Quinton Coples: DE/OLB?

[New York Mick]

Well, that pass rush did allow the 2nd best pass D.

Where'd they rank in sacks?

[Greenseed4]

Wilk and Sheldon's raw numbers are almost identical, with Richardson being a couple inches shorter and a bit more explosive; but their 40/20/10 yard splits and agility drills were almost identical. Obviously Wilk has transitioned himself to become a fantastic player, but as far as prospects coming out of college, you'd have to give it to sheldon hands down; better conference and more explosive. If Wilkerson can teach Coples and Richardson his work ethic, the line is going to be pretty damned beastly. That's also not to forget that Kenrick Ellis was at once considered a 1st round talent prior to his arrest; he's had no off-field issues since then, so as long as he can stay healthy, those four guys are definitely our future.

Nice find.

My favorite stat is that Shell-Rich led his team in tackles from the DT spot. That's pretty impressive.

Kudos to the FO for sticking to their board, literally ZERO pundits had them pegged taking him. But like you point out, if he's a comparable talent to Wilkerson. The #2 rated DE (3-4 teams) last year, how can you pass on him? We actually found a guy to kick Coples out to another position (an idea they were flirting with, well before the draft), and in essence promoted from within.

I see Wilk and Rich both playing the DE spot in a three-man line...Ellis in the middle. Coples or not, that's going to be pretty fun to watch. Having Q roam around willy nilly as an amoeba pass rusher is going to be impossible to defend.

[j4jets]

Where'd they rank in sacks?

 

Pass rush is about pass D, not sacks. You're smarter than that.

[F.Chowds]

As far back as the scouting combine in February, Rex Ryan started dropping hints aboutQuinton Coples becoming more of an edge player. He'll be on the edge, all right. Coples, used mostly as an interior lineman as a rookie, will be moved to 3-4 outside linebacker, according to a league source. 

Ryan uses multiple fronts, so it's quite possible Coples will be deployed as a down lineman in certain situations. But the plan, for now, is to stand him up. The former first-round pick was listed at 290 pounds last season, so he will have to drop weight to play linebacker, which requires some pass-coverage responsibilities. 

This helps explain why the Jets were so hot for DT Sheldon Richardson, their second pick in the first round. Now there's an opening on the line for Richardson, who projects as a Day 1 starter. 

Coples, the 16th overall pick in 2012, led the team with 5.5 sacks even though he played in only 47 percent of the defensive snap

[BroadwayJoe12]

As far back as the scouting combine in February, Rex Ryan started dropping hints aboutQuinton Coples becoming more of an edge player. He'll be on the edge, all right. Coples, used mostly as an interior lineman as a rookie, will be moved to 3-4 outside linebacker, according to a league source. 

Ryan uses multiple fronts, so it's quite possible Coples will be deployed as a down lineman in certain situations. But the plan, for now, is to stand him up. The former first-round pick was listed at 290 pounds last season, so he will have to drop weight to play linebacker, which requires some pass-coverage responsibilities. 

This helps explain why the Jets were so hot for DT Sheldon Richardson, their second pick in the first round. Now there's an opening on the line for Richardson, who projects as a Day 1 starter. 

Coples, the 16th overall pick in 2012, led the team with 5.5 sacks even though he played in only 47 percent of the defensive snap

 

Saw it from a different source as well: 

 

ESPN New York reports the Jets will move Quinton Colpes to outside linebacker.

Coples (6-foot-6, 290) is obviously going to have to drop some weight to make the transition to stand-up edge rusher, but it explains why the Jets took Sheldon Richardson with the No. 13 overall pick in the draft. Coples, the 16th pick in last year's draft, led the Jets with 5.5 sacks as a rookie, even though he played just 47 percent of the snaps. Gang Green's new front-seven shapes up like this: LE Richardson, NT Kenrick Ellis, RE Muhammad Wilkerson, OLBs Coples and Antwan Barnes, ILBs Demario Davis and David Harris. It's a very solid group.

