Just re-watched the Bengals game

[#27TheDominator]

Things weren't particularly bleak in that game. I watched it on a theater size screen with rewind capability. The offense didn't put it together, but the team was competitive.

• Austin Howard was not bad at all. I don't think any of the sacks were on him. Ducasse wasn't bad either. There was one sack where they dropped the RDE and Howard and Ducasse kind of stood around while the right side of the line was obliterated, but otherwise they were fairly good. Powell looked pretty poor in pass protection. He was a contributing factor on at least two sacks.
  
• Coples looks good. No complaints there. Hill was okay. One nice catch and one blatant drop. Seems big and fast as advertised. Maybe a bit stiff.
  
• The backs looked decent. I don't remember seeing much from McKnight against the Giants, but he looked pretty good against the Bengals. Powell looked okay and Ganaway looked worth the pick. He only had one catch, but his hands looked good.
  
• Demario Davis looked good. Allen looked good against the Giants and decent here, but Josh Bush looks a little lost out there. Late to the party quite often, though he physically looks fine.
  
• LOL at Tebow describing his INT. "I have to trust my guy Cumberland to win the battle". I'm paraphrasing, but he threw Cumberland under the bus, when Cumberland was already behind the guy before he thought about throwing it. Michael Vick says that and he'd be crucified by the media.
  
• Buttle his usual self- "he runs with his feet on the ground."
  
• Kenrick Ellis seems to be the real deal. I had my doubts last year, but he could put us right back at the top defensively.
  
• Jay Richardson looked very good. Better than Dixon who is probably his primary competition. Not sure how they looked against the Giants.
  
• I like Lankster a little better than Trufant, but they are similar. Both are okay, but so damn short that they can be a liability. Did Wilson play in that game? Didn't see him much. Saw more of Bell than Landry, opposite of the Giants game.
  
• QBs looked pretty dreadful, but we all knew that.
  

[LionelRichie]

what's alarming about both games is that the Jets struggles in preseason are the EXACT same problems they had all last season:

offensive penalties, pick 6, turnstile at RT, no ability to convert on short yardage, can't defend the TE/RB.

The one thing we have not seen much of is playaction. I think that is going to be a huge part of the passing game and we have not seen much of it so far.

[stoicsentry]

Good read, thanks for doing this. All in all, this doesn't sound that bad.

Surprised about Howard & Ducasse. Rex didn't express much confidence in Howard, and he usually does as long as someone shows a glimmer of performance.

If what you say about Powell is true, maybe we'll cut him and go with Ganaway/Conner instead. The last thing we need out of a back is bad blocking.

Great to read the news about Ellis, as well as Jay Richardson. Hope we carry all 7: Pouha, Wilkerson, DeVito, Coples, Ellis, Dixon, Richardson. That is an awesome group right there. No superstars, just a whole bunch of solid performers... we may have turned the d-line from a weakness into a strength.

Between Allen and Bush, we just need 1 of those 2 to be able to contribute immediately. That would be a victory for this draft.

[BornJetsFan1983]

im worried to this sporano guy who was supposed fix our O...and hell he might have but our QBs have no time to take the snap let alone throw a td

[NJ]

Our D has a chance to be good .... very good. The crime will be if they are gassed early from incessant 3 & outs.

[pointman]

Its time to cut ties with Powell. That project is over. I really really hope that Demario turns into something exciting.

[vinnys025]

Its time to cut ties with Powell. That project is over. I really really hope that Demario turns into something exciting.

If Chris Rainey happenes to be cut, we should pick him up immediately. This kid is the real deal. Or trade for him possibly.

[Kleckineau]

Powell and Conner both stink.

A fullback who isnt a great blocker and cant pick up a yard and a supposed feature back with no open field instincts.

Should have grabbed Benson on the cheap when he was available and dumped thes two.

Greene Benson and McKnight would have been fine.

[slats]

Its time to cut ties with Powell. That project is over. I really really hope that Demario turns into something exciting.

Project? This is his first training camp, and all reports have been that he's played well during it. Blitz pickup is a tricky thing, it's why you see a lot of teams use veterans in the 3rd down back role. The Jets don't have that option this year, so need to figure out who's best suited to handle it this season between him and McKnight.

And next year, Greene's as good as gone. Powell will be battling for the starting job.

[Smashmouth]

Project? This is his first training camp, and all reports have been that he's played well during it. Blitz pickup is a tricky thing, it's why you see a lot of teams use veterans in the 3rd down back role. The Jets don't have that option this year, so need to figure out who's best suited to handle it this season between him and McKnight.

And next year, Greene's as good as gone. Powell will be battling for the starting job.

