aec4 Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Our defense is not the type of defense that can be 35 minutes on the field. They tire too quickly, and we don't have a ton of depth. The basic personal, however, is the same as we had in 2009 and 2010. We had a top defense then. Have the players declined some? Sure, but I don't think that's the only cause. Back in 2009 and 2010, our offense held the ball for 32+ minutes. They played field position, and didn't leave the defense in tough spots. When they did not hold onto the ball long, we got beat, sometimes badly. However, we were dedicated to the running game (and pretty successful, I know we haven't been this year so far). We kept pounding it, and if it didn't work out, we tried again and then punted. Was it exciting football? NO, but it never put our defense in a bad spot. Basically, Sanchez was not placed in a position to lose the game for us. Fast forward us to 2012. We can't run it as well, and we take a lot more risks on offense. We turn the ball over, and we go 3 and out with 3 passes way too fast. By the middle of the 3rd quarter, our defense is gased, and they get pushed around. What's the answer? As much as I hate to say it, because I DO NOT THINK HE IS AN NFL CALIBER QB, is to turn to Tebow. Run the thing 3 times and punt if you have to. Play like Denver did last year. Last year, Denver's defense was not that hot, and then all of a sudden Tebow became the QB. The scores were in the teens for both teams, and all of a sudden you heard about how great the defense was. I don't think it makes us a super bowl contender, but it may be better than 6-10 or 7-9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawn306 Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Look at some of Tebow's numbers in the first half from last year. If you put him in they defense will be exhausted by halftime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 it's all sanchez' fault. if he didn't suck so bad they would try harder it's so ****ing bizarre to even type that, lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artemusclyde Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Our defense is not the type of defense that can be 35 minutes on the field. They tire too quickly, and we don't have a ton of depth. The basic personal, however, is the same as we had in 2009 and 2010. We had a top defense then. Have the players declined some? Sure, but I don't think that's the only cause. Back in 2009 and 2010, our offense held the ball for 32+ minutes. They played field position, and didn't leave the defense in tough spots. When they did not hold onto the ball long, we got beat, sometimes badly. However, we were dedicated to the running game (and pretty successful, I know we haven't been this year so far). We kept pounding it, and if it didn't work out, we tried again and then punted. Was it exciting football? NO, but it never put our defense in a bad spot. Basically, Sanchez was not placed in a position to lose the game for us. Fast forward us to 2012. We can't run it as well, and we take a lot more risks on offense. We turn the ball over, and we go 3 and out with 3 passes way too fast. By the middle of the 3rd quarter, our defense is gased, and they get pushed around. What's the answer? As much as I hate to say it, because I DO NOT THINK HE IS AN NFL CALIBER QB, is to turn to Tebow. Run the thing 3 times and punt if you have to. Play like Denver did last year. Last year, Denver's defense was not that hot, and then all of a sudden Tebow became the QB. The scores were in the teens for both teams, and all of a sudden you heard about how great the defense was. I don't think it makes us a super bowl contender, but it may be better than 6-10 or 7-9. Welcome to the start Tebow club. People said I was crazy here for suggesting it and that I was just a Tebow maniac. Boy have times changed from then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 it's all sanchez' fault. if he didn't suck so bad they would try harder it's so ****ing bizarre to even type that, lol I totally agree with your first statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoicsentry Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Look at some of Tebow's numbers in the first half from last year. If you put him in they defense will be exhausted by halftime. I agree with you. There's something weird about it, though...Orton was playing and the defense was mediocre. Tebow took over and within a few weeks, the defense really started to click. Could very well be just a coincidence, but interesting anyway. I wonder what the time of possession was like in those games. His completion % was definitely crap in 1st halves, but maybe they ran it well enough to keep the defense rested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artemusclyde Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 I agree with you. There's something weird about it, though...Orton was playing and the defense was mediocre. Tebow took over and within a few weeks, the defense really started to click. Could very well be just a coincidence, but interesting anyway. I wonder what the time of possession was like in those games. His completion % was definitely crap in 1st halves, but maybe they ran it well enough to keep the defense rested. They did have the #1 rushing offense that year I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason423 Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 I agree with you. There's something weird about it, though...Orton was playing and the defense was mediocre. Tebow took over and within a few weeks, the defense really started to click. Could very well be just a coincidence, but interesting anyway. I wonder what the time of possession was like in those games. His completion % was definitely crap in 1st halves, but maybe they ran it well enough to keep the defense rested. Boomer Esiason was talking about this the other day pretty much in reference to his own career. He said how once the perception is that the team is no longer trying that the only way to spark them is to either fire the coach or