Reggie McKenzie (MERGED)

[UnitedWhofans]

McKenzie was named the Oakland GM in 2012.

Went 4-12, 4-12, 3-13, 7-9 and now 11-3.

Carr was drafted in the 3-13 year. So not all the progress the Raiders can point to that alone.

I think he should be NFL executive of the year and it goes to show what patience can do. 

This is a HUGE draft for Mike Maccagnan coming up. His first two drafts have been, despite what the "only care about stars" media and fanbase thinks, okay. Not great, Not horrible. So this is a big one. He nailed his first top ten pick., which some people think was a no brainer, although with the Jets, the no brainer can go by the wayside.

Darron Lee has potential at the 20th pick. But he needs to really nail this pick

 

 

[Beerfish]

I wish MacCagnan had no fallen into the we can win and rebuild trap because he wasted resources this past off season, he should have about 2 more picks for this draft if he had not been trying to win now.

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, Beerfish said:

I wish MacCagnan had no fallen into the we can win and rebuild trap because he wasted resources this past off season, he should have about 2 more picks for this draft if he had not been trying to win now.

I still believe that he felt in order to survive in this town he had to it that way. I don't think it's a good way, but in this market, it appears to be the only way to survive. Which is a reason for previous points that I have made.

[jmat321]

he went thru a few different HCs as well

[rangerous]

29 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

I wish MacCagnan had no fallen into the we can win and rebuild trap because he wasted resources this past off season, he should have about 2 more picks for this draft if he had not been trying to win now.

i don't see where he fell into a rebuild trap.  first off, he had a ton of money to spend so he spent it.  at the time it looked like he spent it pretty wisely by getting players who should have been motivated.  but these contracts are also fairly short duration so they won't impact the drafts or the cap after this year.  second, he's only had two drafts.  by and large his drafts are sound.  you can point to the hack pick and even the devon smith picks as failures but the jury is still out.  and if petty turns out to be an adequate qb then mac has actually done more than just a good job.

if he made one mistake it was to re-sign fitz so late.  he didn't have a choice because fitz was being fitz but what it did do, imo, was impact the locker room.  i believe that sheldon and wilk both resented fitz coming in as starting qb after their boy geno was there practising with the team from the end of last season. and it's not like fitz did himself a favor having a bad year.  playing behind a bad oline didn't help either.  he has some serious challenges and we can only hope he can clean out bowles lock room.  it would be even better if bowles is able to clean up his own locker room.

[Beerfish]

No he did not have a ton of money to spend LAST year which is what I was talking about,  I have no issue with how he and the Jets handled Fitzpatrick.  My issues come from us losing fa in which we would get comp picks and then signing a number of non impact guys that nullified comp picks  (sounds like we will get one for dumping Jenkins but still we could have probably had two more.

[SBBound]

1 hour ago, UnitedWhofans said:

McKenzie was named the Oakland GM in 2012.

Went 4-12, 4-12, 3-13, 7-9 and now 11-3.

Carr was drafted in the 3-13 year. So not all the progress the Raiders can point to that alone.

I think he should be NFL executive of the year and it goes to show what patience can do. 

This is a HUGE draft for Mike Maccagnan coming up. His first two drafts have been, despite what the "only care about stars" media and fanbase thinks, okay. Not great, Not horrible. So this is a big one. He nailed his first top ten pick., which some people think was a no brainer, although with the Jets, the no brainer can go by the wayside.

Darron Lee has potential at the 20th pick. But he needs to really nail this pick

 

 

Wonder point about Oakland...you have to trust in the process.

[UnitedWhofans]

12 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

No he did not have a ton of money to spend LAST year which is what I was talking about,  I have no issue with how he and the Jets handled Fitzpatrick.  My issues come from us losing fa in which we would get comp picks and then signing a number of non impact guys that nullified comp picks  (sounds like we will get one for dumping Jenkins but still we could have probably had two more.

This year, we will have 7 picks to begin with (including the comp). Which is what most teams have. Could we have 9. Maybe, but I will take 7 than the years of Tanny having 3 or 4 picks.

[dbatesman]

Dumbass media and fans, so now drafting 1 good player in 2 years is "bad drafting"? SMDH...

[UnitedWhofans]

21 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

Dumbass media and fans, so now drafting 1 good player in 2 years is "bad drafting"? SMDH...