Source: ESPN New York May 1 - 10:16 PM

 

 

I'm not gonna go dredge back up the old threads, but the consensus around here was that many, myself included, thought Coples was drafted to play OLB initially.  He was worked out as linebacker predraft, has better measurables than Suggs, Jones, Kruger etc. at his weight of 284, so athletically I don't think it's going to be a big deal. If Rex thinks it can work, I'm sure it wasn't a snap decision. Additionally, I'd like to hear more about this tomorrow from one of the coaches: I can easily see them just meaning on certain downs he'll kick outside when Sheldon comes on the field, as opposed to 100% of the time he'll be the OLB.

[Smashmouth]

In today's Star Ledger:

 

 

http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2013/04/rex_ryan_john_idzik_spend_day.html

 

Coples put up the following numbers at the combine:

 

6'6" 284

4.78 40

109" Broad Jump

31.5 Vertical

7.57 3 Cone

25 Bench reps

4.78 Shuttle

 

Really this probably means more DE for Coples unless they're asking him to drop weight to improve his explosiveness. 

 

but he played better on the inside why do we always have to turn all these ******* players into experiments

[SenorGato]

but he played better on the inside why do we always have to turn all these ******* players into experiments

Experiments are good things. It helps s

[bitonti]

i don't like the idea of telling a guy who is 6'6" 280 with no body fat to lose weight and play linebacker. 

[Smashmouth]

Experiments are good things. It helps s

 

Name me one Jets experiment that was a success the past 10 years

 

And no, burying a football does not count

[BroadwayJoe12]

Name me one Jets experiment that was a success the past 10 years

 

And no, burying a football does not count

 

Brandon Moore being converted to offensive guard was pretty damned good.  I get the skepticism, but I'd wait to hear from Rex and the staff before people start calling for heads.  It could be as simple as he'll kick out on certain downs to get Sheldon on the field as opposed to him taking over for Pace as an OLB in the base formation.  

[Smashmouth]

Brandon Moore being converted to offensive guard was pretty damned good.  I get the skepticism, but I'd wait to hear from Rex and the staff before people start calling for heads.  It could be as simple as he'll kick out on certain downs to get Sheldon on the field as opposed to him taking over for Pace as an OLB in the base formation.  

 

Yep Brandon Moore was a nice transition ... but its not something that happens a lot in this league. Something that fails about 90 % of the time does not get me excited.

 

I agree with what your saying on how they will use Coples but once again the guy was better inside so Im not sure why we would ask him to do something different. From what we're hearing Richardson is a freakish athelete so why not go 4-3 and let these 2 tear up the middle on a consistent basis with Wilk on the outside then we fill another DE spot cause Pace has been done for years now. If the Jets want pressure up the middle because we have no real edge rushers then I say go 4-3 and cut the crap already. I mean we drafted Davis who seems to fit the 4-3 better due to lack of size needed in the 3-4 so looking at that, how the hell are we drafting ? I really dont care much for Rex moving players around, teams are on to that crap now and each year we have created less and less pressure on QB's and in a QB driven league thats going to burn you at some point.

[SenorGato]

Name me one Jets experiment that was a success the past 10 years

And no, burying a football does not count

Abe to 4-3 DE

Ellis from 4-3 DE to 3-4 DE

Wilkerson from 4-3 DT to 3-4 DL

Smith from QB to anything but on offense

Pouha from IR to NT

DeVito from DT to 3-4 DE/DT

[Jetsfan80]

Abe to 4-3 DE

Ellis from 4-3 DE to 3-4 DE

Wilkerson from 4-3 DT to 3-4 DL

Smith from QB to anything but on offense

Pouha from IR to NT

DeVito from DT to 3-4 DE/DT

 

And 3 of those happened under Rex.  Uncreative, he is not.  I think he's earned the benefit of the doubt with the DL, seeing as he is unquestionably the best in the business in that department.  Unquestionably.

[BroadwayJoe12]

Yep Brandon Moore was a nice transition ... but its not something that happens a lot in this league. Something that fails about 90 % of the time does not get me excited.

