Only the Jets....

[Smashmouth]

C'mon T0m, if you didn't think Coples had a good game yesterday you must have been passed out

Explain this good game ? He had a pressure I think and 1 tackle. What about that constitutes a good game ?

[Sperm Edwards]

Explain this good game ? He had a pressure I think and 1 tackle. What about that constitutes a good game ?

First off I'll just disclose that I wasn't focusing on Coples all game and haven't done my re-watch yet. So I mostly notice him when he was creating pressure and, of course, the tackle.

Next, a tackle downfield is not the same as a tackle for loss that also resulted in a fumble, though you're making it out as though they were the same thing.

Also, if Carr is dropping and firing right away on quick slants and such, for most of the game, then there's less opportunity for Coples to get to him(for a full sack). Unless someone just whiffs on a tackle (or he goes through without any blockers in his way due to a blown assignment), that isn't really enough time to get in there and bring him down.

Pass rush isn't just about getting sack or tackle stats, as you're surely aware. Some of it is just the act of helping to put enough pressure on the QB so he makes poor decisions, makes poor throws that aren't completed, and that he can't let plays develop. Same with garnering attention to free up someone else to make a play. Carr had what, like 75 yards passing before their last drive? And if there were no big gains on the ground, I can't fault Coples for not getting to a runner who was met by someone else on the team first. Especially if the play gravitated away from where Coples was on the field.

In other words, when the D does that good of a job it's a team effort, and the individual stats aren't so meaningful as long as someone out there is making the actual tackle. Just my opinion. If he was getting manhandled, or if we saw him whiffing or getting juked, then his lowly stats are the result of sucking. This wasn't the case from what I saw, but like I said I haven't watched the game a 2nd time yet. Mrs. Sperm goes crazy when I rewind during the live broadcast.

[JustInFudge]

Explain this good game ? He had a pressure I think and 1 tackle. What about that constitutes a good game ?

 

Ah the stats game again, meanwhile, your boy Landy who you hate, had the best stats of the game.  7 tackles, 1 sack, 1 tackle for loss, and a QB hit.

[Smashmouth]

First off I'll just disclose that I wasn't focusing on Coples all game and haven't done my re-watch yet. So I mostly notice him when he was creating pressure and, of course, the tackle.

Next, a tackle downfield is not the same as a tackle for loss that also resulted in a fumble, though you're making it out as though they were the same thing.

Also, if Carr is dropping and firing right away on quick slants and such, for most of the game, then there's less opportunity for Coples to get to him(for a full sack). Unless someone just whiffs on a tackle (or he goes through without any blockers in his way due to a blown assignment), that isn't really enough time to get in there and bring him down.

Pass rush isn't just about getting sack or tackle stats, as you're surely aware. Some of it is just the act of helping to put enough pressure on the QB so he makes poor decisions, makes poor throws that aren't completed, and that he can't let plays develop. Same with garnering attention to free up someone else to make a play. Carr had what, like 75 yards passing before their last drive? And if there were no big gains on the ground, I can't fault Coples for not getting to a runner who was met by someone else on the team first. Especially if the play gravitated away from where Coples was on the field.

In other words, when the D does that good of a job it's a team effort, and the individual stats aren't so meaningful as long as someone out there is making the actual tackle. Just my opinion. If he was getting manhandled, or if we saw him whiffing or getting juked, then his lowly stats are the result of sucking. This wasn't the case from what I saw, but like I said I haven't watched the game a 2nd time yet. Mrs. Sperm goes crazy when I rewind during the live broadcast.

Sperm the tackle for a loos was a good play and I though already implied. I just can't get excited about Coples until he lives up to what a disruptive OLB should be and at this stage he is simply not disruptive at all. If it has not happened up to this stage I don't see it happening. I hope the light goes on but I don't think it will .

 

All your points make total sense lets see how he does as the year goes on . I would say when Barnes comes back you will see much more of Barnes and Babin than Coples if he does not turn it on

[jack48]

Hard to get sacks when the ball is coming out of the QB's hands in 2 seconds flat on almost every play in a short passing attack.  

 

Coples was a handful yesterday.  I focused on him a lot.  He's a monster.  He constantly beats up on the OL.  Feel bad for the dudes blocking him.   

 

He's not going to light up the stat sheet like Jets fans want.  But he disrupts the offense in a major way.  He can collapse an entire side of OL and really ugly a play up.

I don't think he plays a position where he CAN light up the stat sheet.

[Smashmouth]

Ah the stats game again, meanwhile, your boy Landy who you hate, had the best stats of the game.  7 tackles, 1 sack, 1 tackle for loss, and a QB hit.