McKnight should be no where near the 3rd down back position. If he gets a lot of touches hes going to fumble that much more. and I cant see this pussy picking up a blitzing LB its just not happening. Powell will get the job for those reasons alone but then again hes probably no better at picking up the blitz. If Jordan White becomes our Return man which m hoping he does McKnight should be shipped the hell out of here for a real back to play on 3rd down.

[slats]

McKnight should be no where near the 3rd down back position. If he gets a lot of touches hes going to fumble that much more. and I cant see this pussy picking up a blitzing LB its just not happening. Powell will get the job for those reasons alone but then again hes probably no better at picking up the blitz. If Jordan White becomes our Return man which m hoping he does McKnight should be shipped the hell out of here for a real back to play on 3rd down.

McKnight looked pretty good against the Bengals. If there's a back on the bubble, it's Conner.

Rex has talked about McKnight as a potential CB, I have no idea why they haven't worked him at WR. Seems like a more natural move to me.

[The Crusher]

Things weren't particularly bleak in that game. I watched it on a theater size screen with rewind capability. The offense didn't put it together, but the team was competitive.

• Austin Howard was not bad at all. I don't think any of the sacks were on him. Ducasse wasn't bad either. There was one sack where they dropped the RDE and Howard and Ducasse kind of stood around while the right side of the line was obliterated, but otherwise they were fairly good. Powell looked pretty poor in pass protection. He was a contributing factor on at least two sacks.
  
• Coples looks good. No complaints there. Hill was okay. One nice catch and one blatant drop. Seems big and fast as advertised. Maybe a bit stiff.
  
• The backs looked decent. I don't remember seeing much from McKnight against the Giants, but he looked pretty good against the Bengals. Powell looked okay and Ganaway looked worth the pick. He only had one catch, but his hands looked good.
  
• Demario Davis looked good. Allen looked good against the Giants and decent here, but Josh Bush looks a little lost out there. Late to the party quite often, though he physically looks fine.
  
• LOL at Tebow describing his INT. "I have to trust my guy Cumberland to win the battle". I'm paraphrasing, but he threw Cumberland under the bus, when Cumberland was already behind the guy before he thought about throwing it. Michael Vick says that and he'd be crucified by the media.
  
• Buttle his usual self- "he runs with his feet on the ground."
  
• Kenrick Ellis seems to be the real deal. I had my doubts last year, but he could put us right back at the top defensively.
  
• Jay Richardson looked very good. Better than Dixon who is probably his primary competition. Not sure how they looked against the Giants.
  
• I like Lankster a little better than Trufant, but they are similar. Both are okay, but so damn short that they can be a liability. Did Wilson play in that game? Didn't see him much. Saw more of Bell than Landry, opposite of the Giants game.
  
• QBs looked pretty dreadful, but we all knew that.
  

Nice job. Optimism? SEXY

[The Crusher]

McKnight should be no where near the 3rd down back position. If he gets a lot of touches hes going to fumble that much more. and I cant see this pussy picking up a blitzing LB its just not happening. Powell will get the job for those reasons alone but then again hes probably no better at picking up the blitz. If Jordan White becomes our Return man which m hoping he does McKnight should be shipped the hell out of here for a real back to play on 3rd down.

Uh no love for last years leading return man in yards per return?

[#27TheDominator]

what's alarming about both games is that the Jets struggles in preseason are the EXACT same problems they had all last season:

offensive penalties, pick 6, turnstile at RT, no ability to convert on short yardage, can't defend the TE/RB.

The one thing we have not seen much of is playaction. I think that is going to be a huge part of the passing game and we have not seen much of it so far.

Yes. The offense is scary. Howard wasn't a turnstile though. The turnstile plays came later and Howard was moved the left. The early sacks were on blitzes. Heyer was the turnstile. He was getting run around and one time just was blown by and tackled the DE for a holding penalty. Awful and he's gone.

Good read, thanks for doing this. All in all, this doesn't sound that bad.

Surprised about Howard & Ducasse. Rex didn't express much confidence in Howard, and he usually does as long as someone shows a glimmer of performance.

If what you say about Powell is true, maybe we'll cut him and go with Ganaway/Conner instead. The last thing we need out of a back is bad blocking.

Great to read the news about Ellis, as well as Jay Richardson. Hope we carry all 7: Pouha, Wilkerson, DeVito, Coples, Ellis, Dixon, Richardson. That is an awesome group right there. No superstars, just a whole bunch of solid performers... we may have turned the d-line from a weakness into a strength.

Between Allen and Bush, we just need 1 of those 2 to be able to contribute immediately. That would be a victory for this draft.

Ducasse and Howard didn't look great, but they certainly looked serviceable. IIRC they played played some right vs. the ones (Howard played the whole half at RT) and left vs. the 2s.

Anybody with eyes saw that Richardson looked good in that game, but Dixon seemed to be taking a back seat. With the switch to more 4-3 and speed based sets some guys aren't going to fit in as well and Dixon may be one of them.

