offered a deal similar to what the Astros gave him. Take it at face that he wanted to go home and leave it at that.

Dumping Lieber was a total bonehead move.

Jake Westbrook

Yancey Brezobhan

Bob Wickman

Ted Lilly

Jose Contreras

And probably soon to be added to this list-

Brad Halsey

Brandon Claussen

The answer is-What are servicable MLB pitchers and former Yankee minor leaguers who Mel Stottelmyre couldn't figure out what they could do when they were here? So when you say the farm hasn't produced anything, that's only half right. they've produced guys, and dealt them away.

And when they've brought guys in that were good in the first place-Weaver, Vasquez, Benitez-Stott's no better with them.

The whole MO of Stott-don't strike people out-try to get them to hit it. And then they wonder why who ever it is he works with sucks. Ask Clemens or Nolan Ryan if that works, if they don't laugh at you. It's all fine and good if you're a crafty lefthander or a junkballer, but he tries to turn everyone into Greg Maddux, and it doesn't work. He amde the same mess in Flushing after he filled the whols staff's heads with nonsense. By all accounts, he's a nice man and a great story. But if the Yanks had Dave Wallace, we'd have had 6 or 7 titles over 4 in this run.

It should never have gotten to that point with Pettitte. That was my biggest problem with it. It should have been taken care of long before.

Stottlymyre is on the hotseat no doubt. Rumblings are that the FO wants Neil Allen to be the ptiching coach. Don't know though if that is going to help though. I don't think he is going to add 5 MPH to Kevin Brown's fastball or keep Gordon from constantly throwing the ball over the heart of the plate.

[shawn306]

Watch out.

Half witted comment for jet/bosox coming

[Jet/BosoxFan]

shawn is correct about the Andy Pettite drama.

Pettite was ignored by the Yankees in the '03 offseason because george was too busyt courting sheffield and doc gooden.

Forget about the deal he was offered by the Yankees, Bugg, it wasnt about money with Pettite. He wanted to feel appreciated by george and george didnt do that, did he? And now look...you have Garroid, no AP, and the wheels have totally fallen off, havent they???

The Yankees didnt even call AP until the night before he signed with Houston, as shawn said.

Now, george is looking to blame all these other "culprits" when this horrid Yankee tankjob is his fault and his alone!