Jump to content
Want to remove all ads? ×

Adam Schefter: "People within the Jets organization pushed for Simms to be the starter"

Matt39

By Matt39
in NY Jets Forum

Recommended Posts

Sperm Edwards

Sperm Edwards

Posted
Posted

G&P is dead. I can't believe people want to go back to a failed strategy. Geno is getting big boy treatment and big boy play calling. That's better than sheltering a player for 3-4 years only to discover he's a buttfumbler. 

 

Whatever.  I can't believe you actually think the things that you write.

 

A 40/30 ratio in his 2nd ever game instead of a 30/40 ratio is not "change the whole philosophy to ground and pound & hide the QBs flaws for the next 4 years" except in your own head.  There are ways of easing a QB into more passes without having him throw that many times right away.  As an example, look at how Seattle eased Wilson in, and he was much more polished out of the gate than Geno.  

 

There is such a thing as being in-between. Everything doesn't need to be all or none.  Easing a guy in with "only" 30 attempts, in his 2nd NFL start, is not hiding and coddling him for 4 years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • Replies 125
  • Created
  • Last Reply
Scott Dierking

Scott Dierking

Posted
Posted

Whatever.  I can't believe you actually think the things that you write.

 

A 40/30 ratio in his 2nd ever game instead of a 30/40 ratio is not "change the whole philosophy to ground and pound & hide the QBs flaws for the next 4 years" except in your own head.  There are ways of easing a QB into more passes without having him throw that many times right away.  As an example, look at how Seattle eased Wilson in, and he was much more polished out of the gate than Geno.  

 

There is such a thing as being in-between. Everything doesn't need to be all or none.  Easing a guy in with "only" 30 attempts, in his 2nd NFL start, is not hiding and coddling him for 4 years.

This is Mart Monhinweg ball. It is just the way he approaches things. He is pass first mentality.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
cr726

cr726

Posted
Posted

Throwing the ball to mediocre WR's should be reason enough to run the ball a little more especially if the run is getting 5 yards per carry.

Whatever.  I can't believe you actually think the things that you write.

 

A 40/30 ratio in his 2nd ever game instead of a 30/40 ratio is not "change the whole philosophy to ground and pound & hide the QBs flaws for the next 4 years" except in your own head.  There are ways of easing a QB into more passes without having him throw that many times right away.  As an example, look at how Seattle eased Wilson in, and he was much more polished out of the gate than Geno.  

 

There is such a thing as being in-between. Everything doesn't need to be all or none.  Easing a guy in with "only" 30 attempts, in his 2nd NFL start, is not hiding and coddling him for 4 years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Matt39

Matt39

Posted
  • Author
Posted

It was 35 pass attempts.  He also got sacked 4x and scrambled 1 more.  That's 40x.  

 

Agree with you it's too much, and was unnecessary in a close game.  Ivory was doing fine, the fumble notwithstanding, since Hill(?) picked it up.  I could see if we were trailing and they were stuffing the run like Tampa was, or if Smith & his receivers were having a field day, but none of these was the case (let alone each of them).  It was a close game and we were running effectively (4.0 ypc without one massive run skewing the "average").  

 

Should have been 40 runs to 30 pass attempts, not the other way around.

 

We just kept throwing and throwing like we were in a shoot out. We stopped the Pats running game. They weren't exactly stopping ours. And Ducasse was actually handling Wilfork. Give the damn ball to Ivory.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Matt39

Matt39

Posted
  • Author
Posted

who just fumbled...

 

Hill fumbled too. I suppose we should stop passing. 

 

Thursday night games are generally sloppy. We saw how that game was playing out. The Pats did nothing offensively. The only way the Jets lose that game is if they turn it over- and what do they do- they drop back a rookie QB 40 times, in the rain, throwing to practice squad level WR's. We kick two field goals instead of throwing picks, we win.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
kay_gee

kay_gee

Posted
Posted

Whatever. I can't believe you actually think the things that you write.