Powell seemed like the #2 or #3 back. I don't see them cutting him. Ganaway is the one that had almost no run and looked raw.

McKnight should be no where near the 3rd down back position. If he gets a lot of touches hes going to fumble that much more. and I cant see this pussy picking up a blitzing LB its just not happening. Powell will get the job for those reasons alone but then again hes probably no better at picking up the blitz. If Jordan White becomes our Return man which m hoping he does McKnight should be shipped the hell out of here for a real back to play on 3rd down.

McKnight looked very good running the ball and even made some tough yards inside. He's plenty big and tough enough to be a third down back and he looks like the only back with outside speed. They used that little pitch out really well with him. Jordan White made a truly boneheaded play dropping a kickoff in the endzone and then running it out to the 10. He does not seem particularly fast and good kick returners need some top end. White looked okay, but he's nothing to get excited about at this point. Unlike McKnight, he isn't the kind of guy where you try to get the ball into his hands. Powell is the one that was sh*tting the bed on the blitz pickup, but as Slats said, that is one of the things that takes some time to get down. .

[JollyGreenGiant]

Uh no love for last years leading return man in yards per return?

Nah, many have had success returning kicks under Westhoff.

[The Crusher]

Nah, many have had success returning kicks under Westhoff.

This is Westhoffs last year. What now?

[Smashmouth]

Yes. The offense is scary. Howard wasn't a turnstile though. The turnstile plays came later and Howard was moved the left. The early sacks were on blitzes. Heyer was the turnstile. He was getting run around and one time just was blown by and tackled the DE for a holding penalty. Awful and he's gone.

Ducasse and Howard didn't look great, but they certainly looked serviceable. IIRC they played played some right vs. the ones (Howard played the whole half at RT) and left vs. the 2s.

Anybody with eyes saw that Richardson looked good in that game, but Dixon seemed to be taking a back seat. With the switch to more 4-3 and speed based sets some guys aren't going to fit in as well and Dixon may be one of them.

Powell seemed like the #2 or #3 back. I don't see them cutting him. Ganaway is the one that had almost no run and looked raw.

McKnight looked very good running the ball and even made some tough yards inside. He's plenty big and tough enough to be a third down back and he looks like the only back with outside speed. They used that little pitch out really well with him. Jordan White made a truly boneheaded play dropping a kickoff in the endzone and then running it out to the 10. He does not seem particularly fast and good kick returners need some top end. White looked okay, but he's nothing to get excited about at this point. Unlike McKnight, he isn't the kind of guy where you try to get the ball into his hands. Powell is the one that was sh*tting the bed on the blitz pickup, but as Slats said, that is one of the things that takes some time to get down. .

Dom didnt McKnight get most of his yards vs the second teamers ? I remember him doing nothing vs the Giants #1's refresh my memory I might be wrong on this . The Jets did nothing the first half and most of that was due to the fact the offensive line got raped. Im not a big McKnight Fan and when he starts fumbling all over the field or getting droped by arm tackles in the open field I think the perception will change dramaticly. Running into a pile and driving with your legs does not nake you tough running a guy over or catching the ball around LB's and taking the hits and holding on to the ball makes you tough and McKnight is a pussy IMHO.

[war ensemble]

• LOL at Tebow describing his INT. "I have to trust my guy Cumberland to win the battle". I'm paraphrasing, but he threw Cumberland under the bus, when Cumberland was already behind the guy before he thought about throwing it. Michael Vick says that and he'd be crucified by the media.
  

Thanks Dom.

The Michael Vick reference is a good one. I think that player overachieved big time.

[#27TheDominator]

McKnight looked pretty good against the Bengals. If there's a back on the bubble, it's Conner.

Rex has talked about McKnight as a potential CB, I have no idea why they haven't worked him at WR. Seems like a more natural move to me.

I'm not sure either. With all the troubles they have had at WR you'd think they'd have slipped McKnight, LT, Keller or Cumberland out there. They never did though. Seemed like a natural way to change formations and keep their best players on the field. FWIW, they are trying a bunch of bodies @FB which probably does not bode well for Connor. Terminator did get some yards this game, as opposed to that debacle against the Giants.

Also, Rex did talk up Howard after this game, saying that he "showed he deserved more time on the field". Initially I watched it on a small screen in a bar with no sound (thankfully I couldn't hear Buttle) and thought he was nuts. Watching it again and paying attention to him I understand and agree. I will see about downloading the Giants game so I can get sick.

Nice job. Optimism? SEXY

I'm sexy, but it has nothing to do with my attitude. My ass is sublime.

