When exactly did the Yankees dynasty die???

[Jet/BosoxFan]

It's pretty damn obvious that the Yankees are a disgraceful band of suckass old men who lack even fundamental baseball skills and cant piece together a few wins without suffering devastating losses to inferior competition. But when exactly did the dynasty die???

Granted, many Yankee fans have seen the light and accept that they no longer back a perrenial World Series winner. But they point to different instnaces when asked "when did the dynasty end?"

The 4 most popular answers:

-Mariano's throw into CF during Game 7 in Arizona

-The Angels ferociously taking out David Wells

-Alex Rodriguez

-The BALCO scandal shakes the foundations of MLB

...and of course we still have the yahoos that insist "It's not over, the Yankees still rule, and they're gonna flick the switch and start winning again one of these days"

any thoughts?

[Maxman]

The throw didn't end the dynasty. In all seriousness the Gonzalez bloop ended it in Arizona - 2001.

That team was on its lasts leg though. It was amazing they even won it all in 2000.

Unfortunately they have not replaced the heart of those teams.

[TaborJet]

I edited the 1st line.....

It's pretty damn obvious that JBF is a disgraceful Yanee suckass young punk who lacks even fundamental baseball sportsmanship and cant piece together a few posts without suffering devastating losses to superior Jetnation members. But when exactly did JBF's love for the Red Sox die???

JBF, you sure like to post about the Yankees. Methinks you should come out of the closet with your Sojo jersey on. Be proud!

[Jet/BosoxFan]

The throw didn't end the dynasty. In all seriousness the Gonzalez bloop ended it in Arizona - 2001.

That team was on its lasts leg though. It was amazing they even won it all in 2000.

Unfortunately they have not replaced the heart of those teams.

I'll buy that one, Maxman. The Yanks dynasty officially ended in 2001 witht the Gonzalez bloop.

Anyone else have any other suggestions? Please back them up with evidence as Maxman has done.

[shawn306]

Game 7 2001 World Series. Heck they even wrote a book about it. Actually was a very good read.

[Jet/BosoxFan]

C'mon Yankee fans...that one is too easy!

Wasnt the Yankees/Arizona World Series just an abberation where you ran into 2 stud pitchers (Big Schill and Big Skullet) and timely hitting?

They've done some great things after the 2001 Series, right?

C'mon Yankee fans...help me out here!

[shawn306]

C'mon Yankee fans...that one is too easy!

Wasnt the Yankees/Arizona World Series just an abberation where you ran into 2 stud pitchers (Big Schill and Big Skullet) and timely hitting?

They've done some great things after the 2001 Series, right?

C'mon Yankee fans...help me out here!

Of course they did. They beat the Red Sox in 2003.

[Jet/BosoxFan]

Of course they did. They beat the Red Sox in 2003.

Very good shawn....so tell me when the dynasty died???

Are you implying it when Josh Beckett stuffed 'em in a garbage can and threw 'em down a flight of stairs in 2003?

[TaborJet]

Very good shawn....so tell me when the dynasty died???

Are you implying it when Josh Beckett stuffed 'em in a garbage can and threw 'em down a flight of stairs in 2003?

Ok, let's talk about the Red Sox dynasty....wait...you need more than 1 series win - doh!!!

[Jet/BosoxFan]

Feel free to start that RS dynasty thread, TJ. You might even get a reply or two! But for now, please stop polluting my thread with your nonsense unless you can actually bring something to the table!

[TaborJet]

Feel free to start that RS dynasty thread, TJ. You might even get a reply or two! But for now, please stop polluting my thread with your nonsense unless you can actually bring something to the table!

Why don't YOU start an acutal Red Sox thread?

[Jet/BosoxFan]

Why don't YOU start an acutal Red Sox thread?

UGH!!! can one of you mods kindly delete the last 3 posts on this thread before TJ completely hijacks it?

Forgive me for getting political here, but TJ reminds me of Kim Jong Il...We're fighting a war on terror in the middle east and some other dude emerges and raddles his sabres in N Korea in a seperate plea for international welfare and attention.

This is a "Yankee Dynasty is dead...please tell me why" thread. Go ruin someone else's thread.