 

I agree with what your saying on how they will use Coples but once again the guy was better inside so Im not sure why we would ask him to do something different. From what we're hearing Richardson is a freakish athelete so why not go 4-3 and let these 2 tear up the middle on a consistent basis with Wilk on the outside then we fill another DE spot cause Pace has been done for years now. If the Jets want pressure up the middle because we have no real edge rushers then I say go 4-3 and cut the crap already. I mean we drafted Davis who seems to fit the 4-3 better due to lack of size needed in the 3-4 so looking at that, how the hell are we drafting ? I really dont care much for Rex moving players around, teams are on to that crap now and each year we have created less and less pressure on QB's and in a QB driven league thats going to burn you at some point.

 

I think we'll see more 43 this year as they've been increasing its usage the last couple of years.  Personally, I think the designation of him playing OLB is more a need of the media as they like things to have a proper label to them, I'm not entirely sure how much we're going to see him dropped into coverage.  From what I've gathered in Rex's defense over the years, he'll probably continue to have Pace play strong side OLB and have Coples fill in for Thomas on the weak side.   I just read Coples is going to be asked to play at 280-285, what he came into the league as, I'm sure whatever transition there is, Rex feels he can handle.  I hope so, because if he can, having all three of those guys on the field at the same time can evolve into an elite unit, especially if Ellis stays healthy.  

 

 

I'm just going to defer to him and Dunbar and hope they're correct here.

[bitonti]

Mario Williams tried this conversion, tore his pec and hit the free agent market. 

 

there's just something really risky about taking a guy who has had his hand in the dirt for his whole career and making him learn a new position. The angles and footwork, it's all different.  

[Smashmouth]

Abe to 4-3 DE

Ellis from 4-3 DE to 3-4 DE

Wilkerson from 4-3 DT to 3-4 DL

Smith from QB to anything but on offense

Pouha from IR to NT

DeVito from DT to 3-4 DE/DT

 

lol you have got to be kidding me. None of those are projects. They all play on the DL and all across the league players are moved across line on defense. Those are not projects.

 

Figures 80 would agree with this

[SenorGato]

And 3 of those happened under Rex. Uncreative, he is not. I think he's earned the benefit of the doubt with the DL, seeing as he is unquestionably the best in the business in that department. Unquestionably.

Yet you're questioining....I don't get it.

[Jetsfan80]

Yet you're questioining....I don't get it.

 

When did I question it?  From yesterday:

 

Rex doesn't ever keep guys in the same spots, he's always moving people around.  So this shouldn't be a surprise.  We need to make sure all 3 get on the field as much as possible.  If this is how we do it, I'm fine with it.  Rex is the master with DL.

 

[Jetsfan80]

lol you have got to be kidding me. None of those are projects. They all play on the DL and all across the league players are moved across line on defense. Those are not projects.

 

Figures 80 would agree with this

 

WTF are you talking about?  Pouha was worthless in the Herm era and Rex turned him into a beast.  He was the DEFINITION of a project player.  Same with DeVito.  What other coach in the NFL can say they've done something similar with multiple different players?

 

You asked for examples and they were provided for you.  Want another one?  How about Maybin?  He was worthless in Buffalo, Rex got 6 sacks out of him as a pure pass-rusher.

 

Don't ask for examples then sh** on them when you get them. 

[T0mShane]

WTF are you talking about? Pouha was worthless in the Herm era and Rex turned him into a beast. He was the DEFINITION of a project player. Same with DeVito. What other coach in the NFL can say they've done something similar with multiple different players?

You asked for examples and they were provided for you. Want another one? How about Maybin? He was worthless in Buffalo, Rex got 6 sacks out of him as a pure pass-rusher.

Don't ask for examples then sh** on them when you get them.

Turning 4-3 DTs into 3-4 DEs isn't a conversion. Turning a guy from a DT into an OLB is a conversion.

[Jetsfan80]

Turning 4-3 DTs into 3-4 DEs isn't a conversion. Turning a guy from a DT into an OLB is a conversion.

 

Smash was talking about "experiments" or "projects" not "conversions", yet somehow the argument got twisted.  Pouha and DeVito absolutely qualify as successful experiements/projects.

[Smashmouth]

WTF are you talking about?  Pouha was worthless in the Herm era and Rex turned him into a beast.  He was the DEFINITION of a project player.  Same with DeVito.  What other coach in the NFL can say they've done something similar with multiple different players?