A 40/30 ratio in his 2nd ever game instead of a 30/40 ratio is not "change the whole philosophy to ground and pound & hide the QBs flaws for the next 4 years" except in your own head. There are ways of easing a QB into more passes without having him throw that many times right away. As an example, look at how Seattle eased Wilson in, and he was much more polished out of the gate than Geno.

There is such a thing as being in-between. Everything doesn't need to be all or none. Easing a guy in with "only" 30 attempts, in his 2nd NFL start, is not hiding and coddling him for 4 years.

+1.

10 more rushing attempts than passing attempts doesn't equal "ground and pound."

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bitonti

bitonti

Posted
Posted

G&P was dated when the Jets were using it in 2009/2010. the way the NFL is today, if you are running more than you are passing, it's probably not gonna be enough points. Look at this weekend. The Titans tried to run run run over the Texans and lost. The Vikings a run first team is in trouble. The Niners just got their run stuffed in Seattle. Run more than pass is a recipe to lose. Whether the QB is a rookie or whatever. The only way to win in this league in 2013 is to pass. You guys want the Jets to run their way to victory, down by 3,  on the road? It's one thing to wind the clock with the run, and play ball control. You guys want to run from behind. No chance of it working. Marty Morn throw it 50x might be ugly but it's the only way forward.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
SickJetFan

SickJetFan

Posted
Posted

While it was already pointed out that the initial comparison wasn't versus last year, this list is still kind of ridiculous.  There is no measurable means by which this year's OL can be considered better than last year's.  Slauson was replaced by Vlad (not Colon), who he had beaten out for the starting job for 3 straight years prior to this.  Colon replaced Moore.  At best maybe it's a wash, but at this point I can't see how you don't give the edge to last year's OL, at least for now.  We'll see how Winters turns out.

 

As far as the WRs go, it's pretty much the same guys.  While Holmes is back, he's also not completely healthy, had no training camp or preseason, and so has hardly looked like his old self.  On the flip side Kerley, last year's leading WR, was out of the game this week.  Once everyone is back and at 100% I'd agree you give this year's group the edge, but that's not currently the case.

 

The point isn't that Sanchez was in a great situation last year, because he certainly wasn't, but to act like Geno has it so much better is laughable.  Not to mention, this group doesn't even come close to comparing to what Sanchez was given for at least his first two (if not three) years in the league.

 

lol I knew one of u fags was gonna nitpick what I said about OL because I did not precisely say who replaces who.  I still stand by what I said SMITH has edge as Slausen Sucked and Colon better than butt fumble ass.

.

as far as WR go - i would argue because Holmes is back and even w/o Kerley - Edge goes to SMITH now because Holmes > Kerley and no he is not hurt he played 62 snaps.  what the hell is he doing playing 62 snaps if he is hurt huh coach.

 

I think it is laughable to compare how good sanchez had it his 1st 2 years to what Geno has now because if 2011 and 2012 rosters didnt happen we would not be having this conversation at all. If you to compare more apples to apples then it is Geno 2013 to Sanchez 2012 or 2011 when they had similar supporting casts and it was shown how much Sanchez sucks.

 

btw - I do think Sanchez sucks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Matt39

Matt39

Posted
  • Author
Posted

G&P was dated when the Jets were using it in 2009/2010. the way the NFL is today, if you are running more than you are passing, it's probably not gonna be enough points. Look at this weekend. The Titans tried to run run run over the Texans and lost. The Vikings a run first team is in trouble. The Niners just got their run stuffed in Seattle. Run more than pass is a recipe to lose. Whether the QB is a rookie or whatever. The only way to win in this league in 2013 is to pass. You guys want the Jets to run their way to victory, down by 3,  on the road? It's one thing to wind the clock with the run, and play ball control. You guys want to run from behind. No chance of it working. Marty Morn throw it 50x might be ugly but it's the only way forward.