[TaborJet]

UGH!!! can one of you mods kindly delete the last 3 posts on this thread before TJ completely hijacks it?

Forgive me for getting political here, but TJ reminds me of Kim Jong Il...We're fighting a war on terror in the middle east and some other dude emerges and raddles his sabres in N Korea in a seperate plea for international welfare and attention.

This is a "Yankee Dynasty is dead...please tell me why" thread. Go ruin someone else's thread.

This thread is hijacked. Mission accomplished.

[124]

Last year, Game 7 of the ALCS.

[Maxman]

1976 World Series.

[TomShane]

Signing Giambi. Clearly.

[Barton]

Considering this team keeps making the playoffs, it hasn't died yet.

Its in jeopardy this season if they don't make the playoffs, until then shut the f*** up JBF, you'r such an assclown.

[Jetsfan80]

Considering this team keeps making the playoffs, it hasn't died yet.

Its in jeopardy this season if they don't make the playoffs, until then shut the f*** up JBF, you'r such an assclown.

So wait, just making the playoffs means a team is still in the middle of a dynasty?

The Jets have made the playoffs 3 of 4 years. Would you call that a dynasty? I think not.

[Barton]

So wait, just making the playoffs means a team is still in the middle of a dynasty?

The Jets have made the playoffs 3 of 4 years. Would you call that a dynasty? I think not.

Frickin idiot.

[TaborJet]

So wait, just making the playoffs means a team is still in the middle of a dynasty?

The Jets have made the playoffs 3 of 4 years. Would you call that a dynasty? I think not.

I think he means that some core players from the late 90's are still here, so it's not officially dead yet. Now that doesn't mean the dynasty lives until the last Yankee leftover retires, either.

[Jetsfan80]

Frickin idiot.

So, how are Randy Johnson's mechanics, EB?

Go play some wiffle ball. At least until you can come up with a response above the intelligence level of "mildly retarded".

[TaborJet]

JBF

In all honesty, if you have to pin it on something, I would say the retirement of O'Neill, Brosius, Knoblauch, and the 1st departure of Martinez would sum it up.

If the Yanks could win anything in the next few years, it won't be considered the same team as the late 90's. This is the Arod/Matsui/Johnson/Giambi Yanks, for better or for worse.

[Jet/BosoxFan]

So wait, just making the playoffs means a team is still in the middle of a dynasty?

The Jets have made the playoffs 3 of 4 years. Would you call that a dynasty? I think not.

I knew the yahoos would say that the dynasty isnt dead yet. JonEJinx will say the same thing when he "comes back" (read: emerges from his underground bunker) from vacation. And while EB may be a snot-nosed, snivelling little puke, he is as big of a yahoo as anyone.

BTW good example, 80, using the Jets as a refence point for debunking EB's ridiculous "they made the playoffs, theyre still a dynasty" statement. I will use this one:

The Pierce/Walker Celtics have made the playoffs for like the last 5 years or so. They must be a dynasty by EB's definition...think they're gonna dethrone the Bird/McHale/Reef Chief dynasty any time soon???

Lets get back to the "when did the Yankees dynasty officially die?" discussion because I think we were making strides. Any other thoughts Yankee fans?

Let me also put this little disclaimer on this thread.

*You must be at least 18 to reply to this post. There, that oughtta take care of the riffraff.

[Jetsfan80]

*You must be at least 18 to reply to this post. There, that oughtta take care of the riffraff.

Nice, I make the cut by 1 year.

By the way, the dynasty ended following Game 5 of the 2000 World Series (it will take about 2 minutes following this post for Yankee fans to rub that in). If a dynasty means winning titles, well, then that ended the run, because the Yanks haven't won a series since!

[Jet/BosoxFan]

JBF

In all honesty, if you have to pin it on something, I would say the retirement of O'Neill, Brosius, Knoblauch, and the 1st departure of Martinez would sum it up.

If the Yanks could win anything in the next few years, it won't be considered the same team as the late 90's. This is the Arod/Matsui/Johnson/Giambi Yanks, for better or for worse.