JIF I think Landry had a very good game The thing is I'm not just looking at yesterdays game when it comes to him. I will give credit where credit is due. I still did not like his angle on Oaklands first TD he should know better than to take inside position when a WR's momentum is taking him to the outside. Either way best tackler on this team is either David Harris or Antonio Allen Im not sure Landry is in that conversation

 

I'm also not trying to make this about "1" tackle when it comes to Coples ...it was a very good play All Im saying is it was the ONLY play  come see me when He makes 2 .3 or 4 really good plays in a game like a true disruptive OLB is supposed to make. Lets see the kid blow some sh*t up for once.

[JustInFudge]

First off I'll just disclose that I wasn't focusing on Coples all game and haven't done my re-watch yet. So I mostly notice him when he was creating pressure and, of course, the tackle.

Next, a tackle downfield is not the same as a tackle for loss that also resulted in a fumble, though you're making it out as though they were the same thing.

Also, if Carr is dropping and firing right away on quick slants and such, for most of the game, then there's less opportunity for Coples to get to him(for a full sack). Unless someone just whiffs on a tackle (or he goes through without any blockers in his way due to a blown assignment), that isn't really enough time to get in there and bring him down.

Pass rush isn't just about getting sack or tackle stats, as you're surely aware. Some of it is just the act of helping to put enough pressure on the QB so he makes poor decisions, makes poor throws that aren't completed, and that he can't let plays develop. Same with garnering attention to free up someone else to make a play. Carr had what, like 75 yards passing before their last drive? And if there were no big gains on the ground, I can't fault Coples for not getting to a runner who was met by someone else on the team first. Especially if the play gravitated away from where Coples was on the field.

In other words, when the D does that good of a job it's a team effort, and the individual stats aren't so meaningful as long as someone out there is making the actual tackle. Just my opinion. If he was getting manhandled, or if we saw him whiffing or getting juked, then his lowly stats are the result of sucking. This wasn't the case from what I saw, but like I said I haven't watched the game a 2nd time yet. Mrs. Sperm goes crazy when I rewind during the live broadcast.

 

You'll notice he's was a lot to handle.  The Raiders were having a hell of a time with him.  And he was seeing plays through to the end, the biggest knock he gets.  Him and Sheldon, really.  Sheldon didnt record a single stat outside of maybe one pass deflection?...but he looked to be playing well.  There are lot of playmakers on defense, especially in the front 7.  I dont see any one player having a year of eye popping stats.

 

The other thing you cant dismiss about the "one play" Coples made was that it was the opening play of the 2nd half.  It set the tone for the rest of the game.  Especially considering the Jets just scored on an 80 yard drive before the half.  That play, changed the momentum as the Raiders proceeded to go 3 and out on the next 5 possessions, if I'm not mistaken.  

 

Its like Rex says, a big hit can change the game and I'd say that was a pretty damn good example. 

[Matt39]

Just from my eyes I thought Mo had the best game of anyone on the dline yesterday.

 

Motor mouth Sheldon needs to stop reading his own press clippings.

[JustInFudge]

JIF I think Landry had a very good game The thing is I'm not just looking at yesterdays game when it comes to him. I will give credit where credit is due. I still did not like his angle on Oaklands first TD he should know better than to take inside position when a WR's momentum is taking him to the outside. Either way best tackler on this team is either David Harris or Antonio Allen Im not sure Landry is in that conversation

 

I'm also not trying to make this about "1" tackle when it comes to Coples ...it was a very good play All Im saying is it was the ONLY play  come see me when He makes 2 .3 or 4 really good plays in a game like a true disruptive OLB is supposed to make. Lets see the kid blow some sh*t up for once.

 

If you watch again, he was "blowing sh*t up", which was creating others to make plays.  He's not going to light up the stat sheet, Smash.  Its not the position he plays.  If you ever heard Bart Scott talk about that position in Rex's system, he describes it really well...its a thankless job.

[JustInFudge]

I don;t think he plays a position where he CAN light up the stat sheet.

 

Exactly.

 

Just from my eyes I thought Mo had the best game of anyone on the dline yesterday.

 

Motor mouth Sheldon needs to stop reading his own press clippings.

 

Mo gets a game ball on D for me.  He was a monster.  I think a lot of what Sheldon and Coples do creates opportunities for Mo but Mo is such a monster, he creates for himself too.  Thats the difference, right now at least.

[Smashmouth]

If you watch again, he was "blowing sh*t up", which was creating others to make plays.  He's not going to light up the stat sheet, Smash.  Its not the position he plays.  If you ever heard Bart Scott talk about that position in Rex's system, he describes it really well...its a thankless job.

For once I forgot to DVR the damn game but I saw Coples getting stood up a lot more than I would have liked I didn't see him blowing much up at all but those are usually things you see on the re wind like Sperm said. Lets see what happens vs a real offense next week . We know the blue print lets see if we can carry it out. Rodgers may be one of the best scramblers in the game and he will run with the ball when nothing is there its going to be a huge test.