 

When you're in the red zone in a 3 point game with a rookie QB, take the points. The Pats were doing nothing offensively.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bleedin Green

Bleedin Green

Posted
Posted

lol I knew one of u fags was gonna nitpick what I said about OL because I did not precisely say who replaces who.  I still stand by what I said SMITH has edge as Slausen Sucked and Colon better than butt fumble ass.

.

as far as WR go - i would argue because Holmes is back and even w/o Kerley - Edge goes to SMITH now because Holmes > Kerley and no he is not hurt he played 62 snaps.  what the hell is he doing playing 62 snaps if he is hurt huh coach.

 

I think it is laughable to compare how good sanchez had it his 1st 2 years to what Geno has now because if 2011 and 2012 rosters didnt happen we would not be having this conversation at all. If you to compare more apples to apples then it is Geno 2013 to Sanchez 2012 or 2011 when they had similar supporting casts and it was shown how much Sanchez sucks.

 

btw - I do think Sanchez sucks.

 

Congratulations, you proved yourself to be a complete ******* moron before even finishing one sentence.  At least you quickly gave me all the reason I needed not to waste my time reading the rest of your idiotic horsesh*t.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Matt39

Matt39

Posted
  • Author
Posted

a FG ties a TD wins... have no problem with them going for a win in that situation. 

 

The offense has scored two touchdowns in 8 quarters. Take the points. Always on the road in that type of sloppy game. Let the defense get a chance to win it for you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bitonti

bitonti

Posted
Posted

The offense has scored two touchdowns in 8 quarters. Take the points. Always on the road in that type of sloppy game. Let the defense get a chance to win it for you.

 

no defense will stop Tom Brady at home with a FG to win.  The Jets are playing with house money, go for the jugular.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Lupz27

Lupz27

Posted
Posted

Yeah I get that part, but you're supposed to be passing to put up yards & points, not passing for the sake of passing.  The point is to win, not pass.

You can't blame this on MM, he had 10 plays that were IF executed would have put the Jets in a position to score 24 points, maybe more. Between the missed reads on wide open receivers, bad throws, and bad drops, that's where the Jets would have ended up points wise IF 5 of those plays are successful IMO, that's not really asking for to much when guys are getting paid what they get to play this game no?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sperm Edwards

Sperm Edwards

Posted
Posted

You can't blame this on MM, he had 10 plays that were IF executed would have put the Jets in a position to score 24 points, maybe more. Between the missed reads on wide open receivers, bad throws, and bad drops, that's where the Jets would have ended up points wise IF 5 of those plays are successful IMO, that's not really asking for to much when guys are getting paid what they get to play this game no?

 

I'm not blaming anything on anyone.  I'm saying I agree with Matt that in a very close game, with a rookie QB (who isn't ready to begin with), with WRs dropping passes left & right, in the rain, and with Geno not exactly having pinpoint accuracy that night, that I would like to have seen a little more of Ivory.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sperm Edwards

Sperm Edwards

Posted
Posted

G&P was dated when the Jets were using it in 2009/2010. the way the NFL is today, if you are running more than you are passing, it's probably not gonna be enough points. Look at this weekend. The Titans tried to run run run over the Texans and lost. The Vikings a run first team is in trouble. The Niners just got their run stuffed in Seattle. Run more than pass is a recipe to lose. Whether the QB is a rookie or whatever. The only way to win in this league in 2013 is to pass. You guys want the Jets to run their way to victory, down by 3,  on the road? It's one thing to wind the clock with the run, and play ball control. You guys want to run from behind. No chance of it working. Marty Morn throw it 50x might be ugly but it's the only way forward.

 

Yeah, and San Fran and Seattle were heavily run-first teams and did pretty well with it last year.  They were 31st and 32nd, respectively, in pass attempts last season.