 

You asked for examples and they were provided for you.  Want another one?  How about Maybin?  He was worthless in Buffalo, Rex got 6 sacks out of him as a pure pass-rusher.

 

Don't ask for examples then sh** on them when you get them. 

 

Sorry dude but you just dont get it.

 

Just so your aware a project player of the type we are talking about here (that you seem to miss) is a player that is asked to play a very different position like moving from DL to LB or putting your hand in the dirt as opposed to playing OLB . The players mentioned by you and Gato all play across the DL and Coples has excelled on the interior of the line and now is being asked (as some suggest) to play outside LB ? Thats a world of  difference and I think it also plays away from Coples strengths. The only project mentioned in this thread was Brandon Moore. 

 

Makes sense though cause every post I make Gato disagrees with maybe he likes to debate me just for the sake of arguement. Guy has never agreed with one post i make ,,,, maybe he likes the fact I dont back down even in the Sanchez arguements.

[Jetsfan80]

Sorry dude but you just dont get it.

 

Just so your aware a project player of the type we are talking about here (that you seem to miss) is a player that is asked to play a very different position like moving from DL to LB or putting your hand in the dirt as opposed to playing OLB . The players mentioned by you and Gato all play across the DL and Coples has excelled on the interior of the line and now is being asked (as some suggest) to play outside LB ? Thats a world of  difference and I think it also plays away from Coples strengths. The only project mentioned in this thread was Brandon Moore. 

 

Makes sense though cause every post I make Gato disagrees with maybe he likes to debate me just for the sake of arguement. Guy has never agreed with one post i make ,,,, maybe he likes the fact I dont back down even in the Sanchez arguements.

 

I'd say Maybin qualifies then.  Didn't he have his hand in the dirt in Buffalo?

[bitonti]

people bring up the brandon moore project as a success... and ultimately it was... but we forget this guy was on and off the roster/psquad for the better part of 3 seasons. He was cut a bunch. It took forever. He spent a season in Scotland playing for the Claymores of NFL Europe. It was not an easy transition. 

[BroadwayJoe12]

people bring up the brandon moore project as a success... and ultimately it was... but we forget this guy was on and off the roster/psquad for the better part of 3 seasons. He was cut a bunch. It took forever. He spent a season in Scotland playing for the Claymores of NFL Europe. It was not an easy transition. 

 

No one forgets that; the question simply asked if there were any successful conversions and was simply answered in yes, brandon moore.  It was never asked the time or effort put into said conversion.   You do realize that you can bring up a point without trying to negate an argument that no one was making right ?? Because you do bring up a valid point, it just gets lost in the strawman. 

[Smashmouth]

I'd say Maybin qualifies then.  Didn't he have his hand in the dirt in Buffalo?

 

who :?

[SenorGato]

You keep saying he excelled on the interior of the DL. No, he didn't. In college he played his best at DT. Last year he was mostly a DE for the Jets in either front - and I wouldn't say he excelled either. He did improve as the year went on.

I was also unaware of our relationship BUT now that I think about it I do disagree with you often. Sorry that leaves you offended or whatever.

Oh and Ryan ran Coples through LB drills at his pro day and had nothing but good things. This idea being newly published does not mean its new to the Jets. Many DE/OLBs weren't really given OLB roles as rookies.

[BroadwayJoe12]

This definitely feels like something that's been in the works for a while, especially when you remember that quote from Rex comparing suggs and coples: "He’s (Coples) certainly a guy that we’re excited about. He’s just scratching the surface. We’re kind of approaching him the same way we approached Terrell Suggs (in Baltimore). I remember Ozzie Newsome coming to me and saying, “Rex, we’re going to put Terrell in your room." So you take a guy that’s a rush linebacker-type guy and you put him in that defensive line room. We did the same thing with Quinton. I see him as a guy that can maybe be more of an edge presence than he was that first year..." 

 

As such, Coples apparently played at least 27 snaps over the last three games standing up; either they were trying to see how he'd handle the transition or it was just part of the package they were in.  Also, do not forget that it's still possible to play Coples at OLB with his hand in the dirt and have the rest of the lineman line up in a 3 man front, something they often did with Suggs.  Considering both Pace and Thomas play in the 265 range, I don't think weight is going to be much of an issue at all.