change the QB. I think he referenced his getting playtime as a young QB because of that and then getting benched at the end. Now Boomer I think has a much higher opinion of himself as a player than most do, but I think there is alot of truth to it, Kyle Orton, no matter what kind of numbers he puts up, is a journeyman QB. Every guy on that team looks at him and doesnt believe. Once you get a few games in and have the losing record you cant get the team back. Matt Cassel is going through the same thing in Kansas City. I think the team just gave up in Denver. For whatever reason those guys all loved and believed in Tebow. When he came in they all raised the level of their games. I dont think it had anything to do with rest or anything else. Maybe they took it as a challenge that they had to keep games low to give him a chance to win. Maybe they had faith that he could do what Orton could not if given the chance in the 4th Q. When you listen to players interviewed about Tebow they all seemed to think he gave them a chance, regardless of hwo bad he stunk. Even if you go back to our team in 2007 there was a clear improvement in the way the defense played when the team made the switch to Kellen Clemens. Whether it was because they felt that they got Chad benched or because Clemens gave them a chance to do something there was improvement. Maybe its even the fact that coaching approaches are different with a totally unproven guy. Whatever it is I think it happens. I think the question here, though, is whether or not the Jets believe in Tebow. My biggest reservation with getting Favre is that a legend in another city doesnt mean players will treat him as a legend somewhere else. That ended up being the case because the guys on the team didnt care for him at all. Tebow is years removed from college now and is a total outsider as a Jet. The team doesnt believe in Sanchez at all, but I dont know if Tebow is going to spark them to do anything. That said if they are going to make a meaningful move it does have to be soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Bit Special Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Our defense is not the type of defense that can be 35 minutes on the field. They tire too quickly, and we don't have a ton of depth. The basic personal, however, is the same as we had in 2009 and 2010. We had a top defense then. Have the players declined some? Sure, but I don't think that's the only cause. Back in 2009 and 2010, our offense held the ball for 32+ minutes. They played field position, and didn't leave the defense in tough spots. When they did not hold onto the ball long, we got beat, sometimes badly. However, we were dedicated to the running game (and pretty successful, I know we haven't been this year so far). We kept pounding it, and if it didn't work out, we tried again and then punted. Was it exciting football? NO, but it never put our defense in a bad spot. Basically, Sanchez was not placed in a position to lose the game for us. Fast forward us to 2012. We can't run it as well, and we take a lot more risks on offense. We turn the ball over, and we go 3 and out with 3 passes way too fast. By the middle of the 3rd quarter, our defense is gased, and they get pushed around. What's the answer? As much as I hate to say it, because I DO NOT THINK HE IS AN NFL CALIBER QB, is to turn to Tebow. Run the thing 3 times and punt if you have to. Play like Denver did last year. Last year, Denver's defense was not that hot, and then all of a sudden Tebow became the QB. The scores were in the teens for both teams, and all of a sudden you heard about how great the defense was. I don't think it makes us a super bowl contender, but it may be better than 6-10 or 7-9. Tebow isnt going to help keep the defense off the field anymore than Sanchez. So... we're still screwed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bergen Jet Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Tebow isnt going to help keep the defense off the field anymore than Sanchez. So... we're still screwed. I think this team is absolutely screwed with Timmy... However, I do think he can help move the chains a little and maybe keep the horrendous O on the field a little longer than Sanchez without a running game and without receivers. That said, I'd end the Sanchez experiment after this week if the O sputters and let Tebow get a shot at it. I can't see Rex or any coach pulling their starter with a 2-3 record though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 I agree with you. There's something weird about it, though...Orton was playing and the defense was mediocre. Tebow took over and within a few weeks, the defense really started to click. Could very well be just a coincidence, but interesting anyway. I wonder what the time of possession was like in those games. His completion % was definitely crap in 1st halves, but maybe they ran it well enough to keep the defense rested. Tim Tebow led the league in 3 & outs last year, and Denver's TOP for the season was 29:43. For reference, the Jets were 30:49. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Bit Special Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 I think this team is absolutely screwed with Timmy... However, I do think he can help move the chains a little and maybe keep the horrendous O on the field a little longer than Sanchez without a running game and without receivers. That said, I'd end the Sanchez experiment after this week if the O sputters and let Tebow get a shot at it. I can't see Rex or any coach pulling their starter with a 2-3 record though... I think they need to find a way to integrate him into the offense a lot more... its bullcrap at how little they've used him and how mindnumbingly boring his play calls are. And that, along with all the other problems fall back on lousy coaching. Give Belichick the keys to this team and we win 11-12 games. Rex we'll be lucky to win 8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoicsentry Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Tim Tebow led the league in 3 & outs last year, and Denver's TOP for the season was 29:43. For reference, the Jets were 30:49. OK, so there's another factual point against him. Here's another oddity though: does the Denver defense right now look like the Denver defense of 2011? I don't think they have been nearly as good. I swear, it's not my goal to make any argument for Tebow, but there's a really weird string of coincidences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aec4 Posted October 8, 2012 Author Share Posted October 8, 2012 Tim Tebow led the league in 3 & outs last year, and Denver's TOP for the season was 29:43. For reference, the Jets were 30:49. Jets are 28:17 this year, and that includes an OT game!