Dom didnt McKnight get most of his yards vs the second teamers ? I remember him doing nothing vs the Giants #1's refresh my memory I might be wrong on this . The Jets did nothing the first half and most of that was due to the fact the offensive line got raped. Im not a big McKnight Fan and when he starts fumbling all over the field or getting droped by arm tackles in the open field I think the perception will change dramaticly. Running into a pile and driving with your legs does not nake you tough running a guy over or catching the ball around LB's and taking the hits and holding on to the ball makes you tough and McKnight is a pussy IMHO.

Smash, I think he got some carries in the 2nd quarter. He looked good all game. It seemed lihe they were trying to see what Powell had first. I said tough yards because he ran into a pile and came out the other side. I agree McKnight looked spotty against the Giants. That's specifically why I mentioned him here. You have to stop thinking of the guy as a poor man's LT or Matt Forte and start thinking of him more along the lines of an Eric Metcalf.

[slats]

Jordan White made a truly boneheaded play dropping a kickoff in the endzone and then running it out to the 10. He does not seem particularly fast and good kick returners need some top end. White looked okay, but he's nothing to get excited about at this point. Unlike McKnight, he isn't the kind of guy where you try to get the ball into his hands.

White looks like a direct Jeremy Kerley replacement. A slot receiver who doubles as a capable punt returner. I agree, I don't see him returning kicks, but I do think he has the skills to be a Jim Leonhard type guy on punts. Sure handed with ability to make a couple people miss. The one thing Kerley brought to the table that White doesn't is the ability to run the wildcat, but the Jets have Tebow for that now.

[#27TheDominator]

White looks like a direct Jeremy Kerley replacement. A slot receiver who doubles as a capable punt returner. I agree, I don't see him returning kicks, but I do think he has the skills to be a Jim Leonhard type guy on punts. Sure handed with ability to make a couple people miss. The one thing Kerley brought to the table that White doesn't is the ability to run the wildcat, but the Jets have Tebow for that now.

White looks surprisingly rangy for a slot guy. I guess he's just about 6', but he looks long and lean. I expected him to look liltle, like Kerley, Trufant, Lankster and me. As a side note, does VIctor Cruz return punts? That guy would be a master. I like Wilson back there. I'd give him more run in the preseason to see if we can trust him.

[Smashmouth]

White looks like a direct Jeremy Kerley replacement. A slot receiver who doubles as a capable punt returner. I agree, I don't see him returning kicks, but I do think he has the skills to be a Jim Leonhard type guy on punts. Sure handed with ability to make a couple people miss. The one thing Kerley brought to the table that White doesn't is the ability to run the wildcat, but the Jets have Tebow for that now.

Yep JW does look sure handed catching punts Kerley and McKnight scare the hell out of me and since Kerley seems to get nicked up alot we need to keep this guy Kerley could be on his way out. Plus white is pretty big or at least he looks big not sure on his size numbers.

[pointman]

Project? This is his first training camp, and all reports have been that he's played well during it. Blitz pickup is a tricky thing, it's why you see a lot of teams use veterans in the 3rd down back role. The Jets don't have that option this year, so need to figure out who's best suited to handle it this season between him and McKnight.

And next year, Greene's as good as gone. Powell will be battling for the starting job.

Second year we got to see him do nothing. He runs to the line of scrimmage and waits to get tackled. In running back years, two preseasons is plenty. He has a better shot of competing for our starting QB position than he does competing for our starting RB position. He won't ever be our #1 RB.

[slats]

Yep JW does look sure handed catching punts Kerley and McKnight scare the hell out of me and since Kerley seems to get nicked up alot we need to keep this guy Kerley could be on his way out. Plus white is pretty big or at least he looks big not sure on his size numbers.

Jets are too thin at WR to think about cutting a guy who caught 29 passes for them last year and looked pretty good doing it, but he has to get out of the doghouse and onto the field or White's gonna steal his playing time.

[slats]

Second year we got to see him do nothing. He runs to the line of scrimmage and waits to get tackled. In running back years, two preseasons is plenty. He has a better shot of competing for our starting QB position than he does competing for our starting RB position. He won't ever be our #1 RB.

This is effectively his first preseason. He had absolutely zero chance to do anything last summer with the lockout. He was buried on the depth chart, and the Jets were preparing for the season with Greene, LT, and hoping for something from McKnight. Powell was barely an afterthought.

This summer he's looked good in practice according to a number of sources. A lot of people had him ahead of McKnight, and he looked to be ahead of him with the RB rotation in the Bengal game.

I don't know if he'll ever be the Jets #1 back, but I do know that if they don't take a RB high next year, or overpay a vet, that he'll be competing for the job next year.

[T0mShane]

I think the key to this season will be to watch it on a theater-sized screen with rewind capability.

[JollyGreenGiant]

This is Westhoffs last year. What now?

Than we are doomed.