[SenorGato]

As far as the weight...I doubt he drops something extreme like 20 pounds considering the kind of athlete he is at 285 pounds.

[SenorGato]

80, somehow I confused you and Smash in that post about questioning.

[flgreen]

Coples Expanding into a Defensive Multi-Tool
Posted by Randy Lange on May 2, 2013 – 3:20 pm

“The plan” was hinted at by Rex Ryan a few months ago and has been referred to a few times since then.

And today, with the Jets veterans working out at the Atlantic Health Training Center during a Phase 2 practice of their offseason program and then meeting with reporters at midday, a little more of “the plan” was revealed in the locker room:

Q will be playing some OLB.

“Yeah, I definitely think it’s going to open up opportunities for me,” the always affable Quinton Coples said with a bigger smile than usual of rushing the quarterback from a standup position. “It’s going to help me get to the quarterback very efficiently.”

There are questions with “the plan,” of course. Coples thinks he’ll still play in the range of 280 to 285 pounds. While that’ll be a load for opposing tackles, tight ends and backs to handle, will it be too big a load for him to carry for 60 minutes a game? Will it take too long to get familiar with playing the run or playing in coverage from a two-point stance? Is Q permanently a ‘backer or will he be a hybrid?

All these things remain to play out and work on throughout the offseason, next month’s full-squad minicamp and Cortland training camp. But one thing Coples repeated today was that it didn’t seem to him that “the plan” was just hatched by the Jets this year.

“I think he had a plan for me, not knowing if he was going to draft me,” Coples recalled of the predraft workout that Ryan put him through at North Carolina’s pro day in 2012. “The workout he had for me at Carolina, I think he had a plan for me as far as playing outside linebacker from there. I think things worked out well. I fell down to 16, he picked me up, so it worked out perfect. Last year was a trial year to see how things went, and now we’ve got more depth on the defensive front, so it’ll be a perfect time.”

To be sure, Ryan and coordinator Dennis Thurman are not declaring a position change. Ryan has reminded that the Jets coach a multiple defense with multiple roles for many of the players in that unit, and Coples, with his versatility, flexibility and athleticism, is one of those players. Coples said today he will still be putting his hand in the dirt quite a bit, depending on the call.

But Ryan gave a greater hint of his thinking during his February remarks at this year’s combine.

“I see Quinton as a guy that can maybe be more of an edge presence than he was that first year,” Ryan said then, “but having him go through that, putting him over a guard, putting him over tackles, even over centers, I think it’s good because when you put him over tight ends, it’s a lot easier to knock those guys back and you have a lot of confidence when you face those double-teams. That was kind of what we did with him, but I’m expecting big things from him. Like I said, I think he’s just now scratching the surface.”

Coples had another way of talking about the implementation of “the plan.”

“Things,” he said, “are starting to develop.”

Hayden’s Continuing Higher Education

Hayden Smith made it through year one as a “cross-training” athlete, someone who wasn’t changing positions but whole sports. The tight end who hails from “Down Under” as well as “a Mile High” and “from Across the Pond” said he’s getting more comfy with the surroundings in this neck of the woods, even though in his second year in the NFL he’s already learning his second offense from new OC Marty Mornhinweg.

“I feel a lot more comfortable the second time around,” Smith said. “I don’t have to spend so much time on the details of the game itself, so at least all that’s kind of taken care of this time so I can just focus on the offense itself. There’s new things to learn there, but there’s a lot of common threads, and that’s just knowing football. So there’s a lot less on my plate from that standpoint.”

Helping Smith with the transition is coach Steve Hagen, who comes to the Jets this year off of his four-year stint as Cleveland’s TEs coach. He’s in his ninth NFL campaign (the first eight came in two four-year hitches with the Browns) and spent two decades in the college coaching ranks besides.

” ‘Details make you dangerous’ — that’s one of his sayings,” Smith said. “He’s fantastic. The tight ends room is already littered with quotes from him. He’s a very intense guy with a great message and he’s delivering his message well.”