Dumbass media and fans for determining the quality of a player after 1-2 years.

Also dumbass media and fans for focusing on star players rather than quality players. Cant have an Pro Bowler at every position

 

[dbatesman]

18 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Dumbass media and fans for determining the quality of a player after 1-2 years.

Also dumbass media and fans for focusing on star players rather than quality players.

 

Totally

[JiFtheOracle]

Amazing what a franchise QB can do for a team...

[August]

And I'm sure some of his draft choices probably bombed too, but the difference is that he wasn't ran out of town after one bad year. He was allowed to learn from his mistakes and correct those mistakes. And now they have a nice young team and looks to be set for the next 5-8 years. 

[CanadaSteve]

1 hour ago, Beerfish said:

I wish MacCagnan had no fallen into the we can win and rebuild trap because he wasted resources this past off season, he should have about 2 more picks for this draft if he had not been trying to win now.

I agree Beer, but this is the problem last season caused us.  Players, ownership, management, and WORST of all, the fans and the media, believed the rebuild was going WAY faster.  We should have been about 3-4 wins last season, which would have improved us even more this year.

Imagine, the first draft we had, and then instead of the one we got, we could have had either Jalen Ramsey or Ronnie Stanley in the 1st.  Might of had a shot at Max Tuerk in the 3rd as Mangold's replacement, and potentially.  We would have been that much further down the road.

That 10-6 season set us back another year AT LEAST.  Jets fans and media should forget it ever happened, and start thinking this was the first season of a solid 3-year rebuild.

[UnitedWhofans]

5 minutes ago, JiF said:

Amazing what a franchise QB can do for a team...

Very true, and the Raiders gave him 3 years to find one.

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, CanadaSteve said:

I agree Beer, but this is the problem last season caused us.  Players, ownership, management, and WORST of all, the fans and the media, believed the rebuild was going WAY faster.  We should have been about 3-4 wins last season, which would have improved us even more this year.

Imagine, the first draft we had, and then instead of the one we got, we could have had either Jalen Ramsey or Ronnie Stanley in the 1st.  Might of had a shot at Max Tuerk in the 3rd as Mangold's replacement, and potentially.  We would have been that much further down the road.

That 10-6 season set us back another year AT LEAST.  Jets fans and media should forget it ever happened, and start thinking this was the first season of a solid 3-year rebuild.

Now in addition to that fooling everybody, all the vets that played well last year regressed or got hurt. That's why instead of 7-8 wins. which is what I thought they would get, they have 4.

[jeremy2020]

30 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Dumbass media and fans for determining the quality of a player after 1-2 years.

Also dumbass media and fans for focusing on star players rather than quality players. Cant have an Pro Bowler at every position

 

I trust your opinion on dumbasses. No one with more experience.

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, jeremy2020 said:

I trust your opinion on dumbasses. No one with more experience.

Trust me, we all have experience being dumbasses.

[JiFtheOracle]

5 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Very true, and the Raiders gave him 3 years to find one.

Well, he showed that he understood the draft and positoinal value...so I get why he got 3 years to find one.  The dude has landed at least 3 impact players in every draft he's had. 

So far, our fearless GM got lucky with the only impact player he's drafted.   Yay!!!!

[Integrity28]

Someone needs the joewilly12 treatment.

[UnitedWhofans]

1 minute ago, JiF said:

Well, he showed that he understood the draft and positoinal value...so I get why he got 3 years to find one.  The dude has landed at least 3 impact players in every draft he's had. 

So far, our fearless GM got lucky with the only impact player he's drafted.   Yay!!!!

I don't how how you came to that determination given the records of those first 3 teams.

[drdetroit]

It's a process

[JiFtheOracle]

1 minute ago, UnitedWhofans said:

I don't how how you came to that determination given the records of those first 3 teams.

It was simple.  I looked at the draft and noticed he found at least 3 players either starting or making significant impact from each of his drafts. 

[drdetroit]

15 minutes ago, August said:

And I'm sure some of his draft choices probably bombed too, but the difference is that he wasn't ran out of town after one bad year. He was allowed to learn from his mistakes and correct those mistakes. And now they have a nice young team and looks to be set for the next 5-8 years. 

I think Mac needs another year or two as the GM.  Bowles however is waste of time

[UnitedWhofans]

5 minutes ago, JiF said:

It was simple.  I looked at the draft and noticed he found at least 3 players either starting or making significant impact from each of his drafts. 