[Smashmouth]

I don;t think he plays a position where he CAN light up the stat sheet.

Actully he does just go around the league and the history of this league and tell me OLB's don't light up stat sheets. They certainly do. Some take over games entirely from time to time making it impossible on a QB taking away half the filed with their pass rushing ability alone

[Smashmouth]

Exactly.

 

 

Mo gets a game ball on D for me.  He was a monster.  I think a lot of what Sheldon and Coples do creates opportunities for Mo but Mo is such a monster, he creates for himself too.  Thats the difference, right now at least.

Every time a pass is tipped or batted down I say MO did it both times yesterday and both times it was MO hes very aware out there for a DLman just like Watt only difference is Watt is insane

[CM28]

After that play Europeans added one point to the Raiders score.

 

Hey! Cheap shot..

[Sperm Edwards]

Sperm the tackle for a loos was a good play and I though already implied. I just can't get excited about Coples until he lives up to what a disruptive OLB should be and at this stage he is simply not disruptive at all. If it has not happened up to this stage I don't see it happening. I hope the light goes on but I don't think it will .

 

All your points make total sense lets see how he does as the year goes on . I would say when Barnes comes back you will see much more of Barnes and Babin than Coples if he does not turn it on

I think sticking a guy so effectively and causing a fumble at the same time is disruptive. So is putting pressure on the QB, which he did even if he didn't come away with a sack.

I'm not calling him a candidate for defensive player of the year, but he didn't just stand around doing nothing all day, where the Jets wouldn't have known the difference if he played or not.

It's fair to say wait & see, since he hasn't lived up to billing yet. Sure the excuses are legitimate. Changing positions suddenly in May based on drafting another DT, and he wasn't yet conditioned for OLB. Then he broke his foot or ankle or whatever it was at the start of the season and claims he wasn't really right until about week 10. From that game on he was more than meh.

This year is a big deal for him. 2nd year at the position, playing at the proper weight, and he's healthy. We'll see what he does.

[Sperm Edwards]

Every time a pass is tipped or batted down I say MO did it both times yesterday and both times it was MO hes very aware out there for a DLman just like Watt only difference is Watt is insane

Mo may be the best human at his position. (Watt is not human).

[DRJETS]

For once I forgot to DVR the damn game but I saw Coples getting stood up a lot more than I would have liked I didn't see him blowing much up at all but those are usually things you see on the re wind like Sperm said. Lets see what happens vs a real offense next week . We know the blue print lets see if we can carry it out. Rodgers may be one of the best scramblers in the game and he will run with the ball when nothing is there its going to be a huge test.

Just an advise to a fellow Jets fan, do you know you can DVR the entire season? Hit info twice on your remote, then hit "record" and when it says "this episode only" hit it there and change it to "series." 

[Villain The Foe]

That was his one tackle for the entire game. One.

it was a doozy though! lol. 

[jack48]

Actully he does just go around the league and the history of this league and tell me OLB's don't light up stat sheets. They certainly do. Some take over games entirely from time to time making it impossible on a QB taking away half the filed with their pass rushing ability alone

It depends which side you play. Pace gets more shots at the QB, I think

[Smashmouth]

Just an advise to a fellow Jets fan, do you know you can DVR the entire season? Hit info twice on your remote, then hit "record" and when it says "this episode only" hit it there and change it to "series." 

yep I know how to use the DVR I just didn't set anything for this season  Im not on the local channels like you are I live in Texas and have NFL Sunday Ticket Each team is not on the same channel each week. I usually DVR as many games as possible and watch them during the week. After the Jets game this week I was out in my workshop right after the game so I didn't watch much else.

[JetsFanInDenver]

Just an advise to a fellow Jets fan, do you know you can DVR the entire season? Hit info twice on your remote, then hit "record" and when it says "this episode only" hit it there and change it to "series." 

 

For Raiders games i hear you have to type "The biggest loser". True story.

[slats]

Sperm the tackle for a loos was a good play and I though already implied. I just can't get excited about Coples until he lives up to what a disruptive OLB should be and at this stage he is simply not disruptive at all. If it has not happened up to this stage I don't see it happening. I hope the light goes on but I don't think it will .

 

All your points make total sense lets see how he does as the year goes on . I would say when Barnes comes back you will see much more of Barnes and Babin than Coples if he does not turn it on

What stage, exactly, are we at with Coples at OLB? He was a DL his rookie year, and prepared to be a DL again in his first NFL offseason, only to learn (after drafting Richardson) that he would be moved to OLB that year. This is the first year he spent the offseason preparing to play OLB. He played very well at the end of last season. Maybe he would've statistically been more disruptive if Carr wasn't releasing the ball inside of two seconds every pass play. Which may've been because Coples and the rest of the front seven was being rather disruptive. The guy completed over 60% of his passes for less than 5 ypa. He couldn't get rid of that ball fast enough.