Actually, I kind of agree with that, TJ. But could you clear up something for me?

I have been under the impression that george m steinbrenner went ballistic after the 2001 W/S loss to Arizona and dumped Tino for Giamboo, blew K*ckblauch, Stanton and Mendoza outta town, and began to needle Joe T by calling out his coaching staff. I know all of those people sucked wherever they ended up...but they were all key parts of the Yankee dynasty, were they not?

He also seemingly forced Brosius and Oneil into retirement, did he not? Maxman swears up and down that he didnt...but it sure as heck seemed like he did. Then he brought in household names like Robin Ventura, Rondell White, and Raul Mondesi (the Raul trade is my watershed moment as to when the dynasty died) to replace them and both guys sucked that year.

[Barton]

sometimes I think 80 is more pathetic and stupid than JBF, but then I realize they're equally as stupid as the other.

[TaborJet]

Actually, I kind of agree with that, TJ. But could you clear up something for me?

I have been under the impression that george m steinbrenner went ballistic after the 2001 W/S loss to Arizona and dumped Tino for Giamboo, blew K*ckblauch, Stanton and Mendoza outta town, and began to needle Joe T by calling out his coaching staff. I know all of those people sucked wherever they ended up...but they were all key parts of the Yankee dynasty, were they not?

He also seemingly forced Brosius and Oneil into retirement, did he not? Maxman swears up and down that he didnt...but it sure as heck seemed like he did. Then he brought in household names like Robin Ventura, Rondell White, and Raul Mondesi (the Raul trade is my watershed moment as to when the dynasty died) to replace them and both guys sucked that year.

Maybe Steinbrenner thought that inserting 1 major player into the lineup each year, he would have a shot:

02 Giambi

03 Matsui

04 ARod

But I think he forgot it takes years of building with role players and dominant pitching. With his age comes impatience.

[shawn306]

Actually, I kind of agree with that, TJ. But could you clear up something for me?

I have been under the impression that george m steinbrenner went ballistic after the 2001 W/S loss to Arizona and dumped Tino for Giamboo, blew K*ckblauch, Stanton and Mendoza outta town, and began to needle Joe T by calling out his coaching staff. I know all of those people sucked wherever they ended up...but they were all key parts of the Yankee dynasty, were they not?

He also seemingly forced Brosius and Oneil into retirement, did he not? Maxman swears up and down that he didnt...but it sure as heck seemed like he did. Then he brought in household names like Robin Ventura, Rondell White, and Raul Mondesi (the Raul trade is my watershed moment as to when the dynasty died) to replace them and both guys sucked that year.

Stanton and Mendoza did not leave till after 2002. They were both there for the Angels.

The feeling was that after the loss to Arizona the Yankees needed power. Nick Johnson was not going to give them the power hitter so they went after Giambi letting Tino go.

Knoblauch was simply not the player he was in Minnesota. Sufferning from Steve Sax syndrome and going through a very bitter divorce just sucked all the juice out of him.

O'Neill has announced before the season that 2001 would be his last. George had nothing to do with forcing him out.

Brosius retirement was a shock. I don't think anyone saw that coming.

I thought R.White and Ventura while being veterans were the kind of hitters that the Yankees had been bringing in in the past. Professional, move the runner over, hit in the clutch. That 2002 team was very good. They just ran into an Angels team that was playing unconsious baseball at the time.

[Jet/BosoxFan]

youre right about Stanton and Mendoza. It just seemed like Ramiro was killing the Red Sox since '02 when it was actually '03.

And I remember the sickening sendoff in Game 6 of the W/S when Paul O'neil played his last game in the Bronx. So the retirement must've been announced. But how many times has Clemens retired? And Jordan? And Tragic Johnson? george coulda brought Paul back if he wanted to, no?

And Brosius woulda hit better and played a better 3rd base than Ventura and E Wilson!!! Talk about a clutch hitter, especially in the postseason!!!

The Yankees should have brought Scott B back this year. Forget Tino!

[shawn306]

youre right about Stanton and Mendoza. It just seemed like Ramiro was killing the Red Sox since '02 when it was actually '03.