 

You coach the team you have, not the team you wish you had.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Matt39

Matt39

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Yeah, and San Fran and Seattle were heavily run-first teams and did pretty well with it last year.  They were 31st and 32nd, respectively, in pass attempts last season.

 

You coach the team you have, not the team you wish you had.  

 

If Brady was carving us up I'd have no issues with Marty letting Geno sling it around and take his lumps. Rex would have been on the firing line the day after anyways, limiting Geno's exposure to the press and what not. Instead we have Geno throwing every down in a game where our defense is dominating....now we have rumors about Simms floating around and people questioning Geno, when he clearly isnt really ready yet. We brought in Ivory for a reason. Feed him.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
jbone

jbone

Posted
Posted

I'm not blaming anything on anyone.  I'm saying I agree with Matt that in a very close game, with a rookie QB (who isn't ready to begin with), with WRs dropping passes left & right, in the rain, and with Geno not exactly having pinpoint accuracy that night, that I would like to have seen a little more of Ivory.

I don't remember how many times I yelled at the TV.........."Run the dam ball".

 

If you're gaining yards, moving the chains and keeping the ball out of Brady's hands, why not run it a little bit more? Not saying we should have abandoned the pass or anything, but we clearly had a good thing going on with the run game. Something we didn't have with the passing game. For various reasons.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sperm Edwards

Sperm Edwards

Posted
Posted

If Brady was carving us up I'd have no issues with Marty letting Geno sling it around and take his lumps. Rex would have been on the firing line the day after anyways, limiting Geno's exposure to the press and what not. Instead we have Geno throwing every down in a game where our defense is dominating....now we have rumors about Simms floating around and people questioning Geno, when he clearly isnt really ready yet. We brought in Ivory for a reason. Feed him.

 

 

I don't remember how many times I yelled at the TV.........."Run the dam ball".

 

If you're gaining yards, moving the chains and keeping the ball out of Brady's hands, why not run it a little bit more? Not saying we should have abandoned the pass or anything, but we clearly had a good thing going on with the run game. Something we didn't have with the passing game. For various reasons.

 

Agree.  All of the snickering/sarcastic comments to rationalize it, using "ground and pound" as a punchline, sound foolish.  Thursday night was a single game, not a philosophy lesson to prove or disprove a general, unwritten rule on the value of running the football more or less than passing it.

 

What silliness.  The run is working better than the pass in a close game in the rain with a raw, rookie QB and bad receivers dropping barely-on-target passes.  But still abandon the run and pass it more because otherwise that's a statement about the superiority of ground and pound, and ground and pound sucks, meow meow m'meow-meow-meow Sanchez buttfumble meow-m'meow.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sperm Edwards

Sperm Edwards

Posted
Posted

If you assume 100% of Wilson's runs were designed passes that broke down (I really wasn't paying attention to that), then last night Seattle:

 

40 designed running plays

30 designed passing plays

 

Someone go tell Pete Carroll that he's not beating a superbowl team with that stupid ground & pound philosophy!  Only 8 completed passes the whole game and they won? Impossible.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Scott Dierking

Scott Dierking

Posted
Posted

If you assume 100% of Wilson's runs were designed passes that broke down (I really wasn't paying attention to that), then last night Seattle:

 

40 designed running plays

30 designed passing plays

 

Someone go tell Pete Carroll that he's not beating a superbowl team with that stupid ground & pound philosophy!  Only 8 completed passes the whole game and they won? Impossible.

Didn't watch the game, but did they have the game in hand, and decided to stay on the ground?

 

The team that passes the most in any game typically loses, but you can't extrapolate that into teams need to run the ball more in order to win.

 

It doesn't work that way.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing

Content Partnership

Yes Network

Site Sponsor

MILE-Social - NJ Social Media & SEO company

Site Sponsor

MetLife Stadium Tailgate

NY Jets Podcast

NY Jets Podcast

DMCA Page

  • -- DMCA Page
    • ×
    ×
    • Create New...