Holt from Downtown … Colorado Springs

Speaking of a Rocky Mountain high (Smith played college hoops for Denver’s Metropolitan State) reminds me we want to wish a fantastic career to John Holt, who was our intern and reporter for most of the last year.

John had a great sports background and writing experience from North Carolina and Ole Miss, and he put that to good use from last year’s training camp all the way through doing the lion’s share of the work on our eight-part predraft position-by-position series. But John’s love is basketball and he’ll get the chance to pursue that goal with USA Basketball’s Web site. Hopefully, he and his dad have safely and successfully concluded their two-thirds-of-the-country drive from Newark to, yes, snowy Colorado Springs.

It wouldn’t surprise us to find a great rivalry spring up in the next few years between John and Nick Gallo, our previous intern/reporter who for the last two seasons has been working with the Oklahoma City Thunder.

All the best out West, Holty.

[SenorGato]

Idzik has given Ryan way too much say.

It is necessary that Hayden Smith turn out to be some kind of NFL player.

[Bleedin Green]

To be sure, Ryan and coordinator Dennis Thurman are not declaring a position change. Ryan has reminded that the Jets coach a multiple defense with multiple roles for many of the players in that unit, and Coples, with his versatility, flexibility and athleticism, is one of those players. Coples said today he will still be putting his hand in the dirt quite a bit, depending on the call.

 

I think this paragraph right here says it all and seems to support a lot of what people here were saying, but now straight from the team's / player's mouth.  This is not going to be a matter of Coples constantly having to drop back in coverage while playing standing up the entire game or anything like it.  It's just another element to into an already versatile defensive scheme, clearly designed to try to get as many of the Jets' strongest rushers on the field for passing downs by letting all of their DL, including Coples, be out there at the same time even when lined up in the 3-4.

[Matt39]

The Jets defensive line is combating the hurry up offenses theyre facing on a weekly basis. Their D line might be the most versatile in the league now. I like it.

[Sperm Edwards]

Sorry dude but you just dont get it.

 

Just so your aware a project player of the type we are talking about here (that you seem to miss) is a player that is asked to play a very different position like moving from DL to LB or putting your hand in the dirt as opposed to playing OLB . The players mentioned by you and Gato all play across the DL and Coples has excelled on the interior of the line and now is being asked (as some suggest) to play outside LB ? Thats a world of  difference and I think it also plays away from Coples strengths. The only project mentioned in this thread was Brandon Moore. 

 

Makes sense though cause every post I make Gato disagrees with maybe he likes to debate me just for the sake of arguement. Guy has never agreed with one post i make ,,,, maybe he likes the fact I dont back down even in the Sanchez arguements.

 

How many of the NFL's top 3-4 OLBers played OLB in college?

 

Coples weighed 278 at his pro day.  Ryan Kerrigan at 274 (as well as being 3" shorter than Coples and no faster).  Both played on the DL in college.  (BTW, from ESPN on 2/28/2011:  "Purdue DE Ryan Kerrigan did not perform as well as hoped during the week of the Senior Bowl, when he lined up at outside linebacker, and he doesn't have elite athletic ability.")  He went to the pro bowl at OLB as an alternate for Aldon Smith 3 months ago, in his 2nd season.  

 

Adalius Thomas played for years in the 270-280 lb range at only 6'2" tall - physically he looks like a butterball compared to Coples - and didn't have the genetic gifts Coples was born with.  Guy was a beast at LB (until NE picked him up, ha ha ha) and could play anywhere from DT to ILB.  (He was also a TE and a basketball player).  Some guys are just more versatile than others.

 

That doesn't mean this transition will go as well for someone else; it means don't pigeon-hole a guy's role based on numbers or timed drills.  Ryan also worked Coples out at LB a little before we drafted him.  He'll try Coples out there some during this spring/summer.  He can either make the transition fully, somewhat, or he can't at all.  I haven't seen Ryan do a lot of square peg round hole stupidity with his personnel on defense, and he's still widely considered to be one of the game's best defensive coaches, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.  If he can't make the transition, Rex isn't going to risk lowering his defense's precious ranking in what might very well be his last year here.  

 

Which brings us to that other thing: while I want us to win games, reality must also set in that we are not winning a SB this year; it's a damn good year to experiment a little.