And I remember the sickening sendoff in Game 6 of the W/S when Paul O'neil played his last game in the Bronx. So the retirement must've been announced. But how many times has Clemens retired? And Jordan? And Tragic Johnson? george coulda brought Paul back if he wanted to, no?

And Brosius woulda hit better and played a better 3rd base than Ventura and E Wilson!!! Talk about a clutch hitter, especially in the postseason!!!

The Yankees should have brought Scott B back this year. Forget Tino!

I can't explain the Brosius thing. Sometimes you just know when enough is enough.

O'Neill sendoff sickening !?! Dude I know your kinda busting chops with that one but that was without a doubt one of the greatest things I have seen in some 30 years as a sportsfan.

The only thing that even comes close to that is back in 1975 when the Rangers relaesed Eddie Giacomin. He was signed by the Red Wings and his first game as a Red Wing was at the Garden against the Rangers. The crowd basically chanted Ed-die, Ed-die the entire night.

O'Neill was the blood, guts and heartbeat of that team. He played the game the way it should be played and the fans recognized that. It did not make a difference that the Yanks were losing at the time, they were going to make sure that they said "Thanks" for the 8-9 years he gave them.

[Jet/BosoxFan]

Now dont get me wrong...I dont hate Paul O'Neil. But I assure you that you love him way too much!

1. The heart and soul of that team was their pitching, beginning and ending with Mariano

2. When people remember Paul O'neil, they remember a crybaby who whined excessively about strike outs.

3. The sendoff (probably cool if youre a Yankee fan) was a little over-the-top to the rest of us. Then again, everything in NYC is over-the-top...

[TaborJet]

Now dont get me wrong...I dont hate Paul O'Neil. But I assure you that you love him way too much!

1. The heart and soul of that team was their pitching, beginning and ending with Mariano

and timely hitting

2. When people remember Paul O'neil, they remember a crybaby who whined excessively about strike outs.

I like when Steinbrenner called him a "warrior." Yes he trashed some equipment, but he wanted to win.

3. The sendoff (probably cool if youre a Yankee fan) was a little over-the-top to the rest of us. Then again, everything in NYC is over-the-top...

Great sendoff for a true Yankee. O'Neill was a huge part in getting 4 World Championships.

[Bugg]

You guys of whiny woe-is-me curse crap forever, faggoty "cowboy up", Pedro and his midget and letting a Jimmy Fallon movie intrude on an 86-years-in-the-making WS win claim the Yankees and NYC area over the top? Right.Compared to a Jimmy Fallon movie jumping into a World Series win, O'Neill's last Stadium game was a papal funeral.

Look-this season is done when they drop 4 home games to the Rays. The Yankees have to retool to get back in the mix-period. When and why it went bad matters less than fixing it. And listening to the bleats of Sawx fans as if they want to see an inprovement is a waste of time.

[Jetsfan80]

sometimes I think 80 is more pathetic and stupid than JBF, but then I realize they're equally as stupid as the other.

Youngin', I thought Maxman told you about no more personal attacks!

Just because you have sand in your vagina after getting schooled in every debate you get into with, oh, just about every baseball fan on this message board (including fans of your own team, except JonEJet, who happens to have a child's mind of his own), doesn't mean you need to insult my intelligence.

Now go listen to some 50 Cent or Nelly or whatever you children do. I have no patience for ignorant fools who think they know how to fix the Yankee pitching staff despite never playing an inning of HIGH SCHOOL BASEBALL!

Yankee record against Brewers, Royals, Devil Rays combined in 2005: 3-13

Numbers don't lie, kid. Your Yankees have lost the magic.

[LionelRichie]

Now dont get me wrong...I dont hate Paul O'Neil. But I assure you that you love him way too much!

1. The heart and soul of that team was their pitching, beginning and ending with Mariano

2. When people remember Paul O'neil, they remember a crybaby who whined excessively about strike outs.

3. The sendoff (probably cool if youre a Yankee fan) was a little over-the-top to the rest of us. Then again, everything in NYC is over-the-top...

JBF - i have never met you, but from reading all of your posts i can tell that you are that guy that talks just to hear his own voice.