[Shadetree]

Bottom line for me? The Jets D looked good on the edges. That was important for me heading into the season. I liked what i saw from coples and we saw some pressure from babin. I was real happy with the whole D overall, corners included.

The inability of the offense to step on the Raiders neck kinda made a very, very good defensive performance go unnoticed. If the offense can step up and produce a big lead and some momentum in a game, this D can finally operate with depraved indifference. The pass rush is gonna be a lot better in 2014.

It's week one. Weeks 2 through 7 or 8 are going to be a bear, so I'm gonna hold off on my irrational euphoria as much as I can. But if we beat GB with a solid defensive effort I'm gonna sh*t Skittles.

[Smashmouth]

What stage, exactly, are we at with Coples at OLB? He was a DL his rookie year, and prepared to be a DL again in his first NFL offseason, only to learn (after drafting Richardson) that he would be moved to OLB that year. This is the first year he spent the offseason preparing to play OLB. He played very well at the end of last season. Maybe he would've statistically been more disruptive if Carr wasn't releasing the ball inside of two seconds every pass play. Which may've been because Coples and the rest of the front seven was being rather disruptive. The guy completed over 60% of his passes for less than 5 ypa. He couldn't get rid of that ball fast enough.

Every team does this vs the Jets based on our propensity to blitz the hell out of the QB and disguise who will blitz and who will not. In that case the scheme causes more issues than any individual player ever will. yet somehow Babin a 34 year old was more visible to me in limited duty than Coples. You can bring up all the points you like I don't think the guy is a particularly good football player nor is he a particularly good OLB I think he would have done much better putting on the weight and progressing as a DLman and I will never back off that stance until I see this guy consistently cause problems for an offense and show way more of a motor than he currently does. Want to see what an OLB should be doing and what type of Motor they should have then look at Clay Matthews or Von Miller and compare Coples to that or better yet just watch those guys play then fall asleep watching Coples.... heres some more for you to compare http://cover32.com/2014/06/18/top-10-in-2014-the-best-outside-linebackers-in-the-nfl-today/5/

 

Coples at the current time is not even on the radar of other OLB's in this league not even remotely close so lets hold back the pats on the back for one play until he does it week in and week out like peers Im comparing him too.

[ARodJetsFan]

 could have a bone jarring hit causing a fumble get kicked into the air right to the only opposing player within 20 yds.

 

That Coples guy really is a bust, isn't he?

The Raiders had quite few things go their way yesterday - that's just one example.

[T0mShane]

If it was impossible for Coples to get a sack against Derek Carr, why did Jason Babin get a sack while playing the same position in about a third of the snaps that Coples got?

[Matt39]

If it was impossible for Coples to get a sack against Derek Carr, why did Jason Babin get a sack while playing the same position in about a third of the snaps that Coples got?

 

Because Coples is a crap edge rusher.

[T0mShane]

Because Coples is a crap edge rusher.

Agreed.

[Matt39]

Agreed.

 

Not many guys in the league could take down MJD with one arm though either. He needs to be playing on the interior with that strength....and to be honest I think he's a better interior rusher than Sheldon is when he doesnt have his head up his ass.

[DRJETS]

yep I know how to use the DVR I just didn't set anything for this season  Im not on the local channels like you are I live in Texas and have NFL Sunday Ticket Each team is not on the same channel each week. I usually DVR as many games as possible and watch them during the week. After the Jets game this week I was out in my workshop right after the game so I didn't watch much else.

I feel you.  In a few years I will probably be in the same situation as you are now, watching from afar.  To a point, I envy you since you don't have to put up with this state mostly left wing commies politicians hijacking my paycheck every single weeks.    Hopefully, soon I will sell my home and take my family and taxes down south.  Ok, I feel better now. 

[T0mShane]

Not many guys in the league could take down MJD with one arm though either. He needs to be playing on the interior with that strength....and to be honest I think he's a better interior rusher than Sheldon is when he doesnt have his head up his ass.

I hate haaaate the OLB thing for the reasons you mentioned.

[Smashmouth]

Because Coples is a crap edge rusher.

But But he clotheslined a dude . As for the one arm comment if you wrap someone around the neck chances are 99% of the time the body follows the head straight to the ground. Now if he would have stuck Jones Drew straight in the hips and threw him down that would have been more impressive and more along the lines of what you described earlier that not many in the league can do that.

[Smashmouth]

Not many guys in the league could take down MJD with one arm though either. He needs to be playing on the interior with that strength....and to be honest I think he's a better interior rusher than Sheldon is when he doesnt have his head up his ass.

He would have been much better rusher up the middle IMO as well. Its hard to take plays off when you have 300 pound lineman wanting to pancake your ass every play. Your forced to engage. What really bothers me is when I see Coples doing the Gholston Dance with LT's