RIght now.

5 years in.

Thank you for making my point. 

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, drdetroit said:

I think Mac needs another year or two as the GM.  Bowles however is waste of time

Bowles killed himself. 

[drdetroit]

2 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Bowles killed himself. 

?

[UnitedWhofans]

Just now, drdetroit said:

?

Not literally. I was all aboard the Bowles train until these last 3 games. 

[JiFtheOracle]

Just now, UnitedWhofans said:

RIght now.

5 years in.

Thank you for making my point

No silly, they were making an impact even when they stunk.  You can have a bad record while developing players you've drafted.  This is a thing.  So even though they sucked, he was finding talent through the draft.  They just didnt have a QB so they sucked but because he was finding talent, they gave him a 3rd year to find his QB and it worked.  Because they trusted his ability to find players through the draft.

Then when it all started coming together, he had the genius idea of signing younger FA's that still wanted to play Football.  As opposed to old sh*tty vets who could give 2 sh*ts and were just collecting pay checks. 

Amazing, isnt it? 

 

[drdetroit]

1 minute ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Not literally. I was all aboard the Bowles train until these last 3 games. 

Bowles just got really exposed this season.  I actually understand the logic of keeping him because we will probably suck next year again anyway with another demonic schedule but the guy is an empty suit and totally inept

[UnitedWhofans]

4 minutes ago, JiF said:

No silly, they were making an impact even when they stunk.  You can have a bad record while developing players you've drafted.  This is a thing.  So even though they sucked, he was finding talent through the draft.  They just didnt have a QB so they sucked but because he was finding talent, they gave him a 3rd year to find his QB and it worked.  Because they trusted his ability to find players through the draft.

Then when it all started coming together, he had the genius idea of signing younger FA's that still wanted to play Football.  As opposed to old sh*tty vets who could give 2 sh*ts and were just collecting pay checks. 

Amazing, isnt it? 

 

They were 3-13 with Carr at QB the first year. So they sucked even when they had a QB.

That's why I said the QB was not the only thing. My point is that you don't know if Macc drafted impact players or not 5 years from now. An example is Carolina. Marty Hurney was fired after the 2012 season and they went to the SUper Bowl 3 years later with big players that Hurney drafted. Keuchly, Newton, Thomas Davis.

 

[JiFtheOracle]

5 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

They were 3-13 with Carr at QB the first year. So they sucked even when they had a QB.

That's why I said the QB was not the only thing. My point is that you don't know if Macc drafted impact players or not 5 years from now. An example is Carolina. Marty Hurney was fired after the 2012 season and they went to the SUper Bowl 3 years later with big players that Hurney drafted. Keuchly, Newton, Thomas Davis.

 

They sucked with a Rookie QB.  That's a first.

[August]

17 minutes ago, drdetroit said:

I think Mac needs another year or two as the GM.  Bowles however is waste of time

I wouldn't argue against firing him but I'd keep him for another year just to see if he redeems himself after a bad coaching job. 

[UnitedWhofans]

1 minute ago, JiF said:

They sucked with a Rookie QB.  That's a first.

YOu know what joewilly would have said.

[bostonmajet]

28 minutes ago, JiF said:

They sucked with a Rookie QB.  That's a first.

Thats were we are getting confused. Petty is basically a rookie, but clearly not a rookie. Manning sucked his first year, but he was a rookie, so it was okay. But because Petty isn't a rookie if he sucks - he just sucks, right?

.... I am hoping my sarcasm is coming through here ....

People on this site are advocating for a full re-build. I get it. But, when we play a crappy game with a lot of rookies running around doing doping things, we crap all over the GM. When a guy playing in his 3rd start is under throwing his long balls (as opposed to over throwing them before) they have decided he isn't the guy.

Hey, I get it. Mac may not be the GM we need. The odds are that Petty isn't the guy. But, if you are unhappy with the Jets looking like a HS team, then you are in for a rude awakening next year, after the vet purge and 3-4 more rookies playing a prominent role. The O-Line and the Secondary need to be completely rebuilt. It is going to be painful even with some FAs hired to fill the gaps.

Drafting a QB in the first, second, or third isn't going to make a big difference. Signing Glennon won't make a big difference. We have a bad-team and it is going to take a while to turn it into a good one.