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 I totally agree with your first statement. all kidding aside, the decline of the defense coincides with rex letting pettine call the games, and rex changing "who he is" to satisfy the media and his bosses after his jets career is over, that will be his biggest regret, not being true to the the cocky loudmouth over load blitzing mofo he really is he doesn't write checks with his mouth anymore, so the players don't feel like they have to cash them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 all kidding aside, the decline of the defense coincides with rex letting pettine call the games, and rex changing "who he is" to satisfy the media and his bosses after his jets career is over, that will be his biggest regret, not being true to the the cocky loudmouth over load blitzing mofo he really is he doesn't write checks with his mouth anymore, so the players don't feel like they have to cash them This may very well be part of it, but I do believe the D is totally disheartened and are kind of going through the motions because our offense stinks on ice. I do believe that to a large degree the offense has sucked the life out of the defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 This may very well be part of it, but I do believe the D is totally disheartened and are kind of going through the motions because our offense stinks on ice. I do believe that to a large degree the offense has sucked the life out of the defense. nonsense the 2000 ravens O had what, 3 games without a TD and they won 2 of them ? if that's the case they should all be waived. I'd rather see the rutgers D out there trying than whiny pants pros getting all sulky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassmaster2 Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 The problem with the defense is the lack of a pass rush from the line and the poor play from the line backers because the backers are old and slow , the Jets need to get young and fast , where is the pass rush ,the Jets has not had a pass rush in 10 year, it all comes back to the GM doing a very poor job in drafting good players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 nonsense the 2000 ravens O had what, 3 games without a TD and they won 2 of them ? if that's the case they should all be waived. I'd rather see the rutgers D out there trying than whiny pants pros getting all sulky In my opinion it's cumulative, not based on 1 season. Sanchez getting extended, and then sucking as badly as ever, has it's toll. It's just an opinion, but I don't think it's nonsense. And further, we are nowhere near the 2000 Ravens, don't have Jamal Lewis, and the league was different then as you well know. If we had a ground game that could make his ineptitude minimally painful then I think they would play better. But in no universe, no matter how well Sanchez and the receivers and the OL and the backs played, could or would the 2012 Jets defense be on any sort of par with the 2000 Ravens. Nor should they be expected to be, much as we wish them to be. I do agree with your last sentence wholeheartedly. At least the college kids look like they're trying and don't have the luxury of saying, "Oh well, even if we get our asses kicked, I'm still making six figures or today's game." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 If Sanchez is totally responsible for the D sucking, how do you account for CJ Spiller running wild on Jets D in game 1 while Sanchez threw 3 TDs? The Jets run D has played the same in every game. There can be mutually exclusive suckage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 In my opinion it's cumulative, not based on 1 season. Sanchez getting extended, and then sucking as badly as ever, has it's toll. It's just an opinion, but I don't think it's nonsense. And further, we are nowhere near the 2000 Ravens, don't have Jamal Lewis, and the league was different then as you well know. If we had a ground game that could make his ineptitude minimally painful then I think they would play better. But in no universe, no matter how well Sanchez and the receivers and the OL and the backs played, could or would the 2012 Jets defense be on any sort of par with the 2000 Ravens. Nor should they be expected to be, much as we wish them to be. I do agree with your last sentence wholeheartedly. At least the college kids look like they're trying and don't have the luxury of saying, "Oh well, even if we get our asses kicked, I'm still making six figures or today's game." I know they aren't the 2000 ravens. but almost every year a team makes the playoffs with a lousy "_____" either a running game like last years giants, defense like the patriots, etc etc etc and yes even with lousy QB's so if the D plays inspired tonight, does sanchez get the credit ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 I know they aren't the 2000 ravens. but almost every year a team makes the playoffs with a lousy "_____" either a running game like last years giants, defense like the patriots, etc etc etc and yes even with lousy QB's so if the D plays inspired tonight, does sanchez get the credit ? No. He only gets blame if they're uninspired. What, are you new here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vudu Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Another week another injury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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